Yankee-kun to Hakujou Gaaru - Vol. 1 Ch. 14 - Big Sister
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You could have translated it as "aphid."
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I think everyone on this site already knows what Onee-chan means.
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@caenlim Yeah cuz all manga readers were born the same year as you right?
@GalladeGuy Except people new to this site.
Fun fact, I didn't start reading manga online until I was in college. Wouldn't know what the hell any of this meant at the time. That was 10 years ago.
Another fun fact, people are born every day. And they don't know what you know coming out so fuck off with that shit. It's logic like that which makes people think they can spoil stories "because everyone has watched it".
@GalladeGuy Except people new to this site.
Fun fact, I didn't start reading manga online until I was in college. Wouldn't know what the hell any of this meant at the time. That was 10 years ago.
Another fun fact, people are born every day. And they don't know what you know coming out so fuck off with that shit. It's logic like that which makes people think they can spoil stories "because everyone has watched it".
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@knight_evangel The vast majority of people here are going to know what it means, and anyone who doesn't will just look it up and find out for themselves. It isn't anything like spoiling a story. It's the definition of a word. Should translators have to put notes explaining what somewhat uncommon English words mean for the small amount of people here who might not know what they mean? Of course not. Everyone here is at least smart enough to look up a manga site and end up here. They can look up the definition of a word, too. It's the same thing with Japanese words that are commonly left untranslated in manga.
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@GalladeGuy I said the logic behind spoiling is the same, not that the action itself is similar to spoiler. It is an egocentric thought to believe that something to ease a layman's reading experience should be erased because of the expert's disgust with it.
It is for convenience's sake. Just like Kodansha manga till this day always provide a glossary for Japanese terms, scanlators FOR YEARS, no literal DECADES have been using TL notes. For convenience.
Funny, you probably learned all of the terms that you know from those very same notes. So it's legit. And you're making a humungous assumption saying "most of readers here". You don't know most of the users, I doubt you've talked to all of them personally and plenty of people could be using the site anonymously.
P.S. No, not everyone here is smart enough to look up words either. This place is full of young adults, working adults, smart kids, trolls, toxic people, little kids and people who think everyone is born in the same year as them. There is plenty of variety, and you don't get to "choose" who is smart enough on this site for the sake of an argument out of some predisposed thought that manga readers as a whole have suddenly "leveled up" to know basic Japanese across all users.
It is for convenience's sake. Just like Kodansha manga till this day always provide a glossary for Japanese terms, scanlators FOR YEARS, no literal DECADES have been using TL notes. For convenience.
Funny, you probably learned all of the terms that you know from those very same notes. So it's legit. And you're making a humungous assumption saying "most of readers here". You don't know most of the users, I doubt you've talked to all of them personally and plenty of people could be using the site anonymously.
P.S. No, not everyone here is smart enough to look up words either. This place is full of young adults, working adults, smart kids, trolls, toxic people, little kids and people who think everyone is born in the same year as them. There is plenty of variety, and you don't get to "choose" who is smart enough on this site for the sake of an argument out of some predisposed thought that manga readers as a whole have suddenly "leveled up" to know basic Japanese across all users.
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@knight_evangel If someone can't even look something up, I'd honestly have to question how they've figured out how to get to this site in the first place. And no, I did not learn these words from translation notes, nor am I claiming to be an expert. I never even said to get rid of the note. All I said was that most people here know basic Japanese words like Onee-chan that appear in a very large majority of the manga on this site. It's something you'd notice and look up the definition to within a few days of reading manga, because it's in just about everything. What's even worse is that you're accusing me of thinking everyone was "born in the same year as me", when you yourself have apparently been reading manga for longer than I have. I guess you're the one assuming things here, huh?
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@GalladeGuy I actually disagree that it was an assumption on my part. I would call it a deduction. Unless you were playing the devil's advocate (and if you were, then please accept my apologies), I doubt you would "attack" the need for translator's notes in a manga on the thought that "most people don't need it". Part of my deduction is because the thought is absurd.
It would actually make tons of sense if you said instead that you dislike it! Now that's an argument people have been making for years, and I don't necessarily disagree with it. Sure enough, TL notes can be distracting. But "most people don't need it"? Haha, yeah not.
I think that your belief is a combination of two fallacies (it could be one, I'm not sure though).
1. Confirmation bias. (I'm not sure if this is a type of fallacy, perhaps just a type of bias.). There aren't many ways of drawing a conclusion on the number of readers from x and y demographics coming across said comic. X being those who are layman and wouldn't understand a certain term and Y being those who have been reading for years and wouldn't need an explanation. I call it confirmation bias because you could only have drawn this conclusion by simply having been surrounded by similarly well-learned people on the website by your own volition, most likely without your own knowledge. I doubt you read literally every genre with every writing style and art style regardless and consistently pursue all years of manga to the point where you'd have read at lead 50% of all manga uploaded on this site, which is just the starting point for taking your statement "I know at least half of the manga readers here" seriously.
2. The second fallacy I think this falls under is argumentum ad populum. Or "If many people believe it, it must be so." Rather than come up with a reason that supports the belief that this note is an obstruction at all, you simply say that there are many others who do not need the translators' notes, thus it isn't needed.
Keep in mind that I am not necessarily for nor against the notes themselves in this exchange. I merely disapprove of your reason. Because it's simply not quantifiable nor provable. Seriously, how many people do you think read manga? Honest, try and give me a number. Do you even know how small or large the traffic on this website is?
Honest, I'm not even joking. If you outright said "I freaking hate translator's notes they should just leave it at the end!" I'm all smiles, that's a legitimate reason!
But who is "most people"? Most people in your favorited manga's comment section? What'd you do, have an interview with them all? Did you read your non-favorited manga too just in case? Did you go to the webmaster and do an IP address check and start a background check using the dark web? LOL
It would actually make tons of sense if you said instead that you dislike it! Now that's an argument people have been making for years, and I don't necessarily disagree with it. Sure enough, TL notes can be distracting. But "most people don't need it"? Haha, yeah not.
I think that your belief is a combination of two fallacies (it could be one, I'm not sure though).
1. Confirmation bias. (I'm not sure if this is a type of fallacy, perhaps just a type of bias.). There aren't many ways of drawing a conclusion on the number of readers from x and y demographics coming across said comic. X being those who are layman and wouldn't understand a certain term and Y being those who have been reading for years and wouldn't need an explanation. I call it confirmation bias because you could only have drawn this conclusion by simply having been surrounded by similarly well-learned people on the website by your own volition, most likely without your own knowledge. I doubt you read literally every genre with every writing style and art style regardless and consistently pursue all years of manga to the point where you'd have read at lead 50% of all manga uploaded on this site, which is just the starting point for taking your statement "I know at least half of the manga readers here" seriously.
2. The second fallacy I think this falls under is argumentum ad populum. Or "If many people believe it, it must be so." Rather than come up with a reason that supports the belief that this note is an obstruction at all, you simply say that there are many others who do not need the translators' notes, thus it isn't needed.
Keep in mind that I am not necessarily for nor against the notes themselves in this exchange. I merely disapprove of your reason. Because it's simply not quantifiable nor provable. Seriously, how many people do you think read manga? Honest, try and give me a number. Do you even know how small or large the traffic on this website is?
Honest, I'm not even joking. If you outright said "I freaking hate translator's notes they should just leave it at the end!" I'm all smiles, that's a legitimate reason!
But who is "most people"? Most people in your favorited manga's comment section? What'd you do, have an interview with them all? Did you read your non-favorited manga too just in case? Did you go to the webmaster and do an IP address check and start a background check using the dark web? LOL
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@knight_evangel No, I don't know for sure who does and doesn't know what the word means. All I know is that in the many hundreds of comment sections I've read in my over one and a half years on this site, I have never once seen a person ask what a word like Onee-chan meant. That means that every single person I've come across on this site either already knows what words like that mean, or are smart enough to look it up for themselves. That is why I said most people know what it means or can find out for themselves. It's just what I've observed, and it seems reasonable to extrapolate that to the rest of the readers on this site, given that the actions of all of the readers I've seen confirm what I've said.
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@GalladeGuy It isn't reasonable. Divide those "hundreds" of comment sections by the chapters you've read of each respective manga. Even if you only went to one comment section per manga to get to that "hundreds" that'd still only be a small fraction of the total amount of manga on this site(I hope you don't think there are less than one thousand titles out there), and it isn't like you monitored said comment sections for months to see if more posts were made. And it's not as if your manga are automatically the most populated ones either. Not everyone who reads manga decides to comment in the first place. And lastly, I could ask if you had ever seen anyone say "I just looked up what it means, what's with that TL note?", rather more often then not people who need a TL note are grateful for one and not scornful.
And yeah, saying "It's what I've observed" is textbook confirmation bias. It tends to happen to people who believe they are versatile enough to make deductions based on their length of experience, when in reality their experience is a small sample within the confines of a much broader scope.
For instance, I've been reading manga and going to manga forums for 10 years. And you are the first person I've read say this. Does this mean you are the minority in your way of thinking?
My answer would be "No, I don't know because I don't have conversations about this often. Nor was I actively looking for people who were saying it." instead of "Yes, because he's the only one I've heard say this and I go to a lot of forums".
Just because my experience is broad doesn't mean I was in the right place all of that time to gather the right data for that deduction.
At this point you probably won't forgive me but eh....I'm sorry for hounding you, it's just that this way of thinking is also the primary source of stereotyping. And when other people see that kind of talk they think it's okay and learn from it. It's not a good thing. It's a jump in logic and my least favorite kind at that.
And yeah, saying "It's what I've observed" is textbook confirmation bias. It tends to happen to people who believe they are versatile enough to make deductions based on their length of experience, when in reality their experience is a small sample within the confines of a much broader scope.
For instance, I've been reading manga and going to manga forums for 10 years. And you are the first person I've read say this. Does this mean you are the minority in your way of thinking?
My answer would be "No, I don't know because I don't have conversations about this often. Nor was I actively looking for people who were saying it." instead of "Yes, because he's the only one I've heard say this and I go to a lot of forums".
Just because my experience is broad doesn't mean I was in the right place all of that time to gather the right data for that deduction.
At this point you probably won't forgive me but eh....I'm sorry for hounding you, it's just that this way of thinking is also the primary source of stereotyping. And when other people see that kind of talk they think it's okay and learn from it. It's not a good thing. It's a jump in logic and my least favorite kind at that.
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@caenlim I personally feel like mangadex is full of trolls, so I don't blame you for assuming that about me. But nah, if you have nothing else to say about it then I'm cool. EDIT (I just like debates because I'm a nerd who was on the debate team).
Also hey, are you United States too? Dope, you guessed right.
P.S. You have to use the @ for notifications to come up, dunno if you forgot that or not.
Also hey, are you United States too? Dope, you guessed right.
P.S. You have to use the @ for notifications to come up, dunno if you forgot that or not.
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Heh, you don't have to fight over my decision to include a definition.
This could be the first manga someone reads in their life--for that matter, it could be the first chapter or even the first page they ever read if a friend shares it with them. They could read this chapter on numerous sites other than this one. This could be their 100th manga but the first one that actually uses the word "onee-chan." It's also possible to forget words or have trouble remembering the meaning, even if you've seen the word several times. And even if none of that ends up being the case for any reader, it's generally better to supply excess information than insufficient information.
Plus, this definition is way more complete than, say, https://jisho.org/search/oneechan
This could be the first manga someone reads in their life--for that matter, it could be the first chapter or even the first page they ever read if a friend shares it with them. They could read this chapter on numerous sites other than this one. This could be their 100th manga but the first one that actually uses the word "onee-chan." It's also possible to forget words or have trouble remembering the meaning, even if you've seen the word several times. And even if none of that ends up being the case for any reader, it's generally better to supply excess information than insufficient information.
Plus, this definition is way more complete than, say, https://jisho.org/search/oneechan
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Notice how some asshole build a obstacle into the middle of the pavement.
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Holy shit, thicc husky voiced older sister? You can't beat that
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