GATE - Jieitai Kanochi nite, Kaku Tatakaeri - Ch. 127

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The original design basis tsunami height was 3.1 m for Daiichi based on assessment of the 1960 Chile tsunami and so the plant had been built about 10 metres above sea level with the seawater pumps 4 m above sea level. The Daini plant was built 13 metres above sea level. In 2002 the design basis was revised to 5.7 metres above, and the seawater pumps were sealed. In the event, tsunami heights coming ashore were about 15 metres, and the Daiichi turbine halls were under some 5 metres of seawater until levels subsided.

A report from the Japanese government's Earthquake Research Committee on earthquakes and tsunamis off the Pacific coastline of northeastern Japan in February 2011 was due for release in April, and might finally have brought about changes. The document includes analysis of a magnitude 8.3 earthquake that is known to have struck the region more than 1140 years ago, triggering enormous tsunamis that flooded vast areas of Miyagi and Fukushima prefectures.

In short, this was a once in a thousand, if not ten thousand, year tsunami. While it was known that there was a possibility of a worse situation, and they had been deliberating it, there was no impetus to do something immediately, because it was such a low chance of occuring. Then it happened. I don't think you can reasonably blame anyone for negligence on such a low possibility event occurring. The court was right to uphold the acquittal, as a tsunami of the size that hit the plant was reasonably unforeseeable and the executives could not be held negligent. It's hard, I know, but sometimes no one is to blame for something shitty that happens. Yes, higher seawalls and higher watertight measures could have stopped the damage, but there was no reason to think it necessary on a logical basis; greed doesn't even have to factor in, but it certainly would have supported the logical conclusion, because those costs would have been passed on to the public, too.

I haven't seen (translations of) court documents, but back in the day I watched a few documentaries that mentioned how a relevant authority wanted a higher embankment to be built, but TEPCO refused it. Furthermore, the documents mentioned rusted inoperable emergency manual valves because thorough emergency drills had been skipped, so the condition of the valves was never revealed. Diesel backup generators were at ground level, making them useful only in normal situations of power down, but useless if the plant got flooded.

In short, it was all because TEPCO wanted to save some yens, yet in the end this incident has most certainly cost a whole lot more money. Furthermore, how many of Japanese nuclear power plants are online today? Does TEPCO have any running now? I do know other companies were allowed to resume power production in some units, but TEPCO has been refused it due to lacking security/emergency measures (a big surprise). So, nobody was deemed guilty, yet years later TEPCO has still not been deemed worthy to run nuclear power plants. That makes you think a little bit.

Edit: Sorry about this off-topic talk, what comes to Gate.
 
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Unless the wyvern is super fast and vastly outmanuvering the chopper,
the chopper have something called ranged weaponry, please use it while staying the fuck away.

This is the army version of someone using a pistol within the target hand reach range, instead of you know, maintain some distance.
 
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I haven't seen (translations of) court documents, but back in the day I watched a few documentaries that mentioned how a relevant authority wanted a higher embankment to be built, but TEPCO refused it. Furthermore, the documents mentioned rusted inoperable emergency manual valves because thorough emergency drills had been skipped, so the condition of the valves was never revealed. Diesel backup generators were at ground level, making them useful only in normal situations of power down, but useless if the plant got flooded.

In short, it was all because TEPCO wanted to save some yens, yet in the end this incident has most certainly cost a whole lot more money. Furthermore, how many of Japanese nuclear power plants are online today? Does TEPCO have any running now? I do know other companies were allowed to resume power production in some units, but TEPCO has been refused it due to lacking security/emergency measures (a big surprise). So, nobody was deemed guilty, yet years later TEPCO has still not been deemed worthy to run nuclear power plants. That makes you think a little bit.

Edit: Sorry about this off-topic talk, what comes to Gate.
Feel free to read the technical report on the Fukushima incident; there is no mention of any rusted valves anywhere; in fact, throughout all five volumes, the word "rust" does not come up even once. You may be getting it confused with something you saw or read about Chernobyl, or possibly in reference to Peter Bradford's quote how at high enough temperatures the zirconium cladding on the fuel cells interacts with the water in what is effectively a 'high-speed rusting', converting to zirconium oxide (which is much more liable to rupture and release radioactive iodine-131, which it did; with a half-life of just 8 days it broke down to xenon-131, which is a stable, non-radioactive isotope, long before the accident was even fully sized up). Or, you may have read some propaganda that equated its conditions to shitty maintenance situations found elsewhere, which is also exceptionally possible, because ideologues will latch onto anything they can. The one thing related to valves that is mentioned, and repeatedly, is that there should have been some less-difficult manual measures for if there was complete and total loss of all forms of power (as loss of DC power had some important valves 'fail-close', and loss of AC power resulted in other valves 'failing-as-is'), rather than 'just' rely on the massive amount of redundancies (33 power line, 13 diesel generators) that could fail if there was an accident that was one in a thousand years/one in ten thousand years, as this was.

Similarly, "thorough emergency drills" were not skipped; there simply wasn't any training for a complete and total disaster situation, and there cannot realistically be one for where everything fails. They were trained for many different emergencies, but all with the assumption there would be some function remaining, given that the earthquake and tsunami it caused were well-anticipated; however, it was anticipated to be only about a 7.5-8.0 magnitude quake, significantly weaker than the 9.1 (39.810 times bigger, 251.188 times stronger than a 7.5) that actually hit and surprised everybody. It's not realistic nor feasible to train (and make sure they had said training refreshed) all your staff for a freak 1-in-1000/1-in-10000 year scenario, both in terms of monetary cost and in terms of what the workers can realistically remember and prepare for. Similarly, seismic activity was the primary concern for the diesel generators, so they were built sturdily to handle earthquakes, which meant that they were built with strong connections to the ground- one set was built in a basement, and another 10-13 meters above sea level (both technically "at ground level"), which would have been sufficient for any but this freak occurence tsunami.

TEPCO executives may have wanted to save yen, sure, but it's also within reason for them not to expect something like what happened. Any given civil engineering project is built around a certain level of risk management, never to the fullest extent possible, because it's just too prohibitively expensive to do so. That's where the hundred year, thousand year, ten-thousand year disaster scenarios are simulated and factored into projects (if you don't believe me, Grady over at Practical Engineering has talked about this sort of thing at length, repeatedly).

As for TEPCO lacking safety measures, from what I've read, a contractor accidentally damaged intruder-detecting equipment on the 12th of February 2021, they notified the NRA as they were fixing it, and in fixing it and doing an inspection of other systems that may have experienced similar errors, they detected 12 other similar pieces of equipment had minorly malfunctioned (including at other sites) by the 19th, and implemented hasty temporary measures while they repaired them. By the 5th of March 2021, all repairs had been completed and no intrusions had occurred, but several inspections from the NRA between the 21st and the 4th stated that since the detection equipment had malfunctioned in 2020 but was only caught in 2021, more inspections were needed (bruh, as soon as it was noticed, they acted immediately; if the equipment malfunctions such that it doesn't signal that it's not working right and regular inspection doesn't show anything wrong until a malfunction is fixed, how can you blame them?), and forced them to stop moving nuclear fuel at Kashiwazaki-Kariwa by suspending their NRA pre-use inspections; the actual safety of the reactors themselves is not in concern, and they meet the new standards properly.

As for reactors, there are 54, 43 of which were originally deemed operable but has been reduced to 33 following further decommissionings, and only 10 have been given the go-ahead, which all were on the west side of Japan (Kansai, Shikoku, and Kyushu EPCOs); TEPCO is building a new reactor at Higashidori, and aside from that, there's just Kashiwazaki-Kariwa under TEPCO. Chubu, JAPC, Tohoku, Hokuriku, Hokkaido, Chugoku, and J-Power EPCOs all do not have any plants running, as well, with Chugoku, JAPC, and TEPCO all having current-standard reactors available.

You brought this upon yourself and everyone else in the comments section because you had to snark off about something without properly knowing what you were talking about. :p
 
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They've had massive air superiority throughout the MONTHS of conflict, they didn't expect a sudden counterattack that popped up that closely to them, as they'd gotten arrogant; they acknowledged it was a very risky play to do this and went ahead with it anyways, thinking nothing could get them, and now they're paying for it. As for the helicopters, they look to be Huey Iroquois, which only have a max speed of 127 mph when fully laden; the wyverns can match that, I have little doubt. Many predator birds can exceed that drastically, and they're much smaller in form, so cannot generate as much thrust; they have to rely on thermals leading into dives to reach that speed.
I was implying that they had gotten arrogant yeah- I didn't reallize huey transports could only hit 127 mph- even a chinnook is noticably faster
 
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I was implying that they had gotten arrogant yeah- I didn't reallize huey transports could only hit 127 mph- even a chinnook is noticably faster
They can go much faster if lightly laden, but each of those helis is fully loaded with troops and gear; they aren't going to be zooming at their top speed. That's why I specified "when fully laden". If they were far enough away from the ambush to begin with, they could probably out-fly just simply due to stamina of the wyverns getting exhausted, but in a close-in ambush, yeah, it's a dogfight.
 
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Feel free to read the technical report on the Fukushima incident; there is no mention of any rusted valves anywhere ... one thing related to valves that is mentioned, and repeatedly, is that there should have been some less-difficult manual measures for if there was complete and total loss of all forms of power (as loss of DC power had some important valves 'fail-close', and loss of AC power resulted in other valves 'failing-as-is'), rather than 'just' rely on the massive amount of redundancies (33 power line, 13 diesel generators) that could fail if there was an accident that was one in a thousand years/one in ten thousand years, as this was.

It was probably just my memory playing tricks on me. The documents must have said manual valves were inoperable for different reasons, but now years later I recalled it as being too rusted to function. I didn't watch or read any propaganda documents, as I'm a nuclear power supporter, so I would find it distasteful. Though nowadays I'm placing my hopes on the mini power plants, rather than the traditional ones. The big ones have got too expensive and too time-consuming to build.

Nevertheless, I do believe TEPCO is responsible for not making the embankment higher when an expert told them to do it, simply because a major quake would be too improbable - in Japan of all places. However, I'm not surprised nobody was punished. Like I said, in too many countries when things get too big, nobody suddenly is guilty of anything. But if a Japanese person uploads a manga volume onto the Internet, the whole power of the Japanese law enforcement will weigh down upon him.
 
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also the fact that they didn't bother to have anti-air cover for helicopters is absolutely something they are getting punished for- helicopters notoriously almost always lose against dedicated anti-air units. but here it's a little questionable
if they're faster(which they should be) they should easily be able to keep out of reach of Melee units
They don't need to be faster anyways, they should just climb as the rapidly decreased oxygen concentration and temperature would immediately fatigue animals. Mount Everest is like 29k feet tall and normal helicopters are rated for a max altitude of like 25k for comparison (no idea about military copters), so at that point the enemy soldiers are also likely to pass out.
 
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They don't need to be faster anyways, they should just climb as the rapidly decreased oxygen concentration and temperature would immediately fatigue animals. Mount Everest is like 29k feet tall and normal helicopters are rated for a max altitude of like 25k for comparison (no idea about military copters), so at that point the enemy soldiers are also likely to pass out.
12,600 ft (3,840m), which actually makes the Huey a high performance helicopter (though on the low end for turbine-engined helis), being 2000+ feet higher altitude capable than most helicopters, as most cannot get past the 10,000 foot ceiling due to the piston engine they use stalling out from the thin air and in fact civilian helis breaking 5000 feet is seen as impressive; in short, "normal" helicopters cannot reach altitudes of 25k, and only turbine-engined helicopters can go higher than 10k, most not even reaching 20k feet. The Chinook can reach altitudes of >18000 feet, but only if empty; laden, they're much more restricted in altitude, and travel much slower than even a laden Huey, which makes sense given they are the heaviest transport chopper. All this idea that they could escape is also predicated on the concept that the wyverns can't fly as fast as them, too (which is shown to be untrue in the chapter, in fact with spurts of speed, assumed from a dive, they can outpace the helicopters horizontal travel speed, which is significantly higher than their vertical climb speed).

Additionally, while a lightly loaded turbine-engine 'copter (that isn't a Huey) can reach such heights, everyone on board would need to be strapped down with heavy clothing and wearing oxygen masks, because the air would be way too thin and cold, and they couldn't travel very fast because there would be little air to propel them forward. As such, more than likely they'd end up tracked by the wyverns flying leisurely in shifts, using thermals and formations to conserve and recover energy, while the heli troops are running out of fuel and unable to reach their objective.
 
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12,600 ft (3,840m), which actually makes the Huey a high performance helicopter (though on the low end for turbine-engined helis), being 2000+ feet higher altitude capable than most helicopters, as most cannot get past the 10,000 foot ceiling due to the piston engine they use stalling out from the thin air and in fact civilian helis breaking 5000 feet is seen as impressive; in short, "normal" helicopters cannot reach altitudes of 25k, and only turbine-engined helicopters can go higher than 10k, most not even reaching 20k feet. The Chinook can reach altitudes of >18000 feet, but only if empty; laden, they're much more restricted in altitude, and travel much slower than even a laden Huey, which makes sense given they are the heaviest transport chopper. All this idea that they could escape is also predicated on the concept that the wyverns can't fly as fast as them, too (which is shown to be untrue in the chapter, in fact with spurts of speed, assumed from a dive, they can outpace the helicopters horizontal travel speed, which is significantly higher than their vertical climb speed).

Additionally, while a lightly loaded turbine-engine 'copter (that isn't a Huey) can reach such heights, everyone on board would need to be strapped down with heavy clothing and wearing oxygen masks, because the air would be way too thin and cold, and they couldn't travel very fast because there would be little air to propel them forward. As such, more than likely they'd end up tracked by the wyverns flying leisurely in shifts, using thermals and formations to conserve and recover energy, while the heli troops are running out of fuel and unable to reach their objective.
The numbers are based on a google search result from hangar.flights which makes the statement. "Most helicopters can fly at a maximum altitude of around 25,000 feet, depending on the helicopter engine and its function. However, manufacturers and operators generally limit helicopter flight operations between 10,000 to 20,000 feet."

There are records of helicopter rescues from Everest in that altitude range so I have no reason to doubt the statement. There are also apparently some specialized helicopters that have reached the peak of Everest.

In any case the point is that the helicopter is capable of far greater altitude than the wyverns by a lot. They don't need to hit anything close to maximum altitude, they just need to get higher than the wyverns can.
 
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The numbers are based on a google search result from hangar.flights which makes the statement. "Most helicopters can fly at a maximum altitude of around 25,000 feet, depending on the helicopter engine and its function. However, manufacturers and operators generally limit helicopter flight operations between 10,000 to 20,000 feet."

There are records of helicopter rescues from Everest in that altitude range so I have no reason to doubt the statement. There are also apparently some specialized helicopters that have reached the peak of Everest.

In any case the point is that the helicopter is capable of far greater altitude than the wyverns by a lot. They don't need to hit anything close to maximum altitude, they just need to get higher than the wyverns can.
It's a massive (and false) generalization, which is why I provided the information I did in correction. Most helicopters can't reach anywhere near that height, and those that have are ones that have done so under very specific conditions, not simply under their own power; the one that went up Everest, for example, did so literally, requiring the ground to push off from (called ground effect) and the upward airdrafts sweeping up the mountain, to maintain altitude. Any form of forward travel is restricted to within 12,000 feet lest their downforce be insufficient and they cannot propel forwards, since they function gyroscopically. None of the soldiers or the pilots look to have thorax compression jackets on, so the air in their lungs would likely kill them if they tried a high-altitude escape route; most helicopters aren't pressurized for high altitudes, either. Furthermore, most height records are with tiny empty-frame helicopters like the one-man Lama that Boulet used (slightly higher records have been claimed with nonstandard-modified helicopters, but his record is the highest that officially stands, as others have not surpassed his when measured against MSL rather than AGL, or been certified for airworthiness). It also takes a very long time to reach such vertical heights, travelling strictly vertically; Fred North's attempt had him ascending for 95 minutes, so as you can see it's not a very fast ascent, especially once you get beyond a few thousand feet. All this is also completely ignoring the effect of turbulence, too.
 
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It's a massive (and false) generalization, which is why I provided the information I did in correction. Most helicopters can't reach anywhere near that height, and those that have are ones that have done so under very specific conditions, not simply under their own power; the one that went up Everest, for example, did so literally, requiring the ground to push off from (called ground effect) and the upward airdrafts sweeping up the mountain, to maintain altitude. Any form of forward travel is restricted to within 12,000 feet lest their downforce be insufficient and they cannot propel forwards, since they function gyroscopically. None of the soldiers or the pilots look to have thorax compression jackets on, so the air in their lungs would likely kill them if they tried a high-altitude escape route; most helicopters aren't pressurized for high altitudes, either. Furthermore, most height records are with tiny empty-frame helicopters like the one-man Lama that Boulet used (slightly higher records have been claimed with nonstandard-modified helicopters, but his record is the highest that officially stands, as others have not surpassed his when measured against MSL rather than AGL, or been certified for airworthiness). It also takes a very long time to reach such vertical heights, travelling strictly vertically; Fred North's attempt had him ascending for 95 minutes, so as you can see it's not a very fast ascent, especially once you get beyond a few thousand feet. All this is also completely ignoring the effect of turbulence, too.
thanks for all the info!
 
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I was implying that they had gotten arrogant yeah- I didn't reallize huey transports could only hit 127 mph- even a chinnook is noticably faster
That is not saying much, the Chinook is the fastest military helicopter in service in the world.
 
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That is not saying much, the Chinook is the fastest military helicopter in service in the world.
That statement is not wholly correct. It is the fastest American military helicopter. Globally, there is the Eurocopter X3 with a top speed of 483 km/h which makes it not just the fastest military helicopter, but also just generally one of the fastest helicopters.
 
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That statement is not wholly correct. It is the fastest American military helicopter. Globally, there is the Eurocopter X3 with a top speed of 483 km/h which makes it not just the fastest military helicopter, but also just generally one of the fastest helicopters.
While it does exist, it is not in service with any military, hence that qualifying statement. Otherwise things like the Cheyenne and Comanche would also be faster.
 
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While it does exist, it is not in service with any military, hence that qualifying statement. Otherwise things like the Cheyenne and Comanche would also be faster.
Chinook is 200 MPH. Hind are rated for 208 MPH. UH60 Blackhawk is 222 MPH (never exceed). Apache is 227 MPH (never exceed). Westland Lynx is 201 MPH. All are in service. Chinook is, though, surprisingly, the highest max & cruise speed in default configuration, AFAIK.
 
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Chinook is 200 MPH. Hind are rated for 208 MPH. UH60 Blackhawk is 222 MPH (never exceed). Apache is 227 MPH (never exceed). Westland Lynx is 201 MPH. All are in service. Chinook is, though, surprisingly, the highest max & cruise speed in default configuration, AFAIK.
Ya know, I was only looking at cruise speeds. That is my bad.
 
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The JSDF dropped the ball with this air operation.

They got too big of a head and forgot that just because they had superior technology, this world still has resources that don't follow the logic of our world by the letter.

This doesn't mean those empire soldiers will win, still far too much of a difference, but they are catching losses that they could have avoided.

We haven't seen Itami and Co much for some time now, I understand why and don't mind because this conflict goes beyond them, and now that Lelei was kidnapped things may turn back.
JSDF forgot WiFI cannot travel through worlds. Unless there is a tower.
 

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