Orcsen Oukokushi ~Yaban na Orc no Kuni wa, Ikanishite Heiwa na Elf no Kuni wo Yakiharau ni Itatta ka~ - Vol. 3 Ch. 9 - The Fierce Boars

[Reina4444]

so the orcs are actually a fantasy version of prussia in northern germany. they just took the map of europe for worldbuilding.

 

[Korvalus]

AFAICT air power is still in it's infancy, if it exists at all. Like would the wright brothers have had the motivation to create an aeroplane if giant eagles existed and already dominated that particular societal/economic niche? There's no impetus to create a flying machine because in a way people can already fly; maybe the whole idea of a flying machine is seen as ridiculous and a waste of resources when you can just pay an eagle.

That bein' said, I suppose there will be some sort of bomber gear and flak jacket an eagle will eventually get to fill that role.

Everything Nogami Takeshi has crafted deserves it.


Well,the need for man made flyers still exists.

The giant eagles both have their bodily limits in what they can do and are clearly not universal by any means.

Sure,early aircraft won't have the same speed,power,nor maneuverability,but having a tool one can mass produce to take up the capacity that a limited number of slower growing eagles can't fulfill helps immensely.

Of course,the first step is making the all important internal combustion engine and getting their power to weight ratios good enough to start takin' off.

Speaking of,we have yet to see the Americas,so for all we know,their version of the Wright Brothers and Curtiss will come eventually.

Not only that, but flying creatures have next to none cargo capacity. There's a huge market for flying cargo carriers and passenger liners, like zeppelins.

Also, they would have more endurance than flying creatures. Sure, in the level of tech this manga shows flying machines would be made of paper-mache so to speak, but eagles and others are borderline naked and regular or higher calibre bullets can do serious damage to them, but maybe not to a iron/steel armored plane or zeppelin.

so the orcs are actually a fantasy version of prussia in northern germany. they just took the map of europe for worldbuilding.

To be fair, as a european is getting rather tiresome. With the attention to detail shown elsewhere and go for the lazy route there? Man...

 

[Whatever1337]

the chapters were translated up to chapter 12(likely by MLT) and they do discuss that problem later.

 

[instant_noodle]

I feel like they are missing out on eagle bombings and supply airdrops, but I guess we'll see how the war goes

Horrible payload and non-existence accuracy. Reminder in this era pilots were only equipped with Eyeball Mk.II bomb sight and bombing run was something like this:

A reason why blimp was popular back then is because there's no aiming device that can reliably drop things at where you want yet -> gotta drop more and hope some might hit (accuracy by volume) -> you have to carry more -> airplanes of the time couldn't fly with such load -> blimp would be the best bet. So eagle bombing/airdrop would be a terrible choice

 

[izumabakumatsu]

The way the final page says things kinda makes me think Elfind probably has put lotsa traps and are actually ready for this war more than the Orcsens think they are. Aaa, I wish the LN translation comes out soon cause I really would love to read this story in how it was written in the novel.

 

[ZuccTastic]

Considering the orc nation is located in and around Germany, and that Camelot follows great Britain's steps on being a naval superpower; I do hope the author imitate the irl German-British naval arm's race

 

[NARESH4444]

Not only that, but flying creatures have next to none cargo capacity. There's a huge market for flying cargo carriers and passenger liners, like zeppelins.

Also, they would have more endurance than flying creatures. Sure, in the level of tech this manga shows flying machines would be made of paper-mache so to speak, but eagles and others are borderline naked and regular or higher calibre bullets can do serious damage to them, but maybe not to a iron/steel armored plane or zeppelin.

Like how it happened for us,a war would be needed to accelerate it to the commercial stage,if not our reincarnated orc king pushing things along.

And the early ones wouldn't have much endurance in a flight,but definitely could do more flights per day since they wouldn't need extensive rest.

Also,the real irony is the fragile-ish nature of canvas aircraft,majority of bullets fired at anything other then key components or structural members would pass right through,it's why larger cannon armaments weren't really considered useful until the metal skinned planes that would actually cause the explosive filler to explode on contact came to be.

The allied powers eventually started using incendiary loads to make any hits burn away the canvas and wood near the end of the war.

Oh,but a zeppelin that can maintain a relatively high altitude would be pretty much impervious to colonial era style enemies.

Horrible payload and non-existence accuracy. Reminder in this era pilots were only equipped with Eyeball Mk.II bomb sight and bombing run was something like this:

A reason why blimp was popular back then is because there's no aiming device that can reliably drop things at where you want yet -> gotta drop more and hope some might hit (accuracy by volume) -> you have to carry more -> airplanes of the time couldn't fly with such load -> blimp would be the best bet. So eagle bombing/airdrop would be a terrible choice

You're halfway correct.

The eagles would be equivalent to whatever payload they can carry with their talons(which might be pretty big),and be more accurate since they could drop them more in line with their movement,like the swing arm mechanism on WWII divebombers.

But also,it took not too long at all in WWI for underwing bombracks to be a thing,so the Gen 1 hand dropped scouts would eventually become the mid-WWI Gen 1+ bombers with useful payloads as one of their branches.

If we talk tactical and Close Air Support(CAS),then eagles and Gen 1 would be equal,Gen 1+ is where some advantages are gained,and Gen 1++(late war WWI)is pretty much the peak of what we would get before Elfind gets annihilated(assuming the Orcs had Gen 1 at the start of the conflict).

Lighter then air airships were not universally used either,plus their capacity and slow movement,although allowed for better accuracy with useful volume,also meant the weather would batter them around,plenty o' German zeppelins were not over their actual targets in the UK and plenty had lossed enough altitude to become vicitms to the UKs' countermeasures.

Eagles would actually fare better then that.

Now,if we got a zeppelin carrier for those Gen 1+ aircraft,that'd be the best use case.

 

[Someanon]

The way the final page says things kinda makes me think Elfind probably has put lotsa traps and are actually ready for this war more than the Orcsens think they are.

For me, I assumed it meant that Elfind would be the first to strike instead, catching them off guard while still in prep time.

 

[AlaAlba]

Something’s wrong can feel it.

 

[skeleton637]

Horrible payload and non-existence accuracy. Reminder in this era pilots were only equipped with Eyeball Mk.II bomb sight and bombing run was something like this:

It took me a moment before I figured out it was a hat. I was looking at the googles wondering where you found a picture of a muppet doing WWI bombing runs.

Effectively living for hundreds of years means you have plenty of time to hold a grudge.

 

[instant_noodle]

The eagles would be equivalent to whatever payload they can carry with their talons(which might be pretty big),and be more accurate since they could drop them more in line with their movement,like the swing arm mechanism on WWII divebombers.

Those swing arm meant to clear the bomb from the propeller, it has nothing to do with accuracy.

Then again, this is fantasy setting and all the logic can just be thrown out the window so I wouldn't dive too deep into this matter.

 

[NARESH4444]

Those swing arm meant to clear the bomb from the propeller, it has nothing to do with accuracy.

Then again, this is fantasy setting and all the logic can just be thrown out the window so I wouldn't dive too deep into this matter.

I see you're very much lacking in thinking further then surface level and are attempting to run away from it.

You skipped over the all important "in line with their movement",and most of the conversation as well,with little attempt to acknowledge anything.

Chucking a bomb out the side is very much different from having talons clucthing and then releasing the bomb down the middle through a swinging motion,in the same manner as a WWII dive bombers' swing mechanism works,but now fully under the eagles' control with enough force to make last second adjustments to the aim.

So no,the giant eagles won't be a horrendous light boming solution until larger fixed wing Gen 1+ aircraft show up.

 

[Colonel-Picquart]

Just a minor translation note but Navy ranks don't have sergeant majors, the equivalent would be.something like "Chief Petty Officer" or maybe even "Midshipman"

The elfs are more like hoi4 TNO (The New Order) germany, no wonder everybody wants to exterminate these fools LOL; do they even have allies I wonder

They're the Russians, the frequent pogroms against minorities correlate to our real life tsarist state sponsored anti-Semitism. Their uniforms also resemble tsarist uniforms of the period.

 

[Momoehab]

Just a minor translation note but Navy ranks don't have sergeant majors, the equivalent would be.something like "Chief Petty Officer" or maybe even "Midshipman"


They're the Russians, the frequent pogroms against minorities correlate to our real life tsarist state sponsored anti-Semitism. Their uniforms also resemble tsarist uniforms of the period.

Do you think I should change it? or would the others find it confusing?

 

[IvanDFakkov]

I really hope they make a better warships somehow.

Would take a while if we go with IRL history. This was the time of ironclads, though with 2 pre-Dreads being shown, I'd expect things to be more like when Japan whooped Qing's ass. That said Elfind isn't Qing China, so we may see the outcome of Second Schleswig War.

Is the orc naval commander a ref to Ernst Lindemann, captain of the Bismarck?

 

[Colonel-Picquart]

Do you think I should change it? or would the others find it confusing?

It's a flavour thing really. You could take the opportunity to explain German Imperial Naval ranks of it becomes a bigger feature in subsequent chapters (which is highly likely I think) if that's the case then you could go with Warrant Officer (official translation) Deck Officer (literal translation of Deckoffizier) or if you step it down a rank to Chief PO equivalent then the word is actually Feldwebel the same as the German word for Sergeant so you have a few choices. If you just want the flavour though I'd go with Chief Petty Officer since that's the highest NCO rank in Anglophone navies and is more "navy sounding" to me.

 

[instant_noodle]

I see you're very much lacking in thinking further then surface level and are attempting to run away from it.

You skipped over the all important "in line with their movement",and most of the conversation as well,with little attempt to acknowledge anything.

Chucking a bomb out the side is very much different from having talons clucthing and then releasing the bomb down the middle through a swinging motion,in the same manner as a WWII dive bombers' swing mechanism works,but now fully under the eagles' control with enough force to make last second adjustments to the aim.

So no,the giant eagles won't be a horrendous light boming solution until larger fixed wing Gen 1+ aircraft show up.

Bruh what do you mean run away? I can nitpicking all night about these little details then author can just explain it by "it's magic lol" and be done with it, what's the point? If you want, then explain me how would the eagle arm the bomb? Because it literally doesn't have any finger to press any button that send any electric signal to tell the bomb "ok you can start counting now" when they're already in the sky. Do you just active the fuse on ground, let the rotor spin freely and have the bomb armed mid-flight which can explode with the lightest sudden movement? Talk about fuse, how do you design a bomb that eagle can carry with their talons? Because the talons are designed to claw into soft tissue like skin, meat, muscle, not gripping like human's hand, which is why normal hard shell bomb ain't gonna work. Soft shell works, like putting explosive in a bag, sure, but then that leads to how would you design the fuse with such horrible aerodynamic shape? How can you make sure the rotor would spin correctly? How would the impact fuse make proper contact, etc... Next is how would the eagles brake and recover from the dive? Unlike falcon, eagles themselves are not built for steep dives, but rather shallow angle strafing. If you watch any video about eagle hunting, in case of a miss it would follow through and use ground effect to recover, because without that ground effect, trying to recover from a steep dive mid-air would put 5-6G overload on the body and cripple its wings. There's a reason so many dive bombers got equipped with auto-recovery mechanism, because pilots would likely gray out in such overload and lost control. The list goes on, but then again, it's pointless.

And again, I don't know where you got the idea of dive bomber's cradle meant for accuracy, but its sole purpose is to clear the propeller
Source: Naval History and Heritage Command's Archive, 1972

 

[NARESH4444]

Bruh what do you mean run away? I can nitpicking all night about these little details then author can just explain it by "it's magic lol" and be done with it, what's the point? If you want, then explain me how would the eagle arm the bomb? Because it literally doesn't have any finger to press any button that send any electric signal to tell the bomb "ok you can start counting now" when they're already in the sky. Do you just active the fuse on ground, let the rotor spin freely and have the bomb armed mid-flight which can explode with the lightest sudden movement? Talk about fuse, how do you design a bomb that eagle can carry with their talons? Because the talons are designed to claw into soft tissue like skin, meat, muscle, not gripping like human's hand, which is why normal hard shell bomb ain't gonna work. Soft shell works, like putting explosive in a bag, sure, but then that leads to how would you design the fuse with such horrible aerodynamic shape? How can you make sure the rotor would spin correctly? How would the impact fuse make proper contact, etc... Next is how would the eagles brake and recover from the dive? Unlike falcon, eagles themselves are not built for steep dives, but rather shallow angle strafing. If you watch any video about eagle hunting, in case of a miss it would follow through and use ground effect to recover, because without that ground effect, trying to recover from a steep dive mid-air would put 5-6G overload on the body and cripple its wings. There's a reason so many dive bombers got equipped with auto-recovery mechanism, because pilots would likely gray out in such overload and lost control. The list goes on, but then again, it's pointless.

And again, I don't know where you got the idea of dive bomber's cradle meant for accuracy, but its sole purpose is to clear the propeller
Source: Naval History and Heritage Command's Archive, 1972

You really have no idea how any of this actually works,do you?

If you want, then explain me how would the eagle arm the bomb? Because it literally doesn't have any finger to press any button that send any electric signal to tell the bomb"ok you can start counting now" when they're already in the sky.

Neither did WWI aircraft.

They were not electrically armed,all they had were safety pins that were pulled out and exploded with contact fuses,so if we want this exact system for the giant eagles,either pull the safety pin out before take off or have the pin pulled by a lanyard tied to the eagles' leg upon release.

Do you just active the fuse on ground, let the rotor spin freely and have the bomb armed mid-flight which can explode with the lightest sudden movement?

Also not a thing on every WWI bomb,the Germans even went as far as making the bombs spin so that centrifugal force would arm them.

Talk about fuse, how do you design a bomb that eagle can carry with their talons? Because the talons are designed to claw into soft tissue like skin, meat, muscle, not gripping like human's hand, which is why normal hard shell bomb ain't gonna work.

Not only do you not know how military tech works,you have no idea how animals work.

Clearly that stick is made of skin and flesh...oh wait...

So,how would I make a bomb for the giant eagle?

+

Yup,yup,magic,totally.

Soft shell works, like putting explosive in a bag, sure, but then that leads to how would you design the fuse with such horrible aerodynamic shape? How can you make sure the rotor would spin correctly? How would the impact fuse make proper contact, etc...

I like how a bag is your supposed only solution,and not even wrapping the cloth/leather of the bag around the bomb body for that "only soft" method of yours,the middle bit I already explained,and if we go full on bag system,then make the bag into a tear drop shape,the aerodynamic forces will correct the orientation along with ensuring the main mass is where the fuse is.

Next is how would the eagles brake and recover from the dive? Unlike falcon, eagles themselves are not built for steep dives, but rather shallow angle strafing. If you watch any video about eagle hunting, in case of a miss it would follow through and use ground effect to recover, because without that ground effect, trying to recover from a steep dive mid-air would put 5-6G overload on the body and cripple its wings.

Congrats,you've just explained exactly how the bombing would go,shallow angle dives before they swing their legs forward,exactly like the swing arm mechanism of a WWII dive bomber,and would pull up.

And if they're going slow enough,they wouldn't even need to dive,just let go with slight lead and the bomb will reach the ground.

Also,being a Goddamn giant bird,they might be able to pull off a five second mid air brake to dump off nearly all forward momentum,drop the bomb,then flap out of the stall before soaring away.

There's a reason so many dive bombers got equipped with auto-recovery mechanism, because pilots would likely gray out in such overload and lost control. The list goes on, but then again, it's pointless.

That's if we even consider the need to pull a 70,80,or even 90 degree dive.

And again, I don't know where you got the idea of dive bomber's cradle meant for accuracy, but its sole purpose is to clear the propeller

I already clarified what I meant,but clearly the ability to read does not function for you.

The eagles would be equivalent to whatever payload they can carry with their talons(which might be pretty big),and be more accurate since they could drop them more in line with their movement,like the swing arm mechanism on WWII divebombers.

You skipped over the all important "in line with their movement",and most of the conversation as well,with little attempt to acknowledge anything.

Chucking a bomb out the side is very much different from having talons clucthing and then releasing the bomb down the middle through a swinging motion,in the same manner as a WWII dive bombers' swing mechanism works,but now fully under the eagles' control with enough force to make last second adjustments to the aim.

The key parts are the mounted in line aspect of how the giant eagle would hold the bomb,and the swinging motion they can do when moving the bomb,which is two things a WWII dive bomber swing arm mechanism does,as apposed to bomb racks under the wings that have an offset.

At no point did I say the swing arm mechnism was for accuracy alone.

Simply put,you clearly have no idea when each aspect of military tech nor animal structure comes into play,nor the actual timeline of when such innovations came to be.

 

[jarjaxle]

Can anyone...Anyone...who have might read and Understand Raw Chapters....give us....Readers......even 1 Good Explanation or reason....to Why we even Should Spare any of those Light Elfs? Any reason at all?

I say burn entire Nation and Leadership to the Ground.....maybe even Common Citizen too