Chapter Jumpers

[Hounder]

It appears there are a few "scanlators" who think it is a great and wonderful idea to post new chapters waaaaay ahead of another scanlation (example:https://mangadex.org/title/15240/kishuku-gakkou-no-juliet -20 chapters ahead of the others). Needless to say, while you have a warning set-up when already reading and you come across a skipped section, there is no warning for people who use the direct link to the chapters without realizing that it is well ahead of what they have read at that point. Is it possible, in some way, to have a warning of some kind set-up for that situation? While I understand that there are those are are impatient with another group's speeed, many readers do feel that at a minimum, it is in bad taste to post chapters that far ahead like that without something.

 

[ununseti]

Sometimes this happens for other reasons as well (e.g. a scanlator group removing their chapters from the site, or the group deciding to skip ahead because the material was already covered in the anime, etc.), so it would be cool if there was an automatic warning screen just to prompt the reader to take a look at the chapter and make sure that this is what they want.

EDIT: Oh wait, it already warns you when there's a gap in the chapters. I hadn't realized.

I guess you were talking about the more sociological aspects of these kinds of situation?... ^_^;;

To fix the direct link use case, I guess one idea could be to always show the warning if there's a preceding gap, even if the user is not coming from the previous chapter but rather using the direct link.

 

[Hounder]

Only problem I can see is how to determine if to warn or not. Maybe it can be based on a combination of what has been read and the chapter number. Maybe even a setting that gives the reader a way to set the number of chapters ahead that they would be willing to allow ahead to be shown. Of course, the issue there is what happens if there are multiple "gaps" involved, with multiple read chapter groups.

Ugh, still sucks that there are individuals/groups that do it, so there has to be something that could be done.

 

[eins]

Learn moon and buy the tank if you don't want to get any spoiler.

 

[Hounder]

@eins If that is supposed to mean something, it failed. No freaking clue what you are trying to say.

So far, the only safe option is to go to the manga's "homepage" and go to the chapter from there, as that is the only way to know that you aren't getting jumped ahead way into a future chapter without already knowing/memorizing the exact chapters you are on for all the manga you may read.

 

[eins]

To begin with, there is no restriction to upload chapters in any order. I doubt that's your problem here. You just don't want to get any spoiler because you forget which chapter that you recently read.

If you are talking about "give a warning you skip certain chapter" that's redundant. And you already said what makes it redundant, just go to manga page to check your progress.

 

[Hounder]

@eins Doesn't help if someone goes straight to the chapter from the MangaDex homepage, a situation we are trying to come up with a solution for directly. No point in always having to load a chapter homepage first unless that is the only option possible.

 

[kn1000a]

This idea came up a few times here on the suggestion forum (example https://mangadex.org/thread/56423) and I want to support it as well.

Some people simply don't check their progress in the manga and blindly click on the direct link from their homepage or follow list. While it is their responsibility, this should be a good QoL change to catch the ones falling through the system. Below is my brainstorm:

1. Have a warning dialogue even when clicking the chapter from outside (and not just from the reader).
Similar to the warning we get if we read the next chapter that skipped more than 1 chapter ahead. MD should check if the new chapter is more than +1 of the chapter before it on MD. If so, issue a warning. This should not depend on whether the reader has read the last chapter on MD; the warning only cares if the new chapter is more than (previous chapter on MD +1).

2. Disable direct chapter link from Follow and frontpage.
This is something I personally do, and believe everyone should do as well. Clicking on the manga and then on the chapter ensures that you see the new chapters vs the old chapters you read, and whether if it skips anything.
However, since the practice of clicking on new chapters from follow/frontpage has been fairly common, this might be a downgrade to people who never experience the possibility that their chapter might be skipped. If so, they won't see this as an improvement and only as a bothersome function, possibly turning them away from MD.

2.1. Have a "NEW" tag on the chapters when clicked on the manga.
Related to #2, if you are to only click on the manga THEN search for the new chapters, it could be quite hard to do so. Personally, whenever I see a new title on the updated front page, I usually click on the manga before noticing what chapters were new. If said manga have 200+ chapters, I'll have to scroll around and search for chapters updated in the last few hours. Note that new chapters aren't always the latest chapters; it could be a special between ch.30 and 31 three years ago, or another scanlator group reuploading chapter 1.
To solve the hassle, a "NEW" tag could be considered. It will work like the "END" tag when the chapter is the ending of the series, but instead of it being determined when uploaded by the scanlator, this "NEW" tag will be automatic for chapters that are uploaded to MD in the last x hours. After x hours, it will disappear. The point of this tag is so that when scrolling, it is easier to see which chapters are new, therefore saving some time to look at the "Age" section.

2.2. A different tag can also be used instead of "NEW", while following similar mechanics as 2.1.
For example, a green circle:

When read, the circle will turns into an eye to mark as Read. The eye can have a higher priority, therefore if a chapter is read, the eye is shown instead of a circle.

Just some brainstorming.
EDIT: I kinda notice how useless 2.1. and 2.2. are since the color-coded "1hr ago" serves this same purpose. I guess my points are redundant.

 

[Teasday]

I'm not sure I want to be adding a feature that warns you if you're jumping ahead, although the changes planned to both the reader and the read markers should make it significantly easier to implement than it currently is. I'll think about it.

Regardless, my primary goal is to make all users stay inside the reader as long as possible without re-opening it or reloading other pages, both in order to save server resources as well as make the reader work faster by not having to sit through the initial loading times for every chapter and so on. The main avenue for doing so is currently the Recommendations feature, and for what it's worth it's doing its job but I reckon not a whole lot of people use it. Anyway, at least when it comes to follows, the recommendations view should enable us to redirect the user to whatever their earliest unread chapter is.

 

[lightingcloud]

@Teasday why not? I mean, if the "original" translator is i.e. at chapter 20 over 35 and a not-so-intelligent troll uploads chapter 34, but I follow 1000 mangas so it's not like I can remember every chapter number... Why shouldn't I be given another protection layer?

Edit: I don't use the Recommendation feature bc I update the count on mal right after reading the chapter, and to do that I go back to the Manga page and click on the mal link. Maybe adding it in the reader would help?

 

[ItsQuote]

i'd like to offer a counterpoint to this: https://mangadex.org/title/21437/atsumare-fushigi-kenkyu-bu has had the last 20-ish chapters released in essentially random order, as the series has little in the way of continuity and so the chapters were uploaded as they were completed. having to click through a warning for each chapter would rapidly progress from annoyance to a bug report, unless it's something i can turn off in my profile. i'm sure this isn't the only title on mangadex released this way.

on a personal note, if i'm involved in the series to the point that i care about spoilers, i'll check the title page before clicking to any new chapter just to be on the safe side, and if i forget to do so that's on me. i don't think mangadex needs to look out for us that much.

 

[Teasday]

_{@lightingcloud posted:}

Edit: I don't use the Recommendation feature bc I update the count on mal right after reading the chapter, and to do that I go back to the Manga page and click on the mal link. Maybe adding it in the reader would help?

Mmyeah. Another thing I've been thinking of adding to the reader is that clicking on the manga title opens a little subwindow (maybe like an area scrolling in from the right side, we'll see) that displays all the basic manga data, much like on the proper title page. I already get that data, might as well use it.

 

[kn1000a]

@ItsQuote That is a good example. However, I myself also read Atsumare in chronological order . Whenever it goes random I have to wait a few days for the missing chapters to be uploaded. I simply cannot jump chapters, no matter the series.

Of course if this is ever implemented, there should be an option to turn it off. The current "skipped chapter" warning on MD in fact can be turned off as well. It's in the Setting page.

This is a Suggestion forum, so it's up to the developers to decide what should be common sense enough to not include. If there is something troublesome to even a minority, it's good to suggest it anyway. This may not be a problem for you (or even me; I never have this skipping chapters problem), but a lot of people reading MD have this problem as you can see in this forum. They trust the system and scanlators too much. Obviously it should be common sense to check if the chapter is spoiler, but that doesn't mean we shouldn't consider it and pretend it never happen.

 

[ItsQuote]

@kn1000a i'm right there with you. the point of my last sentences was to throw my personal opinion into this discussion, not to say "it's not a problem for me, so it can't be a problem for anyone else" or decry the positions of others on this suggestion. it's absolutely up to the staff whether this is a feature that should be implemented - i certainly wouldn't expect them or anyone else to take my singular post as anything more than a singular opinion.