Sengoku Komachi Kuroutan - Ch. 96 - Diplomacy

[Scrabbleman]

That's just feudalism with modern flavor. And no, nobody actually happy living under capitalism either except few rich bastards.
Just ask your local uber driver, or mc donald workers. Were they're actually happy with their jobs?

I mean, you're asking the very bottom of the social ladder. It'd be more accurate to ask office workers, technicians such as plumbers and electricians, and small business owners.

 

[Kampfbell]

Oh no she's planting red flag on Akechi isn't she, by giving him such weird ideas
Now what do you call of Jacobin movement in feudal japan

 

[oddjack]

I mean, you're asking the very bottom of the social ladder. It'd be more accurate to ask office workers, technicians such as plumbers and electricians, and small business owners.

So the 'bottom feeder' doesn't matter?
You're forgetting that these 'bottom feeder' outnumber even to office workers 50 to 1.
Neglecting these peoples from their comfort, it's a recipe for social collapse

 

[sleazytrax]

History has also shown that every society needs a ruling class, even so-called classless societies. The masses would overthrow their rulers only to elect new rulers to be ruled by.

Wait, doesn't this show that the idea of rulers is stupid? Like, they are just going to be overthrown and replaced anyway, so it's not a stable system. If you mean something like society needs governance rather than rulers, then sure.

 

[amaniza2010]

History has shown that anything close to democracy is generally a recipe for disaster when ruling newly conquered territories. As an invader, teaching the masses how to manage themselves and showing them they don't need the ruling class is a really bad idea

Welcome to Sengoku Era Japan it all Wars

 

[HDMI1]

I think Akechi is getting some dangerous political advice from his brother too. I always saw the brother being way more hostile towards her, but also avoiding interacting directly with her.

It's Hashiba and his brother I believe; Hideyoshi is the one that really wants to curry favor with Oda, that's why he tried to get more info out of Shizuko before she left for Akechi's camp.

 

[Bramia]

History has also shown that every society needs a ruling class, even so-called classless societies. The masses would overthrow their rulers only to elect new rulers to be ruled by.

We're talking about very different things. Oda is sugar coating the conquest of all of his neighbors under the banner of unification. He's subjugating them and annexing their lands. When you do that, installing a democratic system in the newly acquired lands tends to lead to early rebellions because nobody likes invaders sitting in your throne and now you also have both the capabilities and political power to make decisions.

That's what I was talking about

 

[caliche9700]

Sugesting democracy to that dude was very dumb, ikbet many of Odas generals want her dead and this will make it worse, since it sounds like a rebellious idea.

 

[maddery]

I think Akechi is getting some dangerous political advice from his brother too. I always saw the brother being way more hostile towards her, but also avoiding interacting directly with her.

I think you are confusing him with Hideyoshi.

 

[sssr]

OK, so for people who think Shizuko's proposal is "democratic" (including Shizuko herself), you're misunderstanding political theory. What Shizuko is proposing is basic rule of law, which the Qin State actually pioneered under the Laws of Shang Yang. The problem with the implementation of this concept is that it was extremely harsh in the Chinese context and many elites in later dynasties managed to escape it. It really only worked under Shang Yang himself, who was able to implement it to the point of mutilating the nose of Prince Qian, Duke Xiao's ELDER brother and foremost military commander of the Qin State, as punishment for failing to educate the Crown Prince correctly.

Japan is actually very familiar with this concept, having learned Legalism in the Tang era. In fact, there was a very famous political experiment done by Takeda Shingen himself where he implemented the very harsh but unfair legalism under the Qin Dynasty of Shihuangdi on one of his conquered territories, but applied a much fairer and slightly less harsh legalism on another. The latter is basically what would have happened if Akechi had agreed to implement Shizuko's proposal. The result of Takeda's experiment was constant rebellion in the harsh implementation area but strong loyalty in the region with fair implementation. Shingen unfortunately died before being able to implement whatever his conclusion had been in the rest of his territories, and Katsuyori never had enough power to do so despite making several attempts. The Takeda were as much pioneers in radical Japanese governance principles as the Oda were, and in fact many of their ideas were "borrowed" later by the Tokugawa, who would employ many former Takeda loyalists.

Also, this manga seems to portray Akechi more like Ishida Mitsunari, in particular making him much younger than he should have been (the historical Akechi Mitsuhide was a tutor to Konoe Sakihisa, and Sakihisa was two years older than Nobunaga).

 

[Kalamel]

History has shown that anything close to democracy is generally a recipe for disaster when ruling newly conquered territories. As an invader, teaching the masses how to manage themselves and showing them they don't need the ruling class is a really bad idea

Shizuko is a good girl, so she must intended for a benevolent system.

But if you play it dirty, you can have it in another way. You don't teach the masses how to manage them. You teach them that they should hold the power to manage themselves, while also rigged the system they are not familiar with. The one you place as the new local ruler would be a local powerful people who would focus on enrich themselves than challenging you.

If they did well, you have a non-threat accomplice ruling on you behalf (and their profit), along with legitimacy from voting to cement peace in the area.

If they fail, you have masses that think they should overthrow their ruler, their former comrades, in the name of self-governing.

Basically, shift the responsibilities away and divide them apart into 2 new social classes, and pit them against each other when the bad times comes.

 

[Panino]

...I think instead of going for Nobu, Akechi will eventually most likely go after Shizuko instead and re-enact Honno-ji, probably with the reasoning saying that her ideas are too dangerous... that it would eventually do away with honor and the feudal system

Exactly what I thought.

 

[Scrabbleman]

So the 'bottom feeder' doesn't matter?
You're forgetting that these 'bottom feeder' outnumber even to office workers 50 to 1.
Neglecting these peoples from their comfort, it's a recipe for social collapse

Notice how you focused entirely on the office workers, and not the blue-collar workers I also included as an example. Plumbers, electricians, woodworkers, construction workers, even janitors are definitely more important than a McDonald's cashier or an Uber driver.

 

[eva3071]

That's just feudalism with modern flavor. And no, nobody actually happy living under capitalism either except few rich bastards.
Just ask your local uber driver, or mc donald workers. Were they're actually happy with their jobs?

I believe the point of that post was sarcasm at about how the elites who want to impose neo-feudalism like to use candy-sweet propaganda to call it anything but.

 

[solamente]

every time a new chapter comes out it's like amnesia: "oh this should be a fun 5 minute brain turn off read". Psych, immediately embroiled in warring states period alternate history politicking and I gotta remember 8 different names just to make it past the first page. genuinely wonderful

 

[ShaiHH]

Again with the comically oversized crates that no one would be able to move without a crane if they are filled.

 

[BG9]

MC about to unlock logistics wizard skill