Beatrice - Vol. 1 Ch. 9

[semicharmed]

These instagram clout chasers honestly don't care, it's sad but it's true. I've seen one instagram clout chaser say "if they send me a long message i won't read it lol" these type of people just don't care about scanlating groups and the community and the culture behind it. It's all just for that internet points which makes me feel sorry for them as it is all they have. Posting their instagram pages with their handles even if you don't want some sort of brigade, people could still interpret it that way, and people who think they have nothing but good intentions will take it upon their selves to "help" you. You can't just go hands off and say "it's their own accord" when there's an instigation. The Instagram clout chasers will never get it through their thick skull.

That being said I understand the outrage out of fear of authors and their publishing companies finding out. Though I think authors react differently. Ishida Sui of Tokyo Ghoul, I distinctly remember, had tweets for international fans saying to please not to tag him about the new chapter since he didn't want to spoil his jpn audience this is bc JB scans puts out chapters for TG days before its official release in japan. What I got from these tweets is that he didn't even mention that it was piracy, I'm sure it's just an open secret among wsj authors that they know. But then again what's a small webtoon author compared to a multi-million author from a big publishing company? Though I still think author's will react differently. I firmly believe the author for WMMAP knows bc of how massive it is. But I still I really understand the fear of it. And I don't want this series to stop updating.

I respect NASS a lot since they are the few of these groups who still post some of their scans publicly, and I read so much from you. You guys don't ask for money and post at an amazing s
pace, you don't get that a lot. Not that I don't read from groups who post exclusively to discord, but mangadex is more unified, there purpose is to have a unified space for manga and scanlators so I will always favor this. And the way discord is a live-relay chat makes it difficult for me to talk about chapters and opinions and of course the overarching fear of getting dogpiled on if I say something that people don't agree on. If you guys start posting on discord exclusively of course I'll abide but I will always have those thoughts.

With all that said I have to talk about the chapter.

No duke nipples: *sadness noises*
Chloe having the time of her life: *happiness noises*

Thank you nass for sharing it with us.

 

[TsubasaNoHana]

Dont understand why people still repost this to insta when it could threaten any of these translation to be stopped permanently by authors..

 

[proulout]

@TsubasaNoHana Simple, they don't care about the series or the scanlators. If one serie goes down because of the instagram sharing, it doesn't matter, there is plenty of other materials translated/edited by somes smucks for them to share.
All they're after is MOAR FOLLOWERS.

 

[ish131hxs]

I am scared 😞😞😞 what if they drop the project please don't 😭😭😭😭 . Thank you for the update.

 

[scarlet_summer]

Tsk3
There are kids that have itchy hands

 

[itsmae]

@RunyStarr Hello, I have read your comments and I believe we will never get on the same page about such things. However, I do agree with you that posting their Instagram handles on a designated channel will likely lead to harassment from NASS followers despite telling them not to harass them. As such I will be taking down the channel. Just for full transparency sake, I (and other admins) will continue to ask Instagram accounts to take down posts of our translations but will leave them alone if they chose to ignore us. There are however, a few things I would personally like to comment on.

You should have known better and the fact it took you 6 or so days to realize that is probably something you should look into.

These are more philosophical thoughts but I personally don't think a person should be judged by the time it took for them to acknowledge and recognize their mistakes. I think them being able to recognize the faults in their actions, despite the time it took them to get there, is more valuable than anything. I have recognized that I was in the wrong to post their server link and you have helped me in seeing that. For that, I would like to thank you.

But again you had to right to go bothering another group who was doing their own scanlation

I believe it is a pretty well-known fact that other groups should not be working on the same series that a group is already actively working on. It's generally known throughout the scanlation community that sniping is not okay and series should only be picked up after 3-6 months of inactivity from the original group. I understand that we don't legally own these series and such do not have any legal claim to them but it is rather disappointing to see another group sniping your series after you've spent 10-20 hours preparing that one chapter to be released. It's a lot of wasted efforts that scan groups just find unmotivating and disheartening. So I will stand by my decisions to call them out for sniping. If you do not support it, I understand. It's an exhausting issue. Let's just agree to disagree.

you're not allowed to give any kind of negative critique without the worry of being banned

I pride myself on the fact that NASS accepts criticism and I believe it allows for improvement. To list a few things that we have changed many of our translations when it did not please the readers (most notably Scarlet's title in "May I Please Ask You Just One Last Thing?"), we've redesigned our discord server according to critiques from readers in our early stages, we've provided near transparency when doing things that would affect NASS and its readers, and just recently after your criticisms, we are going to shut down the channel and handle things more privately.

I think we have both exhausted this comments thread so I will leave this now. You have a wonderful day.

 

[ririx]

@RunyStarr
Excuse me for bumping in, but I just wanted to make a small comment.

While I agree with certain things you have stated, I believe that you really need to consider the way you word your comments as well. There are a lot of ways to word things, but you used such a hostile/rude tone (e.g. refer to your first comment), it's just bound to "fire up" and offend individuals reading it, resulting in a negative reaction. While your words may have merit, presenting it in such a disrespectful way really backfires. Simply, if you want respect, then act respectful. Even if others are not respectful, do not stoop to their level. I think your real critique beyond the remarks is important since it offers another perspective on how to handle things; however, I believe your critiques would be viewed in a much better light if you voice your concerns in a more neutral manner.

 

[AkaiHidan]

I don't understand, your translations are avaliable anywhere on the internat, just by typing "Beatrice Chapter1" or something like that, thus, why posting them on instagram would be a problem? I mean, if your translations were private and protected with a password, I'd get it, but your scans are already everywhere, so why is *instagram* specifically a problem?
Btw, thanks for the chapters!

 

[Writerfromanotherstar]

@AkaiHidan BECAUSE IT'S ILLEGAL. And they'd have to stop translating. This is paid content on kakao (the raws). Beatrice and any other webtoon/Manhwa translated belongs to the artist/writer who did it, and these translations aren't legal/official (rights weren't bought). Spreading them on social media (specially ig since they have one) allows it to get to the writers,,

As @/proulout said below:

You may not be aware of this, but two month ago, the group secret land castle had to close down their website and stop scanlating the series chitra, because the autor noticed his series was scanlated, was furious and tried to sue them.
Guess how he got wind of this ? That's right, by the dumbasses that repost that shit and tag the autor on instagram.
You may understand the scanlators don't want to get in legal shenanigans more than necessary due to some attention seeking manchilds.

 

[Ifrittuccia]

Given that I haven't read the whole discussion, I want to remember one thing at all.
If you post chapters on social media, you are the first to be stupid.
Do you really believe that there will be no consequences for you?
Do you believe that facebook, twitter or istagram will not pass your data to the authorities in the event of a complaint?
At least try to use your brain when you do something, it's not like we are on the internet that the laws don't affect you but rather because the laws are confused (depending on the country of origin) there is more risk of paying the consequences.
Having said that although it is true that the team does not have the right if you want to upload the chapters you do it at your own risk but use your translations, even those who have no experience know that it takes time and effort to translate.
And know that in the past I have criticized NASS, who fortunately never sent me to that country or was banned, because they actually have no right to complain unfortunately.
One thing was if they had created another, it is to translate something without the author's permission, but I assure you of one thing.
For what little I have seen on their discord channel, users there are more polite than those who comment brutally on the comments here.
I hope that no one will take this comment of mine to shame, which gives both parties reason on certain points. 😅

 

[unkogr0l]

I feel like this Runny Star is just idk a soft entitled crackpot. That's not a valid argument but it's true and you know it.

 

[mechpolaris]

In short, warn those instagrammers of the possible consequences of their actions (cancel translation and scanlation) without harassment (sadly, it's still up to them)

I'm feeling Doctor Elise vibes from Chloe and being hailed as a genius while stubbornly ignoring any pampering of the Male Lead/s with their dense dilemma of "why am I so concerned about her" situation

 

[xtoramaru]

Hope y'all don't mind me throwing this thought out there.

NASS is being reprimanded for their 'harassment', but aren't the IG posters the ones who started 'harassing' them first by sniping and posting on social media? It feels like harassment, considering someone repeatedly sniped your work in any context where you've worked hard at it, and then refused to hear you out at all. The IG posts themselves are a form of harassment.

Especially since there are socially agreed on rules on scanlating that they are disregarding. When it comes to socially agreed upon rules, is it really wrong that NASS had told the readers involved and linked them? There is no such thing as 'social rules police', except for the readers themselves. It feels like telling NASS to just stop bothering them is like telling them to give up and let others step all over them, when those people are breaking the rules. Stopping the requests for them to stop might just make things worse, since they may think you've given up, and that they 'won'.

Or maybe I'm thinking of it all wrong... If so then please correct me.

 

[irina]

@xtoramaru
I agree with what you’re saying. NASS is not harassing the snipers (who are harassers themselves for not following the rules lol). Although, I do have to agree that it is a big discord community; hence, there will be some people who’ll take it too far.

However, that doesn’t mean the people that are stealing the chapters deserve any sort of immunity (not revealing their identity -ig account- as NASS did). That is like giving them a free pass. The account owners won’t act if they get *one dm* from the translator, for example, but they MIGHT act if they get hundreds from the readers in the NASS community. By stealing the scans & releasing them (to be found by the author and publisher) they are giving the OK to be found and exposed by the group. You want to repost the work of NASS? This is the price.

 

[ParagonNight]

Wait NASS is getting flacc for showing the IG accounts ? If its true thats fucking stupid. They already do this for free and just have a couple simple rules to follow. Just dont repost the work they've done. Idk why people dont understand that, its not like its out of greed or anything. There are very valid legal issues that can come up if the author doesnt want their work translated / didnt buy rights. Its not like they're against sharing the discord server just no the images.

@mechpolaris Thats not physically possible when they have stated that the IG accounts have ignored their DM's. This leads them with 2 options. Either stop translating the work / try password locking or ask the fans to hopefully politely tell them to stop. There will always be people who take things to far however NASS has very valid concerns.

@AkaiHidan I think of it like this, Instagram is similar to imgur with how it shows recommended work similar to what your looking at or other images that said person follows. Unlike manga/manwha aggrigators which you need to specifically go out of your way to find its much easier for a random person to find the stuff on IG. Meaning an author who follows fan work and or has an IG account might start seeing their translated work showing up their rather then random links leading to aggrigator sights. Basically its more likely the files on IG will be noticed rather than the ones on here.

 

[ParagonNight]

@RunnyStarr I just want to through my 2 cents on the topic of humiliating these IG accounts. The way you've worded your past posts it seems you find it so horrible that they've showed or "Humiliated" the IG accounts. It almost makes it seem like your saying poor IG accounts getting thrown under the buss however let me say this. They are trying to not get sued / get into legal issues with Copyright holder. EVEN BEYOND THAT the IG accounts have no respect from me. They are stealing work other people have done (Translations) whether it be legal or not and posting it for their own benefit. That is so low and they know what they are doing since (prob for the benefit of NASS due to potential legal issues) they're not crediting. It would be the same as stealing art and then gaining followers/money of that. As far as I am concerned that kind of person deserves to be called out. Of course thats if we ignore all the other issues with them reposing and the intent from NASS.

You also said this "Do scanlators deserve respect? Yeah but stuff like this makes is an automatic 'lose all respect' from me" which I find ironic since the IG accounts are showing no respect to the translators at all by honoring their simple requests. So why should they show them respect.

TLDR: IG accounts that steal / repost or ignore the wishes of translators deserve no respect and are frankly allowed to be called out if they ignore the groups in my book. Just saying. Also im very cynical so I assume the worse in intentions from all parties

 

[RunyStarr]

I feel like I should make it know I don't use instagram. And I do have problems with sharing artists (and translators) work without consent, but I don't think that justifies bothering them to this level especially when you don't own the work and only the translation. I feel like there are other ways to keep your works safe other than asking a discord server of 12k to tell insta users to take it down or posting screenshots of these users in an attempt to humiliate them. Other methods include: Not having the scanlation be under a specific group, using aliases or throwaway accounts, putting it on a site and password protecting it, putting it on Reddit instead of MD, using a VPN (if you're paranoid like me). Making sure people can only access your discord through affiliate groups (I think you might already do this).

Like these are genuine ways to keep yourself protected. The idea that Instagram users should be hunted down when aggregator sites (which makes actual money off your work) and pinterest exist just makes it feel like this is just a way of venting frustration out on someone you can actually get to. Just a theory. As for the idea of 'instagram causes us to get found out by the authors', it's understood you're more likely to be found out by looking up the name of the story on google right?

Also, I do wanna say
@ririx
You're absolutely right. I should have acted better and not freaked out so bad. Not an excuse but reason I did so is because in most scanlation group discords you feel like you can't say much. I saw someone get made fun of yesterday in the SLC discord for asking if they could do either shorter passwords or a copy and paste function because it was hard for them to type out (I believe). And you continuously just see things get worse and worse in a specific group and they are given warnings to pull back and then they pulled something like this. I got angry and frustrated because no one understood they kept going too far until they had. I will absolutely give Mae credit for handling this conversation very well and certainly better than I originally did as I still remember the LLS thing from April and this went a lot better than that.

 

[charkan]

It is quite simple to define the problem. Social networking spreads like wildfire and most authors have a social networking account. Authors sometimes don't even know that there are sites like mangadex or he knows that the target audience who pays to read does not visit such sites but visits social networks. Did you understand the logic of their complaint? I see no rudeness in these complaints.

The problem is that there are people on social networks who love to post recommendations links to their followers and then don't understand why the story stopped translating due to their actions.

 

[Angelsun]

At this point, I wouldn’t mind if NASS stop posting for awhile or ever. These clout seeking instagrammers had been asked politely over and over to stop reposting. Sure there may have been a few who stepped out of line when calling them out, but this wouldn’t have happened if they simply follow the rules NASS clearly stated. Being called out like this isn’t as bad as potentially getting sued. NASS worked hard to translate these chapters FOR FREE. All they asked was to not repost the chapters on Instagram or any social media platform. I have no sympathy for these instagrammers who cannot or choose not to follow such simple rules.

 

[pianistlover]

I wouldn't mind giant obnoxious watermarks on every page, if it would prevent them from sharing on social media.