Uchi no Musuko wa Tabun Gay - Vol. 2 Ch. 23 - Girls

[Mojo]

@Ken4553 well that's true and also not the whole truth, it's a bit more complicated then that. Japanese, in general, value conformity as a society. So homosexuality is excepted but only in it's place. Which is not the same as acceptance of gay rights and the like. I do believe that it is still illegal for same sex couples to get married. The legal way for gays to get on each other family register and gain rights in medical emergencies and insurance is for one person in the couple to adopt the other. So instead of married your Father and son or Mother and daughter. That doesn't sound like something a country that accept homosexuality would force a gay couple to do. Having legal rights is the benchmark I use not mere public opinion. I also look at crime statistics. Like the amount of violence commented to gay people. How safe is it to be openly gay in the country. Is there any anti-discrimination laws prevent a employer from firing you based on your sexual orientation? etc.

Also, most of your reference are based on the past, the world changes all the time. For example in Zambia homosexuality was historically/culturally widely accepted but then American Baptist missionary's went in preached and demonized it to the point the country now throws you in jail for being caught gay.

 

[Ken4553]

@Mojo by "value conformity as a society" you mean their Japanese standard of politeness? Which demands that if a subject might be embarrassing or upsetting to talk about, that usually means that you don’t talk about it?

Well that is true.
The only thing Japanese people have against homosexuals is that they can't have kids, they don't really care about anything else.
This is how a conversation would go - I'll use your name, cause I can't think of one.
Mojo: What do you think of homosexuals?
Japanese person: Weird.
Mojo: Why?
Japanese person: They can't have kids.

 

[Mojo]

@Ken4553 There are plenty of hetero couple that rely on surrogate mothers, artificial insemination and adoption. Homo still can't get married in Japan even with all those ways of having children available to them too. They are a first world country with some of the best health care including maternity aid. It's more than not having kids it about legal rights. I say it again, laws are the benchmark of how a society really feels/accepts a minority group like homosexuals.

But as you say Japanese are not one to talk about sensitive subjects in public (because manners/rudeness) so it's hard to gauge what they really feel.

 

[Ken4553]

@Mojo

No, I was kind of just saying that Japanese have this stigma attached to homosexual couples that 'they can't have kids', even though it wouldn't affect the birthrate in their country.

So, at the national level, that's probably the main reason why gay marriage is not accepted, because they don't talk about it at all and explain that there are options outside of heterosexual sex to get a kid.

They are accepting of gay couples, but it's kind of like they think the relationships are a hobby than more of a real relationship.

Outside of that, some random Christian Pastor probably demonized same sex couples in Japan too, but I guess it only slightly affected them.


Also, my fault if my responses are completely off-topic from what you are saying. I'm gonna be honest and say I only read the first sentence of each of your replies, then skipped about half of it and read the end. I might come back later and say "Damn, I'm a dumbass"
I'm just really tired and lazy right now.

 

[lightingcloud]

@Ken4553 yeah they sound really "I don't discriminate you" to me, nothing sounds more "acceptance and tolerance" like "you can't contribute to society, just marry a woman and have kids already don't be a pussy"

 

[Ken4553]

@lightingcloud
No, I meant that Japan is more accepting than most places.
You said "Then again, I can't imagine how hard it must be for the boy, especially in Japan..."

Being gay in America, you get bullied a lot, some to the point of suicide.

In other places, you get hunted down for being gay.

In Japan, yeah, there is discrimination, but it's only at the level of being ignored. If someone said they were gay in Japan, they would just say "Well, okay, keep that to yourself."
They don't say "You can't contribute to society" or anything like that.

And the only reason they are worried about homosexuals not having kids is because the child population in Japan is declining. Not a minimal decline, but a really really big decline in kid population. So big in fact, that the government is at the level of going all out to make people have sex.

So, it's pretty much in all of Japans population to think of gay couples as weird, because their in a time where nobody wants kids. It's already rare to see a normal couple out in public.

Also, read your comment out loud.

 

[lightingcloud]

@Ken4553 I read TONS of autobiographic mangas on the difficulties of being gay in Japan. I don't care if samurai fucked each other. They are long gone, we're in 2020 if you didn't notice. Sure, many Americans may be dicks on the issue, but IIRC the law is still on the side of LGBT+. In Japan it isn't. Period.

 

[Ken4553]

@lightingcloud

I thought we were talking about acceptance and discrimination from people and not the law?

I also just used the samurai reference to talk about how it lead up to this level of acceptance, I didn't use it as a main factor in my argument that Japan's Citizens are more forgiving on homosexuals.

If we are talking about the law, then - If Japanese were more open and if they were educated more on child birth and how to accept more kids into their society. I'm pretty sure that's all it would take for homosexuals to get acceptance for marrying.

Though, the level of difficulty for them to open up like that is almost impossible.

 

[lightingcloud]

@Ken4553 you're missing the point, too. I don't really see how it wouldn't be crazy difficult to be gay in a society that is essentially based on social acceptance of the norm if you "aren't the norm". If other people don't want to see "you", you can't live normally. That is NOT acceptance, in any way. "just be gay in your room" is not, in ANY way, something you'd call "acceptance". damn, you told yourself, they have a stigma.

 

[Ken4553]

@lightingcloud

Yes, a stigma due to the government literally preaching and pretty much shouting at everyone to have a kid.

You wouldn't know this, not to be rude. This might come as a culture shock, but ALL relationships in Japan, nobody there wants to see it. That's the norm.

It's at the level of "Just have a relationship in your room"

Being homosexual and being heterosexual is pretty much the same there. The only difference is that the Citizens are surprised because they also want more kids in their society and a gay couple to them, can't have one. They aren't educated on adoption or surrogate parents.

 

[lightingcloud]

@Ken4553 except that some are regarded as "hey get a room already" and some as "yeah ok but also get a room with someone of the other sex already". I really can't understand how you don't see the difference.

(anyway that's enough for me, see ya!)

 

[Ken4553]

@lightingcloud
That's something you would see in America or Russia or some other place that's more accepting of couples in public.
"hey get a room already" is a joke people use, they don't actually mind having the couple out in public. As for Japan, they don't have a joke like that, they literally just feel uncomfortable with any type of affection shown in public. They aren't Anti-Gay just for ignoring someone who says they are gay, they would also ignore someone who said they were in a relationship with the opposite sex the same exact way.

And if some random Japanese citizen did say "hey get a room already". That person is dead serious.

Japan is a closed off society. They think different due to their culture.

Seeing a regular couple in Japan is like an American seeing a Gay couple . They are at the same level, because Japanese Citizens don't like seeing something that should be private. 😟 You can see how that would affect a gay person. (They have nobody to talk to, so they can only think for themselves on how others would react)

What you see in manga/webtoons are usually based on scandals that have happened that they read somewhere or based off of western shows.

And bye.
😕

 

[asdf888]

y'all need to chill

 

[Kryspy_Kreme]

Yuuri's already bringing girls to his room!!! Moommm!! lololol

 

[Tensei21]

I love how nonchalant Yuuri is about everything

 

[anneudon]

Yuuri is my favorite lol

 

[wKEIKOw]

Damn Yuuri has a harem..?