Nito no Taidana Isekai Shoukougun ~Saijaku Shoku "Healer" nano ni Saikyou wa Cheat desu ka?~ - Ch. 42.1

[NullSaint]

Can someone let me know where are we in Web Novel terms? TY

 

[RoxasJ]

Maybe she'd change her mind if she went through the same shit the MC did. Like he told her he was summoned and abandoned to die just like that but she STILL condemns him for his choice? Fucking stupid. Anyway see y'all next time

 

[Eridian]

because she has a massive crush on the guy and presumably wants him to stay with her?

while very cathartic in many aspects, MC crushing that kingdom isn't something normal folks would applaud. she's acting correctly based on the context of who she is.

"i shot the fast-food worker because she gave me the wrong order"
"i blew up the gas station because the gas was expensive"
"i ran over the woman and her kids because they were too loud"

revenge fantasy is fun, but it's more or less just emotional slop. a rational look at the story leaves a lot to be desired.

WOW, what a bullshit comparison. Yeah, an evil nation doing evil and cruel shit is the same as a fast food worker giving the wrong order. The fuck is the matter with you.

 

[unnamederror]

stfu bitch, you didn't even know how much he was suffering back then and you blabbering about how he had to act to his enemies?
this woman always such a nuisance, just leave her be, and move on

 

[unnamederror]

Maybe she'd change her mind if she went through the same shit the MC did. Like he told her he was summoned and abandoned to die just like that but she STILL condemns him for his choice? Fucking stupid. Anyway see y'all next time

yeah, this is such a bullshit, even when he had to kill the dangerous guy, that's very necessary, they can't even hold the candle with these people but they get angry because the mc want to kill the bad guy? wtf

 

[AVTE]

I just hope Sierra leaves she is by far a self-righteous soldier who only knows how to oney thats it thats all she done as a royal guard member obey orders does if she ever does end knowing what the princess and king did or what that country did she wouldn't be talking that shit but either I hope she leaves she is an idiot nothing more nothing less

 

[Kikaibaka]

If I'm being honest MC and Sierra+Her Kingdom's values have never aligned anyway, splitting here is probably for the best because she wants to essentially shackle him under the guise of "keeping him off the wrong path: ie don't let him turn his fangs towards us" and frankly considering without him THEY'D ALL BE DEAD they should shut the fuck up instead of giving him reasons to want to leave the Kingdom. Sierra would have broken mentally after suffering less than a tenth of what MC has been through, I don't really give a shit for her moral grandstanding at this point.

 

[larcek]

i do hope Sierra and the Knights realize that this one king summoned heroes for his own benefits and discarded those he deemed useless. it shouldn't take too much brain cells to imagine the military power the king would have developed over a somewhat short time.

and MC didn't destroy the whole kingdom, he kept it cleanly at the castle. while that country likely is going through a rough political time, some noble, or another country surely will happily take that role.

it really feels more to be the frustration speaking from sierras mouth instead of her true feelings.

 

[panneqaha]

I'm just sitting over hear thinking that the MC should probably stop using the creepy talking staff. It's cool and all, and quite powerful, but I also really don't trust it. Who knows how much influence--verbal, magical, etc.--it's having over Masamune. Just reverse it back to what it started out as and be done with it.

 

[Drunut]

It's cute to argue the full revenge fantasy angle, here, but Sierra is correct to be concerned. This is TL-dependent, but she seemed less concerned about him killing people than about killing a country's leadership and letting the country wither on the vine without thinking of the consequences. They killed everyone in the castle with only a vague idea of the result being less bad than the status quo. The country will collapse, and uncountable numbers of completely uninvolved people who live in that country will suffer and die because of it. Not everyone, because someone will fill the vacuum eventually, but not a small number of people. And Masamune doesn't seem to have thought of the collateral damage. At least, that's what I imagine his hazy unresolved regret is about.

It's nevertheless fun to have a series that actually has (potentially) unresolvable ideological differences that the main character has to deal with.

 

[Flame-2-Haze]

"So, the kingdom discarded you for being a 'healer' and just randomly sent you to somewhere or in the middle of nowhere and doesn't care if you died in a ditch or something, but I don't want you to do some 'revenge' on the kingdom because it's wrong."

Girl, if he doesn't destroy the corrupted and evil kingdom that would indiscriminately kill the innocents, then who will???

 

[KoffeeStarZ0e]

The fuck does she knows anything about him ? he survived hell, and the one time he thought that this world would be different, just to ended up being exiled into a deadly dungeon for having a healing ability. Him crashing out is justified, him literally nuked the country is fucking justified.

 

[Reina4444]

It's cute to argue the full revenge fantasy angle, here, but Sierra is correct to be concerned. This is TL-dependent, but she seemed less concerned about him killing people than about killing a country's leadership and letting the country wither on the vine without thinking of the consequences. They killed everyone in the castle with only a vague idea of the result being less bad than the status quo. The country will collapse, and uncountable numbers of completely uninvolved people who live in that country will suffer and die because of it. Not everyone, because someone will fill the vacuum eventually, but not a small number of people. And Masamune doesn't seem to have thought of the collateral damage. At least, that's what I imagine his hazy unresolved regret is about.

It's nevertheless fun to have a series that actually has (potentially) unresolvable ideological differences that the main character has to deal with.

the country you're speaking of is literally a warmongering empire sacrificing its own citizens on the battlefield for no reason, while abusing the hell out of summoned foreigners.
if anything, the treatment of people can only get better from there.
the collapse has to come to actually to improve the situation.

 

[pachingching]

just tell them what that kingdom did to summon heros dumbass. This moral discussion would have ended on that note.

 

[SugarFree]

She says that doesn’t make it right, but it doesn’t make it necessarily wrong, either. Had they been left alive, their regime would have continued to maintain and kill innocent people for the sake of their twisted goals; we already know they’re willing to brutally torture people for the sake of the summoning, so who knows what else may have gone on that we don’t know about.

On the other hand, though, there is going to be a mountain of unforeseen fallout from this. A country without clear leadership is doomed to fall. They will be conquered and destroyed, and their people will suffer immensely because of Masamune’s actions and lack of foresight. The only option that would have both saved the country and fulfilled his revenge would be to gather an alliance of countries to deal with the threat, but that was basically impossible in the political climate.

It really was a “it’s all fucked no matter what” situation, a real moral gray area until they could look at it in hindsight.

 

[dankenglish]

Those are bad comparisons and not at all comparable to mc's situation.

"i was summoned to another world and the kingdom that summoned me tried to kill me so I destroyed them"

good point. i used my points because IRL people don't get summoned to other worlds very often, so it's difficult to build a context.

i'll build off yours, if you don't mind:

"i was summoned to another world and the kingdom that summoned me tried to kill me so I destroyed them"
"now with the monarchy gone, the people of that kingdom are not protected by any military force"
"warlords will certainly rise and war will engulf the people because this land is economically viable and has no claimant"

"there is a girl who seems to like me and she happens to be a knight for her own kingdom"
"she doesn't seem to approve what I did"
"i myself understand that revenge isn't ideal, but i'll do it anyway because feelings"
"i'm allowed to feel this way, because i was bullied before i was summoned, and i suffered"

"but i got cheat powers out of it"

the guy is emotionally ungrounded. literally suicidal. how am i supposed to sympathize with his thinking process?

if he didn't get those edgy reversal powers, his healing ability would have been low-value. the crazy princess had the correct evaluation when she booted him. for some reason, she didn't just execute the guy with her knives or magic, just teleported him to some random place.

MC got those reversal powers and power-leveled, which puts into question whether how much he really suffered. even his former classmates need to put in effort; all he did was stumble onto some conspiracy.

the Dragon Heart folks seem nice, but they're murderhobos. literally tried to actually kill MC when they first met, but they get a pass because he doesn't want to be a bully? but he was happily sadistic towards the kingdom, of course. and they killed kids who were connected to their targets as well? guess we need to look past that.

and when he gets actually bullied by others who are looking down on him, he holds himself back to the point where one of his girls steps up to defend him. it's cute, but very inconsistent.

and the kingdom that summoned him had wanted to go to war against the demons. generally indefensible unless those sacrifices are criminals - but we're going with the "war bad, kingdom bad" theme here so the sacrifices were all obviously economically viable kids and pregnant moms or something. and we're assuming the demons are all good girls like Toa.

anyways, i'm still going to read this story because there is a lot of catharsis, but i've come to the opinion that the story is pretty bad

surprising since i was quite hype for this series early on... but that was literally 7 years ago. (holy crap that's a long time ago)

 

[D_Juno345]

Not even close to being equal comparisons. Some better comparisons would be:
-“I shot the fast-food worker because he slipped ricin in my food”
-Can’t think of a proper comparison for the second one
-“i ran over the woman and her kids because they were firing gunshots at me”

It’s only a fair comparison to make if you actually put forward equivalent stakes. You seem to have forgotten that the castle was occupied with people fully or partially complicit in both trying to kill the MC when he was first summoned, as well as the wide-scale human sacrifice needed for the otherworld summons in the first place

Yeah and the fact she ask him if he think about what he was doing. Like bruh bro only killed people that did him really bad to the point that he is alive is a miracle. Anyway this talk about moral is stupid when you said 'i killed people too but they are knight' like that is also not a bad thing. In the first place this situation is just really out of place. And sierra dialogue just make her seems like a hypocrite by reprimanding mc about killing people. The author have a really nice way of doing the story but after the not killing the guy that invaded(like they want to get information out of him as if they are not hopeless at all while facing the invader and think yeah i can get some info from this invader), and now this. Author should just continue the story with the other character worry about mc's mental state and find a way to fix or help and not this bulsh*t.

 

[Iskarioth]

About time someone told him he's just another terrorist.

 

[hurafloyd]

because she has a massive crush on the guy and presumably wants him to stay with her?

while very cathartic in many aspects, MC crushing that kingdom isn't something normal folks would applaud. she's acting correctly based on the context of who she is.

"i shot the fast-food worker because she gave me the wrong order"
"i blew up the gas station because the gas was expensive"
"i ran over the woman and her kids because they were too loud"

revenge fantasy is fun, but it's more or less just emotional slop. a rational look at the story leaves a lot to be desired.

Banalizing MC’s experience with those examples is so shallow, it cant even compare. The moral grounds of MC’s decisions can be argued but comparing them like you did its absurd.

Sierra is acting as a normal person who doesnt understand what another is feeling and gone through would (or empathize on that matter) is on point, although, would you keep your own sanity if you had endured what the MC endured? I highly doubt it.

Also, Sierra (or MCs companions in general are) is trying to put the MC on a higher moral ground, not many “vengeance emotional slops” try to even bother providing a moral compass for the MC, which is in my opinion a good thing for a story. What the MC ends up doing remains to be seen.

 

[Seraphus]

Honestly, I feel that is a very ambiguous statement for such a heavy topic; her position also has quite a bit of interpretation. Yeesh... being direct has advantages, people.

Doea she actually object to the specific kingdom, or the philosophy behind the act?
Because he has a pretty damn solid basis for his actions, and I thought she respected that, even if the act was extreme. I mean, these were bad people doing really bad things, right?

Anyway, these declarations all seem to have a great amount of ambiguity.

But I dig it.