Hope You're Happy, Lemon

[Monn12]

I actually don't disagree with much that you've said here. For what it's worth, my original argument started in and is based on the very beginning of the manga as I believe only two chapters had been released at the time. Things were still tense and awkward between the two main characters. It was written fairly well (not great, but not enough to warrant the review bombing which was my point) in that regard. Many things would have played out different save for the core plot device (which exists to force them into interacting). I will also say that kids in college are still really fucking stupid and our characters are only freshmen. As far as I'm concerned, college kids are just as dumb as high school kids, but just happen to be legally considered adults. It's been 15 years and my friends and I still joke about the asinine and cringe stuff we did has college kids (and not just as freshmen, either). They also have a history and histories are often worth fighting for (I've had big fights with all my friends, but we've come through. That's not to say every relationship can be salvaged, but many can be).

I guess for context on my preferences, I don't mind love triangles or what have you. I don't really crave them, though. I just like relationships that form over time and hit various obstacles along the way. It doesn't have to be super dramatic or anything, but, in real life, the strongest relationships are the ones that have overcome adversity. I very much do not like romantic plotlines where two characters are just magnetically drawn to each other immediately from the start and just act sweet and lovey dovey the whole time. That's not how relationships tend to work. Enemies to lovers is a big trope I like. Childhood friends is also a big one for me since it implies a lot of history before any romantic feelings come to fruition. Love at first sight is basically anathema to my tastes. Many of my favorite romantic manga/plotlines feature characters who end up with someone completely different to who they were looking for at the start. Some of my absolute favorites even end with a break up because they learn they weren't good for each other, but their relationship with each other was important for their growth as people.


I don't disagree with your take on this manga in particular. This manga is far from perfect. I just don't think it's any worse that any of the other romance people flood to.

That said, and I'm sorry to restate this, but the Russian-speaking romcom just flops for me. I'm sure a lot of people like the characters (like, actually, I am 100% sure of it because it's wildly popular and I can never get away from it), but, from the effort I put in to read it, not a single character landed well for me. They were just too flat and the premise struck me as way too wish fulfillment-y. It's just subjective taste. If me calling it garbage offended you, I am sorry. That said, I will not rescind my statement nor my opinion. That also said, my negative opinion of it should not impede your enjoyment of it. By all means, please continue enjoying it.

Thank you for clarification and extensive one (i really hate 1-2 sentence statements that do not clarify anything). I can understand and relate to what you have said. As to reference to my statement i have read 18-20 chapters at the time of writing (maybe more) and now waiting to pick it up when more chapters will come out. Despite my rant I will try to read it but as i said i have my grievances towards the series.
As for college year stupidity, i agree, i actually had to grow up fast after school and my proportion of stupidity was less than normal (always was fun to hear shenanigan's from my friend but also was happy that i did not experience them myself). So yeah i might have put my standard towards this manga which was unwarranted.
Love triangle thing and drama, i somewhat agree but the irritating point is that almost EVERY story has it and speaking not only mangas but books and movies too. To me it is like a cheap method to create a long lasting drama and manga(novels) authors squeeze the drama from love triangle's to extreme with levels reaching netorare/netorase (cuckolding) at which point i lose interest.

Anyway, thank you for answering, clarifying and being a reasonable person without 1 or 2 cheap statements. It is a breath of fresh air reading long statements in here without someone calling you names (you didn't call me names just had a lot of these things happen) without even some normal clarification.

 

[jvdlg]

Pelo os acontecidos dos últimos capítulos suponho o que aconteceu e o que aconteceu depois:

Ela provavelmente foi pedida por alguma menina para terminar com o cara e como ela era muito "altruista" terminou inventando essa mentira.
Creio que esse seja o plot do termino deles

E agora em algum momento ela vai descobrir que a melhor amiga dela ta apaixonada nele também, só que agora ela nao vai desistir pq ela mudou e no fim eles vão ficar juntos.
Creio que esse vai ser o fim

Deixando claro que sera uma merda, pq voltar para uma pessoa que mente para você desse jeito é um absurdo

 

[Unkn0wnk1ing]

I have read Hope You're Happy, Lemon though out the chapters I have not found that lemon has not tell the truth on why she lied about cheating even if she tells the truth the fact does not change that she ruined his life while she is living a prosperous life it doesn't seem fair, I hope when she does tell the truth the MC yells at her in says (how could you lie to me like that and how could you live such a happy life you don't deserve to live a life of happiness you should live your life in absolute regret for want you have done) in front of her friends and her friends leave her and say how could you do such a thing lying about cheating on three different boys

 

[Monn12]

Pelo os acontecidos dos últimos capítulos suponho o que aconteceu e o que aconteceu depois:

Ela provavelmente foi pedida por alguma menina para terminar com o cara e como ela era muito "altruista" terminou inventando essa mentira.
Creio que esse seja o plot do termino deles

E agora em algum momento ela vai descobrir que a melhor amiga dela ta apaixonada nele também, só que agora ela nao vai desistir pq ela mudou e no fim eles vão ficar juntos.
Creio que esse vai ser o fim

Deixando claro que sera uma merda, pq voltar para uma pessoa que mente para você desse jeito é um absurdo

It's the worst option of all that i have commented here.
I provided 3 reasons of why she did it.
The one that you think will happen is the worst, author is a dumbass. It isn't a compelling story, it doesn't sell well and your reputation as an author will be worse. That reason is the worst, with that reason she should apologize and to never approach him EVER.

 

[Nami]

Still not nearly as bad as most people here, who can't stand complex relationships whatsoever cause they've never been in one, make it out ot be.

Fucking preach.

 

[Nami]

I agree with you on the incel point. There are men out there that live in a "bubble" so to speak where they set impossibly high standards on women, and when they read Manga and watch anime, they are vindicated in their beliefs. So when a female character that breaks the mold and deviates from that perfect girl with no flaws archetype, they get frustrated and begin to hate her.

But not Lemon.

My main frustration with this her is not only is the reason for the lie she told has been unexplained from the start, but that she was still in love with him when she told it. Everything went out the window the moment the author revealed that, because it comes into question as to why she told the lie in the first place. It's hard to accept her flaws with that piece of information, especially when she still refuses to change from the moment that they were middle schoolers to when they are actual university students. You're telling me, that since she was a pre-teen, Lemon is still unconfident, in spite of the fact that she's the popular girl, and she still can't communicate with someone she supposedly loves, to the point that she can't let him go.

The lie she told in the beginning isn't the problem. If she told Sunao from the beginning that she lied about cheating on him in middle school and the story then revolved around her trying to convince him that she's changed while using to confidence that she would undoubtedly have as the popular girl, that would've made for a much more enjoyable story about moving on from your past relationships. But she hasn't, which is my main issue. She made the wish on the star to reinsert herself back into Sunao's life, which is the worst thing that she could've done in her position; she's taking advantage of all the situations they're finding themselves in order to get close to him, and she, while knowing that he likes someone else, wants to be his partner. These flaws of hers are not being addressed in a satisfying manner and are instead exacerbated by her consistent avoidance to address the main problem at hand: the fact she still hasn't told him she lied.

What makes everything even worse is that she's trying to get back with him while knowing that he likes her best friend. She has a feeling that her best friend might have feelings too, but she's throwing her under the bus for somebody that she has spoken to in years.

I know that there are people in the audience that can't stand the idea of a flawed woman but I can't help but feel that they are vindicated by the fact that Lemon is too flawed even to the point that it's far too unrealistic. How is Lemon, who is characterized as being on top of the social hierarchy and Sunao, the character who is portrayed as being completely average besides his above-average physique, have conflicting personalities? She can't tell him the truth, sure, but after this long she should've. She's had many opportunities but hasn't taken any of them. She keeps beating around the bush on why she lied to Sunao and is trying to get back with him in spite of the fact that she knows he likes her roommate. What's worse is that if she just told him about her lie, she would've had a better chance to get back with him. We know that it's been at least 10 years since she dumped him back in middle school, so why in that time didn't she take the initiative and try to get back with him the proper way instead of all this wishing upon a star nonsense?

This is very well said. All of it.

I don't even dislike this manga. I actually like it a lot, in spite of its flaws (or maybe in some cases because of them). But I also agree with absolutely everything you've said here. Manga and anime fans have real trouble getting attached to female characters that don't strictly adhere to a well established archetype and anyone who is a little less perfect (or a little more human) than that is often shit on by those fans. But Lemon has also made some infuriating decisions that we still don't have answers for almost 50 chapters in and I'm left wondering when her and Sunao are going to have that conversation. It needed to happen like 30 chapters ago.

That said, love triangles are often times a fun read and I don't mind that aspect of this manga. I just wish there'd be payoffs a little more often.

 

[Monn12]

This is very well said. All of it.

I don't even dislike this manga. I actually like it a lot, in spite of its flaws (or maybe in some cases because of them). But I also agree with absolutely everything you've said here. Manga and anime fans have real trouble getting attached to female characters that don't strictly adhere to a well-established archetype and anyone who is a little less perfect (or a little more human) than that is often shit on by those fans. But Lemon has also made some infuriating decisions that we still don't have answers for almost 50 chapters in and I'm left wondering when her and Sunao are going to have that conversation. It needed to happen like 30 chapters ago.

That said, love triangles are often times a fun read and I don't mind that aspect of this manga. I just wish there'd be payoffs a little more often.

Can you please elaborate on why you find love triangles fun? After like 100(i think a lot more but for conservative reasons 100 should be enough) triangles (seinen-shounen) i started to hate them.(they usually also have harem tag there).
Love triangles usually mean that MC is indecisive and wishy washy. Like i expect a girl (not a woman) to be like this, but when a boy does it it just sucks out any respect i built toward that character.

As for fans bitching about purity and flaws, it might be true, but to my experience, flawed and realistic characters in manga are usually praised. They are criticized usually when they are bad out of character (just to add some artificial realism to them), they are artificially bad from the start (meaning negative character traits and/or decisions are out of touch with human psyche).
On the other good manga/novels/books praise complex and realistic(flawed) characters.

Where I found, what you ascribe as anti-archetype haters is mostly where female characters have some traits or past that many guys would find disgusting. For example, many guys would not marry(dating is a maybe) sex workers, known cheaters or known easy women. Some may think they can handle this but there were known cases when people had to end dating due to rumors pressing them down harder than they thought.

As for manga thing, completely agreed with you. I also think, author is pulling cheap tricks where many things could have been resolved much sooner. Many readers (including myself) feel frustrated that MC and FMC cannot have a normal conversation clarifying everything. It's especially damaging when MCs trauma was flushed out as something very damaging and he only recently (after 4-5 years) started to heal. So instead of clarifying or out right ignoring her, he plays along with her.
Lemon is one hell of a B, but MC is just little better, simply because he didn't hurt her or lie to her, though he lies to himself and doesn't respect himself (actions are louder than words and if you don't t respect yourself nobody else will respect you even as a hero in fiction).

 

[Nami]

Can you please elaborate on why you find love triangles fun?

 

[firelord35678]

Felt like a waste of time reading nothing major happens and it’s full with useless dialogue

 

[BakedBanana]

Hope You're Happy, Lemon

I am not happy.