Ruri Dragon - Ch. 9 - As Normal As Possible

[MangaRoxas]

If this is what is considered unreadable TL's then goddamn are we in an amazing position right now.

 

[Me]

It started with her looking for dragon balls

And boy, did she find them!

 

[toapat]

i see were getting the origin story for how Miss Aoki became a Dragonslayer. i havent interrogated the appartment but im wondering if theres a random katana laying around with how athletic she is compared to Ruri.

 

[YamiryuuZero]

Why are they all talking like zoomers? I'm still waiting for them to bring up the skibidi toilet. I seriously doubt they're being this breezy in the raw.

This moron needs to stop trying to revive his dead writing career and actually tell us what they say.

Unfortunately, the localization industry is filled with people like that, who think they have to "punch up the dialogue otherwise it is boring."

There's even a petition to get Japan to create guidelines for the localization industry (since none exist) to prevent this type of crap from flying. It's one thing to have fan scanlations to do this type of thing because they are, by nature, not professionals; but when it comes to professionals in the industry, they keep hiring people like themselves who think less of Japanese language and Japanese authors and see themselves as having the divine duty to "fix" what the Japanese have created.

Point in case, JelloApocalypse's failed localization attempt of Lovely Complex.

 

[BuyVelomobiles]

I

Unfortunately, the localization industry is filled with people like that, who think they have to "punch up the dialogue otherwise it is boring."

There's even a petition to get Japan to create guidelines for the localization industry (since none exist) to prevent this type of crap from flying. It's one thing to have fan scanlations to do this type of thing because they are, by nature, not professionals; but when it comes to professionals in the industry, they keep hiring people like themselves who think less of Japanese language and Japanese authors and see themselves as having the divine duty to "fix" what the Japanese have created.

Point in case, JelloApocalypse's failed localization attempt of Lovely Complex.

In a bizarre twist of fate, it turned out that they were, in fact, being breezy, and the guy still managed to fuck it up. Mom goes from making a casual remark about being thirsty to busting out the fidget spinner and shutter shades. God only knows what else he's changed without us knowing.

Also, I'm more than aware of the issues with "Localizers", and I know that, in the grand scheme of things, if this was the worst they did, we'd be blessed.

 

[Mazaky]

they are actually speaking that lax in the raw

case in point:

- "shabettara, nodo kawakan?" >> "shabettara, nodo kawakunai?" >> "shabettara, nodo ga kawakimasen ka?"
--> "are you not thirsty from talking?"

- "shoujiki, wakaran" >> "shoujiki, wakaranai" >> "shoujiki, wakarimasen"
--> "honestly, I don't know"

the mother IS talking with a very casual vibes

I think it's a lot far from talking casual to "My pipes could use a drink after all that yapping", the translation/localization is really bad and makes the dialogue weird, since nobody really talks like that in real life, while also making it age poorly extremely quick, in a couple months this translation will be see as "cringe" already, there is a lot of ways to make the tone more "casual", even with some TL notes, the "To be honest, I dunno" reads a lot better for example than the first bubble or the "bio-dad" also on this chapter.

There is a lot of forced slags and you if read early chapters and these new ones you can easily see that it's not the author intention to sound like that and it's far from looking like a casual talk, like I said before, no one in real life, outside of the twitter sphere, talks like that and even there I don't think people talks like that. While the JP raws make it look more modern and casual as a younger author writing it the localization make it looks like how a 40 yo see younger people talking making way to forced, a lot of "How Do You Do Fellow Kids?" vibes from this, and with all the talks about localization on the past months you can easily see that this could be one of such cases.

 

[undeed]

I think it's a lot far from talking casual to "My pipes could use a drink after all that yapping", the translation/localization is really bad and makes the dialogue weird, since nobody really talks like that in real life, while also making it age poorly extremely quick, in a couple months this translation will be see as "cringe" already, there is a lot of ways to make the tone more "casual", even with some TL notes, the "To be honest, I dunno" reads a lot better for example than the first bubble or the "bio-dad" also on this chapter.

There is a lot of forced slags and you if read early chapters and these new ones you can easily see that it's not the author intention to sound like that and it's far from looking like a casual talk, like I said before, no one in real life, outside of the twitter sphere, talks like that and even there I don't think people talks like that. While the JP raws make it look more modern and casual as a younger author writing it the localization make it looks like how a 40 yo see younger people talking making way to forced, a lot of "How Do You Do Fellow Kids?" vibes from this, and with all the talks about localization on the past months you can easily see that this could be one of such cases.

btw, let me be clear,
I don't engage to all the translation and localization debate and whatnot
for me it's whatever

I'm just showing the other person who was wondering if the conversation was that "breeze" in the raw

I agree, it's a bit jarring for me too
but I'm old (sadly)
and this manga is targeted to the young audience
so I can see how the translators chose to do all that twitter lingo
it's an age gap, and I can accept that
as long as they only do it where the setting makes sense (imagine Gandalf speaking all those lingo)

and it's not like this is only happen in the western translation
there are examples where the mangaka themselves tried to portray such weird conversation in the original
case in point: Re:creator anime/manga

I have lived in Japan for 4 years, going in 5
granted I've never actually chat with high schoolers or someone younger than that,
but I've talked with some interns (uni students, 20-ish y/o) in really casual setting
and yeah, Japanese people in real life don't actually speak like anime/manga characters
(unless you are in Akihabara or comiket or something)

 

[BuyVelomobiles]

so I can see how the translators chose to do all that twitter lingo
it's an age gap, and I can accept that

It's not an "age gap" thing. It's just what they do in general. The fact that this one time is was vaguely more appropriate is a total coincidence. And again, we're left with the issue I brought up persisting: They're not being that breezy.

as long as they only do it where the setting makes sense (imagine Gandalf speaking all those lingo)

The mom talking like she's binged tiktok to try relating to her daughter wasn't part of the original vision, and it adds nothing, even if we grant the ridiculous premise that it's the translator's job to "fix" the author's dialogue. There's no point in making them use any more slang than they actually use in the story. You bring up Gandalf using lingo, but that's basically what happened here (Not to say that mom is old...).

and it's not like this is only happen in the western translation
there are examples where the mangaka themselves tried to portray such weird conversation in the original
case in point: Re:creator anime/manga

Ironically, those panels could have used more slang.

and yeah, Japanese people in real life don't actually speak like anime/manga characters
(unless you are in Akihabara or comiket or something)

You mean to tell me they don't spontaneously break out into abstract, philosophical speeches in normal conversation?

 

[undeed]

It's not an "age gap" thing.

I meant the target market/audience
it's all about the business to me: the target is young, so let's make this feels young

The mom talking like she's binged tiktok to try relating to her daughter wasn't part of the original vision, and it adds nothing, even if we grant the ridiculous premise that it's the translator's job to "fix" the author's dialogue. There's no point in making them use any more slang than they actually use in the story. You bring up Gandalf using lingo, but that's basically what happened here (Not to say that mom is old...).

and like I said,
in this manga, I think the environmental setting still (kinda, barely) fits within the tiktok dialog
which is a modern world setting
who knows, maybe there are mothers who actually talk like that nowadays
or maybe in 5 years, when people reread this, those conversations actually relatable in the future
I don't know

now it would be different if the conversation was taking place in ancient China or a medieval setting, and suddenly the characters said "that's cringe"
and I'll be like 'how the fuck do you know that word'
(like in 99% of isekai stories when a random English/German words suddenly comes out, but I tried to close my eyes for that)

 

[Trashmaster123]

When I said "First time", I meant "First time for translations in general", not for the manga. I'll remind you we have a serious issue with "localizers" thinking they have carte blanc to butcher the source material.

I was talking about all translations, that's why I said what I said.

Complaining about localization teams "butchering" always cracks me up. We do not have an issue, you and your reddit circlejerk buddies do.

Some do a pretty bad job, but for most projects they literally do have permission to do mostly whatever they want for the dialogue assuming they don't change names, the main plot, or some specified culture references, it's a contract for the distribution in a region.

...make two separate sentences.

Different languages have different information densities, slang even moreso. This is common in fan translations too, is it only a problem when it's official?

Supposedly the guy is fluent in Japanese, so I can only assume he did this entirely on purpose. I can understand making mistakes, and I can understand having to chuck a line or two that literally can't translate without a Japanese lesson, but when the TL feels he can change that they say, you can't trust much of anything they put down anymore.

They turned "I talked too much and need to drink" (casual) into "I talked too much and need to drink" (chill). Maybe not how everyone would translate it, but crying about the exact tone of a line is inane.

Lo and behold, there's usually a much deeper problem with the work as a whole when you look into it.

What are you even going on about.

- Best regards, a former "butcherer" of light novels

 

[BuyVelomobiles]

Complaining about localization teams "butchering" always cracks me up. We do not have an issue, you and your reddit circlejerk buddies do.

A) Why are you lumping me in with Communists?
B) We have an issue regardless of whether you feel bothered by it.

If the idea that "localizers" aren't actually telling you the story the author wants to tell doesn't bother you, then you're not really a fan of Japanese media, and I suggest you stop pretending to be.

Different languages have different information densities, slang even moreso. This is common in fan translations too, is it only a problem when it's official?

No. If you look into my history, I've made a couple of enemies on here with my insistence that making up lines is a problem. I've taken on entire projects just because I've seen less competent TL's doing this. And to boot, this isn't a difference in "Information density", since the woman never directly said she needed a drink, or asked if Ruri needed a drink. And she definitely didn't use slang to do it. Rather, what she said was akin to "Man, all this talkin' makes ya thirsty, doesn't it?"

Though, I will say, it would be nice if the thing I'm expected to pay for was more professional, and of higher quality, than the shit some guys on the internet put out for free.

They turned "I talked too much and need to drink" (casual) into "I talked too much and need to drink" (chill). Maybe not how everyone would translate it, but crying about the exact tone of a line is inane.

No, he turned "Man, I need a drink" to "Hello fellow children, doesn't all this pwning dry out your talk hole? Let's dip our cups into the skibidi toilet to refresh ourselves".

What are you even going on about.

That when the "Localizer" decides it's God, and it can make any changes it wants to the script for literally any reason, it often does. Back in the old days, when the line differed from the dialogue, chances were the TL made an honest mistake. Maybe he didn't notice the subject had changed, and, bless his soul, he kept assuming we were talking about the dog. You can be reasonably sure you're following the story to the best of the TL's abilities.

"Localizers" that feel the story is theirs to alter will make unpredictable, arbitrary changes and deny us the author's original vision. Here we've got a guy who claims to be "fluent" in the language, who ought to know the mother used no slang, turning her from a laid-back parent to a cringy Zoomer wannabe. Why? I have no idea. The script didn't do it, the character wouldn't in the first place, the author didn't ask for it, and I doubt he thought fans would like it. I can assure you, we're not supposed to think of Mom as someone who tries to be "hip with the kids".

Like, even when I've gotten backlash for re-doing a project, it's because people assumed that the original was accurate, and felt my effort was redundant: my own critics care about the accuracy of the translation. So really, that's where the conversation starts here.

-Sincerely, Some Autistic TL

 

[analoggue]

Is there an alternative TL anywhere? I know it won't be on mangadex bc this localization is official, but considering the fact that we all hate it, it seems bound to happen.

 

[Mazaky]

btw, let me be clear,
I don't engage to all the translation and localization debate and whatnot
for me it's whatever

I'm just showing the other person who was wondering if the conversation was that "breeze" in the raw

I agree, it's a bit jarring for me too
but I'm old (sadly)
and this manga is targeted to the young audience
so I can see how the translators chose to do all that twitter lingo
it's an age gap, and I can accept that
as long as they only do it where the setting makes sense (imagine Gandalf speaking all those lingo)

Yeah, I'm not trying to blame you or anything like that, just talking about how I don't think it's something like a age gap problem, I'm around the same age as the author and even for me, and some friends that I talked about this, it seems like the problem is a lot more to the localization than by how the author tried to make it more casual.

and it's not like this is only happen in the western translation
there are examples where the mangaka themselves tried to portray such weird conversation in the original
case in point: Re:creator anime/manga

And like I said, I don't mind the use of slangs or things like that, but I just think that there is a large gap between casual talk and slangs and the example that I gave before (the yapping one), it's pretty clear by the raws that it's out of place and didn't portray properly what the mom really said in a more casual tone.

I have lived in Japan for 4 years, going in 5
granted I've never actually chat with high schoolers or someone younger than that,
but I've talked with some interns (uni students, 20-ish y/o) in really casual setting
and yeah, Japanese people in real life don't actually speak like anime/manga characters
(unless you are in Akihabara or comiket or something)

And yeah, they don't talk like anime/manga but they don't talk like what it was portrayed either, that is why it's so out of place. The notion of how people on manga/anime talks was something built over many years and even sometimes it strike as weird but it's something almost cultural at this point, while I don't live on Japan I have many friends that do and some that are born and raised on Japan that speak english and are around the same age or younger than me, when I showed this localization to then they just cringed and really disliked the intent that the localization team tried to pass and even gave me some more in line translations that would work better (like the one I said in the last post), I just read chapter 10 for example and while I noticed some weird localization choices again it was far from how bad this chapter was translated and felt more natural even the ones that I noticed.

 

[BuyVelomobiles]

I just read chapter 10 for example and while I noticed some weird localization choices again it was far from how bad this chapter was translated and felt more natural even the ones that I noticed.

Mom wasn't around nearly as much, so whenever the "localizer" decided to butcher the dialogue, it was almost always the kids talking. Still got really noticeable, and probably still pretty unfaithful to the source material.

 

[duodecimus]

Anyone know whats up with chapters 4-8 missing? They aren't on the linked official site either.

 

[BuyVelomobiles]

Anyone know whats up with chapters 4-8 missing? They aren't on the linked official site either.

It's how they do it. First and last three chapters are available for free.