Imasara desu ga, Osananajimi wo Suki ni Natte Shimaimashita - Ch. 41 - Everything, Falling Apart

[FiddlePop]

Holy 35 pages worth of essay comments.

I didn't even know about the existence of this series until someone made a joke about this in the My Cute big GF comment section. I'm baffled seeing that any series gets this many comments

 

[GennArc]

to take 5 months for Yuu to take down walls he's been building up for years now? Cause he's both taking down the "never gonna fall in love" he's been doing for what half a year?

Not half a year. According to chapter 4, he was agonizing until spring.

From autumn through winter, after we lost contact, I kept turning it over in my mind.

-snip-

So when winter passed and spring came,
I decided to forget everything.

So his "I won't fall in love again" didn't last long.

That's author's choice though - to focus on Yuu's afterthoughts and show his efforts via Hikari and the middle school friends.

Yes, and going back to what we discussed, if this was intended to be paralleled, we would've seen more of his POV and less of his afterthoughts.

Those are two sides of the same coin

I don't think that was the intention. Yes, of course he won't tell he that he failed, but that's just in line with not confessing before.

In 17 and in 23 he explains it as trying to catch up to her, not as trying to surprise her w/ a realization of his awesomeness.

I mean, in 23 Yami sees through his bs instantly. "Catching up to her" is just his roundabout way of saying "follow her"/"stay together with her" etc.

 

[GennArc]

I just chalk this up to fundamental differences in Hikari and Yuu's worldview. Yuu is the type of person to quickly come to a negative decision (even if it ends up being the right decision - we've gone over whether or not he should have confessed to Hikari in middle school and it was proven that he would have most likely failed based on Hikari's inner thoughts) whereas Hikari is full of hope and continues to try.

It's not about "quickly giving up" and "trying", at least not in this case.
Look at it this way: Yuu needs to beat the national record in running, while Hikari needs to run 100m in 14s. Yuu realizes it's impossible for him, still takes a long training camp as his last attempt, tries to beat the record and fails. Hikari thinks she isn't quite there, but she still believes it's possible, so she starts training and attempting to reach that result.

Did they ever explain why Hikari and Yuu don't hang out as much at Yuu's house during the three years of middle school?

No. But I think it's just a normal boys and girls thing, just a stage when boys are embarassed to spend time with girls because it's uncool and vice versa.

Also, I chalked Hikari's attitude as this: It's not that she doesn't care he's not going to her high school - she considers them close friends so even with them going to different schools she can still see him everyday as they are next door neighbors. I think this is more of Hikari being a golden retriever whereas Yuu is instantly going into worst case scenario mode.

@story645 made this argument too. But:

• They were not even hanging out at each other's houses in middle school
• Them going separate ways means the distance increasing even further: different groups of friends, different interests etc.

And Hikari saying that she spent more time with her friends than with him during that summer break in 2nd year HS confirms it: even though she is already in love with him, she now has her own group of friends, where Yuu doesn't belong, and she is spending more time with them than with him. So they didn't drift apart only because she fell in love with him and he wasn't averse to her trying to close the distance.

I'm baffled seeing that any series gets this many comments

Well, this "chapter" is an exception because we're on 2 months break and there were some WN extra chapters released, which we're discussing here in the latest manga chapter thread. But still yes, some of the older chapter did get a lot of comments too.

 

[story645]

According to chapter 4, he was agonizing until spring.

Which is about the start of the Japanese school year, right? Which doesn't contradict the idea that Maruto is doing a parallel here - fall for Aya in spring & summer, a year later fall for Hikari in spring & summer.

Yuu also isn't just getting over his never fall in love, he's also working through all the things that have kept him from confessing to Hikari for almost 10 years at this point.

ETA: also realized I wasn't clear about something - I'm saying it probably took a few months from him dropping the "won't fall in love" to slowly start showing his feelings to Hikari.

if this was intended to be paralleled, we would've seen more of his POV and less of his afterthoughts.

The perspective is the parallel. We see more of his afterthoughts and more of her effort b/c that's what's shaping them. Yuu thinks his efforts are worthless b/c he didn't succeed & that's why he gives up, Hikari finds value in the effort & that's why she tries again.

Yes, of course he won't tell he that he failed, but that's just in line with not confessing before.

Which is my point? He's only willing to let Hikari see him putting himself out there when he's guaranteed success. He says as much to Hikari in the confession chapter.

. "Catching up to her" is just his roundabout way of saying "follow her"/"stay together with her" etc.

Which I think supports that he's mostly aiming for her school to convince himself that he's good enough for Hikari rather than about making Hikari see him in a whole new light. Honestly that's why the giving up makes sense to me - he shot his confidence - if it was just about grand schemes he could have tried something else next.

Look at it this way: Yuu needs to beat the national record in running, while Hikari needs to run 100m in 14s. Yuu realizes it's impossible for him, still takes a long training camp as his last attempt, tries to beat the record and fails. Hikari thinks she isn't quite there, but she still believes it's possible, so she starts training and attempting to reach that result.

This is the difference in perspective @HellJester and I are on about. Yuu absolutely does not have to beat the national record - that is 100% something he made up in his own head, thereby setting himself up to fail. (ETA: I'm admittedly biased here cause I have a tendency to do the same thing). In the reality of the story, Yuu has the same 100m in 14s as Hikari to overcome.

 

[BobSmegdorf]

I feel empty without my monthly slop releasing. Please come back.

 

[GennArc]

Which is my point? He's only willing to let Hikari see him putting himself out there when he's guaranteed success.

What I meant here is that he didn't confess before because it felt pointless since she didn't think of him as of a boy. Passing the exams opens up a chance for the confession, that is the intention. And if he doesn't pass, it's just the same as before, she will continue to view him as just a childhood friend.
And he's not "guaranteed success" there, he only creates an opening for a confession which might still fail.

Which I think supports that he's mostly aiming for her school to convince himself that he's good enough for Hikari rather than about making Hikari see him in a whole new light.

I don't think that's the case at all. We read his thoughts on the matter, no point in saying "BUT ACTUALLY he doesn't think that, instead his reason is X".

Yuu absolutely does not have to beat the national record - that is 100% something he made up in his own head, thereby setting himself up to fail. (ETA: I'm admittedly biased here cause I have a tendency to do the same thing). In the reality of the story, Yuu has the same 100m in 14s as Hikari to overcome.

No, he definitely does have to beat the record. The point of my analogy is that his goal was a lot harder to reach than Hikari's one. He was sure she was indifferent to him as a person of opposite sex and he had a lot of evidence to that. At the same time, Hikari thinks that he is not in love with her. I repeat myself, but there is a huge gap between "I don't have any interest in someone" and "I am not in love with that someone".

 

[story645]

He was sure she was indifferent [snip]
At the same time, Hikari thinks that he is not in love with her.

Same for Hikari - she was sure Yuu was indifferent when she started making moves on him. She comments explicitly on how his attitude has changed, from this chapter clearly in response to her actions.

For Hikari "Not in love" is the same thing as "no romantic/sexual interest" when it comes to Yuu. Sexual interest w/o romantic interest isn't even in her field of vision b/c innocent first love & she can't envision Yuu being w/ a girl sexually and not feeling something for her (and Hikari is inexperienced so feels == love) which is why she so firmly pushes back on Aya saying Yuu thought of her as an FWB.

We read his thoughts on the matter, no point in saying "BUT ACTUALLY he doesn't think that, instead his reason is X".

Like I get where you're coming from with

If I manage to get into the same high school as her, even someone as oblivious as Hikari is bound to realize.
...That I’ve been chasing after her all this time.

I agree that "Hikari finally sees me" was probably his fantasy, I just don't think it was his sole motivation.

Yuu is super consistent here and in 17/23/24 in the manga about how he was chasing Hikari and trying to catch up & trying to win and not feeling good enough & I think the end of section is where his deepest motivations lie:

No, it was for Hikari.
Or rather, that is to say—for myself.

That taking the exam for Hikari's school was about Yuu facing his own insecurities.

And he's not "guaranteed success" there, he only creates an opening for a confession which might still fail.

Yeah but the whole post confession conversation is Yuu talking about how he's not gonna confess unless he's pretty sure & we just had a chapter of him thinking "oh Hikari might be into him". Like he's maybe not at 100% but he's > Hikari's 50%.

 

[Mrson]

Holy 35 pages worth of essay comments.

I didn't even know about the existence of this series until someone made a joke about this in the My Cute big GF comment section. I'm baffled seeing that any series gets this many comments

It's just that the manga is paused, and the last chapter is receiving all the theories xd

 

[KaiserBeo]

I'm not gonna lie I feel kinda sad not being able to read this and comment along with everybody every two weeks. It's been three months. I wanna see how Dawn and Dusk over here tear each other apart. Oh well. One day it'll come. Hopefully.

 

[GennArc]

Same for Hikari - she was sure Yuu was indifferent when she started making moves on him.

No she wasn't. She suspected he didn't like her back, but definitely she wasn't "sure he was indifferent". Her list of options from Seki chapter confirms this.

Yuu is super consistent here and in 17/23/24 in the manga about how he was chasing Hikari

Yeah, and every time it's actually in a romantic sense. You said it yourself, he is consistent, and it's obvious he means it in a romantic way here. Yami just sees through it instantly, while Hikari stays oblivious.

I think the end of section is where his deepest motivations lie:

That taking the exam for Hikari's school was about Yuu facing his own insecurities.

Here's the full quote:

Even so, for appearances’ sake, I told my parents it was just a “symbolic attempt.”
That I’d play it safe with the public school, so please let me take a shot at the private one.
Still, since they’d be paying a not-so-cheap application fee, I promised to give it my all.

And I kept that promise.
Not for my parents’ sake—no...

No, it was for Hikari.
Or rather, that is to say—for myself.

And from the context it's obvious that yes, his decision to take the exam and give it his all doesn't benefit his parents or Hikari, and he's doing it for himself - as in it's his egoistical decision to try to chase Hikari.

Yeah but the whole post confession conversation is Yuu talking about how he's not gonna confess unless he's pretty sure

Which has nothing to do with his middle school self, because now he went through an actual relationship that ended horribly hence his whole I won't fall in love again attitude.

One day it'll come. Hopefully.

It's coming back in a week.

 

[story645]

Her list of options from Seki chapter confirms this.

33/33/33 is the probability of any one of 3 independent events happening, 50/50 is the probability of any one of 2 independent events happening - it's more or less the definition of optimistic thinking that she's treating all outcomes as possible with equal probability.

She's not reading 0% into Yuu's actions b/c that's not her personality - as long as she hasn't explicitly been rejected (e.g. he turned her down or has a girlfriend), the space of possible outcomes include success - not b/c she's gotten any sign that he's into her.

She notes in chapter 18 that he's starting to feel differently and the includes that he might be starting to be conscious of her, which is long after she started taking her shot.

he is consistent, and it's obvious he means it in a romantic way here

That doen't contradict my point? He wants to stand at the same level as her b/c he thinks he's not good enough for her (romantically), which is a thing he even tells Hikari during his confession to her.

Like legit the thing we're arguing about is if it is was just for the fantasy that Hikari would see him if he caught up or also b/c he feels he needs to catch up to be worthy of asking her out.

Which has nothing to do with his middle school self,

Except the whole reason he never confessed in middle school was b/c he was sure he'd be rejected. Not gonna do another cycle of whether he had reason to be sure or not, is not the point.

The meta point is Yuu did not want Hikari to get even a glimpse of his attempt if he was not successful, which is in marked contrast to Hikari making a bunch of open moves even though she knows she might not be successful.

 

[ppaaccoojrf]

I'd been reading this since it had 2 or 3 chapters, so seeing it blow up like this over time has been quite entertaining.
I hadn't caught up for a while, so I decided to re-read the whole thing before getting up to date.
Here's my evaluation of each character so far:

Spoiler: -> Yuu

He did nothing wrong with Yami. He had a crush on his childhood friend but he though (correctly) that he wasn't even in consideration as a love interest back then. He got seduced by an older girl, caught feelings for her along the way, and the she ghosted him. He ran into her by chance at the school festival and requested a few answers, and was surprised slap&kiss'd for his efforts.
Not going out of his way to contact Yami after she blocked him is not a mistake. It wouldn't have been creepy for him to try to look for her at her school, but he's also in no obligation to do so. As far as he's concerned, getting blocked after multiple texts and calls is a rejection, and he did well to move on.
His capital sin, however, is lying to Hikari during his confession. He had no control over Yami kissing him, he did not instigate it at all. But he told Hikari that he had been in love with her "for a long time". That's a lie. He could have considered it inconvenient or unnecessary to bring up the whole story about his ex, but he's still outright lying to her while he's trying to start a relationship. His timing for confession is also extremely weird, considering he had just been kissed by his ex in the classroom of the girl he likes, and been given a clear indication that they knew each other. It's a huge red flag all around.

Spoiler: -> Yami

She's just a broken person all around. Her family has given her a terrible view of love and relationships, and she herself had tried to isolate herself from people as a defense mechanism. Hikari extended her hand to her knowing that, and for what it's worth she's sticking to her decision even when things get tough. Yu was basically used by her, but in the way they both got feelings for each other so it kind of worked out until her self-destructive behavior made her push him away again.
She knows she's made multiple mistakes in her relationships with both of them, both unknowingly (she got involved with her best friend's childhood friend before they became friends) and knowingly (she crashed out on him and kissed him on the day of the festival after already being fully aware of Hikari's - and Yu's - feelings), and at this point she's both afraid of losing them both and convinced that she deserves such an end.

Spoiler: -> Hikari

She's surprisingly mature after all of this. She had had an extremely naive view of love and of her crush on Yu, so seeing her confrontation with Yami was surprisingly refreshing. She understand that neither Yu nor Yami had any ill intentions, and she correctly suspects that both of their feelings for each other were genuine. She's also completely trusting that both of her friends are in essence good persons, even with Yu giving her red flags and Yami outright trying to convincer her that she's the worst.
At this point it looks like she's given up in becoming a couple with Yu, but it remains to be seen how she'll be able to salvage her friendships with both of them, which she seems to intend to do.

I've really liked the latest chapters. I though Hikari was a naive and boring moeblob, so I've been pleasantly surprised to see her take the reins and put Yami and Yu in their places while also giving them the benefit of the doubt. I thought Yami was the one carrying this manga but now Hikari is my favorite character, and now I just hope she finds happiness with someone else that isn't Yu.

 

[GennArc]

33/33/33 is the probability of any one of 3 independent events happening, 50/50 is the probability of any one of 2 independent events happening - it's more or less the definition of optimistic thinking that she's treating all outcomes as possible with equal probability.

She's not reading 0% into Yuu's actions b/c that's not her personality - as long as she hasn't explicitly been rejected (e.g. he turned her down or has a girlfriend), the space of possible outcomes include success - not b/c she's gotten any sign that he's into her.

Meanwhile, Hikari calls herself

But, well, since I'm more of a self-doubting, kinda mellow, and, yeah, maybe a bit negative childhood friend (and please, let's not dwell on how cringey that sounds), hearing something like that just... feels like my options are shrinking, you know?

So not exactly an optimistic thinking, even if it's meant as a half-joke, is it?
And she does treat it as a decent chance after he says the line about liking someone for a long time. She doesn't start going through the options of who it might be, she simply ponders about the options shrinking.

Except the whole reason he never confessed in middle school was b/c he was sure he'd be rejected.

...and because rejection might ruin the friendship they had. And back then he still decided to confess in case he passes the exam, which is far from "guaranteed success" you mentioned in previous posts.
The "guaranteed success" approach does apply to HS Yuu, but didn't apply to Yuu from before.

 

[story645]

She doesn't start going through the options of who it might be, she simply ponders about the options shrinking.

I think that's cause she just doesn't care cause it doesn't really matter to her who? Either he likes her or he likes someone else, so she's gonna keep on trying to turn his head. She's legit ruling out outcomes via half baked logic proof:
proposition: Yuu likes Hikari or Yuu likes X or Yuu does not like anyone
Given: not Yuu does not like anyone
Contradiction: Yuu does not like anyone and not Yuu does not like anyone
Therefore: Yuu likes Hikari or Yuu likes X

I'm saying she's optimistic b/c what's driving her is the possibility he could like her rather than doom spiraling into thinking he won't ever like her.

and because rejection might ruin the friendship they had.

Yes and? Hikari has the same worries and it didn't stop her from making moves. That's the point.

back then he still decided to confess in case he passes the exam, which is far from "guaranteed success"

This was a plan based on the fantasy that catching up to her would make his confession successful.

 

[GennArc]

I think that's cause she just doesn't care cause it doesn't really matter to her who?

I mean, if she was sure he liked someone else for a long time, it's just inevitable she'd start thinking of who it might be. Especially in a situation where she's thinking about possibilities and weighing probabilities.

Yes and? Hikari has the same worries and it didn't stop her from making moves.

Go to step 0 of our conversation where Yuu is sure she isn't interested whereas Hikari thinks he might not be in love with her.

This was a plan based on the fantasy that catching up to her would make his confession successful.

No it wasn't, and you know it. Should I quote him yet again?

And then, maybe this time, I’ll finally hear Hikari’s answer.
Whether it makes me happy or breaks my heart, I’ll finally get closure on how I feel.

 

[story645]

it's just inevitable she'd start thinking of who it might be.

This is completely personality dependent & Hikari's personality is that she doesn't think this way. Yuu says this: "Hikari is someone who alway looks forward and not back" - she's not dwelling on who Yuu might like if it isn't her b/c it doesn't really matter if it's not her.

Yuu is sure she isn't interested whereas Hikari thinks he might not be in love with her.

Hikari thinks he "might not be" while Yuu "is sure" b/c of a fundamental difference in personality is the point, which see every thread between you and HellJester and me. They had the same starting point: Yuu was planning to not fall for anyone when Hikari starts liking him & Hikari wasn't planning on falling for anyone when Yuu starts liking her.

And then, maybe this time, I’ll finally hear Hikari’s answer.
Whether it makes me happy or breaks my heart, I’ll finally get closure on how I feel.

Go Yuu for understanding that his scheme might backfire, but even in that quote it's not that he'll confess it's that she'll realize his feelings but will turn him down. But also his plan here is very much that this is the only way to get her to consider him romantically:

Since I can’t put it into words, I have to build a case with actions—surround the truth with facts.

Like he's putting everything on the line for this one scheme b/c it's the one scheme he thinks has a real likelihood of being successful. He just doesn't even try things he thinks are not likely to succeed.

 

[GennArc]

This is completely personality dependent & Hikari's personality is that she doesn't think this way. Yuu says this: "Hikari is someone who alway looks forward and not back" - she's not dwelling on who Yuu might like if it isn't her b/c it doesn't really matter if it's not her.

She is dwelling on "does he like me, does he like someone else, does he not like anyone", that's why I don't see why she wouldn't dwell on "who he likes" if she was sure he liked someone else.

They had the same starting point: Yuu was planning to not fall for anyone when Hikari starts liking him & Hikari wasn't planning on falling for anyone when Yuu starts liking her.

It's not the same at all.
Yuu's starting point is Hikari never being in love with anyone or interested in love at all.
Hikari's starting point is Yuu already being in love twice, of which the first time was with her and for a long time. Fundamentally he is already a person who cares about romance, and all he does is just trying to avoid pain caused by it. Hikari just wasn't interested.

Like he's putting everything on the line for this one scheme b/c it's the one scheme he thinks has a real likelihood of being successful.

Which is very far from the "guaranteed success", against which I argued.

He just doesn't even try things he thinks are not likely to succeed.

I mean, I don't try things that are highly unlikely to succeed if there's a high risk involved either. Otherwise I'd be trying gambling and all sorts of stuff like that. I don't think that's doom spiraling or negative thinking, just rational stuff.