Meguro-san wa Hajimete ja Nai - Vol. 11 Ch. 78

[otherworldlyisekai]

Jesus Christ, do you even realize how low are you putting the bar now? 13yo are kids. Like, literal children.

I didn’t determine what the law is, the Japanese government did, all I’m doing is discussing it 🤦‍♂️ and I clearly said what happened was bad, so what are you even talking about?

Besides, I don’t wanna have my logical evaluations judged by someone who doesn’t have the intelligence to recognize that character tropes are relevant to discussing character development and that star ratings on Amazon can be used to assess the popularity of a manga regardless of how “critical” the review is 😂

 

[BalrogDeMorgoth]

This year seems to be the particular year mangakas make their quid by deliberately being controversial

It's not really controversial, everyone agrees it was bad, there's just one guy spamming otherwise.

The current discussion about age and laws isn't even the problem, it's irrelevant. If Sensei and Meguro met at 40 and the same shit happened, it would still be awful and make said sensei a piece of shit.

 

[otherworldlyisekai]

everyone agrees it was bad

everyone gets it you’re angry, you just wanna say hateful things, you ignore logic and facts, you don’t need to make that any clearer 😂

 

[BalrogDeMorgoth]

everyone gets it you’re angry, you just wanna say hateful things, you ignore logic and facts, you don’t need to make that any clearer 😂

Glad to see you're still mad and too ashamed to use your second account again.

Also see? Literally just one guy, there's no controversy, it's just bad.

 

[otherworldlyisekai]

Glad to see you're still mad and too ashamed to use your second account again.

Also see? Literally just one guy, there's no controversy, it's just bad.

It’s already clear that you have some kind of mental deficiency that doesn’t enable you to understand logical statements that clearly indicate you’re wrong, and, that’s fine, I have made it clear that I respect the mentally challenged and have no desire to make light of your circumstances.

 

[BalrogDeMorgoth]

It’s already clear that you have some kind of mental deficiency that doesn’t enable you to understand logical statements that clearly indicate you’re wrong, and, that’s fine, I have made it clear that I respect the mentally challenged and have no desire to make light of your circumstances.

That's a lot of words just to say you're still all alone and angry, you need to get over it.

 

[the_Bear_from_Bearcave]

I think what the author was trying to convey through Meguro is that she's thankful for what Sensei taught her because even if it gave her a lot of pain it's still because of her experience that she was able to have THIS relationship with Koga. It's kinda similar to how divorcees might not have many fond memories of each other or of their relationship but still be thankful for their failed marriage because it's thanks to that and their ex-partner that they now have THOSE kids that they love very much.

I didn't notice that part before. See, this is actually awful trope and shitty writing, when used in this situation, because it's far more than just failed relationship. If someone had been in marriage with abusive husband before, like violent one for example, it would be fucked up if author made her thank that husband for the abusive marriage just because she was in current, happy one as a result of recovering. Or thanking ex-husband for having kids with her - that she had to protect from seeing the abuse against her, before moving out with them. Or if girl met her great boyfriend who helped her move out of the house where she was being raped by her uncle or step-dad , and then she went to thank that rapist for her current happiness. Or if she got raped by someone, got pregnant and decided to keep the kid, it would also be fucked up if she thanked her rapist just because she loved the kid.

It's one think to accept your current self as you are now, with all your experiences, and completely another to actually thank those who hurt you. Or write the victim as thankful to her oppressor.

EDIT: If anything, that's the main part of the criticism of that ending arc, alongside temporary breaking up with male MC: the author by making her thankful makes it look as just failed relationship, which can result in that thankful feeling even after breaking up, and not as abusive one, which shouldn't result in thanks, while all the critical comments say that it was abusive. Trying to excuse it with "it fits her character" doesn't really work, because author choose to reintroduce him and to give him and Meguro those scenes, instead of writing it in some other way.

 

[bobleponge]

It does look like that for the Japanese audience as well. There was a great guy in previous chapter discussions who was traslating JP reviews and comments from the offical app and site. They were just as dumbfounded ad disgusted as we were when the "thanks for the rape and abuse sensei, i love you" happened.

Huh you got a link to that? I remember when the latest raws where coming out I would look for comments in Japanese to read but it's hard to find any review that came out this year. The worst reviews I could find where here https://webcomics.jp/comment/89947

I've been on the official raw sites multiple times, I've bought chapters and there are just no comments at all, the official place to leave comments that's linked on the website also has no comment at all (on the last chapter at least) is it stuff you can only find in the app?

 

[bobleponge]

Underage is very wide definition, like in my country technically 15yo is age of consent, but people will not think kindly of you if you actually do try to pull shit like that.

My comment isn't about the age of consent but about how weebs give a pass to hentai depicting underaged characters if they're at the "high school age" even though the general population would see any character under 18 depicted in an explicit way as 100% bad

Then there's also the fact that we give pass to stuff in fiction that we wouldn't irl like me raising my eyebrows when my friend told me about her 25 year old boyfriend while she was 19 and yet I read teacher-student stories all the time without batting an eye.


As for Sensei maybe I remember wrong but we still don't know how old he was during the relationship so the age gap bothers me less than the actual "exploitation of someone who looks up to you" since he could have very well been a minor himself. Other characters call him out on his scummy actions but the main victim doesn't, why? I couldn't really tell you but to me the fact that Meguro doesn't resent him is something that's seems to be out of character for her so I let it go too.


Now obviously many are not satisfied with her response so I ask you guys,
Let's say she doesn't thank him, what reaction would you rather have wanted to see from Meguro specifically? and let's try to be as in character as possible. Me personally I think she should have been as detached and uninterested as possible, something kinda like the scene when they meet up for the first time in years. "Thx for the tutoring k bye" kinda stuff

 

[bobleponge]

I didn't notice that part before. See, this is actually awful trope and shitty writing, when used in this situation, because it's far more than just failed relationship. If someone had been in marriage with abusive husband before, like violent one for example, it would be fucked up if author made her thank that husband for the abusive marriage just because she was in current, happy one as a result of recovering. Or thanking ex-husband for having kids with her - that she had to protect from seeing the abuse against her, before moving out with them. Or if girl met her great boyfriend who helped her move out of the house where she was being raped by her uncle or step-dad , and then she went to thank that rapist for her current happiness. Or if she got raped by someone, got pregnant and decided to keep the kid, it would also be fucked up if she thanked her rapist just because she loved the kid.

It's one think to accept your current self as you are now, with all your experiences, and completely another to actually thank those who hurt you. Or write the victim as thankful to her oppressor.

I guess the author and Meguro herself doesn't see what happened to her as something that's as extreme as your examples. The way she sees it Her first "love" wasn't in love with her and just used her for her body, their "break up" was pretty casual and since then she's followed his shitty advice to try to move on that's it 🤷

 

[the_Bear_from_Bearcave]

I guess the author and Meguro herself doesn't see what happened to her as something that's as extreme as your examples. The way she sees it Her first "love" wasn't in love with her and just used her for her body, their "break up" was pretty casual and since then she's followed his shitty advice to try to move on that's it 🤷

I just added an edit that says that this is main criticism of the manga: that what happened to her is shown as not abusive by the author with those scenes. And because it clearly was abusive to her, the author is wrong and writing of ending is bad. That's the main argument here against it, that author basically excuses what tutor did with that writing.

 

[the_Bear_from_Bearcave]

[...]
Now obviously many are not satisfied with her response so I ask you guys,
Let's say she doesn't thank him, what reaction would you rather have wanted to see from Meguro specifically? and let's try to be as in character as possible. Me personally I think she should have been as detached and uninterested as possible, something kinda like the scene when they meet up for the first time in years. "Thx for the tutoring k bye" kinda stuff

For one easy answer, author didn't even have to reintroduce him in the first place, much less make him tutor her again. I don't think she really needed that confrontation, especially combined with that temporary break-up. She's still finding herself, he can just be relegated to the past.

If she was recovering victim of rape, would it be necessary for rapist to appear again?

As for how to write better his reappearance, I think your way would be fine I guess? At least definitely not as controversial. Also don't mix it with that break-up arc.

 

[the_Bear_from_Bearcave]

My comment isn't about the age of consent but about how weebs give a pass to hentai depicting underaged characters if they're at the "high school age" even though the general population would see any character under 18 depicted in an explicit way as 100% bad

Then there's also the fact that we give pass to stuff in fiction that we wouldn't irl like me raising my eyebrows when my friend told me about her 25 year old boyfriend while she was 19 and yet I read teacher-student stories all the time without batting an eye.

Well, in real life porn you'd be actually looking at real person and invading their privacy, who in case of high-school teenager can regret showing her body to all of the world, since she's too immature to take such potentially harmful decision as doing porn. This kinda carries over to movies as well, though there is plenty of sexualization of teenagers in Western movies too, just no explicit sex since it would feel too much like underage porn. In hentai, high-schoolers are often barely different in looks from young uni students, and since they're fictional the question of their psychical maturity doesn't really matter, actual pedo stuff like loli/shota isn't given as much of the pass even among weebdom (unless we're talking about 4chan, but they also don't care much about real life morality). And so much hentai is about rape is in itself probably reason why people care less about other moral limits there, if someone is masturbating to fictional rape, why would it be worse than to fictional couple of teenagers having sex?

I know couple with similar age gap to your example, while they did raise eyebrows at first, they're happily married for a long time now. The thing with student-teacher stories and highschooler-adult age-gap couples that they aren't automatically abusive just because there is a power or experience gap, but we often err on the side of forbidding them (exactly how depending on country) because the risk of abuse is too big. There are in some US states laws that allow for example for 17yo to be with 20 yo, but not with 21yo or older. It's in a way question of statistical risk of abuse. In fiction, you can be assured by the author that this relationship isn't abusive, because author controls the characters and can even tell you what they actually think. Of course , you can also disbelieve author and decide for yourself that fictional relationship would actually be abusive as depicted in story, kinda just like lots of people here disagree with the author on the Meguro-tutor relationship.

 

[Clubman8]

Echoing other sentiments, the last arc was so pointless and soured a manga I otherwise enjoyed very very much. Last chapter saved it, at least.

Why does MAL say there's another volume and 89 total chapters, though?

 

[Apep23]

Last arc ruined this for me I can’t lie.

 

[bobleponge]

Alright after finally finding a way to access the app and reading the Japanese comments for the last chapter here's what I found sorted by most likes

https://imgur. com/gallery/meguro-last-chapter-comments-tSONNrv


Quick and loose breakdown:

50♥️: "Koga has become too nice, something like an ideal boy from the pov of girls. At the end the meaning of "not first time" had taken a new meaning huh, tip my hat. Thanks for your hard work"

I agree a lot with the assessment of Koga, it really feels like the self insert of this story was Meguro all along.

32♥️: some guy confused if this is the actual ending or not, something I felt too when I read these chapters months ago

31♥️: "Koga is too much of a saint, very convenient for women, but if the person in question is fine with it then I guess that's okay lol" (I don't know if they're talking about Meguro or the readers but I also agree a lot with this)

25♥️: a long comment about being frustrated with the last arc nothing that wasn't said here before I agree with a lot of it, especially the fact that there was still no development in term of physical relation between the two MC's

19♥️: someone asking if there's gonna be an epilogue

14♥️: someone who thinks it's funny how much Meguro made Koga wait for her shift to end

10♥️: "this old man wishes he could experience this sort of bittersweet romance too" lol

9♥️: another comment about Meguro making Koga wait

6♥️: I honestly don't really know what this person is trying to say, something about writing the story all over again from another pov? Idk

6♥️: finally someone asking what happened to that "criminal tutor"


I think there might be a few more comments referencing the tutor after this but they all get few likes so I assume everyone who hated that arc hoped out of the story and didn't bother interacting with it? Idk really