Seijo no Maryoku wa Bannou desu - Vol. 4 Ch. 15.4 - Tea Party Part 4

[ivies]

Thanks for the Chapters!!!😍

 

[SAAndy13H]

Wouldn't a way to fix an issue is for Sei to gain custody of Aria. Like put an excuse of that they both are from Japan, and that Prince Kyle being a child himself shouldn't have taken Aria and act as her legal guardian. Pull up evidence of the prince and his entourage being completely incompetent on teaching Aria the customs of this world. Then there is an issue of whether Sei even wants custody since it is her choice.

 

[Glomoro]

@Riger Honestly, the most frequent use of it is probably "Uh, where I come from we only marry one person." "So? You're here, marry all of us or someone gonna die." Perhaps "I'm too young to drink" as well.

 

[tuatara1]

Wouldn't it be easier - and more interesting - for Sei to meet with Aira herself? Rather than having to read about other people's views of Aira, it would be much more compelling to see Sei and Aira interacting directly.

 

[Dragou]

@tuatara1 that would be like explaining the different values Aira and Sei have ..... far to easy

Hell I dont understand why they dont explain it AND if these people dont want to accept it ...... they need the Saints and therefore it would be a REALLY bad move. Even though I like the story such things really bother me. That are points where no one can use their brain.

 

[Mojo]

@Riri The "that thing" is what Sei refers to the idiot prince as. It wasn't Liz who said that at all. Although Liz does acknowledge that Sei has the right to call her fiance a thing because he treated Sei like crap, she even apologies for her fiances poor behavior and Sei say's it's not her fault, she's not responsible for the idiot princes actions. Also, Aira is pretty much isolated from the general public because the Prince and his cohorts "guarding the saint" her only interaction so far has been the cohorts fiances being fed up and telling her off. To which she has NO clue what she did wrong because as Liz puts it they have told her nothing of the customs of the country. In other words, it's not Liz or Aira who are at fault here, it's the country that kidnapped them (Sei and Aira) and the prince that has isolated Aira and not educated her on what's going on that's at fault. So now people are blaming the clueless Aira and Liz is troubled that no one with any sense is by Aira side telling her the pitfalls of their society, because unlike her idiot fiance she cares for Aira's well being. To the prince Aira is just a chess piece to secure his place as crown prince, because controlling the saintess, who is vital to the country is a important position of power.

 

[berryoragami]

I just want Sei and Aira to interact at this point
Thanks for the chapter!

 

[sjmcc13]

@Huapollon : Sorry, no villanesses here.

Spoiler

Aria is a sheltered girl from a well to do family, and as a result the Prince's treatment are just normal to her. She is use to going with the flow and does not realize that the prince and his toadies are messing things up. But it would be natural to assume that they know what they should be doing.

@Psychronia : In the LN

Spoiler

They meet at the end of Vol 2, and once she is separated from that thing becomes friends with Sei and Liz

@icekatze : Keep in mind the summoning is a last ditch desperation move, they prefer a Saint from their world.

@Dragou : A lot of the problems stem from 1 thing, the king wanted to maintain his sons chances of inheriting the throne, and the F-up at the summoning very nearly cost him that possibility. That and realizing it would be a bad idea to put Sei and the thing in the same room. The king can not interfere without dishonoring the prince, but they are at the point that any major incident would throw things over the edge. The problems are all in the prince's hands and he has to pull himself out of the hole he dug, and keeps digging deeper.

@DeadKinginHell @Sheepholata : except for 1 thing, the king and major nobles would have Liz's back since the major scandals are not being ignored by anyone outside the prince and his toadies. Plus they are pretty certain that Sei is the saint as she has ticked more of the boxes (all but like 1 or 2) then Aria.

@Riri : Aria is causing problems, but is has a valid defence for that due to ignorance of their society. It is natural to assume that the prince and his toadies as children of (high ranking) nobles would not be doing anything that would cause a problem or be considered disgraceful from the eyes of their society, which is exactly what they are doing.

@Flowerthinking : Be patient

Spoiler

Sei being in love with him (and not knowing it😪) it pretty much the key to unlocking/activating the Saint ability that confirms her Saint status

@cherokeemoon : and they do not really realize that the customs are different.

 

[icekatze]

@sjmcc13
The matter at hand isn't whether or not they should have summoned Aira, but rather how should they treat her now that she has been summoned. Considering they've already stolen literally everything from Aira, it's pretty hypocritical to get mad that Aira looks like she might, potentially, at some point in the future steal something from one of them.

I don't even like the Prince, but Liz and her gang aren't conducting themselves much better. One would think they might be able to make some accommodations to the young woman who is, not of her own free will, risking her life to save theirs.

 

[DeadKinginHell]

@sjmcc13
Yeah. But at the same time, if the king took action, it will cause a lot of political problems due to the fact that prince moron is the crown prince. It'll be the impetus of a civil war as in that case, support for the other prince will increase. It's unlikely that the king would take any action which would support Liz and Sei, at least not a direct one.

Also, Sei may have ticked almost all of the boxes, but it still is not enough as she isn't officially recognized as the Saint. Aria still holds the title officially, as the dumb prince announced it first. As for the reason why Sei isn't a saint officially, it's because if they changed who the saint is suddenly after the prince moron's declaration, then the country's integrity would be questioned.

The things needed for Sei's official recognition are achievements, especially one so big that it has a good effect for at least everyone in the kingdom. This is for the sake of reducing Aria's and the dumbass prince's credibility.

 

[Dragou]

@sjmcc13 that doesnt stop them from the possibility to try to understand where Sei and Aira come from. Not knowing their upbringing and morals which they learned can produce even more people like the prince. That the 2 summoned girls are this understanding is the all time strangeness anyway. That is most likely such a japanese thing, but honestly it is stupid.
As long both sides dont know their different values it will only get worse. What they do with such a behavior is putting it off for later. Even if they dont do it in public they should do it nonetheless.

In some way it would be interesting to see how they build up this indirect bomb until it explodes (which most likely wont happen because somehow even the MC Sei is in contrast to the start extremly submissive). But it is stupid from the kings side nonetheless. His strategy in dealing with things isbasically running away until it catches up ....like with Aira even though they know that the prince is a problem and an empty (in some ways) apology without real follow ups towards Sei isnt the solution either.

Like so often so many problems could have been avoided or solved if they would just fucking speak with each other. Even if I still like this story somehow, this is just bad writing.

@DeadKinginHell But the biggest problem for that strategy anyway is that Sei doesnt WANT to be the saint. If they speak with Aira and Sei in the same room (at best without moron prince, who gets a scolding and directions from the king outside the public) and clear all things up they could work on it.
Basically they completely ignore who and from where Aria and Sei are, which would normally end in the worst case ending for them. Especially they already offended the real Saint. Like I stated above, it is most likely a japanese thing to be THIS submissive, which people normally wouldnt take silently. (Though Sei already did show at the start that she has the mindset even if she suddenly lost it, even if she was angry there.)

 

[JoshuaFord]

@icekatze
Yes, they are indeed framing it as you put it, "She probably doesn't know it's unacceptable to be close with men because no one told her.", Which shows that they are blaming the guys who didn't tell her the customs, who are the people actually at fault in this situation. Liz wants to tell her the customs and Aira has no objection to hearing Liz out, but liz is forcefully blocked from speaking with Aira by her own fiancee.

 

[sjmcc13]

@DeadKinginHell : There is no chance of a civil war, the background politics are such that pretty much everyone important knows about the summoning and his mess up. So the king would be forced to act in Liz's defense to prevent one.

Also Aria was never officially declared the saint, the prince thinks she is but everyone else has been treating her and Sei as saint candidates from the start. Sei has achievements such that they can not dismiss her, even if she was not the saint her known achievements make her to valuable to the nation, and Aria has none.

@Dragou : Unless forced people assume that and act as if their culture is the only right one. This is something we see signs if in reality in the meetings of cultures. These guys are just going to assume that the summoned come from.similar cultures unless they are told otherwise.

@icekatze : The prince should be treating her better, Liz is acting responsibly given the situation. She is not ostracizing Aria, and trying to figure out how to clear up the issues

Spoiler

the prince will explode at Luz in public, call Sei a fake saint and the king is forced to remove Aria from his care. The 2nd prince will ask for Liz's help assuming Aria needs female friends (which that thing has been actively preventing) and the issues around Aria start resolving themselves from there

 

[Dragou]

@sjmcc13 an this is the point where it doesnt make sense das at least Sei explains that to them. She has the personality to do so, like we saw in the beginning.

 

[icekatze]

@JoshuaFord
That is assuming that the customs of this world are objectively "correct," and the customs of Japan are objectively "incorrect." They kidnap her, have her risk her life, take away everything she is familiar with, but that's not enough apparently. They have to force her to give up the customs from her home and exclusively follow theirs too.

@sjmcc13
Liz is explicitly ostracizing Aira. She calls her "A Troublesome Student." Regardless of what will happen in the future, she is saying that a Japanese person is wrong for acting Japanese.

 

[Onsokumaru]

The prince is obviously the villain right now, but Aira is acting weird as well.
Sei took full control of her life, while Aira is acting like a puppet.
Aira is ignoring advice of people around her, so her being ignorant is no longer an excuse.
Aira just left Sei there to rot. She should have tried to help Sei after what the prince did.
Luckily Sei can handle herself, but imagine if the situation was reversed.

 

[Gameruru]

@Onsokumaru i think there is actually no advice given 2 her & no 1 also did and could inform her that Sei was left rotting. Just saying tho.

 

[Onsokumaru]

@Gameruru
We recently saw the two girls criticize what she is doing wrong, and supposedly that wasn't the first time.

 

[JoshuaFord]

@Onsokumaru the prince actively prevents anyone from giving aira advice, so shes not ignoring anyone per say. In fact, she does wish to hear liz out since she wants to become acquaintances with the other female student later on.
EDIT: seeing your response to gameruru, you have a valid point, other girls have told aira that she should stay away from their fiancees, but considering the fact that she has no one she can rely on but the princes and his aides, i believe its believable that she would struggle to do that. Heres a portion from the ln in aira's perspective.

Spoiler

There were several girls who called out to her but they always said the same things.

They told her to stop following the royal family and high ranking aristocrats, like Kyle and the others, they also told her to keep her hands off other people’s fiancés.

Aira was stumped at what had been said to her.

Aira didn’t intend to tag along with Kyle and the others, nor did she remember ever laying her hands on them.

Kyle certainly touched her a lot, and his close aides favoured her without being instructed to do so. She felt that they were treating her well because they felt responsible for the summoned Aira.

Still, the girls told her to stay away from Kyle and the others. It was a cruel thing to say to Aira, who didn’t have anyone else to rely on other than them.

@icekatze what determines whether customs are right or wrong? Is there objective proof that the customs sei and aira have are more correct than the world they have been summoned to? Of course not since it has has nothing to do with objectiveness, customs are a subjective aspect of society. If someone does not adhere to the customs of the society they are currently in, of course they are going to stand out as "troublesome", the same applies to the varying customs between nations in real life. Should the half a dozen or so girls who havent done anything wrong just suck it up when their fiancees are flirting with a recently transferred commoner girl who is disrepecting the societal norms that they are accustomed to?

You group of "they" is way too broad here, how is Aira and Sei being summoned by force the fault of anyone but the royalty and the summoners?
Yes thay have kidnapped them, and while its unfortunate, whats done is done.

Spoiler

The king attempts to provide apology gifts to both of them, albeit they serve a double purpose to tie their allegience to the nation, which is why both girls end up trying to refuse the gifts.

No they have not risked Aira's life, if anything the princes group is too overprotecting of her, Aira actually ends up wanting to do more difficult monster subjugations but is overruled by the prince who sees her as a pet.
Yes they did take away what shes familiar with, which is why the prince refusing to let her make acquaintances and clear the misunderstanding with the other girls her age (including liz) is so terrible. She has no one that she can trust and rely on, unlike sei, so she is unable to get acquainted with the new customs of society.

Spoiler

When the prince is later placed under house arrest for being an absoloute douchebag, Aira, Liz, and Sei quickly become buddies and the Aira becomes friends with the girls at the academy once the misunderstandings are cleared up. Both Aira and Sei dont really have any qualms with adhering to their new worlds customs, and Aira later becomes a mage at the mage devision, working under the head magician since she wants to continue going on subjugations.

EDIT: Heres a segment from the ln that explains what Liz tries to do to help fix the situation:

Spoiler

Rain didn’t know much about the situation between Aira and Kyle, but he had heard the rumours from the other students, and wondered if there was a way to improve the situation, so he consulted with Elizabeth.

Elizabeth had also been asked by the fiancées of Kyle’s close aides, to do something about their fiancée’s waiting upon Aira.

The result of the discussion was that Elizabeth would help Aira with things at the Academy in place of Kyle and the others.

Thus, Elizabeth encountered Aira when she was alone and spoke to her, but before she could ask Aira the important question, Kyle had interrupted them and they couldn’t talk anymore.

 

[icekatze]

@JoshuaFord
If Aira had chosen to go live in that country, your argument might hold some water. I could argue that treating people as equals has cross-cultural merit, but for the sake of argument, I don't even need to. Aira's experience has been all take and no give. If they didn't want troublesome people, then they had no business summoning troublesome people in the first place. The royalty did summon her though. It was their decision, so it's their responsibility to make accommodations for differences in culture, not Aira's.

"What's done is done," is not an argument that will hold up in many courts.

I'm not even going to address the spoilers, because they're not really relevant to the discussion. We already know the prince is a scumbag, if not objectively, then at least from Sei (and by extension, the audience)'s perspective. But during the tea party, the discussion is framed as a problem with Aira, and not a problem with the prince as it really ought to be.