Haha Naru Umi - Oneshot

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What, you're assuming a lot of thing (if not most of them) and think it's acceptable to assume as such when it really isn't. There are enough clues to tell you what the story is (although a bit fairy tale) but you're just acting like you can't read to attack the story with wrongs points. But at least you are not alone.
What points of mine are wrong, then? If you can find some, please correct them. Or at least point them out for me. I'll understand what you want to say better that way, and I'll be able to discuss them with you, or at least answer your critique.

Because right now, you're just saying I'm wrong without argumentation. What "lot of things" I assume are wrong to assume, or why would everything I assume be wrong to assume? Just because you can see the clues in the story doesn't mean I can or that I will see the same clues as you. Please be more precise. What are the "clues" you are talking about? What are the clues you've seen? Let's share our povs on this story, then.
What points of mine are wrong specifically? Please argue why they are wrong. I'd like to be able to understand if I said something wrong and why, to avoid making the same mistake in the future, and to apologise for it in case you need an apology, and perhaps to rectify my previous statements about this story if it becomes necessary to me.

I actually would like to amend my statement if I was wrong, but if you don't point out what's wrong specifically, I can't do it. And just saying I was wrong but not where or why doesn't help me to resolve the issue.

Thanks. 😊
 
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What points of mine are wrong, then? If you can find some, please correct them. Or at least point them out for me. I'll understand what you want to say better that way.
When you saw p4 you can't really say they are middle school students can you? If the art was like Hino-chan I can understand but this is going a little far. If this is not convincing enough maybe the difference in uniform in p9 can tell you she is not in middle school anymore (she got asked out a more lot in middle school but we nerver know when she started sleeping with people). Of course maybe their school changed uniform or they both changed school, but the last page's fashion give of a more mature vibe. But seriously the height is a dead giveaway.
P10 said her parents want to support her but she will only turn to them as a last ressort.
You are also assuming their situation and how things are (or would be) for them (while not knowing about it).
The theme is heavy, hit a little too close to home and is also well understood (with a where and how, that's important) so it is understandable people would criticize it with their knowledge of said theme. But is the knowledge still relevant despite a change a situation? How much is still relevant? Hard to say.

It is understandable why the story make people uncomfortable but using eveything as ammo and acting blind to push your agenda and feel better is disgusting.
 
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When you saw p4 you can't really say they are middle school students can you?
? Nothing tells me anything about their grade on page four. Is it the "Math III" written in the book cover? How am I supposed to know which grade that represents? You could have a math III theme in primary school too, so I don't see your point here.

the difference in uniform in p9 can tell you she is not in middle school anymore (she got asked out a more lot in middle school but we nerver know when she started sleeping with people). Of course maybe their school changed uniform or they both changed school, but the last page's fashion give of a more mature vibe. But seriously the height is a dead giveaway.
That's kinda true, but the only changing detail is the knot instead of the usual necktie in one of the illustrations. Before that, they're drawn as toddlers with neither, so we only have one little drawing of her with a knot instead of a ribbon compared to all the neckties and all the nothings from younger than middle school.
So asking me to understand this is not happening in middle school when the "clues" are so sparse, that's kinda pushing it.

But I agree with you on this, and I already amended my statement saying, "Edit disclaimer: She's already gotten past middle school, so most of what I said in the spoiler comes from a wrong assumption." Meaning that most of what I said after that was kinda useless, although the critique about having a child not in middle school but in high school still stands, it's still way less disturbing and problematic than how I talked about it in the end.
You are also assuming their situation and how things are (or would be) for them (while not knowing about it).
I mean, they're not explaining how they're going to do things in the future, and since I live in reality, I'm simply imagining how things would go: They'll have a harsh life ahead of them, not like what the rosy end is leading us to think. At that point, it's totally normal to assume, and that's the only thing I can do. The only difference is how others will assume different things, so it's normal people aren't all going to agree with my vision of things in this story.

The theme is heavy, hit a little too close to home and is also well understood (with a where and how, that's important) so it is understandable people would criticize it with their knowledge of said theme. But is the knowledge still relevant despite a change a situation? How much is still relevant? Hard to say.
What change in situation? All knowledge that can be linked to this "situation" (story) is statistics on how hard it is to have a child at that age and educate it. Statistics on abortions at that age. And other stuff. But I don't know those numbers; I'm just convinced life isn't that rosy, that's all.
If you can't prove me with facts that I'm wrong, or I can't prove you I'm right with facts and examples (the numbers I just mentioned, for ex., or even better, interviews of auxiliary midwives or related personnel to childbirth and childcare), then we're only going to exchange our biased views on the matter, and that won't lead our discussion very far, unfortunately. No big deal though; at least we know where we both stand and how far this argument can go. That's already pretty cool.
It is understandable why the story make people uncomfortable but using eveything as ammo and acting blind to push your agenda and feel better is disgusting.
Well, that's true; I'll give you that. But I'm not really acting blind, am I?

Anyway, it's true I wrote my initial comment to feel better. But my goal was not to trash around the story without reason; it was to express why I felt bad and the reasons for why I felt that way. Which led me to give the reasons why my opinion on this story is mostly negative.
The goal wasn't to rage bait people that think differently, and I apologise if you felt hurt by my comment; that wasn't the point.

After realising I made a mistake earlier (when the first person answered me about the mc being in middle school), I specifically modified my first comment to make sure people understand I didn't do what you accuse me of doing, "using everything as ammo and acting blind to push your agenda and feel better." Or at least to show that wasn't the intent.

If the explanation of me making a mistake in my post isn't transcribed well enough and people still don't understand me, then that's how it is. I already tried to turn back, but it was too late.
I didn't want to delete my comment; I wanted to amend it to leave my reflection behind, which I think is still relevant (high school girls giving birth and educating a child at that tender age).

Thank you for taking the time to answer me honestly like this; I appreciate it a lot. :thumbsup:
 
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Ah yes, another artist that is better off working with an actually competent writer. The art's amazing, just wish it was on a story that was not dropped on its head as a baby, several times, at high speed.
 
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? Nothing tells me anything about their grade on page four. Is it the "Math III" written in the book cover? How am I supposed to know which grade that represents? You could have a math III theme in primary school too, so I don't see your point here.


That's kinda true, but the only changing detail is the knot instead of the usual necktie in one of the illustrations. Before that, they're drawn as toddlers with neither, so we only have one little drawing of her with a knot instead of a ribbon compared to all the neckties and all the nothings from younger than middle school.
So asking me to understand this is not happening in middle school when the "clues" are so sparse, that's kinda pushing it.

But I agree with you on this, and I already amended my statement saying, "Edit disclaimer: She's already gotten past middle school, so most of what I said in the spoiler comes from a wrong assumption." Meaning that most of what I said after that was kinda useless, although the critique about having a child not in middle school but in high school still stands, it's still way less disturbing and problematic than how I talked about it in the end.

I mean, they're not explaining how they're going to do things in the future, and since I live in reality, I'm simply imagining how things would go: They'll have a harsh life ahead of them, not like what the rosy end is leading us to think. At that point, it's totally normal to assume, and that's the only thing I can do. The only difference is how others will assume different things, so it's normal people aren't all going to agree with my vision of things in this story.


What change in situation? All knowledge that can be linked to this "situation" (story) is statistics on how hard it is to have a child at that age and educate it. Statistics on abortions at that age. And other stuff. But I don't know those numbers; I'm just convinced life isn't that rosy, that's all.
If you can't prove me with facts that I'm wrong, or I can't prove you I'm right with facts and examples (the numbers I just mentioned, for ex., or even better, interviews of auxiliary midwives or related personnel to childbirth and childcare), then we're only going to exchange our biased views on the matter, and that won't lead our discussion very far, unfortunately. No big deal though; at least we know where we both stand and how far this argument can go. That's already pretty cool.

Well, that's true; I'll give you that. But I'm not really acting blind, am I?

Anyway, it's true I wrote my initial comment to feel better. But my goal was not to trash around the story without reason; it was to express why I felt bad and the reasons for why I felt that way. Which led me to give the reasons why my opinion on this story is mostly negative.
The goal wasn't to rage bait people that think differently, and I apologise if you felt hurt by my comment; that wasn't the point.

After realising I made a mistake earlier (when the first person answered me about the mc being in middle school), I specifically modified my first comment to make sure people understand I didn't do what you accuse me of doing, "using everything as ammo and acting blind to push your agenda and feel better." Or at least to show that wasn't the intent.

If the explanation of me making a mistake in my post isn't transcribed well enough and people still don't understand me, then that's how it is. I already tried to turn back, but it was too late.
I didn't want to delete my comment; I wanted to amend it to leave my reflection behind, which I think is still relevant (high school girls giving birth and educating a child at that tender age).

Thank you for taking the time to answer me honestly like this; I appreciate it a lot. :thumbsup:
The situation thing is mostly about not taking data obtained in A and use it as proof for a situation in B, whether it may be accurate or not. I have to point this out but this is not important.
The outfit in p9 is a whole so it's not just the knot/necktie.
I think for some reason you are wildly overestimating their height (that what I mean by p4, too tall to be middle schooler). Whether IRL or in manga, middle schooler are usually not this tall.
 
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She got in love with like, 5/8 years old
Thought it was one sided
Than lived her next 13 years of so being hunted by this(shows no signs of other preocupations). Her childhood/teen was all deceiving her feelings , having skinships only to feel her hole in the heart.
Than, get pregnant.

I started reading bcause it was a different topic for a romcom-styled thing.

Was expecting it to keep the "kinda serious themed with light art" vibe, but at the end it was just one more 'fluffy romcom' (with a disguise, I would say)

Solid art and writing (I mean, the characters are stupid, but they are stupid from start to end) tho. To me, could've been handled better
 
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The outfit in p9 is a whole so it's not just the knot/necktie.
Maybe you haven't noticed, but she wears a pullover and a skirt in most pages. It could be the whole dress underneath the jersey rather than a skirt, but it's not possible to know. So the only changing detail is the necktie or the knot.
I think for some reason you are wildly overestimating their height (that what I mean by p4, too tall to be middle schooler). Whether IRL or in manga, middle schooler are usually not this tall.
Unfortunately, with the "loli" characteristic, which is well represented in manga, you can't start thinking height actually relates to age when drawing a character.
And mind you, by typing "girls growth spurt" on google you get this: "Most girls start their sexual development between the ages of 8 and 13 (the average age is 12), and have a growth spurt between the ages of 10 and 14."

On google again: "Can females grow after 16?":
Yes, it is normal for some girls to continue growing taller into their late teens. Most girls experience their growth spurts between ages 10 and 14, but growth can continue, albeit at a slower rate, until around age 18 or even 19. Genetics, nutrition, and overall health can all influence growth patterns.
Meaning, even if they grow after 15, the slow rate makes it almost unnoticeable between middle school and high school in the majority of cases.

So girls' middle school height is in most cases equal to their high school height or very close to it. And it's not like we can accurately gauge height from drawings.

But like I said, I agree that the dialogue between the two girls over the baby should actually be happening during high school.

Nevertheless, my argumentation still proves that the writing is extremely vague in that regard and, in my opinion, very prone to confusion. That's why I can at least conclude that this setting is not well written. When the setting is a major one in the story, and it's not well done, well... I can't value this manga very highly; that's just how it is for me.

:02:
 
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Maybe you haven't noticed, but she wears a pullover and a skirt in most pages. It could be the whole dress underneath the jersey rather than a skirt, but it's not possible to know. So the only changing detail is the necktie or the knot.

Unfortunately, with the "loli" characteristic, which is well represented in manga, you can't start thinking height actually relates to age when drawing a character.
And mind you, by typing "girls growth spurt" on google you get this: "Most girls start their sexual development between the ages of 8 and 13 (the average age is 12), and have a growth spurt between the ages of 10 and 14."

On google again: "Can females grow after 16?":
Yes, it is normal for some girls to continue growing taller into their late teens. Most girls experience their growth spurts between ages 10 and 14, but growth can continue, albeit at a slower rate, until around age 18 or even 19. Genetics, nutrition, and overall health can all influence growth patterns.
Meaning, even if they grow after 15, the slow rate makes it almost unnoticeable between middle school and high school in the majority of cases.

So girls' middle school height is in most cases equal to their high school height or very close to it. And it's not like we can accurately gauge height from drawings.

But like I said, I agree that the dialogue between the two girls over the baby should actually be happening during high school.

Nevertheless, my argumentation still proves that the writing is extremely vague in that regard and, in my opinion, very prone to confusion. That's why I can at least conclude that this setting is not well written. When the setting is a major one in the story, and it's not well done, well... I can't rate this manga very highly; that's just how it is for me.

:02:
That...That's not how high school winter uniform work. The whole thing IS the uniform.
I don't think this has anything to do with loli characteristic.
The author is just short of saying blatantly they are high school student, that's as clear as it can be without actually typing "they are high schooler". Now I'm not gonna do a research on grow spurt to talk about IRL height but in manga you can usually tell whether a character is a middle schooler or a high schooler. If they were like Lucky Star character, alright, it's normal to be mistaken but in this case I can't fathom why you think this is very vague.
At this point I think it is only confusing to you but if you think that unless they tell you explicitly that they are going to high school mean it is vague, then it is vague.

Anyway I'm not arguing about how you should rate this manga.
 
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That...That's not how high school winter uniform work. The whole thing IS the uniform.
I don't think this has anything to do with loli characteristic.
The author is just short of saying blatantly they are high school student, that's as clear as it can be without actually typing "they are high schooler". Now I'm not gonna do a research on grow spurt to talk about IRL height but in manga you can usually tell whether a character is a middle schooler or a high schooler. If they were like Lucky Star character, alright, it's normal to be mistaken but in this case I can't fathom why you think this is very vague.
At this point I think it is only confusing to you but if you think that unless they tell you explicitly that they are going to high school mean it is vague, then it is vague.

Anyway I'm not arguing about how you should rate this manga.
It is indeed still confusing to me, but thank you for clarifying. I liked conversing with you; it was nice.

I wish you a good continuation in your passion and better greetings! :bocchiwave:

Edit: It just came to me that I've never been to a school in which we had to wear a uniform or frequented people who had to, like ever. Maybe that's why it's not so natural to me to notice the change in years shown in the different outfits.
 
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KZO

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Not the first time I read something like this, but the first time I read it in a non R-18 manga, which ended up making it really sweet, good thing the love interest is clearly going to get a good job, solving the main issue.
 
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This story is so dumb lol
The protagonist just took a random comment as a sign she had no chances with the other girl, never talked it with her.
And the other girl saw it everything and did nothing anyway, she even saw her dating other people and gave a fuck about it... And Im supposed to believe she still loved the protagonist?
One thing is to be mature and selflessly love someone, but you would assume she would feel at least some tiny jealousy, not taking it everything in stride.
 
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The best part of the story was a lesbian getting railed over by so many men that she doesn't even know who the father is. I don't know how many men you'd have to sleep with in 2-3 weeks to accidentally get pregnant and not even know the father, especially since she was using condoms most of the time.
And she was doing this since middle school.
This is so retarded it should have been a hentai.
Im still wondering if the author didn't simply copied an h-manga and did the sfw version of it, because it feels as empty and full of plot holes and stupid behaviors as a hentai.
 
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This story is very disgusting and wild. Just reading page nine is like a wtf moment for me.
This is nothing like what happens in real life.
The parents are nonexistent.

Edit disclaimer: She's already gotten past middle school, so most of what I said in the spoiler comes from a wrong assumption. But even if that's true, with the writing not making this clear and the drawing being petite and cute, it could totally be in middle school.
If you don't make it clear, you're kind of giving the image this happens in middle school, and that's a very disgusting image to give, even if it's unintended, and it's also not a token of good writing.
She fucked around enough to not know who the father is in MIDDLE SCHOOL??? That doesn't make sense ("Junior high schools (中学校 chūgakkō) (7th-9th grade) are for children aged twelve through fifteen years old.").
Who in their right mind would keep the baby when still being in middle school? It's drawn like a happy fairy tale; they're gonna get married and live happily ever after, but this is totally impossible in reality. Just to write a flirty love relationship of two females who discover themselves at this age.
Don't go feed this bs to your daughters.

Obviously they're both still living at their parents' place, but their parents or advising doctors don't exist in this story, and that's just not happening in reality.
They'll both have to drop out to pay rent; they won't have any way of sustaining themselves at this age like this. You don't want a future like that for the baby and yourself. No sane parent would allow this. I believe so, at least.

In the off chance her parents pay for her life and the baby's life until the girl can make a decent living on her own, well it would mean the parents can afford to do so and have a caretaker for the baby for the girl to make a life of herself at this time. Or one of the girls drops out to mitigate the cost. But you still fucked your prospects for this, at least for one of them. And all of this is still highly improbably happening. And it would happen with way more pain than how it's depicted in this story.
This is a ridiculous fantasy.

To conclude: I'm not a fan of the way things are used at all, just for a lovey-dovey story. I think this is dumb, unaware, and irresponsible writing.
This is what happens when you don't know what high school uniforms look like. It's super obvious they're in high school. What is this rant. It's a fictional story, not a guide book on how to deal with this situation in real life.

"Irresponsible writing." Oh I'm sure you are the most morally responsible of manga readers. The phrase alone makes me sick. People should be allowed to write what they want. I would hate for people like you to decide what kind of stories get published.
 
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Well, then the decision to keep the child is a bit more understandable with that in mind. Not that it's what she should do or not, I wouldn't know.
I think it's advisable to not keep the child in the vast majority of cases, though. Because like I said, raising a child when learning, working or going to university is not doable without help. You have to afford that help and be lucky enough to get it.

That's not something that happens so easily in reality like how this story wants us to try and imagine.
You need to learn to suspend your disbelief a bit. You shouldn't be trying to imagine how this would work in reality. Every story falls apart with this train of thought.
 

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