Site Update - 3rd of June 2025

[shoujocon]

Why're you blaming mangadex? How were they supposed to anticipate some random manga industry group dropping a bomb on them?

Blaming or not blaming aside, of course if you're running a site that hosts stuff without permission from the rightful copyright owner you can anticipate an action from them.

 

[shoujocon]

I'll never forgive the Japanese!

And the mods for complying for even super niche and old TLs

There's no difference between popular series and not popular series, really. They have to remove the content or the situation escalates. And they have a policy and contact for legal matters of where to send claims so it's not even like they're trying to evade it.

 

[AnonymousContributor]

There's no difference between popular series and not popular series, really. They have to remove the content or the situation escalates. And they have a policy and contact for legal matters of where to send claims so it's not even like they're trying to evade it.

Just because it's legal doesn't mean it's a good thing.

They should not have any right to take down shit they do NOT plan to translate or are willing to stop translating leaving a void. The law sucks in this regard.

 

[Angry_Panda]

Just because it's legal doesn't mean it's a good thing.

They should not have any right to take down shit they do NOT plan to translate or are willing to stop translating leaving a void. The law sucks in this regard.

I don't know that I would go so far as to say they legally 'shouldn't have the right', but it does suck, and certainly limits the audience for the work. There is a legal concept in the US (and possibly elsewhere, though I'm not a lawyer anywhere) that an undefended copyright lapses automatically, so allowing for defense of copyright makes sense from that standpoint, but whether it's ethical or moral to do that with a work there's no intention to bring to an audience is another matter entirely.

 

[BestBoy]

undefended copyright lapses automatically

I thought that was trademark? It works similarly, at least.

 

[Angry_Panda]

I thought that was trademark? It works similarly, at least.

It's very similar.

 

[kn4ll]

I don't know that I would go so far as to say they legally 'shouldn't have the right', but it does suck, and certainly limits the audience for the work. There is a legal concept in the US (and possibly elsewhere, though I'm not a lawyer anywhere) that an undefended copyright lapses automatically, so allowing for defense of copyright makes sense from that standpoint, but whether it's ethical or moral to do that with a work there's no intention to bring to an audience is another matter entirely.

Sadpanda has struggled with this issue for a decade. They get automatic take downs from fakku and irodori, even if it's stuff that's never going to be translated. It's a massive pain. I've seen stuff being taken down less than 15 minutes after uploading.

 

[AnonymousContributor]

I don't know that I would go so far as to say they legally 'shouldn't have the right', but it does suck, and certainly limits the audience for the work. There is a legal concept in the US (and possibly elsewhere, though I'm not a lawyer anywhere) that an undefended copyright lapses automatically, so allowing for defense of copyright makes sense from that standpoint, but whether it's ethical or moral to do that with a work there's no intention to bring to an audience is another matter entirely.

I think there should be an intent clause to imply that takedowns are only valid if they plan to give it to said audience but IDK that requires some divine intervention like a genie or some magical bullshit way of granting wishes (hopefully without side effects)

 

[AnonymousContributor]

Sadpanda has struggled with this issue for a decade. They get automatic take downs from fakku and irodori, even if it's stuff that's never going to be translated. It's a massive pain. I've seen stuff being taken down less than 15 minutes after uploading.

Thankfully Hitomi.la archives some of it but it's not foolproof.

 

[Manko-sensei]

All this tauntrum has gotten nonsensical (not like throwing one solves anything ever) but it's about time to learn the difference between laws, ethics and morality. Laws are meant to protect private property and copyright is just one of them, of course they're going to vindicate it until it expires. Ethics belong to the "should" realm, and even if I defend that culture (and cultural works) should be accessible for anyone it holds no value in court. Morality is as well irrelevant for judges, I can follow a principle of wanting to share everything I have because I believe it's the right thing to do, but if I infringe the law they're going to make sure I don't do that again. This is all high school level but I guess being a child forever is really tempting.

 

[shoujocon]

I don't know that I would go so far as to say they legally 'shouldn't have the right', but it does suck, and certainly limits the audience for the work. There is a legal concept in the US (and possibly elsewhere, though I'm not a lawyer anywhere) that an undefended copyright lapses automatically, so allowing for defense of copyright makes sense from that standpoint, but whether it's ethical or moral to do that with a work there's no intention to bring to an audience is another matter entirely.

Can you actually back up that claim? Because at least as far as I know there's no such thing as copyright expiring but I'm open to changing my mind.

 

[shoujocon]

Just because it's legal doesn't mean it's a good thing.

They should not have any right to take down shit they do NOT plan to translate or are willing to stop translating leaving a void. The law sucks in this regard.

I didn't argue with what you think about it just what Namicomi/MangaDex is supposed to do when copyright holders nicely ask before going the suing route. And right to translation is a part of copyright currently, yes.

However a few questions related to this:
How would you even determine if someone plans or not release their work in a language?
How would the legality of distribution of that translated piece of media work, would the translation be copyrighted to the translator or...?
Would the translator be able to profit from those translations of those media?

 

[shoujocon]

All this tauntrum has gotten nonsensical (not like throwing one solves anything ever) but it's about time to learn the difference between laws, ethics and morality. Laws are meant to protect private property and copyright is just one of them, of course they're going to vindicate it until it expires. Ethics belong to the "should" realm, and even if I defend that culture (and cultural works) should be accessible for anyone it holds no value in court. Morality is as well irrelevant for judges, I can follow a principle of wanting to share everything I have because I believe it's the right thing to do, but if I infringe the law they're going to make sure I don't do that again. This is all high school level but I guess being a child forever is really tempting.

First, laws aren't only for protecting private property, what are you talking about? Plenty of laws that protect public good or persons, animals, environment, whatever.

Next thing, culture is created by people that do the work, can we stop pretending that manga somehow magically appears and then some evil people try to take it away from us? If people want to protect the culture they need to actually allocate resources into it. If you say that manga should be accessible to anyone then who is supposed to actually pay for it? And how do we decide which mangaka gets the money and what amount? It's weird to act like manga is the culture and just pirating it is somehow protecting it while completely ignoring the people that actually produce the culture/entertainment we then consume.

 

[Angry_Panda]

Can you actually back up that claim? Because at least as far as I know there's no such thing as copyright expiring but I'm open to changing my mind.

Y'know, I think I'm off the mark on this one. In the US copyrights will eventually expire (and if older ones weren't renewed properly, that may have already happened despite some similar works of the same age still being covered), but the abandonment from non-defense appears to have been a conflation with trademark law, based on what I'm finding. Sorry for passing along bad info - mea culpa.

 

[shoujocon]

Y'know, I think I'm off the mark on this one. In the US copyrights will eventually expire (and if older ones weren't renewed properly, that may have already happened despite some similar works of the same age still being covered), but the abandonment from non-defense appears to have been a conflation with trademark law, based on what I'm finding. Sorry for passing along bad info - mea culpa.

Yeah, they do expire and stuff becomes free to use in the public domain, but it's a long ass time, was it like 70 years after the author's death or something? Not really sure how it's regarding the stuff that was created by a legal entities (companies, etc.) but I guess it's also not a short time.

 

[BestBoy]

conflation with trademark law

That's what I thought, but I didn't want to go look it up or get into a discussion about it. My ol' university BLAW classes were tingling in the back of my brain.

70 years after the author's death

Believe it or not it's more convoluted. For most stuff, created on or after 1978 is life of the author +70 years. Anonymous, pseudonymous, and work for hire is 95 years after publication or 120 years after creation.

Stuff created prior to 1978 can be renewed, but doesn't have to be. Their copyright expirations are also different.

 

[AnonymousContributor]

I didn't argue with what you think about it just what Namicomi/MangaDex is supposed to do when copyright holders nicely ask before going the suing route. And right to translation is a part of copyright currently, yes.

However a few questions related to this:
How would you even determine if someone plans or not release their work in a language?
How would the legality of distribution of that translated piece of media work, would the translation be copyrighted to the translator or...?
Would the translator be able to profit from those translations of those media?

Well scratch intent they need to have the translation out or announced explicitly or should in an ideal world. And that the official release should try to be weekly or not in volume only

 

[qyispy_rclqfg]

Its a risk they undertake when doing this.

Reasonable would say we should give access to things they don't bother to give access overseas.

However, with the old copyright we established decades ago, legally they still hold the legal copyright, not to mention the complicated 'Creator copyright and distribution copyright ' within Japan's Copyright law (yes you Japan, you mad man).


Tl;dr

They can be a arse and dicc about by not translating or grant access to other regions market, because legally they can be a dicc by holding the rights, unfortunately.


PS. Also different country have different copyright laws.

Length of copyright,
Does it automatic apply upon creation or manual registration,
Types of copyright,
Definition of 'works' classified under copyright.

All in all, its a fucking hassle.

I just had to practice the ' me no see works, never knew works, never feel pain of missing works because it didn't perceived by me' as long as they play the legal dicc move.

We can now feel the old days of 'getting cucked out the final volume of a series because they didn't translate it' again...

 

[Manko-sensei]

First, laws aren't only for protecting private property, what are you talking about? Plenty of laws that protect public good or persons, animals, environment, whatever.

Next thing, culture is created by people that do the work, can we stop pretending that manga somehow magically appears and then some evil people try to take it away from us? If people want to protect the culture they need to actually allocate resources into it. If you say that manga should be accessible to anyone then who is supposed to actually pay for it? And how do we decide which mangaka gets the money and what amount? It's weird to act like manga is the culture and just pirating it is somehow protecting it while completely ignoring the people that actually produce the culture/entertainment we then consume.

What a nice strawman you made there, give me more!

 

[JVick]

Is this the new & improved 'mangadex is dying, let's discuss pirate ethic' ? Can I just link the jokes I've made in the other one or should I retype them?