Imasara desu ga, Osananajimi o Suki ni Natte Shimaimashita - Ch. 26.6 - My Happy Date (Normal Version)

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People can think all sorts of things especially in the heat of the moment. If it doesn't show and doesn't affect other people, it's not toxic. Can we at least agree on that?

I would've admitted you have a point here if the chapter ended with her "don't give in so easily..." line. But she continues on about his kindness and looking after her, which is incompatible with "going with the flow" imo.


We sure aren't. She was the one who didn't sleep for three days in their trip because sleeping would mean losing precious time with him, she was the one seriously proposing to live together. He was in love with her, but definitely not as strongly as she was with him.

That's a bold statement, I hope you at least read the novel version to be able to claim having read the series?

I wasn't saying those were rational, I was simply saying that "X harmed Y" or "X acted maliciously towards Y" are interpretations, not facts.

Which arguments are weak?

If you check my first comment in this chain, I was talking about just that - that I dislike the whole discussion being about "who is to blame?". I enjoy observing characters and empathizing with them instead of being a moral judge. That's also why I can tell that character X might've been hurt by character Y, instead of going reeeee X is innocent and Y is guilty.
I've responded to you as best I can. I think that claiming that Yuu "didn't treat Yami as seriously as she did him" is patently false. She was the one that told him that she is using him for pleasure and that rejected his advances when he tried to escalate. That's why I say that she is inconsistent, she says one thing, but does another. She jokes about commitment and is almost never genuine. AKA leading him on and then, finally, ghosting him. Because she is not serious enough about him to not use him.
She was the one who didn't sleep for three days in their trip because sleeping would mean losing precious time with him
Because she was about to ghost him and was quite literally using him for temporary pleasure? You cant be serious. He expected to continue the relationship, while she was planning to "break up" (read: cowardly ghost).

It seems that you're just as bad at reading comments as you are the series you're arguing about. Furthermore, I think that claiming that Yuu "acted maliciously" by being assaulted is a terrible argument that you're trying to make seem legitimate. Hence, my claim that your arguments are weak.

I greatly question the moral character of most readers of this manga ever since Yami was introduced and you've certainly not helped dispel that notion.

Edit;
Also, this is your idea of Yuu rejecting living with her? This has to be the wildest grasp at straws I've seen in a while. She's literally being deliberately dishonest with him and plays it off as a joke. He could never really tell when she was being serious, because she kept sending him mixed signals, as illustrated below. He never rejected her and she made it seem like it was silly. This is also one of her most selfish moments in the entire series imo: she "wanted him all to herself" for a brief time while planning to discard him. This part is not subjective, those were her intent and her actions, as shown by the story.
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He was actually considering it here lmao, poor sod
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that she is inconsistent, she says one thing, but does another
Yeah, I can agree with that, except her words are usually playful/not serious, while her actions and thoughts are as serious as it gets.
Because she was about to ghost him and was quite literally using him for temporary pleasure?
I suggest that you actually read the novel chapter. Temporary pleasure, sure.
claiming that Yuu "acted maliciously" by being assaulted is a terrible argument that you're trying to make seem legitimate
Where did I say that? If reading comments is your forte, please quote me on that.
Also, this is your idea of Yuu rejecting living with her? This has to be the wildest grasp at straws I've seen in a while. She's literally being deliberately dishonest with him and plays it off as a joke.
Again, read the novel chapter. He is not "rejecting" it, he isn't even considering it, no reaction whatsoever. If your girlfriend you're very serious about proposes living together, you get excited about it or you think it's way too early and start thinking how to reject it softly, but you do have some reaction even if you think it's likely a joke.
 
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Yeah, I can agree with that, except her words are usually playful/not serious, while her actions and thoughts are as serious as it gets.

I suggest that you actually read the novel chapter. Temporary pleasure, sure.

Where did I say that? If reading comments is your forte, please quote me on that.

Again, read the novel chapter. He is not "rejecting" it, he isn't even considering it, no reaction whatsoever. If your girlfriend you're very serious about proposes living together, you get excited about it or you think it's way too early and start thinking how to reject it softly, but you do have some reaction even if you think it's likely a joke.
Yeah, no shit he is not considering it, because he treats it as a joke. She plays it off as a joke. Again, focusing on the most minute detail with an incredibly disingenuous interpretation while she literally plans to discard him. Yes, she is lying to herself, but those are her actions.

Either way, I knew you had to be a Yami simp or someone who excuses her bad behavior with the most absurd interpretations. It just makes sense based on what you focus your attention on. I've said all I can here, beyond this I fear it is hopeless. But at least I've made clear my response to you.

I appreciate your willingness to banter, even if we disagree.

Edit: Here's the webnovel version of the events. It's one to one. Note how he doesnt reject her. And note how she acknowledges that she is being inconsistent with him "So, I do what I always do -- I change course." Also, note how she calls him a "boy toy." That's how she is treating him, regardless of how much she is pining over him on the inside. It's frankly gross. "Teasing him like the younger guy he is, pretending to be the lazy, carefree girl who lives for the moment." Certainly screams of treating him seriously. Well, the giant "I will lead him on and abandon him" elephant in the room aside.

"Hey, Yuu."
"Hm?"


Even thinking about the trip back, about saying goodbye... I hate it.


"Wanna live together?"
"...What?"


One second... two...


Yuu’s blank expression...
It doesn’t change at all.


It wasn’t surprise, or a sudden realization, or anything that felt serious.
It was just blank, dazed, with no expectations, and no possibilities at all.


"So yeah, I'll make you my boy toy, and we can just live a carefree life together! Haha!"
"Agh! You're lying again!"


So, I do what I always do -- I change course.


"Not that I expect you to get it. You're in the middle of your bright, shiny youth, after all."
"You're the same age, you know!"


I let go of his hand and poke his nose playfully.
Teasing him like the younger guy he is, pretending to be the lazy, carefree girl who lives for the moment.


This is fine......
No, this is what I decided from the start.
So why am I wavering now?


"So, what do you wanna do for dinner, Yami-senpai?"
"Why bother? Let's just spend the whole night tangled up like this."
"At least order room service or something!"
"Ugh, such a hassle..."
"You're the laziest person alive."
 
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Not yet, I'm still waiting for you to quote me on "Yuu acting maliciously" or me defending that kind of thinking.
An amnesiac I take it?
Yuu hurt Yami by not treating their relationship as seriously as she did
Patently false, since it's an interpretation basing itself on something that is untrue. A distinction that you've repeatedly failed to see: the fact that people can get their facts wrong, leading to absurd interpretations.
Fact: Yuu met Yami in their classroom and it led to her kissing him and Hikari seeing that kiss
Interpretation: Yuu/Hikari/Yami got hurt by what happened in that classroom, Yami/Hikari/Yuu acted maliciously, Yami/Hikari/Yuu harmed another
You are trying to make it seem like this is a valid interpretation lmao. When Yuu never acted maliciously, indeed never acted at all in the classroom but was rather assaulted. I've already addressed these. When it comes to him later withholding this information from Hikari, I've also made it clear that he was never shown to act with malicious intent.
In the whole manga there was only one attempt to "maliciously" harm another, and that was Yami to Hikari in chapter 33.
Here's one I havent addressed. A bit silly isnt it, considering what she did to Yuu? Literally in the images I've posted above where she plans to hurt him. And consequently does, including violent assault. She admits to knowing that this will hurt him. In fact, it's by far the clearest case of malicious harm in the entire series to any lucid reader. But I guess lucidity is up to interpretation, so I'll leave you to your opinions.
 
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An amnesiac I take it?
Where is "malice" in this quote?
Patently false, since it's an interpretation basing itself on something that is untrue.
What's untrue? Is there something in Yami's narration that contradicts this?
The problem here is that you're judging characters from your own moral high ground, while I was talking about how character X felt hurt by character Y. You intepret this situation as "Yuu did nothing wrong hence he couldn't hurt Yami" or something along the lines. The actual characters, on the other hand, have their own perspectives, feelings and emotions. They can be easily feel hurt by something you think is "untrue".
You are trying to make it seem like this is a valid interpretation lmao.
As I stated already, it was an example of interpretation, I didn't say anything about its' validity or rationality:
I wasn't saying those were rational, I was simply saying that "X harmed Y" or "X acted maliciously towards Y" are interpretations, not facts.

A bit silly isnt it, considering what she did to Yuu? Literally in the images I've posted above where she plans to hurt him. And consequently does, including violent assault. She admits to knowing that this will hurt him.
You know what malice is, right? In your opinion, does she want to hurt him? Does she harbor an ill will against him?
 
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Where is "malice" in this quote?

What's untrue? Is there something in Yami's narration that contradicts this?
The problem here is that you're judging characters from your own moral high ground, while I was talking about how character X felt hurt by character Y. You intepret this situation as "Yuu did nothing wrong hence he couldn't hurt Yami" or something along the lines. The actual characters, on the other hand, have their own perspectives, feelings and emotions. They can be easily feel hurt by something you think is "untrue".

As I stated already, it was an example of interpretation, I didn't say anything about its' validity or rationality:



You know what malice is, right? In your opinion, does she want to hurt him? Does she harbor an ill will against him?
This is just silly. Knowingly planning to and actively harming someone is malicious. AKA, planning to ghost someone while clearly being shown to realize how that will affect said person. Walking up to someone and slapping them is harm with malicious intent, the intent to cause pain. Both done by the same person you've tried to claim was "harmed" by Yuu by incorrectly claiming that he "rejected her" and wasnt taking the relationship seriously lol. These are active actions, implying that that he was knowingly hurting her (of course he never hurt her at all). You still havent addressed my response to that, including the passage from the novel. I'd like to see the mental gymnastics you'll pull to make it seem like Yuu is in any way at fault with that while downplaying what she did.

However, I'm probably not gonna engage with this redditor "umm ackchually harm doesnt exist" shit any further. There is a clear distinction between someone acting with the intent to harm someone else and someone getting upset at circumstances. This is an objective distinction, btw. Any rational person can see that. And yes, just because you will have people arguing that gravity doesnt exist doesnt make it any less an objective truth. These two things are different. You may be a weirdo who treats someone being harmed by circumstances (indeed circumstances she created) as being worse than someone actively harming another when ascribing blame, that may be your subjective rating, but they are nonetheless objectively different.

If in doubt, just read what I've already written before. It's already more than extensive enough. It also addresses what you've written.
 
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I'm in agreement that the Yuu-Yami dynamic was the most interesting since you had the trainwreck girlfriend and simp boyfriend who'd do anything for her. You had two flawed people licking each others wounds that you know was only going to end poorly but they were happily depressed together, which is romantic in a special way I suppose.
Yes, all that dark, emo, and vein cutter energy definitely gave Yuu and Yami charisma as a couple. Anyway, I repeat, I wouldn't call Yuu a "simp boyfriend". If anything was clear in his relationship with Yami, it's that Yami fucked with Yuu a lot of times. I call him a "submissive boyfriend", or better yet, a submissive servant of the dominatrix Yami. This femdom approach explains a lot about them, and besides how Yami was literally the man in that relationship, it would explain why the author gave him that androgynous hairstyle and appearance... so similar to Ai Kamiya from Shikimori-san.
But yes, is very possible Yami would have even pegged Yuu in some point of their short relationship.
It is 100% copium to say Hikari doesn't want Yuu, I'm hoping for her sake that she gets over him and realizes that he's a waste of time.
It's exactly the other way around. Hikari doesn't deserve someone as good as Yuu, and she's a waste of time for him.
Hikari is a little dumb and a little thick, but at the end of the day I don't think she really deserved all the hand she was dealt. How was she supposed to know that him not getting into the school would be such a major catastrophic blow to their relationship?
I don't blame her for that. I blame her for getting involved with someone like Yami. If anyone really raised red flags, it was Yami, and yet Hikari insisted on being her friend even after Yami tried to prostitute her. If Hikari hadn't become friends with Yami, Yami would never have seen Yuu again, just as she herself planned.
And honestly, Hikari was incredibly insensitive about the whole school transfer thing, all to be Yuu's supposed best friend. Her character is largely about that —not just her being naive, but her being EGOIST, as the author himself called her in X/Twitter.
I understand that she also has an opportunity to confess instead of playing these games, but how the fuck was she supposed to know about all these hurdles Yuu set up for himself (honestly my most hated trope).

So yeah, I can't help but feel bad for Hikari bc she had an innocent, dumb crush, while Yuu's being an actual indecisive dumbass and immediately fell for an emotional trainwreck with a fuck ton of baggage
That's the point, Yuu isn't really indecisive, the guy always makes clear and coherent decisions with the limited information he has, in fact the funny thing about chapter 40 is that Yami explodes at him precisely because he DECIDED to choose Hikari over her - and because he was already fed up enough with Yami's crap to insist. Honestly even me expected from indecisiveness from his part in that point.
I also don't think no yuu == sexless, unless by dying sexless you mean she takes her own life. If she loses Yuu, she will spiral in some way, most likely finding guy after guy to soothe her loneliness and fill the void without emotional attachment to anyone.
The point of Yami's character is that she simply can't do that, even if she tries. That's why her terrifying gaze gave Yuu an erectile dysfunction during their first attempt at sex in chapter 24. Even Hikari made it clear in chapter 41 ("I know you're not that kind of person, Aya-chan"): Ayami can't have sex with someone without an emotional connection. Without that emotional connection, just like Yuu and Hikari, she simply doesn't work. She's as demisexual as they are. As much, she'd be a dead-eyed Sayu being more raped than fucked. Nothing remotely as satisfying as "her heavenly days" with Yuu.
So, for everyone's sake I'm hoping everyone stays friends, Yuu needs to grow a spine and a pair, Hikari needs to treat herself better and find someone that isn't indecisive and knows what he wants, and Yami just needs a friend before she should get into another relationship.
I mean, Yami got a friend in Hikari and it was Yami herself who kicked off Hikari when she could be honest with her about Yuu. And Yuu is definitely becoming more valiant and proving he really has a spine and a pair of balls after all, he is progresively being less coward and developing himself as person. But yes, he always will be a submissive boy. The point here is he has to be brave to can be even the submissive boyfriend/husband of the dominatrix Yami.
Like Haruki Kitahara (my profile´s avatar) in the Coda True End of White Album 2 with Kazusa Touma.
 
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This is just silly. Knowingly planning to and actively harming someone is malicious. AKA, planning to ghost someone while clearly being shown to realize how that will affect said person.
Yes, that's the joke. GennArc and I think Yami was being honest at this point. Or at least he expressed that opinion in the past; I don't know if he changed his mind. That Yami wasn't planning to ghost Yuu at this point, even if she felt disappointed and hurt by his —apparent— lack of reaction.
What happened to cause such a radical change in the mini time-skip between chapters 28 and 29 was that Yami received a phone call, probably at the beginning of the second day, notifying her from the hospital about her mother's suicide attempt. This is what changed everything. This is important because Yami is never fully capable of lying to herself or to Yuu at the same time (for example, in chapter 23 she can lie to herself, but her words to Yuu leave clear she was really interested emotionally in him and as a good tsundere she didn´t want to recognize it).
His pressure to demand honesty about her family affects her deeply emotionally, this is symbolized by his gesture to squeeze her fingers after she holds his hand -as a symbol of their femdom relationship-. Therefore, when her thoughts and words are aligned with her genuinely believing that everything in her family is resolved and that she can stay by Yuu's side, she's being honest.
The scene where she acknowledges to herself that she is lying when she calls Yuu "I will make you my boy toy" - and yes, she uses that derogatory term so that Yuu realizes that she is lying, and he does - is an example of how in the previous scenes she was honest and sincere with him.
Both done by the same person you've tried to claim was "harmed" by Yuu by incorrectly claiming that he "rejected her" and wasnt taking the relationship seriously lol. These are active actions, implying that that he was knowingly hurting her (of course he never hurt her at all).
Ayami is, in theory, even worse than an openly malicious person (except for chapter 33 and her final action in chapter 40, when she decided to kiss Yuu after seeing the cowardly Hikari spying on them at the door). Ayami is a mentally very unstable girl after all the trauma she suffered, and it's clear she doesn't know what she really wants or desires. Worse still, she doesn't know how to directly express her feelings to Yuu, which is why she resorts to sex to show with actions what she can't say to him with words —and he correctly detects this and attempts to see through her mask and fix her.
That's why she not only wants to hurt others, she wants to hurt herself as well. That energy of "we will inflict deep wounds on our hearts, Yuu". And precisely because she is being sincere in several points and she really loves him, she ends being more toxic and abusive with Yuu than she would have been if she always would have planned manipulate him and later throw him. So, she cannot love Yuu if she cannot love herself.
Hence, she's serious about Yuu, but she can't fully open up to him emotionally, she can't fully express her true feelings to him neither trust fully on him. That's why Yuu constantly pressures her to have a formal relationship, and most importantly, he succeeds, which is why Yami calls Yuu "my boyfriend" in chapter 28.
And the funny thing is, this also happens in reverse; I think that's what GennArc is saying.
I'd like to see the mental gymnastics you'll pull to make it seem like Yuu is in any way at fault with that while downplaying what she did.
Objectively, IMO, Yuu didn't hurt Yami, but he also failed to fully convey to Yami how seriously he was involved in the relationship (and again, it didn't help that Yami is, ahem, crazy). That's why we see in chapter 26 the fears of Yami that Yuu is only with her because Hikari sent him to the friend-zone.
That's why Yami gets upset by Yuu's apparent lack of reaction in chapter 28. In that scene, whatever he was thinking, it was undoubtedly that obvious lack of visible reaction that made Yami think he wasn't taking her offer seriously. If Yuu wanted to hide his thoughts behind that poker face Yami taught him to use, he completely messed up here. Which, of course, still doesn't justify Yami's subsequent actions at all. But let's accept that Yuu did make a mistake here, and that's perfectly understandable, and that it was Yami's responsibility to clarify that she was serious. Out of her own tsundere pride, she refused to do so and instead turned it into a "joke."
Yami's actions in chapter 40 are also more of a mental breakdown than a deliberately malicious intention to hurt someone. She makes it quite clear in her internal monologue, both in the novel and the manga, that she knows she's being incredibly unfair to Yuu and accusing him of things he's not actually responsible for, expecting him to be some kind of fairytale prince who would magically find her during her ghosting, with her actively avoiding him. It's hypocritical and immature of her, and as already mentioned, other proof that she should be in a psychiatric hospital right now.
There is a clear distinction between someone acting with the intent to harm someone else and someone getting upset at circumstances. This is an objective distinction, btw. Any rational person can see that.
Yes, that's the joke; Yami is anything but a rational person right now. The girl believes Yuu hurt her when in reality he didn't, and she knows perfectly well that he's actually innocent of her incoherent accusations of "not fighting hard enough for me." It doesn't help that Hikari, the masochistic pimp, did show more of that "resilience"—and yes, this would be the upside of Hikari's emotional insensitivity; it made her more capable of dealing emotionally with "Aya-chan."
And yes, just because you will have people arguing that gravity doesnt exist doesnt make it any less an objective truth. These two things are different. You may be a weirdo who treats someone being harmed by circumstances (indeed circumstances she created) as being worse than someone actively harming another when ascribing blame, that may be your subjective rating, but they are nonetheless objectively different.
Genn never said Yuu is worse than Yami in any sense, and I dare you to show a quote when he really says in the page Yuu is worse than Ayami. He only said maybe Yuu is not 100% innocent and non-guilty by the collapse of his relationship with Yami, even if the main fault is still from her. However, it's silly to blame him for being a 15-year-old boy who doesn't quite grasp a hint, which is a fairly human and understandable mistake on his part, and it was Yami's responsibility to clarify that she was serious.
 
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Continuing with the parallels, the personality of Hikari is more easier to understand if we work following the theory of Hikari as an Expy of the character of the same name from School Days in both VN and Anime.
Being Hikari Kuroda also the childhood friend of the male protagonist, also a tomboyish girl with twintails, also good in studies and sports, also childish in personality, and originally not interested romantically/sexually in Makoto and only got interested on him after he got a girlfriend -and later he lost the virginity with Sekai-.
Hikari Shirasawa would be an improved version from this character -and, of course, doesn´t being disposed to accept being in a polygamous relationship, at least for now, of course-.
 
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Yes, that's the joke. GennArc and I think Yami was being honest at this point. Or at least he expressed that opinion in the past; I don't know if he changed his mind. That Yami wasn't planning to ghost Yuu at this point, even if she felt disappointed and hurt by his —apparent— lack of reaction.
What happened to cause such a radical change in the mini time-skip between chapters 28 and 29 was that Yami received a phone call, probably at the beginning of the second day, notifying her from the hospital about her mother's suicide attempt. This is what changed everything. This is important because Yami is never fully capable of lying to herself or to Yuu at the same time (for example, in chapter 23 she can lie to herself, but her words to Yuu leave clear she was really interested emotionally in him and as a good tsundere she didn´t want to recognize it).
His pressure to demand honesty about her family affects her deeply emotionally, this is symbolized by his gesture to squeeze her fingers after she holds his hand -as a symbol of their femdom relationship-. Therefore, when her thoughts and words are aligned with her genuinely believing that everything in her family is resolved and that she can stay by Yuu's side, she's being honest.
The scene where she acknowledges to herself that she is lying when she calls Yuu "I will make you my boy toy" - and yes, she uses that derogatory term so that Yuu realizes that she is lying, and he does - is an example of how in the previous scenes she was honest and sincere with him.

Ayami is, in theory, even worse than an openly malicious person (except for chapter 33 and her final action in chapter 40, when she decided to kiss Yuu after seeing the cowardly Hikari spying on them at the door). Ayami is a mentally very unstable girl after all the trauma she suffered, and it's clear she doesn't know what she really wants or desires. Worse still, she doesn't know how to directly express her feelings to Yuu, which is why she resorts to sex to show with actions what she can't say to him with words —and he correctly detects this and attempts to see through her mask and fix her.
That's why she not only wants to hurt others, she wants to hurt herself as well. That energy of "we will inflict deep wounds on our hearts, Yuu". And precisely because she is being sincere in several points and she really loves him, she ends being more toxic and abusive with Yuu than she would have been if she always would have planned manipulate him and later throw him. So, she cannot love Yuu if she cannot love herself.
Hence, she's serious about Yuu, but she can't fully open up to him emotionally, she can't fully express her true feelings to him neither trust fully on him. That's why Yuu constantly pressures her to have a formal relationship, and most importantly, he succeeds, which is why Yami calls Yuu "my boyfriend" in chapter 28.
And the funny thing is, this also happens in reverse; I think that's what GennArc is saying.

Objectively, IMO, Yuu didn't hurt Yami, but he also failed to fully convey to Yami how seriously he was involved in the relationship (and again, it didn't help that Yami is, ahem, crazy). That's why we see in chapter 26 the fears of Yami that Yuu is only with her because Hikari sent him to the friend-zone.
That's why Yami gets upset by Yuu's apparent lack of reaction in chapter 28. In that scene, whatever he was thinking, it was undoubtedly that obvious lack of visible reaction that made Yami think he wasn't taking her offer seriously. If Yuu wanted to hide his thoughts behind that poker face Yami taught him to use, he completely messed up here. Which, of course, still doesn't justify Yami's subsequent actions at all. But let's accept that Yuu did make a mistake here, and that's perfectly understandable, and that it was Yami's responsibility to clarify that she was serious. Out of her own tsundere pride, she refused to do so and instead turned it into a "joke."
Yami's actions in chapter 40 are also more of a mental breakdown than a deliberately malicious intention to hurt someone. She makes it quite clear in her internal monologue, both in the novel and the manga, that she knows she's being incredibly unfair to Yuu and accusing him of things he's not actually responsible for, expecting him to be some kind of fairytale prince who would magically find her during her ghosting, with her actively avoiding him. It's hypocritical and immature of her, and as already mentioned, other proof that she should be in a psychiatric hospital right now.

Yes, that's the joke; Yami is anything but a rational person right now. The girl believes Yuu hurt her when in reality he didn't, and she knows perfectly well that he's actually innocent of her incoherent accusations of "not fighting hard enough for me." It doesn't help that Hikari, the masochistic pimp, did show more of that "resilience"—and yes, this would be the upside of Hikari's emotional insensitivity; it made her more capable of dealing emotionally with "Aya-chan."

Genn never said Yuu is worse than Yami in any sense, and I dare you to show a quote when he really says in the page Yuu is worse than Ayami. He only said maybe Yuu is not 100% innocent and non-guilty by the collapse of his relationship with Yami, even if the main fault is still from her. However, it's silly to blame him for being a 15-year-old boy who doesn't quite grasp a hint, which is a fairly human and understandable mistake on his part, and it was Yami's responsibility to clarify that she was serious.
I was defending my position of arguing with others who claimed that Yuu was worse than Yami. My point was that it's absurd to get hung up on semantics about my use of the word "objectively" in one sentence when you've had opinions like that being expressed. While he never adopted their stance fully, he tried to make those claims seem legitimate, hence me responding:
Furthermore, I think that claiming that Yuu "acted maliciously" by being assaulted is a terrible argument that you're trying to make seem legitimate. Hence, my claim that your arguments are weak.
Not to mention the below denial of Yami harming Yuu from Genn:
"In the whole manga there was only one attempt to "maliciously" harm another, and that was Yami to Hikari in chapter 33."

Beyond that, I responded to him claiming that Yuu hurt Yami, AKA acted maliciously towards her, which he didnt. He provided his "evidence": "Yuu took the relationship less seriously than Yami and rejected her desire to live together." Which is, of course, an absurd interpretation based on false grounds, as I've made clear above. It also makes a clear, backwards distinction between the two characters: "Yuu acted poorly towards Yami," and "Yami took him seriously," directly contradicting her actions towards him and making her seem like a victim rather than the abuser.

Before all of this side-railing, this boiled down to a very simple discussion: I claimed that Yuu was the only person here who has any genuine right to claim that he was harmed. That's my opinion that I based on the fact that he was the only person who was maliciously harmed (knowingly and deliberately), mainly by Yami but also by Hikari, who pushed him and refused to hear him out while knowing what he went through. One case of genuine abuse and assault and another case of deliberate lack of consideration and also assault. Things that he has not been shown to be guilty of. Then the discussion went into how Yuu "wasnt harmed or assaulted," how what happened to him is the same as being "rejected on a dating app" and how it is "his own fault for being led on." And, of course, how Yuu hurt Yami more than vice versa. That's what I was arguing against, before it was all derailed by Mr Genn over here who thought that it was more important to argue semantics and who provided rather odd interpretations, which in many ways align with the sentiment of those I was arguing against, which of course makes sense.

So yeah, without adding more to this discussion:
I think that Yami acted maliciously towards Yuu and I dont think that he did so towards her. Nor do I think he did so towards Hikari. I think it's absurd to claim that he was malicious in any way towards any of the other two and I think it's absurd to blame him for being a victim of Yami, as was stated by at least two people earlier in this discussion. I also think it's absurd to claim that Yami wasn't malicious when she deliberately lied to him about their relationsip, ghosted him and later assaulted him.

This is my interpretation, based on facts that I've already detailed extensively, with screenshots of the manga and with a passage from the novel. If anyone wants to claim that "they were all equally to blame and no one was worse to the other" I think that this is patently false when looking at the facts. But everyone is free to have their own opinion, whatever makes them enjoy their characters the most. Because that's what this boils down to imo, a desire to make the girls and the circumstances seem more palatable when they really arent in this incident. It's easier for people who like these characters to pin the blame on the non-descript male character. Or, because it's hard to admit that the girls alone are bad, they make it easier for themselves by deluding themselves with "yeah they are bad, but everyone is equally shitty." That's my interpretation of the people engaging with this discussion and I suppose that no matter how much I provide basis for my interpretations, applying common sense and extracts from the story, people are just gonna stick to their absurd statements since this is their coping strategy for what's happening in this dumpster fire of a story xD
 
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