Fukakai na Boku no Subete o

[H0P3L3_SS]

@smolbaka switching it to male doesnt change it, and like orange chrisy and lucy kitsune said, mogumo is just nonbinary, not female or male. mogumo has in fact shown that being labeled as "male" or "female" is extremely uncomfortable for them

 

[bastek66]

https://www.animenewsnetwork.com/news/2021-01-13/kata-konayama-love-me-for-who-i-am-manga-ends-in-2-chapters/.168320

 

[LucyKitsune]

@smolbaka What do you not understand about gender non-binary people being neither male nor female! They aren't male. They aren't Nonbinary Male. They are just Nonbinary. That is it. No more. I will not stand by as enbies are casually erased.

 

[Etch-]

@bastek66 nouuuuu

 

[AverageDudeWithAveragePenis]

@LucyKitsune
@H0P3L3_SS
@Orangechrisy


Holy hell you guys care so much about a fictional character's feelings.

Please get some help. I'm begging you.

 

[elgreggo]

@averagedudewithaveragepenis

It's more than just a fictional character's feelings, stuff like this affects real life. People are claiming that "non-binary male" is a real thing, and that's categorically wrong. Non-binary, by its definition, cannot have male or female attached to it, because those are the old binary categories of gender, which non-binary is not part of.

There is no reason to attach physical sex to a person's gender identity either, as it makes no difference in day-to-day life. Only to medical professionals who need to know would it make a difference, and they would be told if was relevant.

The people who need help are those who are in the comments here, effectively dismissing the existence of non-binary people. Why are they in the comments of a manga about gay, lesbian, non-binary, and transgender people arguing that they don't exist? People who do this really need to broaden their view of the world, accept that people LGBT+ people exist, and lose their bigoted views.

I, myself, am non-binary and having people claiming that I don't exist is pretty hurtful. I want to live my life happily, but with ignorant people out there, it's made excessively difficult.

 

[H0P3L3_SS]

@AverageDudeWithAveragePenis
i'm non-binary . i see nothing wrong with trying to correct someone about our gender identities. elgreggo said it all

 

[Orangechrisy]

@AverageDudeWithAveragePenis

Or maybe I just don't like transphobia and it just so happens that perceptions in media affect perceptions in real life? I'm trans myself and I have a number of nonbinary friends so seeing this denial of an explicitly nonbinary character as well as the denial of the possibility of being nonbinary in general is not just a denial of Mogumo but also a denial of my friends. I'd rather not sit by and let transphobia be said without being countered as not doing so makes it seem like that transphobia is okay when it entirely isn't.

 

[LucyKitsune]

@AverageDudeWithAveragePenis

I am trans and I refuse to stand by idly while someone erases non-binary representation. Sure Mogumo might only be a fictional character, but writing is very ofen not just about telling a story but also about conveying a message. The message of this manga is "Non-Binary people exist and those are some of the struggles they face every day!" How would you feel in a world where every character was female or transmasc and you're the only cisgender guy you know, outside of a few people you met on online-communities, none of which you have ever interacted with irl and then someone finally makes a story about how people like you do exist and matter and in the comments someone says "He's a trans guy..." and noone says anything about it? As a trans girl I can tell you it doesn't feel good to have what little representation you get constantly attacked by people who maybe don't even have malicious intentions, they just don't know any better most of the time.

 

[bahamutmybitch]

ah, nuclear waste here huh...

 

[ribbitribbitsaga]

@elgreggo
What if its actual lgbt that are criticizing your existence? They are rare due to social stigma but they do exist.
it should not affect your daily life. Clearly there is some instability in your mind for you to defend a character that can be changed by the editor anytime. Hell look at the commentator above you. That doesn't look good.

I want to live my life happily

The utopian concept of happiness is really a paradox because the same bigoted people would like to be happy too. Hell what if there is a person who's happiness depends on you being reasonable or worse - the termination of your existence? what then?
I think you would benefit from stoicism and the like.

There is no reason to attach physical sex to a person's gender identity either, as it makes no difference in day-to-day life. Only to medical professionals who need to know would it make a difference, and they would be told if was relevant.

I want to know more about this and how you came to that conclusion.

 

[theguywithoutanyname]

Leviticus 18 and 20
The story of Sodom and Gomorrah
Romans 1:26-27
1 Corinthians 6:9–1
1 Timothy 1:8–11
Gender identity my ass, go to a psychiatrist and get the help you need. Just because this bs has been normalized doesn't mean its somehow ok or acceptable. People on twitter saying its fine doesn't make it not a mental illness.

 

[elgreggo]

@ribbitribbitsaga

What if its actual lgbt that are criticizing your existence?

LGBT+ people that exclude part of the community because of their own views and beliefs need to remember where the community has come from and see the progress made for their rights to exist as anything other than a cisgender hetrosexual. They should look back in history to when they could be prosecuted for being themselves. They should look back at how bad the previous generation of LGBT+ people had it, the progress of rights that they have benefited from, and then try to give the next generation of LGBT+ people that same extra progression. They should look to countries in the middle east and how they treat LGBT+ people in the modern day. Finally they should have a long hard think and reevaluate their views on excluding parts of the LGBT+ community.

Clearly there is some instability in your mind for you to defend a character that can be changed by the editor anytime. Hell look at the commentator above you. That doesn't look good.

How is me saying "It's more than just a fictional character's feelings, stuff like this affects real life" not clear enough. People's attitudes towards the characters in the manga will be the same towards LGBT+ people in real life. I care about Mogumo and the rest of the gang because I care about my fellow real-life LGBT+ comrades. Real people attacking fictional LGBT+ people will negatively affect the real LGBT+ people who see the attacks, as it is also an attack on them.

Hell what if there is a person who's happiness depends on you being reasonable or worse - the termination of your existence? what then?

A requirement for me to achieve happiness is that bigots stop spouting anti-LGBT+ rhetoric in public, be that on the internet or out in the physical world. I'm not forcing anyone's opinions to change (though I would prefer it if they did), they could remain internally bigoted if they wanted. A requirement for your "terminate existence" person to achieve happiness is for myself and others like me to stop existing entirely which, due to the shared characteristic part, could be described as a wish for a genocide. Anyone that thinks the later desire is reasonable is a lost cause. It's similar to the issues with white nationalists who only want an ethnostate, and the non-white people who oppose the idea, it can only lead to the genocide of non-white citizens if not stopped.

I want to know more about this and how you came to that conclusion.

There are three main variables in this field of discussion. They are physical sex (what is your body like), gender identity (male, female, non-binary, ect.), and sexuality (lesbian, gay, bi, ace, ect.). Why should the presence or absence of a penis or vagina, and who they want to use it on, affect how you treat a person. Unless you are getting intimate with a person, you only interact with their gender identity. The male presenting cashier at the supermarket probably has a penis, but may not. That makes no difference to how you treat them. Heck you don't even need to know their gender identity, as you can use non-gendered language. They/them/theirs has been around in the English language for ages, see Tom Scott's video on Gender Neutral Pronouns.

 

[elgreggo]

@ theguywithoutanyname

Leviticus 18 and 20
The story of Sodom and Gomorrah
Romans 1:26-27
1 Corinthians 6:9–1
1 Timothy 1:8–11
Gender identity my ass, go to a psychiatrist and get the help you need. Just because this bs has been normalized doesn't mean its somehow ok or acceptable. People on twitter saying its fine doesn't make it not a mental illness.

A 1500-2000 year-old book does not make for a convincing argument in regards to how we treat people in the modern day. It literally says in Numbers 15:32–36 that it's a good idea to stone people to death for collecting wood on a Saturday/Sunday (depending on what branch of christianity you follow). Everything in any text that old should be thoroughly questioned before following it.

 

[ribbitribbitsaga]

@elgreggo
2nd Paragraph: Even then you are just defending a fictional character because it might possibly spoil the mentality of your fellow lgbt characters when there are actual threats to the lgbt in like ME, you are wasting time defending a fictional character from japan. Don't you think that's a bit privileged? I don't see the logic behind this with thinking the enemy is negatively reacting to this manga when in actuality is probably not reading manga because of degeneracy. Your boogeyman is killing gays rn instead of leaving comments here.
3rd Paragraph: Like it or not law of nature dictates there's a winner and loser. That's why happiness is a utopian paradox. Not everyone can be happy . You are going to have to force your hand. WN is just a boogeyman nowadays, WN is dead. Majority of WN is federal agents. A more realistic example would be ME. The 'person' I was referring to actually lives over there.
4th Paragraph: I don't oppose much but would you acknowledge that Pedophile Dr. Money committed an abhorrent inhumane "experiment" on David Reimer? Pretty much had to deal with gender identity. thats where my opposition comes from ngl. I'll watch that Tom Scott video.

 

[Velvedeer]

Going to the comments expecting positivity for nonbinary ppl was a mistake anyway I love my nb child mogumo I hope them nothing but the world wish the translators didnt use he/him in the beginning tho

 

[smolbaka]

@ribbitribbitsaga

There's no sense in talking to someone who's been indoctrinated with gender study programs

Like it or not, mogumo is referred to as otokonoko in japan. So even japan still think he's male.

There are X gender in Japan but they don't go to the extreme lengths of dumping their biological sex down the drain.

Westerners are delusional. you have media, and constant gratification/validation of unhealthy lifestyles to thank for that.

Twitter being the constant breeder of such ilk.





You hate it because I speak truth. It hurts because you know it destroys your fragile world view.

 

[Orangechrisy]

@smolbaka
What the actual heck are you talking about?

mogumo is referred to as otokonoko in japan. So even japan still think he's male.

A lot of people in America might refer to a trans person as a tr*nny, that doesn't suddenly make them that. A lot of people in America still think trans women are male, that doesn't suddenly make them male. The author has wrote and created someone who is explicitly x-gender, why does the opinion of a randomly stated group of people from a country which is largely not the best about any lgbt related topics matter?

There are X gender in Japan but they don't go to the extreme lengths of dumping their biological sex down the drain.

What does this even mean? How would one even go about dumping their biological sex down the drain in this situation? Besides the fact that at any and every opportunity where Mogumo is referred to as a guy they correct the person and say they are not a guy, they also literally almost cut out their adam's apple. Is that not trying to dump their biological sex down the drain whatever that means?

Westerners are delusional. you have media, and constant gratification/validation of unhealthy lifestyles to thank for that.

Only in the past 5 years or so has American media started to change to not just be terrible towards trans people. But in other places such as Britain, transphobic media has increased massively. Media is not all the same, and if you think media is always supportive of trans people you are ignoring a large part of it.

You hate it because I speak truth. It hurts because you know it destroys your fragile world view.

Do you actually think you are destroying anyone's world view with what you say? Like, really? Do you actually think that? People getting annoyed at you because you're transphobic and spouting nonsense doesn't mean their world view is fragile nor does it mean its being destroyed.

 

[Orangechrisy]

@theguywithoutanyname

Gender identity my ass, go to a psychiatrist and get the help you need.

I think you will be real surprised to find out most psychiatrists, as well as the general practice and general guidelines, support trans people.

Just because this bs has been normalized doesn't mean its somehow ok or acceptable. People on twitter saying its fine doesn't make it not a mental illness.

You know, all those people on twitter such as the American Psychiatrist Association, American Psychological Association, American Medical Association, American Academy of Pediatrics, United Nations, United Kingdom’s National Health Service, Endocrine Society, World Medical Association, and World Health Organization. But I mean, they definitely don't count right? It's just people on twitter right? Yeah...

 

[BraveHeartedHero]

@Orangechrisy
You are right on every point. I just want to add that Twitter should never be taken seriously for any matter as that cesspool just makes it hard for any real progress to get anywhere.