Musume no Shinshitsu - Vol. 5 Ch. 41 - If we are a family

[BegoneThoth]

1. loli tag is used if any character that have the body of a minor is depicted in a sexual manner. Rarely, like this work, the work is not about loli but uses some panels that qualifies as loli. Fathers dream in the first chapter is especially suspicious.

2. unless its stated otherwise in later chapters dad is similar if not the same age as the mother.

3. same point as 2

4. Thats the focal point of the story. We only know he had "a dream" about moe after he has been stressed about his wifes potential infidelty. Moes been increasingly agressive in her actions after his fathers dream which makes me think something more than a dream happened when dad was drunk that encouraged her massively. Her later actions during her friends rape suggest it was not intercourse tho.

5. This is a psyhological thriller. Those rarely have strong agendas. Maybe "some people are inherently evil while some become evil ?" . There are strong incestous tones with a tint of pedophilia to father. But focus is on moe and akemi while father and brother mostly react. Moe is knowingly trying to break her father so he would rationalize incest. Its not about him escaping her advances, she planned a whole cheating+child abuse fabrication so her father would be stressed and alone. She pressed him further at every turn and even used a fake boyfriend and sex life to get a strong reactionfrom him. She is replicating akemi in every form to see what works while also kidnapping people, throwing them from apartmens and blowing them up. This is not a daughter trying to seduce her dad. it would be calling what v does to evie a hazing ritual.

6. they are friends from work, not friends. they worked together

7. Father never really lost interest in akemi tho ? in fact he was onboard with reconciliaton despite everyting he percieved as truth until the video incident. Mother was thick af as a hs student, let alone the 2 decades they kepth having sex after moe is born. They are both in their 40s.

I wasn't even sure if I should respond but I didn't want to seem as if I was giving credence to these points.

1. 
   
2. iirc the father was in college, Akemi was in high-school. That's how I've interpreted the backstory. Not just the dialogue but how Akemi was in a school uniform and the father wasn't, they met at a neighborhood library, etc.
3. 
   
4. Several characters have called out how he interacts with her as weird. The author's portrayal of his interactions emphasizes weirdness.
5. 
   
6. So we're in agreement then.
7. 

idk. Maybe the Vietnamese translation you're reading is different from the English one I'm commenting on?

 

[Alqualonde]

I wasn't even sure if I should respond but I didn't want to seem as if I was giving credence to these points.

1. 
   
2. iirc the father was in college, Akemi was in high-school. That's how I've interpreted the backstory. Not just the dialogue but how Akemi was in a school uniform and the father wasn't, they met at a neighborhood library, etc.
3. 
   
4. Several characters have called out how he interacts with her as weird. The author's portrayal of his interactions emphasizes weirdness.
5. 
   
6. So we're in agreement then.
7. 

idk. Maybe the Vietnamese translation you're reading is different from the English one I'm commenting on?

Im also reading the english translation. Father says he was already married when he was at moes current age at chapter 5 and he says akemi married him when she was about to graduate hs a chapter 14.

since moe has just started collage, this would make father and mother at most a year apart in age bar some mistranslation but its unlikely as further in chapter 5, he says akemi and him have visited this places when both were in the collage.

Characters pointed out their interactions are weird, mostly because moe is attached to him at the hip. Otherwise most comments on his actions have been about his relationship with his wife,until chapter35+.

edit : in the worst case scenario mom would be fresh into 17 while dad would be 18 a month away from 19( 23 months)when they have met. again bar mistranslations.

 

[BegoneThoth]

Im also reading the english translation. Father says he was already married when he was at moes current age at chapter 5 and he says akemi married him when she was about to graduate hs a chapter 14.

since moe has just started collage, this would make father and mother at most a year apart in age bar some mistranslation but its unlikely as further in chapter 5, he says akemi and him have visited this places when both were in the collage.

Characters pointed out their interactions are weird, mostly because moe is attached to him at the hip. Otherwise most comments on his actions have been about his relationship with his wife,until chapter35+.

edit : in the worst case scenario mom would be fresh into 17 while dad would be 18 a month away from 19( 23 months)when they have met. again bar mistranslations.

• The Vietnamese question was a joke.
• Perhaps we're talking past each other on the age. I'm not saying the dad was 30 and the mom was 15. I'm saying the dad seems to have been a college adult and the mom a high-school girl.
• No, his actions were explicitly called out.

I would just reiterate the same question: Do you think a normal man would be in this situation? Yes, the mom is crazy. Yes, the daughter is crazy. That's not the question. Moe would not have a chance with a normal father. That's my position.
😽

---

🤖

 

[Alqualonde]

• The Vietnamese question was a joke.
• Perhaps we're talking past each other on the age. I'm not saying the dad was 30 and the mom was 15. I'm saying the dad seems to have been a college adult and the mom a high-school girl.
• No, his actions were explicitly called out.

I would just reiterate the same question: Do you think a normal man would be in this situation? Yes, the mom is crazy. Yes, the daughter is crazy. That's not the question. Moe would not have a chance with a normal father. That's my position.
😽

---

🤖

Im not saying dad is normal. He tries to act normal. So far no one is normal in this family. Even Ken is quite weird.


But you said a lot of stuff about dad having a certain type and how being fucked by an adult is traumatic for akemi etc... That doesn't follow. And that's what I'm replying to. They are most likely the same age with 1 year being the most possible age gap. Thats an extremely normal relationship agewise.

The swiftness of their marriage is abnormal. The early motherhood, no doubt, caused her trauma. Her family background also most likely contributed the strife in their relationship.

He never showed any parasexual interest in minors or young women. He shows a parasexual interest in his daughter. That's incestuous not pedophilic. The only place he shows a possible pedophilic tendency is when he has is in the first episode where we dont know how old moe was in the dream. Which is also the cause of the Loli tag.

While dad is a weird one. His weirdness is because how he treated his wife, son and daughter after the wife's first mental breakdown. They both have raised Moe in a way she is obsessed with her father and dismissive of her mother and brother.

Dad's influence on her obsession with purity is also the cause of her skewed desire to have her father. She sees her mother as impure and her father as pure.

Tho he is not shown to have incestuous intentions, he shows such tendencies. But from detective to their circle, people comment on "their actions" mostly caused by moes scheming. Until his ourburst to her boyfriend, he hides such tendencies really well. Detective knows Moe's goal via Ken so she can read deeper into their actions. Their father is not aware of such Intentions/ignores them.

He becomes openly weird in the last couple of chapters.

 

[BegoneThoth]

Im not saying dad is normal. He tries to act normal. So far no one is normal in this family. Even Ken is quite weird.


But you said a lot of stuff about dad having a certain type and how being fucked by an adult is traumatic for akemi etc... That doesn't follow. And that's what I'm replying to. They are most likely the same age with 1 year being the most possible age gap. Thats an extremely normal relationship agewise.

The swiftness of their marriage is abnormal. The early motherhood, no doubt, caused her trauma. Her family background also most likely contributed the strife in their relationship.

He never showed any parasexual interest in minors or young women. He shows a parasexual interest in his daughter. That's incestuous not pedophilic. The only place he shows a possible pedophilic tendency is when he has is in the first episode where we dont know how old moe was in the dream. Which is also the cause of the Loli tag.

While dad is a weird one. His weirdness is because how he treated his wife, son and daughter after the wife's first mental breakdown. They both have raised Moe in a way she is obsessed with her father and dismissive of her mother and brother.

Dad's influence on her obsession with purity is also the cause of her skewed desire to have her father. She sees her mother as impure and her father as pure.

Tho he is not shown to have incestuous intentions, he shows such tendencies. But from detective to their circle, people comment on "their actions" mostly caused by moes scheming. Until his ourburst to her boyfriend, he hides such tendencies really well. Detective knows Moe's goal via Ken so she can read deeper into their actions. Their father is not aware of such Intentions/ignores them.

He becomes openly weird in the last couple of chapters.

• Yeah and 20 and 17 are only 3 years apart. Though at least in the Transformers example their relationship started when they were both in high-school.
• The comments were directed at the father, knowing full well of "moes scheming". That's the whole point the detective is making in that discussion.
• I would ask why you think he has an interest in his daughter. You think he went to the StudentLesson brothel and disliked the curves on the prostitute because he wanted Moe. I'm saying there is more to it. Moe could have been drawn any other way, but the author intentionally designed her to be a loli.

Regardless, let's just say "we agree to disgree".

 

[Alqualonde]

• Yeah and 20 and 17 are only 3 years apart. Though at least in the Transformers example their relationship started when they were both in high-school.
• The comments were directed at the father, knowing full well of "moes scheming". That's the whole point the detective is making in that discussion.
• I would ask why you think he has an interest in his daughter. You think he went to the StudentLesson brothel and disliked the curves on the prostitute because he wanted Moe. I'm saying there is more to it. Moe could have been drawn any other way, but the author intentionally designed her to be a loli.

Regardless, let's just say "we agree to disgree".

Being ok with a 18 yo dating a 15 yo while calling a 18 yo dating a 17 yo trauma inducing... is a choice.

Detective, in the panel youve posted, speculates wheter if dads into it. She explicitly states its her feeling and not an observation she would otherwise make. She doesnt call out dads actions but infers them biased from knowing moes goal. No one else does because from outside and from dads perspective moe is a young girl living with her father while assuming the role of the mother the house iirc this was called mental incest.

Father has an interest in moe because they formed a relationship where he allowed and she advanced her taking the place of akemi in his life. She is a crafty girl. She knew his fathers weaknesess like his questions about akemis infidelity, her own legitemecy, his inferiority complex, his wishy washy resolution and his complex for purity and uses each to advance her goals. He is stressed out about all these weaknesess and moe is trying and succeeding in pushing him into incest. He is now seeking alternatives to incest by reasoning he is a pedo instead.

Moe is also drawn quite maturely aside from dads dreams in the first couple of chapters.She is tall, her face is mature and she wears prudish, almost puritan, clothes. most likely stemming from her obsession with purity. Not having curves doesnt make her a loli. She is drawn as the exact opposite of her mom. Akemi is cute, round, curly and curvy while moe is elegant, sharp, straigth and flat. Akemi is obsessed with freedom,artistic and sexual while moe is obsessed with control. one can be simplified into a circle while other is a triangle. While dad is not sharp in his design and ken is a square. Thats why main characters are akemi and moe while dad and brother only react to their actions with dads reactions being unpredictable.