Hiiragi-chan to Tomikawa-chan - Ch. 92 - Delicious Donuts

[MURDERBEAR]

Maybe, but I didn't make any assumption without observation.
What I am describing is just how maladaptive schemas come to be.
Negative experiences pass through maladaptive interpretation, are ruminated upon, generalized and finally turn into negative schemas, calcifying themselves and becoming resistant to disconfirmation.
But no one cares about all that jargon.

I mean, I care about the Jargon.

I don't disagree with the idea that repeat cycles of trauma, loss of faith in others, and self-hatred have made her resistant to outside interference from those attempting to help - to the extent that anyone HAS, we've yet to see anyone outside of Hiiragi and the hairdresser even attempt to reach out to her without ulterior motives. But I've personally seen people in it far FAR worse than her be pulled out and convinced to seek help, go to therapy, rely on others. At the same time, I've also seen people spiral bad, crash out, and absolutely ruin their lives and fall into vice. There really aren't absolutes in this sorta thing.

For Tomikawa, I think she would probably chafe against someone like a student counselor because those sorts of people tend to provide strong words of affirmation - but affirmation isn't necessarily what she wants. What makes Hiiragi so effective at getting through to her at times is her genuine earnestness. When Tomikawa says "If I get betrayed again, I'm going to kill myself" the 'correct' response that you might see from a counselor or a teacher is to tell someone they're valid, they have so much to live for, death isn't the answer.

Hiiragi just says "then I guess I'd have a reason to die as well."

No bullshit, no fucking about, no empty affirmations. Just genuine earnestness. It's that same earnestness that makes Tomikawa swoon when Hiiragi casually plays the role of the fuckboi. But it's also that earnestness which chafes against Tomikawa when she's in her depressive episodes. When Hiiragi just bluntly states her mind, or doesn't go along with Tomikawa.

I guess I just take umbrage with the idea that "there's no getting through to someone like her." Absolutely it's not easy to get through to someone in that state. Obviously their mind will resist. But it's far from impossible. We're a LONG way from impossible.

I mean, I guess?
I don't think Inuyama-sensei is aware that there's a small following outside of japan for this series, though.

I think something like 98% of her ENG-speaking fans are fans of Oosaki to Komori, and most of those I know jumped on when that one sweaty-ass pic of the two went viral on twitter. But yeah, despite my best attempts to promote the series to damn near everyone I talk to, Hiiragi to Tomikawa gets maybe one or two ENG comments every several uploads, if that. I'd love if she did official EN releases of the Fanbox comics, but I don't have high hopes at the moment.

 

[NotSomeone]

I mean, I care about the Jargon.

I don't disagree with the idea that repeat cycles of trauma, loss of faith in others, and self-hatred have made her resistant to outside interference from those attempting to help - to the extent that anyone HAS, we've yet to see anyone outside of Hiiragi and the hairdresser even attempt to reach out to her without ulterior motives. But I've personally seen people in it far FAR worse than her be pulled out and convinced to seek help, go to therapy, rely on others. At the same time, I've also seen people spiral bad, crash out, and absolutely ruin their lives and fall into vice. There really aren't absolutes in this sorta thing.

For Tomikawa, I think she would probably chafe against someone like a student counselor because those sorts of people tend to provide strong words of affirmation - but affirmation isn't necessarily what she wants. What makes Hiiragi so effective at getting through to her at times is her genuine earnestness. When Tomikawa says "If I get betrayed again, I'm going to kill myself" the 'correct' response that you might see from a counselor or a teacher is to tell someone they're valid, they have so much to live for, death isn't the answer.

Hiiragi just says "then I guess I'd have a reason to die as well."

No bullshit, no fucking about, no empty affirmations. Just genuine earnestness. It's that same earnestness that makes Tomikawa swoon when Hiiragi casually plays the role of the fuckboi. But it's also that earnestness which chafes against Tomikawa when she's in her depressive episodes. When Hiiragi just bluntly states her mind, or doesn't go along with Tomikawa.

I guess I just take umbrage with the idea that "there's no getting through to someone like her." Absolutely it's not easy to get through to someone in that state. Obviously their mind will resist. But it's far from impossible. We're a LONG way from impossible.



I think something like 98% of her ENG-speaking fans are fans of Oosaki to Komori, and most of those I know jumped on when that one sweaty-ass pic of the two went viral on twitter. But yeah, despite my best attempts to promote the series to damn near everyone I talk to, Hiiragi to Tomikawa gets maybe one or two ENG comments every several uploads, if that. I'd love if she did official EN releases of the Fanbox comics, but I don't have high hopes at the moment.

There could be a language barrier thing going on here, but what I meant back in my first comment is that you can't just talk Tomikawa through her problems, you can't just communicate good enough with her and everything ends up ok.
Yeah, a friend or loved one encouraging her to find therapy would help a lot, but even so it is not something you solve with the only the help of a psychologist, she needs to be stabilized through medication before she can even think about sorting out her problems with a therapist.
When I say she's beyond "talking through" I am not saying she's beyond help, It's just that the issues we're seeing and will continue to see arise from this relationship are not something you can just solve with communication when it's obvious both of these girls need professional help.

 

[MURDERBEAR]

There could be a language barrier thing going on here, but what I meant back in my first comment is that you can't just talk Tomikawa through her problems, you can't just communicate good enough with her and everything ends up ok.
Yeah, a friend or loved one encouraging her to find therapy would help a lot, but even so it is not something you solve with the only the help of a psychologist, she needs to be stabilized through medication before she can even think about sorting out her problems with a therapist.
When I say she's beyond "talking through" I am not saying she's beyond help, It's just that the issues we're seeing and will continue to see arise from this relationship are not something you can just solve with communication when it's obvious both of these girls need professional help.

I think this is a language barrier thing, because

Tomikawa is so broken, dependent and hates herself so much that even if Hiiragi straight up said everything as it is, Tomikawa would still doubt her.

and

There's no way to get through someone like Tomikawa. There's no ammount of communication skills that could do it.

read less as "this person needs professional help" and more as "this person is beyond help."

I don't think anyone here is saying communication alone is enough to fix all her issues. That's a silly, almost pseudoscientific idea. The topic of mood stabilizers and therapy have been brought up multiple times. But you can't get someone to agree to meds and therapy if you can't first communicate with them. And there's no chance someone in Tomikawa's mindset just seeks out therapy and medication first, especially if she's deep in insisting there's nothing wrong with her at all.