Ore ni Trauma wo Ataeta Joshi-tachi ga Chirachira Mitekuru kedo, Zannen desu ga Teokure desu - Vol. 3 Ch. 14.1 - I want you to listen (1)

[ArcLife]

Awesome work just like the other manga

 

[K-Lye]

With quality like this, we should drive them away. There's no "improvement" to be made when you literally don't speak any of the languages involved, and just rely on a machine to do all the work for you. You're trying to imagine these people are just honest, hardworking newbies who want to put out the best possible material, but oh shucks, wouldn't you know it, they just didn't do so good. But they're not. If they cared about quality, they'd translate to their first language- If they cared about improving, they'd translate everything by hand- and if they cared about the reader, they'd practice with old, already-released chapters. And if you're so thoughtless you didn't think about any of the above, then clearly all you care about is yourself.

I myself spent literal years just trying to watch anime without subs and translating porn doujins for my own personal use. I didn't even consider scanlation until I didn't need subtitles anymore, and I saw a simple, SOL series that I desperately wanted to read more of. Only once I finally got a grip on the basics of the written part of the language did I start including machine tools to identify text, and suggest lines.

Let me put it a whole different way. Forget about the readers, the aggregators, decency, etc.

You say we rely on a small number of translators to do series. This may or may not be a problem. But consider this:

There are hundreds, if not thousands of translators groups out there. Some of them inevitably get donations for their work. I won't pretend to know precisely how much is donated in total, but this website gets almost 50 Million unique visitors every month. If even .1% donated a single dollar to a group in that period of time, that's $500,000 monthly.

With that in mind, what do you think would get us more manga: An army of completely illiterate morons, or a small group of well-paid translators? If this were spread out between, say... 100 highly-specialized, competent groups, do you think they might be motivated to take this up as a full-time job instead of doing the odd chapter here and there?

I don't think it needs to be said, but obviously fewer groups being around won't suddenly concentrate donations on to the survivors, and we don't personally control how many groups are around. But at the same time, fewer people being around doesn't exactly equate to less work getting done. Especially when the vast majority are putting this kind of stuff out and failing to do the job in the first place while spoiling it for anyone that would otherwise be willing and able to.

I can't profess to know the ins-and-outs of the community enough to comment. However, as I said the point is about how potential new talent is treated. There is no need to berate and put-down people for trying to have a go. You'd equally be able to achieve what you discuss here being a bit more constructive and supportive of these people.

This story got summarized on Youtube. The comments went into great detail with the spoilers.

No no. I had the tab open because I didn't recognize the characters; You had the tab open because you didn't recognize the words: We are not the same. I started off my first translation already knowing the structure of the language, and being able to understand 80% of what was being said in standard dialect. I started translating nearly two years ago; I started learning in 2007.

Translation isn't an entry-level job. Never has been. I spent literal years figuring out the language through anime and regular studying before I even thought to translate anything. And even then, it was doing hentai doujin in private, and it was a slog. Only a year or two later did I finally put out my first chapter after joining a group. It was only months into that that I finally became what I might call "competent" at the task and felt confident enough to change the title of that series to what it is now (It is, for the record, a perfect, 1-to-1 translation now).

To boot it doesn't look like you speak either language as a first, so you've made the job even harder still.

You can start by reading a book on the basics of the language. Though I respect that you're willing to accept criticism instead of doubling down on the shit you put out. You've got the right attitude, if nothing else; Let's work on your ability next.

And this is is what I mean. The negative comments on this translators work go well beyond criticism and are just plain mean. There are ways to communicate constructively and then there's just being condescending. Full marks to them for being big enough to rise above it.

 

[Misxyco]

And this is is what I mean. The negative comments on this translators work go well beyond criticism and are just plain mean. There are ways to communicate constructively and then there's just being condescending. Full marks to them for being big enough to rise above it.

He does have a point though. My translations are poorly made, even I could tell after uploading them. His way of writing does make him sound grandiose but he's simply critical of proper translations.

He has the same mentality of a classically training pianist reacting to a mediocre performance. Their words come out harsh because of the amount of time they put in themselves.

Nonetheless, he did offer to help me in one of my translations so I know he means well.

 

[Misxyco]

Personally, I'm thinking of taking down my translations and let someone who can adequately translate JP to EN do this series. Like I said, @Shantsu did a better job TL-ing since he has some knowledge of Japanese, I just hope he wouldn't mind.

I didn't plan to TL this series at all, again, I am just a reader not a translator (and i don't plan to be.), so my translations are scuffed.

 

[K-Lye]

He does have a point though. My translations are poorly made, even I could tell after uploading them. His way of writing does make him sound grandiose but he's simply critical of proper translations.

He has the same mentality of a classically training pianist reacting to a mediocre performance. Their words come out harsh because of the amount of time they put in themselves.

Nonetheless, he did offer to help me in one of my translations so I know he means well.

And that's why I commend your positive attitude. Your analogy of a classically training pianist is fair though also serves to reinforce my point. If a world-class pianist openly acted like this towards someone learning anew they'd soon find themselves with quite the public backlash.

Let's be clear though I don't disgaree with their feedback either. The translation was not great. It's just unnecessary to be mean and disdainful when the same mesage can be delivered more positively.

 

[Misxyco]

And that's why I commend your positive attitude.

Thank you. Although in person, I'm very pessimistic so it's funny hearing that I have a positive attitude.

 

[Shockmaster]

Great work on this chapter, hope you end up continuing this

 

[BuyVelomobiles]

I can't profess to know the ins-and-outs of the community enough to comment. However, as I said the point is about how potential new talent is treated. There is no need to berate and put-down people for trying to have a go. You'd equally be able to achieve what you discuss here being a bit more constructive and supportive of these people.

Look, when you find a polite way of telling someone to get back to stop hogging new chapters and come back again after attaining at least a crude understanding of the languages involved, you let me know. Because this is the kind of harshness I reserve for people who don't speak any of the languages involved and who are effectively avatars for Google Translate.

I can't profess to know the ins-and-outs of the community enough to comment. However, as I said the point is about how potential new talent is treated. There is no need to berate and put-down people for trying to have a go. You'd equally be able to achieve what you discuss here being a bit more constructive and supportive of these people.


And this is is what I mean. The negative comments on this translators work go well beyond criticism and are just plain mean. There are ways to communicate constructively and then there's just being condescending. Full marks to them for being big enough to rise above it.

It's been my experience that people who'll take criticism will take it no matter how it's given. I've been both meaner and nicer, and the results have varied with no regard to it. The last time I criticized someone, it was over the Kusobitch serialization. It was objectively worse work than anything @Misxyco put out, yet I think you'll agree, I was much nicer than I was here. So have all the others criticizing him across all his series. He's now staying up until 4 AM after the midnight release to shit out a chapter first to try spiting me.

The time before that was for Chapter 48 of Dorei Choukyou, where the guy outright says he made shit up, but he's still somehow better than all those other people that make shit up. I was comparably blunt, and he shut down, talked shit, then got me banned.

I, on the other hand, regularly take harsh criticism without complaint (1,2). And our buddy here took it like a champ.

I'm sure there's some situation where the exact politeness of words matters, but in a setting like this, the real factor is the person receiving the criticism. When you're making something, especially something for others, you have to take criticism in all its forms; There's no other path forward.

And this is is what I mean. The negative comments on this translators work go well beyond criticism and are just plain mean. There are ways to communicate constructively and then there's just being condescending. Full marks to them for being big enough to rise above it.

The closest I came to mean was pointing out that we're operating on entirely different premises when we keep tabs open.

He does have a point though. My translations are poorly made, even I could tell after uploading them. His way of writing does make him sound grandiose but he's simply critical of proper translations.

He has the same mentality of a classically training pianist reacting to a mediocre performance. Their words come out harsh because of the amount of time they put in themselves.

Nonetheless, he did offer to help me in one of my translations so I know he means well.

Like I said before: Sitting down and studying the basics of the language, trying to do some chapters for yourself, then maybe posting on a series that's already been done is probably the best way to go about it. Being the first to upload a chapter has it get picked up by aggregators- and the aggregators don't change when a better one comes along. Which means countless more people will be stuck reading your first (and worst) translations unless they know to come here and change the group they're reading from.

If you re-post a chapter, especially for a popular series you'll get plenty of people complaining that it's redundant, and bad, but at least then the more experienced scans can get attention for the latest chapters, and you get your feedback for the work without immortalizing it on 15 different sites to the readers' detriment.

You've got the right attitude. That's rare, and it's not something you can train up: You're born with it. What's missing is the hard work that goes into learning to turn chicken scratch into The King's English.

 

[Shantsu]

Thanks for the TL; definitely better than the MTL …
However, feels like a waste to have two people redundantly working on the same thing; maybe if you contact that other uploaded you two could work together and lighten each others load?

We're on it

 

[idc_sao]

I get the Scalation community have high standards and there are many of us very grateful for that. However the way new translators are berated and ridiculed for poor translations on their first attempts is partly why so many people are fearful of getting involved. Everyone was new to something once and really think people could be a little bit more supportive in encouraging them to develop their skills rather than tearing them a new one just for having a go.

That said @Shantsu this is a much better translation so thanks and yes please do continue!

To me its not even about being "high" in standards just, having standards in general. What was posted was something anyone can do, scanlating is something everyone "can do" but isn't something everyone "should do", a big issue for me right now could have been solved with proofreading and QA, if you skip that, you are getting your proofreading and QA from the the whole public in this comment section. Being new shouldn't be a reason to post something low quality with cut corners, being new means to learn to uphold these standards and not just take it on because of just goodwill. If you are passionate about the series to the point of scanlating it you will do the bare mininum to not do a bad job. You cannot convince everyone the best form of criticism/feedback is encouragement. People are going to be harsh regardless, if the person decides to drop it because of the harsh comments I doubt they would last long.

 

[lukesasha]

Fantastic translation! Please keep going!

 

[bluekosa]

I prefer your translation, if you don't mind continuing.

 

[ankiwi]

Yeah this is looking like an axe it's going way faster. This is the part that made me drop it in the LN cus it's soooo stupid. Though not exactly the same it's still so dumb.

 

[Chonchiz]

😔

 

[OliveOilOilOil]

Personally, I'm thinking of taking down my translations and let someone who can adequately translate JP to EN do this series. Like I said, @Shantsu did a better job TL-ing since he has some knowledge of Japanese, I just hope he wouldn't mind.

I didn't plan to TL this series at all, again, I am just a reader not a translator (and i don't plan to be.), so my translations are scuffed.

Translation is a form of art than science. I have seen the same material translated with three totally different vocabulary and interpretation and they can be equally valid.

Japanese does have nuances that English language cannot capture, especially idioms and figures of speech. There is arguably no perfect translation. Chinese language comes close enough but even that isn't 100%, and depending on which side of the strait one would look more valid than the other.

I really liked the speed of your translations, despite any shortcomings. This debate really goes back to the old days where some prefer speed subs, others don't mind a troll sub (i.e. using their own colourful language to simplify something) or simply gets riled up by one, or wait two weeks after the broadcast and the discussion's well and truly over really formally peer-reviewed sub where the thread on imageboards have long expired.

The main plot of the story line is basically intact. Don't like the criticism get to you. If you want some manga to practice on, I know at least one underrated modern title right one off the bat there's about 70 chapters of raw have gone untranslated for a very long time and where there's enough interest asking for the translations to continue. PM me if you want more info. Thank you for your TLs in any case.

And I think Aggregators that rip off whatever is the first one to come out should be duly punished with a poisoned well, including poor quality releases. Especially those that comes with lots of malicious ads and malware. IMO they do not deserve a decent copy of a translation and I know some TLs deliberately mess up the pages or mix them up for the initial release to discourage viewership on these aggregators.

Now all the state of the EL translations as it is right now is just as a dumpster fire as the storyline itself. Sad.

 

[ViruX_24]

Thank you for your translation. Please do part 2 too

The previous TL is terrible and it's impossible to make out what was being said, while yours is superb!

wow chill, he try his best aight...

 

[Shantsu]

Personally, I'm thinking of taking down my translations and let someone who can adequately translate JP to EN do this series. Like I said, @Shantsu did a better job TL-ing since he has some knowledge of Japanese, I just hope he wouldn't mind.

I didn't plan to TL this series at all, again, I am just a reader not a translator (and i don't plan to be.), so my translations are scuffed.

Looking to provide support. The discord server link is expired. Either drop your username or contact me @arkadounel

https://discord.com/invite/SYVbhNcZ

 

[BuyVelomobiles]

Translation is a form of art than science. I have seen the same material translated with three totally different vocabulary and interpretation and they can be equally valid.

Japanese does have nuances that English language cannot capture, especially idioms and figures of speech. There is arguably no perfect translation. Chinese language comes close enough but even that isn't 100%, and depending on which side of the strait one would look more valid than the other.

I really liked the speed of your translations, despite any shortcomings. This debate really goes back to the old days where some prefer speed subs, others don't mind a troll sub (i.e. using their own colourful language to simplify something) or simply gets riled up by one, or wait two weeks after the broadcast and the discussion's well and truly over really formally peer-reviewed sub where the thread on imageboards have long expired.

The main plot of the story line is basically intact. Don't like the criticism get to you. If you want some manga to practice on, I know at least one underrated modern title right one off the bat there's about 70 chapters of raw have gone untranslated for a very long time and where there's enough interest asking for the translations to continue. PM me if you want more info. Thank you for your TLs in any case.

And I think Aggregators that rip off whatever is the first one to come out should be duly punished with a poisoned well, including poor quality releases. Especially those that comes with lots of malicious ads and malware. IMO they do not deserve a decent copy of a translation and I know some TLs deliberately mess up the pages or mix them up for the initial release to discourage viewership on these aggregators.

Now all the state of the EL translations as it is right now is just as a dumpster fire as the storyline itself. Sad.

I just recently found out some aggregators outright remove credit pages. They do nothing but have bots scrape websites for others' work, and then they don't even have the decency to keep your promotion in.

 

[Rafalga]

Some chapters are removed? We are missing 9-13 now

 

[SushiFiq]

Seeing the TL also fan of the series make me happy. It one of my current favourites LN so I want to read as manga as well