Killing Bites - Vol. 8 Ch. 37 - My Grand Ancestor
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i say this everytime i can but...
hopefully Nomoto woops Hitomi's ass
hopefully Nomoto woops Hitomi's ass
@neorasp
I define a mistranslation as something that will significantly change the reader's understanding of what is going on. I don't care about loss or mistranslation of minor details.
Beta scanlate Page 3, Panel 3 was all wrong and made no sense.
Beta scanlate Page 4, Panel 3 makes it sound like rabbit was trying to hide things from nomoto. Actual dialogue is talking about the match's status.
Beta scanlate Page 6: every single speech bubble, other than the first one was wrong. How do you even mess up so bad? From the beta scanlate, it sounded like rabbit was asking rhino about pros, and rhino didn't dare to threaten rabbit for some reason.
Beta scans Page 12: No, those guys weren't supposed to defeat rabbit.
Beta scans Page 13: this and the preceding page made it sound like rabbit wants to make the truth known, but it's out of her hands. Apparently, that's not true. She's a conniving trickster trying to make excuses to keep the lie going.
Beta page 14: an important detail was lost here. Nomoto has someone in mind. This isn't just any random fight to give beagle experience/fame. There's an ulterior motive.
I'll continue the rest in an edit later.
I define a mistranslation as something that will significantly change the reader's understanding of what is going on. I don't care about loss or mistranslation of minor details.
Beta scanlate Page 3, Panel 3 was all wrong and made no sense.
Beta scanlate Page 4, Panel 3 makes it sound like rabbit was trying to hide things from nomoto. Actual dialogue is talking about the match's status.
Beta scanlate Page 6: every single speech bubble, other than the first one was wrong. How do you even mess up so bad? From the beta scanlate, it sounded like rabbit was asking rhino about pros, and rhino didn't dare to threaten rabbit for some reason.
Beta scans Page 12: No, those guys weren't supposed to defeat rabbit.
Beta scans Page 13: this and the preceding page made it sound like rabbit wants to make the truth known, but it's out of her hands. Apparently, that's not true. She's a conniving trickster trying to make excuses to keep the lie going.
Beta page 14: an important detail was lost here. Nomoto has someone in mind. This isn't just any random fight to give beagle experience/fame. There's an ulterior motive.
I'll continue the rest in an edit later.
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@Arcenciel
I did not ask where the translation was off the mark, i asked where the other translation lost the original meaning in a way that made it go off the plot.
Also, don't change your definition of translation as it suits you. at first you said that wasn't a translation because all the meaning was lost. I understand that by that definition you now understand that your claim the beta translation wasn't a translation was indeed wrong, but if you understand that much than admit your mistakes instead of backpeddaling just to win an argument on the internet.
remember, this argument is not about weather the current translation is more accurate, but weather the beta one could be called a translation at all.
edit: where are you reading the beta btw?
I did not ask where the translation was off the mark, i asked where the other translation lost the original meaning in a way that made it go off the plot.
Also, don't change your definition of translation as it suits you. at first you said that wasn't a translation because all the meaning was lost. I understand that by that definition you now understand that your claim the beta translation wasn't a translation was indeed wrong, but if you understand that much than admit your mistakes instead of backpeddaling just to win an argument on the internet.
remember, this argument is not about weather the current translation is more accurate, but weather the beta one could be called a translation at all.
edit: where are you reading the beta btw?
@neorasp
Where did I change the definition? The definition is the same: If the meaning is wrong, it's lost. Pray tell, what's the difference? If the meaning is wrong/lost, doesn't it immediately deviate from the plot? If by plot, you simply mean the general outline, then words aren't needed at all. You can remove all the words and still get the general outline from the pictures, i.e. Nomoto meets rabbit, beagle fights wolf, ratel arrives on the scene. Grow up. Don't start accusing people of backpedalling the moment you realise you were wrong.
It can't be called a translation, because the words sometimes did not make sense, and were often misleading even when they do make sense. It's barely an improvement over having the raws, or reading a rewrite.
I'm reading the beta from mangakalot.
Where did I change the definition? The definition is the same: If the meaning is wrong, it's lost. Pray tell, what's the difference? If the meaning is wrong/lost, doesn't it immediately deviate from the plot? If by plot, you simply mean the general outline, then words aren't needed at all. You can remove all the words and still get the general outline from the pictures, i.e. Nomoto meets rabbit, beagle fights wolf, ratel arrives on the scene. Grow up. Don't start accusing people of backpedalling the moment you realise you were wrong.
It can't be called a translation, because the words sometimes did not make sense, and were often misleading even when they do make sense. It's barely an improvement over having the raws, or reading a rewrite.
I'm reading the beta from mangakalot.
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@Arcenciel
if a person in the background buys fish in the supermarket and in another vers same background character buys steak would you still call that a deviation from the plot deeming the work not a translation?
If in chapter A a certain character was called 'elise' but in the current chapter people are talking about 'erizu', would you call this trash that deviates from the plot and not yet a translation? and don't tell me translator choice, without a warning in the cradits we might think its a whole new character.
minor stuff like that doesn't count, and we both know that.
so now you would probably tell me 'the general outline you can get from the pictures'. yup, cause this is an action manga. but even if we are taking the middle ground, there wasn't much deviation in the important stuff between the beta and the 'official' product.
page 3- it is pretty obvious those people wanted a recount from an actual witness of inaba's victory.
page 4 pannel 3- again, its obvious (despite the shelf) that minamoto was about to tell the truth of that match.
i can go on but its a waste of time. please make sure you give me real examples instead of randomly pointing out translation differances.
give me unrefuttable examples, not ones that are slightly off but can still be easy to follow by anyone who is paying attention.
if a person in the background buys fish in the supermarket and in another vers same background character buys steak would you still call that a deviation from the plot deeming the work not a translation?
If in chapter A a certain character was called 'elise' but in the current chapter people are talking about 'erizu', would you call this trash that deviates from the plot and not yet a translation? and don't tell me translator choice, without a warning in the cradits we might think its a whole new character.
minor stuff like that doesn't count, and we both know that.
so now you would probably tell me 'the general outline you can get from the pictures'. yup, cause this is an action manga. but even if we are taking the middle ground, there wasn't much deviation in the important stuff between the beta and the 'official' product.
page 3- it is pretty obvious those people wanted a recount from an actual witness of inaba's victory.
page 4 pannel 3- again, its obvious (despite the shelf) that minamoto was about to tell the truth of that match.
i can go on but its a waste of time. please make sure you give me real examples instead of randomly pointing out translation differances.
give me unrefuttable examples, not ones that are slightly off but can still be easy to follow by anyone who is paying attention.
@neorasp
Regarding fish vs steak, that depends on whether what they ate will have an impact on the story. If the character subsequently chokes on a fish bone, then yes it's a deviation. I don't care about name romanising, as long as it makes sense and stays consistent.
Page 3: You're not paying attention. I said page 3, panel 3. Pay attention please. Nomoto's response makes zero sense and you can't tell what the hell he's trying to say.
Page 4 panel 3: What truth about what match? It's talking about what they should do about tasmanian devil's match. You're not making any sense either. Did you even read the correct translation?
These are not "random translation differences". If your dialogue doesn't make sense at all, it's not a translation, because the words might as well not be there. Please, do go on to refute the rest. Don't try to make excuses for being wrong. But this time, read both versions first please.
Regarding fish vs steak, that depends on whether what they ate will have an impact on the story. If the character subsequently chokes on a fish bone, then yes it's a deviation. I don't care about name romanising, as long as it makes sense and stays consistent.
Page 3: You're not paying attention. I said page 3, panel 3. Pay attention please. Nomoto's response makes zero sense and you can't tell what the hell he's trying to say.
Page 4 panel 3: What truth about what match? It's talking about what they should do about tasmanian devil's match. You're not making any sense either. Did you even read the correct translation?
These are not "random translation differences". If your dialogue doesn't make sense at all, it's not a translation, because the words might as well not be there. Please, do go on to refute the rest. Don't try to make excuses for being wrong. But this time, read both versions first please.
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@Arcenciel
Its good that we can agree that marely deviating from the original meaning of the words does not automaticly makes a translation into not-translation.
moving on,
it seems we are not reading the same langth? there ware no panels in page 3. according to mangakalot numbering (when right clicking and 'save as'), pg1 is the notice, pg2 is when minamoto and inaba meet and in page 3 is a single panel where people shout at minamoto because they are excited someone who witnessed inabas success is here.
i guess page 3 you ware talking about is actually numbered page 4 in mangakalot? the panel with the shelf? if so as i said before, despite the shelf you couldstill get the meaning, even if the late tl made things clearer than the machine tl.
"that was just a laughing matter"
"you are making inaba feel sorry"
"it was probably some short of shelf"
after being asked about the skirmish from 2 years ago, minamoto was about to spill the beans how inaba won due to luck. this panel makes sense in context, and because we knew this is mtl we could guess shelf was simply him starting to blabber. its not like the late tl gave any new or different info to this one, it just gave fish instead of steak but ultimately there were no fishbones in either vers.
PS "I don't care about name romanising, as long as it makes sense and stays consistent." in other words, if the naming is inconsistent the tl is a trash tl or not a tl at all? because there was some consistency issues in the late tl's chapter.
Its good that we can agree that marely deviating from the original meaning of the words does not automaticly makes a translation into not-translation.
moving on,
it seems we are not reading the same langth? there ware no panels in page 3. according to mangakalot numbering (when right clicking and 'save as'), pg1 is the notice, pg2 is when minamoto and inaba meet and in page 3 is a single panel where people shout at minamoto because they are excited someone who witnessed inabas success is here.
i guess page 3 you ware talking about is actually numbered page 4 in mangakalot? the panel with the shelf? if so as i said before, despite the shelf you couldstill get the meaning, even if the late tl made things clearer than the machine tl.
"that was just a laughing matter"
"you are making inaba feel sorry"
"it was probably some short of shelf"
after being asked about the skirmish from 2 years ago, minamoto was about to spill the beans how inaba won due to luck. this panel makes sense in context, and because we knew this is mtl we could guess shelf was simply him starting to blabber. its not like the late tl gave any new or different info to this one, it just gave fish instead of steak but ultimately there were no fishbones in either vers.
PS "I don't care about name romanising, as long as it makes sense and stays consistent." in other words, if the naming is inconsistent the tl is a trash tl or not a tl at all? because there was some consistency issues in the late tl's chapter.
@neorasp
I'm following the page numbering of the actual manga.
No, it's not obvious that Nomoto was blabbering. Reading the BETA just left me confused about what is actually happening. But i suppose you're right on this point. If i had reread a few more times and really put in effort to try and understand instead of getting irritating and giving up, i would probably also reach the conclusion that he was blabbering.
Go on to refute the rest. You have not touched on the most egragarious errors yet.
PS. While i have no idea why the real translators have decided to suddenly change the name, and it certainly does take away points if it wasn't done for good reason(i.e. mangaka just released the correct romanisation), that doesn't automatically make it trash scans. Don't be an idiot. If you sit for a test and got a couple of questions wrong, you don't automatically fail. Trash scans are trash scans because they got too many points deducted.
I'm following the page numbering of the actual manga.
No, it's not obvious that Nomoto was blabbering. Reading the BETA just left me confused about what is actually happening. But i suppose you're right on this point. If i had reread a few more times and really put in effort to try and understand instead of getting irritating and giving up, i would probably also reach the conclusion that he was blabbering.
Go on to refute the rest. You have not touched on the most egragarious errors yet.
PS. While i have no idea why the real translators have decided to suddenly change the name, and it certainly does take away points if it wasn't done for good reason(i.e. mangaka just released the correct romanisation), that doesn't automatically make it trash scans. Don't be an idiot. If you sit for a test and got a couple of questions wrong, you don't automatically fail. Trash scans are trash scans because they got too many points deducted.
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@Arcenciel
well than i figured the numbering was mismatched.
and it really wasn't that hard to see nomoto was about to reveal how inaba won due to mishap
real egragious errors? which ones from the ones you mentioned are the real eragrious errors?
I completly agree that small mistakes here and there do not make a tl trash. when i asked you to point out stuff in the machine tl, i asked for the 'shall not pass' errors not some minor stuff.
well than i figured the numbering was mismatched.
and it really wasn't that hard to see nomoto was about to reveal how inaba won due to mishap
real egragious errors? which ones from the ones you mentioned are the real eragrious errors?
I completly agree that small mistakes here and there do not make a tl trash. when i asked you to point out stuff in the machine tl, i asked for the 'shall not pass' errors not some minor stuff.
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Hitomi has a fur armor and she's not afraid of using it.
Thus, Killing Baits.
Thus, Killing Baits.
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@Arcenciel
If all of them, than do you mean all the rest are the same level?
so if i prove any of them, than because they are all the same level it will work for the rest.
so, before i prove another argument wrong and get the 'what about the rest' treatment letme ask you again-
which points in the list are the REAL DEAL in your eyes?
and don't tell me 'you have to prove everything' because than once im done with this list you will just give me another and say something like 'this list is also real prove that as well'. god knows the two tls don't lack differances.
I WILL prove my argument but i don't want us to debate over each and every point because that will take forever.
If all of them, than do you mean all the rest are the same level?
so if i prove any of them, than because they are all the same level it will work for the rest.
so, before i prove another argument wrong and get the 'what about the rest' treatment letme ask you again-
which points in the list are the REAL DEAL in your eyes?
and don't tell me 'you have to prove everything' because than once im done with this list you will just give me another and say something like 'this list is also real prove that as well'. god knows the two tls don't lack differances.
I WILL prove my argument but i don't want us to debate over each and every point because that will take forever.
@neorasp
False equivalence. Proving one does not prove the others because they are for different situations. I took the time to go and find these errors, and you can't take the time to properly refute them? But I guess you can't help it; stalling and giving excuses is the best you can do at this point, because you know you are wrong.
False equivalence. Proving one does not prove the others because they are for different situations. I took the time to go and find these errors, and you can't take the time to properly refute them? But I guess you can't help it; stalling and giving excuses is the best you can do at this point, because you know you are wrong.
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there is a saying, if you cant tie good knots- tie many. instead of giving me good examples you are spamming me with medicore ones in the hopes their sheer number will overwhelm me. people with bad arguments usually rely on quantity to compensate for the lack of quality.
you took no trouble at all- you pointed out where you thought the tl failed but you yourself failed to explain what in phrasing gave the wrong impression.
since i see im gonna visit it a lot and am not gonna bookmark it just to argue with you-
http://mangakakalot.com/chapter/killing_bites/chapter_37
took the trouble eh? now see what taking the trouble means:
>Beta scanlate Page 4, Panel 3 makes it sound like rabbit was trying to hide things from nomoto. Actual dialogue is talking about the match's status.
so its
>um... ui... we should tell him how to play the game
in the machine tl, vs
>erhm... ui-san... what shall we do about the match
in the late tl.
while its true that in the mtl it sounded like inaba is trying to think up an excuse to take minamoto somewhere secluded while the ltl it was simply the underling worried about leaving stuff in the middle, it did not change the overall plot.
from the second bubble in the mtl it was made clear the underling was worried about leaving stuff in the middle, so that meaning was not lost from that panel or from the story in the mtl
and it is clear even in the ltl that inaba did want to take mino away before e blabbers something.
since no meaning was lost from the plot nd no meaning was added to the plot than your definition of a 'no translation' does not hold.
QED
or i can be as lazy as you and simply state-
"Beta scanlate Page 6: it did not sound like rabbit was asking rhino about pros, and rhino didn't dare to threaten rabbit for some reason, you just porpusly red it that way."
"Beta scans Page 12: Those guys didn't defeat rabbit."
"Beta scans Page 13: this and the preceding page did not make it sound like rabbit wants to make the truth known, but it's out of her hands. "
"Beta page 14: Nomoto has someone in mind, and it can be implyied from the text unless you purposely turn your eyes away for the sake of this argument."
and since you ware the one who came with the claim that machine tl was not a tl first YOU prove your claim so i can refute it.
PS i noticed you didn't bother denying you will provide a new list once this list is done. sore loser to the extreme.
you took no trouble at all- you pointed out where you thought the tl failed but you yourself failed to explain what in phrasing gave the wrong impression.
since i see im gonna visit it a lot and am not gonna bookmark it just to argue with you-
http://mangakakalot.com/chapter/killing_bites/chapter_37
took the trouble eh? now see what taking the trouble means:
>Beta scanlate Page 4, Panel 3 makes it sound like rabbit was trying to hide things from nomoto. Actual dialogue is talking about the match's status.
so its
>um... ui... we should tell him how to play the game
in the machine tl, vs
>erhm... ui-san... what shall we do about the match
in the late tl.
while its true that in the mtl it sounded like inaba is trying to think up an excuse to take minamoto somewhere secluded while the ltl it was simply the underling worried about leaving stuff in the middle, it did not change the overall plot.
from the second bubble in the mtl it was made clear the underling was worried about leaving stuff in the middle, so that meaning was not lost from that panel or from the story in the mtl
and it is clear even in the ltl that inaba did want to take mino away before e blabbers something.
since no meaning was lost from the plot nd no meaning was added to the plot than your definition of a 'no translation' does not hold.
QED
or i can be as lazy as you and simply state-
"Beta scanlate Page 6: it did not sound like rabbit was asking rhino about pros, and rhino didn't dare to threaten rabbit for some reason, you just porpusly red it that way."
"Beta scans Page 12: Those guys didn't defeat rabbit."
"Beta scans Page 13: this and the preceding page did not make it sound like rabbit wants to make the truth known, but it's out of her hands. "
"Beta page 14: Nomoto has someone in mind, and it can be implyied from the text unless you purposely turn your eyes away for the sake of this argument."
and since you ware the one who came with the claim that machine tl was not a tl first YOU prove your claim so i can refute it.
PS i noticed you didn't bother denying you will provide a new list once this list is done. sore loser to the extreme.
@neorasp
Except in this case quantity matters. Just to make sure we're on the same page, can we agree that if a translation is wrong(minor details or not), it might as well have been left as raws? Can we agree that if there's way too many wrong(left as raws), it might as not be a translate at all? If you disagree on the above two points, give reasons. With that out of the way,
>while its true that in the mtl it sounded like inaba is trying to think up an excuse to take minamoto somewhere secluded
Where did you get the above?
><Random Dude A says>: um... ui<rabbit>... we<crowd plus rabbbit> should tell<teach> him<Nomoto> how to play the game<rules of the fight>
This tells me that random dude A wants to teach Nomoto about the rules of the ongoing fight. Nothing about this says that rabbit is trying to give excuses for anything.
>from the second bubble in the mtl it was made clear the underling was worried about leaving stuff in the middle.
Again, where the hell did you get this? Are we even reading the same beta scans?
><rabbit says>Stop Stop, it can't be helped<why? why must Random Dude A stop talking? and why can't it be helped>, we can't tell the investor<random crowd and rabbit can't tell the investor Nomoto the rules of the fight>
This tells me that rabbit is trying to keep random dude A from teaching nomoto(the investor of tasmanian) about the rules. And left me wondering why. That's a change in plot, because it left me questioning rabbit's current motivations and allegiances, and if there were some new rules in place. Oh, and can you explain to me how you get "the underling was worried about leaving stuff in the middle." from the above line? I'm really curious about your reading comprehension, and your ability to seemingly draw information out of thin air.
>and it is clear even in the ltl that inaba did want to take mino away before e blabbers something.
No, in my first read-through, the impression i got was that rabbit was removing Nomoto from the scene, to keep him in the dark.
>"Beta scanlate Page 6: it did not sound like rabbit was asking rhino about pros, and rhino didn't dare to threaten rabbit for some reason, you just porpusly red it that way."
"Beta scans Page 12: Those guys didn't defeat rabbit."
"Beta scans Page 13: this and the preceding page did not make it sound like rabbit wants to make the truth known, but it's out of her hands. "
"Beta page 14: Nomoto has someone in mind, and it can be implyied from the text unless you purposely turn your eyes away for the sake of this argument."
Wow, just wow. Are you seriously saying this? If so, we can leave this discussion here. Anyone who reads your responses can see what an idiot you are being, so i have no need to even refute you.
Except in this case quantity matters. Just to make sure we're on the same page, can we agree that if a translation is wrong(minor details or not), it might as well have been left as raws? Can we agree that if there's way too many wrong(left as raws), it might as not be a translate at all? If you disagree on the above two points, give reasons. With that out of the way,
>while its true that in the mtl it sounded like inaba is trying to think up an excuse to take minamoto somewhere secluded
Where did you get the above?
><Random Dude A says>: um... ui<rabbit>... we<crowd plus rabbbit> should tell<teach> him<Nomoto> how to play the game<rules of the fight>
This tells me that random dude A wants to teach Nomoto about the rules of the ongoing fight. Nothing about this says that rabbit is trying to give excuses for anything.
>from the second bubble in the mtl it was made clear the underling was worried about leaving stuff in the middle.
Again, where the hell did you get this? Are we even reading the same beta scans?
><rabbit says>Stop Stop, it can't be helped<why? why must Random Dude A stop talking? and why can't it be helped>, we can't tell the investor<random crowd and rabbit can't tell the investor Nomoto the rules of the fight>
This tells me that rabbit is trying to keep random dude A from teaching nomoto(the investor of tasmanian) about the rules. And left me wondering why. That's a change in plot, because it left me questioning rabbit's current motivations and allegiances, and if there were some new rules in place. Oh, and can you explain to me how you get "the underling was worried about leaving stuff in the middle." from the above line? I'm really curious about your reading comprehension, and your ability to seemingly draw information out of thin air.
>and it is clear even in the ltl that inaba did want to take mino away before e blabbers something.
No, in my first read-through, the impression i got was that rabbit was removing Nomoto from the scene, to keep him in the dark.
>"Beta scanlate Page 6: it did not sound like rabbit was asking rhino about pros, and rhino didn't dare to threaten rabbit for some reason, you just porpusly red it that way."
"Beta scans Page 12: Those guys didn't defeat rabbit."
"Beta scans Page 13: this and the preceding page did not make it sound like rabbit wants to make the truth known, but it's out of her hands. "
"Beta page 14: Nomoto has someone in mind, and it can be implyied from the text unless you purposely turn your eyes away for the sake of this argument."
Wow, just wow. Are you seriously saying this? If so, we can leave this discussion here. Anyone who reads your responses can see what an idiot you are being, so i have no need to even refute you.
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