Imasara desuga, Osananajimi o Suki ni Natteshimaimashita - Ch. 52 - I'm Sorry, Hikari

[peortega1]

She called him scum because he admitted he had feelings for both of them, that's it.

This is all. Yuu is called scum by both girls and all the people here because he was the enough honest to admit he really wants a threesome with Hikari and Ayami. And Ayami left very clear in her inner monologues in 39, 45, 50 and 51 the only one reason why she doesn´t accept this idea, is because she thinks Hikari never would agree a threesome, but we see her saying several times she really loves Hikari -and yes, this make even more contradictory all the real damage she provoked to Hikari-.

 

[Bawss32]

I genuinely don't even remember why I started reading this Manga anymore, there is so much drama going on with no end in sight that in starting to tweak out

Nah seriously, I started this when it had like 3 chapters thinking it was gonna be some light hearted romance and it turned into whatever it is now 😭

 

[story645]

Which doesn't mean he needs her permission.

Of course not, but he has it and in having it could read that as she's okay w/ them getting back together. Especially since he cries his eyes out at being rejected in front of her.

she demands he talks about it, everything about it screams jealousy.

Or close friend really angry at being kept in the dark about her friend's life, which is half of what's going on in Hikari's head.

She responds with this phrase to him saying he can't forget her, not to him agreeing that he liked Hikari all along.

The context is the whole thing - them both agreeing explicitly that Hikari is the one he loves and has always loved but he's hung up on Aya. Which Maruto is showing Aya'a resentment here - that Aya says Hikari is who he loves/loved (her specific use of the one) - in contrast to Hikari's more open probing which yields Yuu saying they're equal.

one's heart not being 100% in it and still yearning for someone else.

Legit, how is this actually different from "Aya is calling Yuu scum for dating her while really wanting Hikari".

 

[story645]

Yep pretty much lol I just don't see a scenario where Hikari gets them together because of Aya

Maybe Hikari telling Aya that Yuu's willingness to throw everything away means of course Aya is who he wants, but I think Aya's rejoiner would be that he's only willing to throw it away b/c he thinks Hikari would be fine/possibly better off w/o him.

 

[John_Smith10]

Yuu is utter dogshit lmao.
Glorious.

 

[peortega1]

Yuu is utter dogshit lmao.
Glorious.

I already said you, if you come to meet Haruki Kitahara, it´s secure you will be so raged you will travel to Japan to kill personally to Maruto

Aya's rejoiner would be that he's only willing to throw it away b/c he thinks Hikari would be fine/possibly better off w/o him.

I mean, Aya will definitely hammer this home by saying that Yuu is absolutely right to think Hikari doesn't really love him as much as she loves Yuu, and that Hikari could easily survive the heartbreak because of her own callous personality. Remember how Aya complained in chapter 41? "You don't really know Yuu, you don't even call him by his real name. I don't know Ta-kun. The man who I know is named Yuu"
That's exactly where all of Yami's anger comes from. From seeing Yuu groveling for a girl who has never truly loved him completely, who has never unconditionally loved him even in his most pathetic moments, nor accepted him for who he is.
And yes, Egoist Hikari left the bar too low if even YAMI it´s a better ROMANTIC option than her. This chapter was other proof of it. Hikari always has loved much more Ayami than Yuu.

 

[GennArc]

The context is the whole thing - them both agreeing explicitly that Hikari is the one he loves and has always loved but he's hung up on Aya. Which Maruto is showing Aya'a resentment here - that Aya says Hikari is who he loves/loved (her specific use of the one)

If the goal was to show her resentment, she'd call him scum after he says the first line, and then Yuu would respond with "but I'm still unable to forget about you". And this is accentuated by a long pause between the two Yuu's lines in the novel.

Spoiler

Legit, how is this actually different from "Aya is calling Yuu scum for dating her while really wanting Hikari".

Like you said, the context is the whole thing.
Yami was the one who approached him from the start when he only had his eyes for Hikari.
This time, he was the one to confess while still hesitating.

 

[story645]

she'd call him scum after he says the first line, and then Yuu would respond with "but I'm still unable to forget about you".

She calls him scum b/c he's stringing her along by giving her hope by telling her he can't forget her while also admitting he's in love with Hikari.

Yami was the one who approached him from the start when he only had his eyes for Hikari.
This time, he was the one to confess while still hesitating.

Huh? In both situations she was resentful as all out about his feelings for Hikari, she just hoped she could win him over the first time round and believes she hasn't and can't this time around. It's all still centered on Aya's belief that Yuu believes his one true love is Hikari. Even this go around, Aya does not at any point think that Yuu loves her, even saying he's taking her for an idiot when he tells her he does.

Aya will definitely hammer this home by saying that Yuu is absolutely right to think Hikari doesn't really love him as much as she loves Yuu, and that Hikari could easily survive the heartbreak

If Aya was gonna do that then she would she would have taken Yuu in 51.

 

[GennArc]

She calls him scum b/c he's stringing her along by giving her hope by telling her he can't forget her while also admitting he's in love with Hikari.

But Yuu knows that's not true, and he still doesn't retaliate, he actually agrees. If this was real life, you could write it off as him misinterpreting her words, but here I think it's clearly intended to be a shared sentiment between both of them.

Huh? In both situations she was resentful as all out about his feelings for Hikari, she just hoped she could win him over the first time round and believes she hasn't and can't this time around. It's all still centered on Aya's belief that Yuu believes his one true love is Hikari.

I disagree with some of your points here (which I won't cover because we already talked about it a lot), but in this branch of discussion we were talking about what can be perceived as scummy behavior, not about what Yami called one.

• In one case, a girl approaches a guy she just met who is hopelessly in love with another girl and he is open about it. They still start dating and eventually he grows to love the new girl while his feelings for the other girls slowly wane.
• In the other case, a guy likes two girls, and then he approaches one while keeping his feeling for the other in secret. Or, alternatively, he approaches both, while being honest about his feelings for another, and hurting them as a result.

I believe, these are two very different cases.

Aya does not at any point think that Yuu loves her, even saying he's taking her for an idiot when he tells her he does.

Which she didn't mean.
When we hear him say it for the first time in 29, she thinks she is going to treasure that moment for the rest of her life.
When he says it in 51, it's followed by her internal monologue about how happy she is to hear it and that she has to "stake everything on that last bit of coldness left in her" to respond like that.
So no, I am pretty sure she knows he loved her and that he's not lying this time either. But that's only a part of the truth.

 

[story645]

But Yuu knows that's not true, and he still doesn't retaliate, he actually agrees.

Is it untrue though? What Yuu agrees to is that Hikari is the one and Aya is someone he can't forget, which is not the same as Aya being his one.

They still start dating and eventually he grows to love the new girl while his feelings for the other girls slowly wane.

They both just confirmed that his feelings never waned, which after months of dating is very much stringing along.

Which she didn't mean.

Aya's whole thing is she means the things she says, especially the immediate reactions where she's not purposefully lying. The rest of it is that she wants to believe him and get swept back up in the relationship but she's gotta muster her resolve not to - it's akin to a recovering alcoholic turning down a drink.

 

[GennArc]

Is it untrue though?

Well, as more or less confirmed by following chapters, it is untrue.

They both just confirmed that his feelings never waned

Not really, and we know from Yuu's POV chapters how it went.
Basically you shouldn't take the translation too literally, because what this says

「けど夕、あたしじゃない女《陽花梨》のこと好きじゃん！」
「そんなん、初めて会った時から知ってたじゃん！」

is far from what manga TL gives us.

Aya's whole thing is she means the things she says

We just happened to have evidence that she didn't.

Spoiler

This is an official merch from Sunday's Comiket, and the background here starts with

あああああっ!また心にもないこと言っちゃった

which is roughly

Aaaaa! I said something I didn't mean again.

And come on, she says things she doesn't mean on a regular basis, cf chapter 40. We might disagree on some of those, but even you'd admit that a lot of stuff she said there wasn't something she actually meant.

 

[theartistofsoulbell]

Hikari x Aya. Angry guilty sesbian lex

 

[story645]

Well, as more or less confirmed by following chapters, it is untrue.

How do the following chapters confirm that Yuu thinks he no longer loves Hikari? Even in this chapter, Yuu is saying that he's doing all of this for Hikari. Whether that's true or not is not the point, the point is what the characters believe is their motivation at the given point in time.

Not really, and we know from Yuu's POV chapters how it went.

Yuu says Aya has always known that he's loved Hikari, which indicates that Yuu's love for Hikari was continuous. Yuu's POV chapters also don't say anything about his love for Hikari fading away - we get the start and end of his relationship and a morotorium on love that Hikari knocked down w/ a feather.

ETA: Yuu's POV talks about finding love with Aya, but in Aya's POV he doesn't tell her except kinda maybe responding to her prompt when they're breaking up (Aya's so head over heels that it would have absolutely shown up in her POV if he had) and here in the heavily qualified he can't imagine a reason he'd do horrible things to Hikari except out of love for Aya. So in Aya's POV, his feelings for her are at best a shallow floaty thing, the impermanence of a summer fling, in comparison to his feelings for Hikari.

Basically you shouldn't take the translation too literally, because what this says

The Russian translation goes w/ "you love another/you've known that from the beginning" which is the same vibe, and Google translate gives

"But Yuu, you're in love with someone else—Hikari—aren't you?"
"You knew that from the moment we first met, didn't you?"

so I think you're gonna have to translate here.

but even you'd admit that a lot of stuff she said there wasn't something she actually meant.

We went back and forth on this but no, I generally ascribe to Hikari's take that Aya is mean but honest. Like if she really didn't feel the thing than she'd just accept Yuu. ETA which yeah sure maybe we're getting a Yuu/Aya ending where she takes it back 🤷‍♀️

Which here "I said something I didn't mean again" is aimed at Aya fans (and presumably Aya/Yuu shippers) and is generally about her rejecting Yuu.

 

[EulBassist]

Thanks for the chapter!

 

[GennArc]

How do the following chapters confirm that Yuu thinks he no longer loves Hikari?

They confirm it's not his intention to string her along and that the

「けど夕、あたしじゃない女《陽花梨》のこと好きじゃん！」

which is roughly

“But Yuu, you like Hikari, not me!”

is not hundred percent true.

Yuu's POV chapters also don't say anything about his love for Hikari fading away

https://forums.mangadex.org/threads...verything-falling-apart.2308230/post-27254348
This is explicitly saying those are his new feelings for Hikari.

Which here "I said something I didn't mean again" is aimed at Aya fans (and presumably Aya/Yuu shippers) and is generally about her rejecting Yuu.

Sounds very much like confirmation bias. Which I'm also subject to, of course, but still.
Just because it's merch, it's not going to suddenly be OOC and contradict their personalities.

Just for the context, here are full quotes for both Hikari and Yami
https://note.com/takayamashion/n/n7629f8893c73

Hikari:

は？なんで他の女のことで泣いてる男に優しくしてんのわたし？ちょっとお人よしすぎない？いやそもそも他の女のところに行かせた自分が馬鹿だって話もあるかもしれないけどさぁ！ていうか夏コミグッズなのにメリークリスマスって台詞はないんじゃないの？

Yami:

あああああっ！また心にもないこと言っちゃたよあたし！せっかく大好きな男のコが迎えに来てくれたのに全部台無しじゃん！嫌だ嫌だよ夕と離れたくないよ早く謝れってばふざけんなよ……っていうか誰がこんなぐっちゃぐちゃな展開にしたんだよ馬鹿野郎！

 

[story645]

They confirm it's not his intention to string her along

Yuu's not a sociopath so yeah I agree that it wasn't his intent, but Hikari and Aya perceive his actions, with random girls and Aya respectively,
as stringing along. Which that's what Yuu's validating, Aya feeling like she was strung along.

is not hundred percent true.

Sure, but I don't even think Yuu understands that yet. What Yuu confirms to Aya though is that it is true that he's always loved Hikari.

This is explicitly saying those are his new feelings for Hikari.

It's saying it's his third set of feelings for the person he's fallen in love with for the third time, so yeah no wonder Aya believes those feelings never went away. Which right, Yuu could have said "yes but I also love you" or "yes but I only loved you during our relationship" and instead he gets defensive and doubles down w/ "you knew that since the moment we first met".

it's not going to suddenly be OOC and contradict their personalities.

The full quote I think even more strongly points to "didn't mean it" being about the totality of rejecting Yuu (which yeah she still wants a guy she also feels isn't good for her, that's absolutely in keeping with her characterization) rather than the specific feelings she voiced of feeling like Yuu is taking her for an idiot. Which the ambiguity makes it fantastic merch.

 

[GennArc]

Sure, but I don't even think Yuu understands that yet.

He says that he likes her in the following chapter. I think he understands that quite well.

It's saying it's his third set of feelings for the person he's fallen in love with for the third time, so yeah no wonder Aya believes those feelings never went away. Which right, Yuu could have said "yes but I also love you" or "yes but I only loved you during our relationship" and instead he gets defensive and doubles down w/ "you knew that since the moment we first met".

Well, the point was that he knows how it went. Why he's not denying her words is a different topic.

The full quote I think even more strongly points to "didn't mean it" being about the totality of rejecting Yuu

She literally said two short sentences and then thinks "I said something I didn't mean again". It can't get more straightforward.

 

[story645]

r. I think he understands that quite well.

What I meant is that I don't think Yuu understands who he loves more. His love confession in the next chapter definitely ain't it b/c of the Hikari qualifications.

the point was that he knows how it went.

My point isn't that Yuu did not love Aya, it's that Yuu failed to communicate the seriousness of his love to Aya.

. It can't get more straightforward.

The straightforwardness being she regrets rejecting him, which was the effect of the words she said and what the rest of this specific internal monologue focuses on rather than the words she said - there's no her thinking "he doesn't take me for an idiot, he's being very genuine" or anything else that counters what she said. Which generally Aya's internal monologues do reflect why she doesn't mean whatever it is she said.

 

[GennArc]

The straightforwardness being she regrets rejecting him

She literally thinks "I said something I didn't mean again", not "I didn't mean to reject him" or "I didn't mean to sound that harsh".
And I'm not emphasizing that "again" only because it would be a pain to go through the entire conversation about chapters 40-41 once more.
Edit: this is again a question of what even could convince you. If the character outright thinking "I said something I didn't mean" and you still think they meant what they said, what could even be a solid evidence for you? Because this is as direct as writing can get without being verbose.

 

[story645]

Because this is as direct as writing can get without being verbose.

I'm just going by the whole quote:

Aaaah! I went and said something I didn't even mean again! The guy I'm crazy about came all this way to pick me up, and now I've gone and ruined everything! No, no, no—I don't want to be apart from Yu! Just apologize already—dammit, don't mess this up... I mean, who turned this whole situation into such a disaster anyway, you idiot?!

Maruto has consistently done the thing of having Hikari and Aya do an "I didn't mean it" freak out and have an internal monologue with what it is they didn't mean. Here what follows the freak out is very specifically on rejecting him. And in the chapter what follows is also regret about rejection.

Disagree w/ me, fine, but I'm not making logic leaps by assuming the author is being consistent.