Hazure Waku no [Joutai Ijou Skill] de Saikyou ni Natta Ore ga Subete wo Juurin Suru made - Ch. 63.2

[FuzzySupernova]

He did that with the guy and sent him attack his friends with Berserk.

No way, Sherlock, #2
Are you all drunk or something? Did anyone suggest anything different?

 

[StormSen]

Realistic? You have your head stuck in your personal movie if you really believe that. Except for some bonafide psychopaths who are mentally incapable and even those would be able to pretend to have empathy because they know how others would perceive them. Your idea of evil is a construct created specifically to make it easy to hate people by othering them to a degree where they "feel no evil", so it's ok to exterminate them. Kinda ironic

Naive. Time and experience will probably cure you of that.

As for the second part, you seem to be implying that it's okay to kill people if they hate other people. ... You're telling us more about your thought processes than mine. (And just to be clear, IMO punishment should be based on a person's actions, not on their thoughts or feelings.)

 

[auriga]

It surprises me how many people try to come up with any kind of excuse for this cheap plot device.

I dunno, it looks you're among the minority in this thread who wasn't able to suspend their disbelief. I'm the type of reader who calls things out when I feel something is truly egregious that it snaps me out of my immersion but this just wasn't it.

And there's clearly no convincing you so I'm just going to stop.

 

[FuzzySupernova]

I dunno, it looks you're among the minority in this thread who wasn't able to suspend their disbelief.

Firstly, I wasn't the one quoting other people's posts, it was them. Secondly, what disbelief? There was no logic in any comments on my initial post. Don't confuse things.

And there's clearly no convincing you so I'm just going to stop.

You didn't provide any argument to "convince" me. Try actually reading my comments. What I stated is that his control skills, in this case the berserk one, are lifted with certain conditions, the main of which is death. And if you are dead, you are dead, you cannot speak no more. And if you're not, the control won't be lifted. So what is it you fail to understand?

 

[Iskarioth]

Naive. Time and experience will probably cure you of that.

As for the second part, you seem to be implying that it's okay to kill people if they hate other people. ... You're telling us more about your thought processes than mine. (And just to be clear, IMO punishment should be based on a person's actions, not on their thoughts or feelings.)

Not only am I an avid history fan but also older than you unfortunately, by my guess. Other than that I have no idea how me portraying your reasoning somehow gives you insight into me, when it was you implying the that there's some kind of great unforgivable ( comically flat overblown) evil. I think that very perception is dangerous because it makes it easy to come to certain conclusion as has happened in the past.

 

[Tsumi]

Firstly, I wasn't the one quoting other people's posts, it was them. Secondly, what disbelief? There was no logic in any comments on my initial post. Don't confuse things.

You didn't provide any argument to "convince" me. Try actually reading my comments. What I stated is that his control skills, in this case the berserk one, are lifted with certain conditions, the main of which is death. And if you are dead, you are dead, you cannot speak no more. And if you're not, the control won't be lifted. So what is it you fail to understand?

Please provide proof of there being conditions to lift his skills. Just because we only see him keep his skills activated until death of the person or monster does not mean there are conditions. In fact, in regards to the poison skill, he mentioned being able to cancel it halfway through in chapter 20. It's also implied that Paralyze and Sleep have duration limits in that same chapter. By extension, it can be inferred that status effect skills all have duration limitations and can be cancelled at will by the user. Berserk is not a control skill- it's a status effect skill, as are all of his other primary skills.

Edit: Ch 2- Poison lasts until death, paralyze and sleep have duration limits. Also remember Pigimaru gives him extended range by sneaking its tentacles around.

 

[FuzzySupernova]

Please provide proof of there being conditions to lift his skills...

His skills are cancelled by: death, duration limit and manual cancellation (full or partial). There is not a single sign of anything except the death of the target in this case, at least until is shown otherwise.

 

[Tsumi]

His skills are cancelled by: death, duration limit and manual cancellation (full or partial). There is not a single sign of anything except the death of the target in this case, at least until is shown otherwise.

Touka could have released it while offscreen to sow discord and confusion. It would be in character with how he has behaved thus far to do so. Nitpicking this detail as "cheap attempt at drama" or "cheap plot device" feels like you grasping at straws to put this down however you can. Are you that upset that his humanity came back at the last second instead of remaining a mindless berserker to the end?

 

[FuzzySupernova]

Touka could have released it while offscreen to sow discord and confusion. It would be in character with how he has behaved thus far to do so. Nitpicking this detail as "cheap attempt at drama" or "cheap plot device" feels like you grasping at straws to put this down however you can. Are you that upset that his humanity came back at the last second instead of remaining a mindless berserker to the end?

1) "Touka could have released it while offscreen to sow discord and confusion" - and who is nitpicking here?
2) "feels like you grasping at straws" - looks like the other way around to me.
3) "Are you that upset that his humanity came back" - there is no "humanity" in these monsters which could counter against what bastards they are, stop looking for diamonds in a pile of shit.

 

[Tsumi]

1) "Touka could have released it while offscreen to sow discord and confusion" - and who is nitpicking here?
2) "feels like you grasping at straws" - looks like the other way around to me.
3) "Are you that upset that his humanity came back" - there is no "humanity" in these monsters which could counter against what bastards they are, stop looking for diamonds in a pile of shit.

1. It's not nitpicking, it's a perfectly valid in-world and in-character hypothesis of what happened. Your attempts to portray it as bad writing by hyperfocusing on certain details and assumptions is nitpicking.
2. See above.
3. You just proved your judgement is completely clouded by your emotions and that you need to take a step back in order to have a logical discussion.

 

[FuzzySupernova]

1. It's not nitpicking, it's a perfectly valid in-world and in-character hypothesis of what happened. Your attempts to portray it as bad writing by hyperfocusing on certain details and assumptions is nitpicking.
2. See above.
3. You just proved your judgement is completely clouded by your emotions and that you need to take a step back in order to have a logical discussion.

1. Hypothesis - so the "pull out of ones ass" theory to make something up that suits your vision instead of a simple straightforward observation. Riiight.
2. See above.
3. It is a simple just evaluation based on previous observation of this oh so humane group of characters. Trying to humanize them really makes no sense and is a stupid trope humanity can do without in general. Compassion, empathy, second chances, etc., should be reserved for those who actually deserve it and not for plain human scum.

 

[definitionofinsanity]

Fuuuuck! I have murder vengeance blue balls! The cliffhanger!

 

[Tsumi]

1. Hypothesis - so the "pull out of ones ass" theory to make something up that suits your vision instead of a simple straightforward observation. Riiight.
2. See above.
3. It is a simple just evaluation based on previous observation of this oh so humane group of characters. Trying to humanize them really makes no sense and is a stupid trope humanity can do without in general. Compassion, empathy, second chances, etc., should be reserved for those who actually deserve it and not for plain human scum.

You want a simple straightforward observation? Here's the simple straightforward observation: When Satsuki says "I'm sorry", Lewin's reaction is fear and panic. There wasn't a flashback of good times (compassion) nor did Lewin vow to avenge him (empathy/second chances). Tell me, where the hell are you seeing "humanization" here? You're pulling that out of your ass from just a simple "I'm sorry" and entirely ignoring the context around it.

Here's another simple and straightforward observation: Touka has repeatedly shown that he is perfectly capable of manipulating his enemy's emotions, either tricking them into complacency or inducing confusion.

Put the two simple and straightforward observations together and you have a very reasonable hypothesis that Touka intended for this to happen.

 

[FuzzySupernova]

You want a simple straightforward observation? Here's the simple straightforward observation: When Satsuki says "I'm sorry", Lewin's reaction is fear and panic.

As it was from the moment they noticed something weird (insects fell silent, etc.), but you still will make things up.

Here's another simple and straightforward observation: Touka has repeatedly shown that he is perfectly capable of manipulating his enemy's emotions, either tricking them into complacency or inducing confusion.

Blablabla, maybe yes, maybe no. Wishful thinking. If they'll show something like this next chapter, then it's another thing.

Put the two simple and straightforward observations together and you have a very reasonable hypothesis that Touka intended for this to happen.

I don't see how it is any reasonable than it being done for cheap drama. You do you.

 

[Tsumi]

As it was from the moment they noticed something weird (insects fell silent, etc.), but you still will make things up.

Blablabla, maybe yes, maybe no. Wishful thinking. If they'll show something like this next chapter, then it's another thing.

I don't see how it is any reasonable than it being done for cheap drama. You do you.

The only one making things up here is an emotionally enraged person unable to think rationally. If the author wanted us to feel sorry for Satsuki, Lewin's reaction would have been very different, end of story. Instead, we're getting Lewin's party falling deeper into panic and fear, which in this context is building hype for the "Get wrecked bastards!" moment. Hype that almost everyone else in this comment section is feeling by the way. You are pretty much the lone person in this comment section feeling that this moment is a humanizing moment.

 

[FuzzySupernova]

The only one making things up here is an emotionally enraged person unable to think rationally. If the author wanted us to feel sorry for Satsuki, Lewin's reaction would have been very different, end of story. Instead, we're getting Lewin's party falling deeper into panic and fear, which in this context is building hype for the "Get wrecked bastards!" moment. Hype that almost everyone else in this comment section is feeling by the way. You are pretty much the lone person in this comment section feeling that this moment is a humanizing moment.

Having moral compass and hatred for evil doesn't make you enraged. And you still continue making stuff up, as plenty of people liked my initial comment, as well as your statement about "hype that almost everyone is feeling" is simply a speculation. Anyway, this conversation clearly isn't moving anywhere, so I take my leave.