Taida na Akujoku Kizoku ni Tensei Shita Ore, Scenario wo Bukkowa Shitara Kikaku-gai no Maryoku de Saikyou ni Natta - Ch. 17 - Necessary Evil and Abso…

[Azurekyte]

There's a lotta people who read the pictures and skimmed the words in this chapter. I'm pretty sure MC isn't pro slavery, he's just pissed that someone can say 'this thing bad' and only say 'this thing bad' instead of actually having ideas and/or solutions to the problem.

Also, 15 pages holy shit. Chapter 10 was 24 pages, chapter 6 was like 28. At the rate we're going it's gonna drop down to like 8 page chapters before long.

 

[Sheza]

Lots of people here who cant type in proper English grammar arguing over one another and its funny cause theyre butchering whatever they are trying to say LMAO

 

[Miskatonic81]

People unironically defending slavery in the comments was funnier than the actual chapter

 

[MagnaDrake]

at everyone who says stuff like "well you can't expect Weiss to change the entire system, he's saying that because it's hard to overturn it"
Even if he hasn't the power to overturn it, he can still express the opinion that slavery is evil. He could then explain why it's hard to abolish in the current economic situation or whatever.

But no, he chose to say "It's not necessarily evil". I just hope that we as the readers aren't supposed to support his views there.

No, we're not. I thought that's obvious. A character is allowed to have flawed views and have people still root for them regardless. We as humans of the 21st century knows FOR A FACT that slavery is evil. It's irrefutable. But when engaging in fiction, you have to see it in the character's worldview and try to understand why the character thinks like that, sometimes without having the story explicitly tells you of the reason. Within the last few chapters you should be able to take the world apart and make sense on why Weiss would have that opinion in their fictional world. Is it wrong when viewed with the glasses of the 21st century? Absolutely. Is it wrong with THEIR glasses? I can't answer.

And so for the most part I was just explaining on why he actually got angry towards Allen, because somehow people took it that Weiss is enraged purely because Allen opposes slavery, instead of being a good-intentioned-but-naive idiot in a room full of nobles.

 

[AnonymousContributor]

I don't remember if it was a previous chapter, or one of the novel versions that goes into more detail - but MC is not "pro slavery", but very much understanding of why it exists in this world, and just how difficult it would be to abolish as a practice.
As in - looking at just IRL USA history, a literal war was fought over it. And the ramifications still echo through the country's history into the present.

He lays out some of it here - he's just annoyed at the empty idealism and vacuous platitudes that Allen expresses, because it's really easy to say "[Thing] is bad", when you're not also following that statement up with meaningful steps to actually walk that talk.
He is on the record somewhere as thinking slavery is abhorrent, but he's also considering just how immense tackling the removal of that system would be, given the uphill battle of facing off against all of the nobility that not only relies on, but economically thrives on it - the situation of all the people formerly in bondage, the actual economic impact that would have to be addressed - both in terms of the removal of that labor pool, but also the money to pay them to work, the housing, clothing, food, medical care, and more they would all require, and so on.
And he also acknowledges that, in some senses, children put into bondage who've lost their families to war, abandonment, famine/disease and so on, are given some modicum of stability and material guarantee, if not comfort. It's clearly not good, but for the present moment, it means they're not on the streets either dying or resorting to violence and theft, creating downstream issues for society at large.

TL;DR Weiss is super pragmatic about the realities of it while being personally against it; Allen is 100% emotion and idealistic rhetoric but offers zero actionable solutions.


But it would seem that, where Allen is concerned, the OG Weiss is more prone to coming to the surface than normal, and in ways MC can't always anticipate and control.

but it was bad though slavery is obviously bad then after that came more systemic racism

 

[AnonymousContributor]

someone didn't read the world building with detail. Noble have good magic because they afford tutor and book to learn magic. commoner is not that good with magic duh. Allen is special case because he has a talent and OG MC of the story.

why not introducing slavery in his story? because slavery always happen. we IRL only stop slavery in 20th century. Mauritania abolish Slavery in 1981 for god sake. "ohh slavery is bad, should not put in story" is stupid logic as human always took advantage on the poor. we even have new Modern slavery system, using loophole in labor law of certain countries.

i hate slavery so even it logical for it to exist in story, it must not exist. what a stupid take. next what, you hate monarchy so medieval setting isekai should have democracy and republic? truth and reality is not pretty you sweet summer child. nothing wrong to put what mostly happen in such ages in story and worldbuilding.

oh, Noble with magic can solve slavery with magic. so do mega rich Billionaire with such wealth can end world hunger. but did they help or keep that wealth to themselves? it called human greed and taking advantage of others.

telling Noble to use magic and abolish slavery is like telling billionaire to pay more taxes and raise wages plus took less cut from the profit.

Since when did medieval settings contain modern clothing with modern (or at least shit that is a few centuries past medieval) architecture and building features? And when certain features did exist, they were not at the level drawn in story. So obviously don't go harping about realism in a world where people wear 19th-20th century military uniforms in an ostenibly medieval setting and the buildings are at earliest enlightenment era to like victorian or edwardian era lmao

 

[AnonymousContributor]

I also don't think Weiss is comparable to Gojo.

Also also - trying to force one's will on a governmental system built of individuals who hold a monopoly of force (literally - nobles are the ones with magic in this setting; Allen's an anomaly as a commoner who can wield it) - and those same individuals have a vested interest in not having their existing way of life disrupted for a litany of reasons (including the function of the country's economy), and you have a situation ripe for mass slaughter of people in open conflict, including the very ones you're claiming to want to liberate.

Doesn't matter how strong you are as an individual. You will cause suffering making a monumental change without proper planning and logistical backup. The protagonist is saying that that is why Allen's idealism is just that. Allen's got no plan, just a slogan. That's great, but it's hollow and impotent.

You're simply expressing the same things Allen did, and the things the protagonist was calling out in regards to Allen.

Some death is necessary for proper change even with planning btw

 

[Treswimming]

My brother in Christ, we're reading a fictional story about a guy trapped inside of another guy inside of another world. Another world where literal magic exists. Where people become super-human through effort.

The guy writing this could have, at any point during the writing and editing phases, decided to not introduce slavery. Yet he did, and on top of that is having the protagonist defend it. What good is free labor anyway when a group of magicly roided muscle wizards can do the work of a thousand men? The whole thing is edge for the sake of being edgy.

I think it’s good world building. High skilled positions like wizards come at a premium. 1000 slaves is probably still cheaper the. One “magically roided muscle wizard”. I think it’s more interesting to think about how a system like this could exist. Slavery is entrenched in the culture which is going to be difficult to get rid of despite the benefits (See the issues with Coal vs Nuclear power and other power sources). Slaves are probably more stable when bookkeeping. I could go on and on.

 

[DeOneChester]

People unironically defending slavery in the comments was funnier than the actual chapter

I know lmao. And its like the same 3 or 4 people that are REALLY passionate about defending slavery. Bet they wish they could isekai so they could own their own slaves too or something.

 

[MrGrinns]

Slavery used as a tool of punishment for criminals or as means of enforcing a working standard has its advantages. Working off a penance of some kind, or ensuring that there are no jobless/homeless by providing a bare minimum of labor and survivability for homeless populations. But slavery without recourse is an actual detriment to the society its practiced in. Draining an economy of valuable jobs and resources without a system for that money to be returned to the economy creates a financial well. If you look at countries that practiced this sort of slavery you can see that as soon as it was abolished the country went through a huge economic golden age. Of course, this sort of practice also has the issue of allowing for the importation of slaves. Creating a foreign dependant class that interferes with local cultures and most of the time influences society negatively.

Its better to avoid the practice all together as theres too many long-term negatives to negate the positives. Unless heavily regulated, this sort of system can cause very severe issues down the line as seen with the united states and other European countries that practiced slavery

Im gonna assume ill have some angry comments from people that refuse to think logically about the topic. Thats normal, but ill remind them and the mods that i have not broken any guidelines with this topic.

 

[FeudalGrass]

There's a lotta people who read the pictures and skimmed the words in this chapter. I'm pretty sure MC isn't pro slavery, he's just pissed that someone can say 'this thing bad' and only say 'this thing bad' instead of actually having ideas and/or solutions to the problem.

Also, 15 pages holy shit. Chapter 10 was 24 pages, chapter 6 was like 28. At the rate we're going it's gonna drop down to like 8 page chapters before long.

"it is bad but what can we do?" is a bit different from "it isn't necessarily bad" to me



this seems like "if you are born poor it is better for you to be slave, else you would become criminal anyway"

Allen is right to be pissed off tbh, Weiss is in the position to profit from slavery, while Allen is the one who could have been sold into it. Basically got called "you should have been a slave" to lol.

it is not smart dispaying it in a room full of nobles though.

 

[Ainkrip]

i say a dude that belive one must find a good alternative is not a coward, and a moron that can only go "bad thing is bad" is one.
otherwise goverment that do bareminimum shit is the most courage being to ever born.
but hey you do you.

imagin seeing women being kill and go "nooo killing is bad" then call dude that try to find weapon cause he didn't want to end up die with women anyway, A COWARD.

Weiss literally didn’t provide any alternative lol. He could have provided some solutions but he just agreed with slavery being ok lol

 

[Kampfarsch]

Milk is such a fucking drain on this story man

Most Western countries that practiced slavery abolished it without a civil war. The United States is a unique case, where the American Civil War is borne out of the conflict between the landowning slaver class that had been the predominant faction of the wealthy/rich population through the country's existence up until that point, and the new industrial classes (capitalist and worker alike) that opposed slavery both for moral reasons and financial reasons. Elsewhere in the West the landowners used serfdom, not chattle slavery, but this too largely fell in time as national governments centralized their authority and needed more free manpower for their armies. Slavery abolition is entirely possible by reform, but it largely revolves around transforming the nation's economy to end dependence on it as a source of labor.

like how? without creating massive economic, social and kingdom stability issue. either way, bloodbath going to happen like how America civil war did. so if you suggesting that he need to do what he can to abolish it, please tell the best method to do it as Weiss.

if not, you just like Allen, idealism without touching the reality.

It sure is funny that despite talking about it so much, americans know absolutely fuck all about the history of slavery, really cant think past your neighborhood

"it is bad but what can we do?" is a bit different from "it isn't necessarily bad" to me



this seems like "if you are born poor it is better for you to be slave, else you would become criminal anyway"

Allen is right to be pissed off tbh, Weiss is in the position to profit from slavery, while Allen is the one who could have been sold into it. Basically got called "you should have been a slave" to lol.

it is not smart dispaying it in a room full of nobles though.

Its a little more "Most slaves are from the ghetto" not "all poors are criminals/slaves" I think
I dont think they have shown us much of the world so far but weve seen plenty lower class people just living life

 

[Sakuyadorf]

good old slavery lets go on about history instead of talking about how some countries still have it today

 

[Moody0_0]

I don't remember if it was a previous chapter, or one of the novel versions that goes into more detail - but MC is not "pro slavery", but very much understanding of why it exists in this world, and just how difficult it would be to abolish as a practice.
As in - looking at just IRL USA history, a literal war was fought over it. And the ramifications still echo through the country's history into the present.

He lays out some of it here - he's just annoyed at the empty idealism and vacuous platitudes that Allen expresses, because it's really easy to say "[Thing] is bad", when you're not also following that statement up with meaningful steps to actually walk that talk.
He is on the record somewhere as thinking slavery is abhorrent, but he's also considering just how immense tackling the removal of that system would be, given the uphill battle of facing off against all of the nobility that not only relies on, but economically thrives on it - the situation of all the people formerly in bondage, the actual economic impact that would have to be addressed - both in terms of the removal of that labor pool, but also the money to pay them to work, the housing, clothing, food, medical care, and more they would all require, and so on.
And he also acknowledges that, in some senses, children put into bondage who've lost their families to war, abandonment, famine/disease and so on, are given some modicum of stability and material guarantee, if not comfort. It's clearly not good, but for the present moment, it means they're not on the streets either dying or resorting to violence and theft, creating downstream issues for society at large.

TL;DR Weiss is super pragmatic about the realities of it while being personally against it; Allen is 100% emotion and idealistic rhetoric but offers zero actionable solutions.


But it would seem that, where Allen is concerned, the OG Weiss is more prone to coming to the surface than normal, and in ways MC can't always anticipate and control.

IDK. to me what Weiss says is 110% hypocritical. He is also all talk and no action. Just his action is indifference, rather than being vocal about his disagreement and doing nothing like Allen. They are both the same side of the same coin.

I do agree with the one commenter who says the original weiss may be influencing the MC more than originally thought. That shadow that hangs over him is probably more than just dramatic flair when he is "acting" as weiss, but maybe more channeling his inner weiss, and it is slowly influencing him. As I feel the MC behind weiss isnt acting the same now that he is actually attending school.

 

[KaisarX]

Weiss literally didn’t provide any alternative lol. He could have provided some solutions but he just agreed with slavery being ok lol

well that would just make thing boring isn't it.
here a problem.
here a solution.
end of the chapter.
Weiss idea is we need to find solution, his problem is allen also didn't plan on finding shit for solution.
that the entire point of this chapter.

but fuck it, imagin manga decide to write weiss explain a social welfare system and how to force noble to support said system and new basic law of human right. and then he going to become emperor of mankind and clense human of all sin
that would make thing fun interesting and not complete stupid.

but he just agreed with slavery being ok lol

if you are lack reading comprehension then sure, he did said that. his point is that slave system exist for a reason, people lose war become homeless and then just become bandit just to not starve. sure rich people can just donate their excess but why would they? they are fucking parasite asshole noble for christ sake, and Allen said that shit infront of noble children.
and why the hell do we expect isekai-reincarnation protagonist to find a solution to slave when we modern human still can't do shit about it.

Weiss entire point is just "don't bark with no bite" critisim without alternative nor plan just going to marked allen to be kill by power that be.

and a lot of barking people seem to take offend to that, i wonder why.

 

[KaisarX]

People unironically defending slavery in the comments was funnier than the actual chapter

Souce: i don't agree with them. 10/10 #freeslave

 

[ciera]

Thank you for the chapter

 

[BringinTheBeefUS]

You have people rightfully criticizing the over prominence of slavery and the hoops manga authors jump through to justify it being in their story, and then you've got the absolute dunces in this comment section trying to call you an idiot for not liking slavery in your fantasy story LMFAO

 

[KaisarX]

You have people rightfully criticizing the over prominence of slavery

over prominence of slavery?
that shit is like classroom topic in this manga, like it the first time ever this story bought it up and not even that harsh too.

it like saying there is over prominence of fork in eating a salad. that just dumb.