Takarakuji de 40 oku Atatta ndakedo Isekai ni Ijuu Suru - Vol. 4 Ch. 20 - Valetta's Resolve

[DANDAN_THE_DANDAN]

MC YOU'RE DENSE!!!!

Anyways... MangaDex! The only community online where joy of reading manga seems to be accompanied by endless debates about minor plot points!!

@Kronix @Givemersspls @LysandersTreason @SoloSera @Qelix @talismaster @sinisempi @mugfugginbigboi

I'm pro-age gap.

1. Romance would make this more wholesome
2. She's mentally and sexually mature enough to make her own decisions
3. Her friends support her
4. It's consensual

I'm not gonna use "it's in another world so the morales are different!" argument since that's boring, so let's spice it up!

The age of consent is put up to prevent sexual harrasment against minors (source: Wikipedia). Traditionally, the age of consent was "after puberty" (700 BC, Ancient Greece) which then changed to 12 (12th century), then 13 (18th century), then 16 (Offences Against Persons Act 1875) (all in England).

Assuming that this world's political progress is similar to our world, that would set their age of consent at around 12-16.

But what if it's not similar? Surely their morality is lifting that number up and up, isn't it?

Probably. But hey, back in the 700BC people can consent after they pass puberty. I'm pretty sure morales exist in ancient civilizations as well.

So, back to my second point: she's mentally and sexually mature enough to make her own decisions.

ARGUMENT TWO:​

MC can just pull out a +4 card and we'll all be alright.

 

[Ifrittuccia]

How can we not love Valetta. 😍
She's so adorable, she deserves to win hands down.

 

[GoblinGuy]

@DANDAN_THE_DANDAN
Minor plot points.
Geddit? Cause she's a minor. Ehehehe.

Either way, the MC's pretty much retarded compared to Valetta so if anyone can't consent it'd be him. Just make like Kronix and "slay da pussah", MC-kun.

 

[DANDAN_THE_DANDAN]

@GoblinGuy o_o accidental pun

 

[Talismaster]

@sinisempi

Spoiler

Unfortunately, I read the raws AND the web novel. Last I checked, nothing happened. They were just looking for natural deposits of lime or some shit, and found an iron-rich river.

@mugfugginbigboi
You're absolutely right. Except the only reason she's unwed is that the guys her age died in a war or of starvation. Regardless, whether I like it or not, it makes sense for people to try to marry that at age for her world, her setting, based on the cultural and technological level. There are things that are logically, emotionally, or lawfully correct, and this falls into the logic side for me.

But yes. You're right that Valleta is fundamentally designed to be a stinky, uneducated, medieval JK-aged peasant specifically to rely on and fall in love with the MC. Coming from Japan, where Hikaru Genji's raise-your-ideal-wife-from-childhood came from, it's not really a surprise. But that's how it is. At least she's written somewhat well, or better than most characters in her archetype.

@DANDAN_THE_DANDAN
Fair enough. My actual stance is idgaf about age gaps in 2D settings, until there's creepy af shit going on in the background like Rudeus from Mushoku Tensei, who was a literal pedophile that was practically grooming Sylphy. I just like cold hard facts and logic. So following that, someone misrepresenting Japan's actual age of consent at 13 rustled my jimmies.

That said, I enjoy "arguing" with people to see where they stand, or what drives them. Like I said above, pathos, ethos, logos. There's different driving factors to like different things. So I must thank you for taking a different spin on your argument. It's not original, but you put effort into making your point rather than a simple emotional appeal that's the equivalent of "my peepee demands this happen."

 

[mugfugginbigboi]

@DANDAN_THE_DANDAN, @sinisempi Presenting a moral dilemma to our Modern MC of whether or not he should be in a romantic relationship with a minor 10 years younger is my biggest issue. If he goes through with that he has essentially taken advantage of the more primitive moral value system of the world (as you mentioned) to be in a relationship with a minor. Like, there's a reason the age of consent is generally around 17 in the modern day. They also think he's a fucking god which is even worse. It's somewhat akin to the colonial explorers who arrived at indigenous peoples and took wives with them. I don't mind age gap, but, it is usually a large gap between an adult and a minor in these mediums which I have a problem with. I'd even be fine if her age was just never mentioned because she has been visually presented significantly older than 15 as others even pointed out.

 

[Salfaro]

Man, I always forget that she's supposed to be 15. She looks so much closer to Zirconia than Lieze, despite just being one year older than her.

 

[4stjack]

@conscript117 and @givemersspls First, the amount he won is in the title of the novel, so why would I need to read chapter 1 (ep 1?) to find out something so obvious, but thanks for being so condescending. Second, he only won 36 million dollars (4 billion yen = 36,225,485.53 dollars) which, relatively, is not a lot of money. I said "it seems he's blowing through his money pretty quickly" which is subjective, so it's a little hasty to refute that without making it clear what is, in my personal opinion, "pretty quickly". What you consider spending slowly may be very fast to me. I never said I thought he would run out any time soon, by the way. As for this nonsense about a little money making a big difference, does this even have the slightest relation to what I said? No, you just want to sound smart, so you're using my statement to spout bullshit. Sorry to lump you two together, but it seems you are both doing the same thing.

 

[orochijes]

The "age of consent" should be 1) past puberty and 2) married.

 

[conscript117]

@givemersspls and @4stjack Okay, gotcha there, in our eyes he has spent orbital amounts of money but is not an inconvenience with the amount he won, that's what I was getting at.
(@4stjack dont rage bro, take it ez I wasn't trying to sound "condescending" you made it, in your head).

Also talking about the legal age :

In the Middle Ages, getting married was easy for Christians living in western Europe. According to the church, which created and enforced marriage law, couples didn’t need the permission of their families or a priest to officiate. However, while tying the knot could take a matter of moments, proving that you were wed often proved difficult.
Although the church controlled – or tried to control – marriage, couples did not need to marry in a church. Legal records show people getting married on the road, down the pub, round at friends’ houses or even in bed. All that was required for a valid, binding marriage was the consent of the two people involved.

For engaged couples, having sex created a legally binding marriage. Consent could also be shown by giving and receiving an item referred to English as a ‘wed’. A ‘wed’ could be any gift understood by those involved to mean consent to marry but was often a ring. A ‘wedding’ where a man gave a woman a ring and she accepted it created the marriage.
Marriage was the only acceptable place for sex and as a result Christians were allowed to marry from puberty onwards, generally seen at the time as age 12 for women and 14 for men. Parental consent was not required. When this law finally changed in England in the 18th century, the old rules still applied in Scotland, making towns just over the border, such as Gretna Green, a destination for English couples defying their families.

History boys, history.
The source of the information in historyextra.com is one of my favorite sites to learn stuff.


Also one of the reasons why it was allowed to be wed so young was because they needed people to tax for and men for conscription, remember war was at its best in that era, much worse than now, countries wanted more land which in turn created conflict with others.

 

[LysandersTreason]

@mugfugginbigboi

I'm glad you brought up his "god" status. IMO that's a far bigger concern for whether or not Valetta can properly "consent" to a relationship than her age. Like they literally believe he's a god - how could anyone refuse him? They won't. Because of the implication.

 

[Harry_Dong]

@LysandersTreason

She knows he's not really a god though. Even after she finds out, it was her idea in the first place for him to keep up the charade in front of everybody else. She's the only one who knows he's not a real god in that other world and the truth about the where all his stuff he buys really comes from. The revelation happened in the chapter that I first picked this project up: Ch 6.

 

[Arvadiel]

I belong to the Valetta Ship

 

[DarkFlame]

tch... lieze getting in the way of kazura and valetta....

 

[wolfeng]

It's a shame that our main character isn't smarter and it's going for the dense type so typical of japanese mcs. Not realizing that there's a far greater meaning to the bracelet is one thing, but I bet he won't even realize with the lavender + white bracelet after.

 

[unknownids]

and dropped. this love triangle garbage ruined a good premise for a manga.

 

[vacxy3]

Yeah. Netorate flag :3

 

[Winchan]

@Arvadiel

I swear loyalty to Valetta

I will drop this manga in an instant if they do a switcheroo.

 

[Arvadiel]

@Winchan
Count me in, Bröther.

 

[hoegenaamd]

ah yes seiba