Sekai de Tada Hitori no Mamonotsukai ~Tenshoku shitara Maou ni Machigawaremashita~ - Vol. 4 Ch. 17 - Shadow Walker
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@cor3zone
You're absolutely right that it has no legitimacy in the empire, as the emperor is unlikely to accept that the person who want to kill him has sovereignty. To the empire, he's just a demon king and demon kings need to be crushed. There is no argument here.
The keyword here is other countries. There are other countries other than the empire. If he simply marches in with his dragon and kill the emperor, that would rile up the other countries. By doing so, he will never be recognized as a nation by other countries and will be considered as world's number one enemy. If he has no legitimacy, the empire will be able to band up the other countries and attack him. If he has an alliance with the queen, then queen's country will be attacked too.
By proving that he can be civilized and can be approached diplomatically, it will calm the other countries. If a nation is not a rogue state and can be reasoned with, there is no reason why he can't be recognized as a sovereign. If the other countries accept that he is a sovereign nation and that it was in his right to commit to blood feud, there is a good chance that no matter how much the empire make him out as a continental threat, the other countries will just say the emperor deserved it.
True, she didn't tell him to commit vengeance another day, but she also never said anything about peace outweighing family.
"She almost literally told him peace outweighs family. " Where? Show me, where did she say this literally or almost literally? Don't put words into her mouth.
You're absolutely right that it has no legitimacy in the empire, as the emperor is unlikely to accept that the person who want to kill him has sovereignty. To the empire, he's just a demon king and demon kings need to be crushed. There is no argument here.
The keyword here is other countries. There are other countries other than the empire. If he simply marches in with his dragon and kill the emperor, that would rile up the other countries. By doing so, he will never be recognized as a nation by other countries and will be considered as world's number one enemy. If he has no legitimacy, the empire will be able to band up the other countries and attack him. If he has an alliance with the queen, then queen's country will be attacked too.
By proving that he can be civilized and can be approached diplomatically, it will calm the other countries. If a nation is not a rogue state and can be reasoned with, there is no reason why he can't be recognized as a sovereign. If the other countries accept that he is a sovereign nation and that it was in his right to commit to blood feud, there is a good chance that no matter how much the empire make him out as a continental threat, the other countries will just say the emperor deserved it.
True, she didn't tell him to commit vengeance another day, but she also never said anything about peace outweighing family.
"She almost literally told him peace outweighs family. " Where? Show me, where did she say this literally or almost literally? Don't put words into her mouth.
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@Aichan you said before (and i quote...copy-paste) "Liu Bang was just a bandit when he declared himself Emperor, and nobody accepted his right to rule when he started, but he eventually became the emperor of one of the greatest of Chinese dynasties". A bandit you said.....
Now you're saying that he needs to be civilized....sorry, but it doesn't make very much sense
I mean....he has a dragon for a pet....if he marches on the empire and makes scorched earth of it, who can oppose him after such a show of pure raw power? Like the Liu Bang you mentioned, MC doesn't need to wait and get approval, he can simply get it by showing his worth and power: "we're good until you step in my way"....i repeat, based on his and his allies power (namely the dragon and the ex-adventurer or whatever he was), he has nothing to be scared of
And the whole "having the opponent family under your roof" strategy...i think it only works if the opponent or both parties have something to lose if they start a war....in MC case, again, he can obliterate everyone who goes against him...so, if he had a brain and thought that, having his family as hostages in the empire is a stupid move, as he can simply enter, take family back, and exit with ease
And mind you, i'm not saying that MC has to go full mad conqueror mode...we saw that he's pretty chilled and wants to live an "easy life"....it's not like he wants to conquer the world
Now you're saying that he needs to be civilized....sorry, but it doesn't make very much sense
I mean....he has a dragon for a pet....if he marches on the empire and makes scorched earth of it, who can oppose him after such a show of pure raw power? Like the Liu Bang you mentioned, MC doesn't need to wait and get approval, he can simply get it by showing his worth and power: "we're good until you step in my way"....i repeat, based on his and his allies power (namely the dragon and the ex-adventurer or whatever he was), he has nothing to be scared of
And the whole "having the opponent family under your roof" strategy...i think it only works if the opponent or both parties have something to lose if they start a war....in MC case, again, he can obliterate everyone who goes against him...so, if he had a brain and thought that, having his family as hostages in the empire is a stupid move, as he can simply enter, take family back, and exit with ease
And mind you, i'm not saying that MC has to go full mad conqueror mode...we saw that he's pretty chilled and wants to live an "easy life"....it's not like he wants to conquer the world
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@FantasyMaster
Liu Bang as a bandit only had one enemy to deal with, the Qin Dynasty. After the Qin fell, he was appointed as one of the kings by the rebel army. By the time he marched to take the throne of emperor, he was already established as a king.
Right now, our demon lord is just Liu Bang the Bandit, with not only the Qin Dynasty to deal with, but also fantasy Qidan, Xiong Nu, Chu, Xia and other rebel factions that can easily band together to overwhelm him. Remember what happened to the Yellow Turbans. They were powerful and even conquered several territories, but because they were considered as just bandits, they were free targets for everyone and were attacked by the whole map. By accepting the queen's proposal, our demon lord will become King Liu Bang and therefore treated as equal by the other kingdoms.
Bandit or king, which one commands more respect? Let's use a more modern example. Imagine that you're a newly hired junior member of the sales team. A complication at distribution calls for immediate action and there's no superior to give the orders. Would you as junior member decide what to do? The answer is no. Whatever you do or decide is not binding until your superior comes back to deal with it, regardless of whether or not you have dealt with it. You as the newly hired junior member has no say in anything and therefore your decisions will not be supported or respected by anyone.
Liu Bang as a bandit only had one enemy to deal with, the Qin Dynasty. After the Qin fell, he was appointed as one of the kings by the rebel army. By the time he marched to take the throne of emperor, he was already established as a king.
Right now, our demon lord is just Liu Bang the Bandit, with not only the Qin Dynasty to deal with, but also fantasy Qidan, Xiong Nu, Chu, Xia and other rebel factions that can easily band together to overwhelm him. Remember what happened to the Yellow Turbans. They were powerful and even conquered several territories, but because they were considered as just bandits, they were free targets for everyone and were attacked by the whole map. By accepting the queen's proposal, our demon lord will become King Liu Bang and therefore treated as equal by the other kingdoms.
Bandit or king, which one commands more respect? Let's use a more modern example. Imagine that you're a newly hired junior member of the sales team. A complication at distribution calls for immediate action and there's no superior to give the orders. Would you as junior member decide what to do? The answer is no. Whatever you do or decide is not binding until your superior comes back to deal with it, regardless of whether or not you have dealt with it. You as the newly hired junior member has no say in anything and therefore your decisions will not be supported or respected by anyone.
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@Aichan Wait....it's cool that we're comparing this to history, but let's remember that this is a fantasy story
First, people call MC "demon lord", but we know he's a tamer...the demon lord role is not yet occupied (but that's not important)
Second, and i repeat, it's very cool and interesting to compare this to real history, but you talked about the Yellow Turbans and how they got ganked by everyone else....we're talking of real normal people...in this story we have a guy who can literally destroy castle walls by punching them and has a pet dragon that can, as one can understand from what he said, if the boy makes him go all out, do so much damage that he can not estimate the result
Plus, now that i read better, "he was appointed as one of the kings by the rebel army".....well, he have a whole elven village, some high rank monster, a dragon, an ex adventurer and a loli maid appointing him as their king...plus the external queen that is only searching for an ally to gain more power....so he's not "just Liu Bang the bandit", he's a much more king than Liu was
First, people call MC "demon lord", but we know he's a tamer...the demon lord role is not yet occupied (but that's not important)
Second, and i repeat, it's very cool and interesting to compare this to real history, but you talked about the Yellow Turbans and how they got ganked by everyone else....we're talking of real normal people...in this story we have a guy who can literally destroy castle walls by punching them and has a pet dragon that can, as one can understand from what he said, if the boy makes him go all out, do so much damage that he can not estimate the result
Plus, now that i read better, "he was appointed as one of the kings by the rebel army".....well, he have a whole elven village, some high rank monster, a dragon, an ex adventurer and a loli maid appointing him as their king...plus the external queen that is only searching for an ally to gain more power....so he's not "just Liu Bang the bandit", he's a much more king than Liu was
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@FantasyMaster
You're right in that the demon lord can destroy the castle wall with a punch. But you forgot one thing, his subjects can't do the same thing. In the very fact of this chapter, all it needed to overwhelm his village was to send a necromancer and several undead thralls. Imagine how it would be if instead of a single necromancer, an entire army was sent, while he's away fighting on the front lines. The whole reason he did this was to protect them. He can't protect them if he's always busy elsewhere.
Liu Bang was appointed by the rebel army, the victors of the rebellion against the Qin. Ask yourself, what elven village? Did they win any wars? Do people know who they were? Do they have any influence? Would people care that he got appointed by an unknown elven village in the middle of nowhere? Pretty much the only people who knew about them was the empire, and that's only because they accidentally stumbled on it while searching for a dragon.
Yes, the queen. See, this is the whole point of this entire debate. Until the queen actually recognized his rule to the wider world, he is just Liu Bang the Bandit. He is not yet King Liu Bang because no other country has been informed that the queen recognize his sovereignty. If he would go wreck havoc in the empire, he can kiss the queen's commendations good bye so he'd be on his own with no queen backing him up.
The reason why I equate this to real history is because it's much easier to imagine and refute if there is a real world example. Otherwise it's just 'my opinion, your opinion' and at some point someone would start moving the goalpost.
You're right in that the demon lord can destroy the castle wall with a punch. But you forgot one thing, his subjects can't do the same thing. In the very fact of this chapter, all it needed to overwhelm his village was to send a necromancer and several undead thralls. Imagine how it would be if instead of a single necromancer, an entire army was sent, while he's away fighting on the front lines. The whole reason he did this was to protect them. He can't protect them if he's always busy elsewhere.
Liu Bang was appointed by the rebel army, the victors of the rebellion against the Qin. Ask yourself, what elven village? Did they win any wars? Do people know who they were? Do they have any influence? Would people care that he got appointed by an unknown elven village in the middle of nowhere? Pretty much the only people who knew about them was the empire, and that's only because they accidentally stumbled on it while searching for a dragon.
Yes, the queen. See, this is the whole point of this entire debate. Until the queen actually recognized his rule to the wider world, he is just Liu Bang the Bandit. He is not yet King Liu Bang because no other country has been informed that the queen recognize his sovereignty. If he would go wreck havoc in the empire, he can kiss the queen's commendations good bye so he'd be on his own with no queen backing him up.
The reason why I equate this to real history is because it's much easier to imagine and refute if there is a real world example. Otherwise it's just 'my opinion, your opinion' and at some point someone would start moving the goalpost.
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@Aichan Yeah, it's obviously a matter of opinion and i believe that we're only having a constructive and brain-stimulant discussion
But again...i feel like you are underestimating the dragon here....ok, you're right, the village has no power whatsoever and we can say it's deadweight in case of "war"
And you're also right that shit kinda hit the fan with just a necromancer....but i want to point out that the necromancer is a high level "pawn" in the empire army...you can't compare him/her with normal soldiers...and i don't even think it's possible for the normal army to reach the village before MC hop on the dragon, flies to the empire, makes scorched earth (also because the main force is marching towards the village), re-hop on the dragon and flies back to the village to finish the show....
Even if, and i say IF, this necromancer escape now and regroup with the magician woman and the big dude, i don't think they have enough magic/items to teleport an entire army....while, i repeat, MC can ride a huge dragon, soar the skies and unleash god's wrath on his enemies....after that, the queen and the other countries/kingdoms/whatever rulers could only present themselves to MC while crawling on the ground
Plus, iirc, the queen was shown for the first time while mc was returning from a kingdom, where he announced the creation of his country and showed his power by cracking the castle wall (or was it the town entrance wall?...idk) with a punch...so it's not only her that knows of MC situation and power
So i say, kudos to you for making all this comparison, shows you are a f'ing big brain (and i swear i'm making a compliment)...but there is too much fantasy to try to force real life thinking in here....and i don't even know why we're still doing it when most of the complaints were about the fact that a raging OP MC was stopped from going full nuke on an empire by the words of a loli that has no other roles in the story if not being the Jiminy Cricket and making some jokes here and there....i guess it's just too nice to have a good conversation/discussion every now and then
But again...i feel like you are underestimating the dragon here....ok, you're right, the village has no power whatsoever and we can say it's deadweight in case of "war"
And you're also right that shit kinda hit the fan with just a necromancer....but i want to point out that the necromancer is a high level "pawn" in the empire army...you can't compare him/her with normal soldiers...and i don't even think it's possible for the normal army to reach the village before MC hop on the dragon, flies to the empire, makes scorched earth (also because the main force is marching towards the village), re-hop on the dragon and flies back to the village to finish the show....
Even if, and i say IF, this necromancer escape now and regroup with the magician woman and the big dude, i don't think they have enough magic/items to teleport an entire army....while, i repeat, MC can ride a huge dragon, soar the skies and unleash god's wrath on his enemies....after that, the queen and the other countries/kingdoms/whatever rulers could only present themselves to MC while crawling on the ground
Plus, iirc, the queen was shown for the first time while mc was returning from a kingdom, where he announced the creation of his country and showed his power by cracking the castle wall (or was it the town entrance wall?...idk) with a punch...so it's not only her that knows of MC situation and power
So i say, kudos to you for making all this comparison, shows you are a f'ing big brain (and i swear i'm making a compliment)...but there is too much fantasy to try to force real life thinking in here....and i don't even know why we're still doing it when most of the complaints were about the fact that a raging OP MC was stopped from going full nuke on an empire by the words of a loli that has no other roles in the story if not being the Jiminy Cricket and making some jokes here and there....i guess it's just too nice to have a good conversation/discussion every now and then
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Rash personality? What is she on about? That seems like a fairly obvious route that would happen when you learn your family was executed for practically no reason other that out of spite.
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@LongNameIncoming
Definitely rash, dude immediately picked up the plan to be a "demon lord" w/o fully considering rational consequences especially since he already knows the story of the previous monster tamer and the Queen makes a very true point that assassinating the Emperor is a bad move since mc is no longer responsible for himself, but also the elf village he kills the Emperor those elves paint a bigger target on them.
Also he shouldn't even be calling himself a "demon lord" since that's the dumbest thing ever with all the connotations attached to it and the fact that the major religion of their land has it as a doctrine to eliminate demon lords call yourself anything else and make a strong distinction between what he is and what a true demon lord is
Definitely rash, dude immediately picked up the plan to be a "demon lord" w/o fully considering rational consequences especially since he already knows the story of the previous monster tamer and the Queen makes a very true point that assassinating the Emperor is a bad move since mc is no longer responsible for himself, but also the elf village he kills the Emperor those elves paint a bigger target on them.
Also he shouldn't even be calling himself a "demon lord" since that's the dumbest thing ever with all the connotations attached to it and the fact that the major religion of their land has it as a doctrine to eliminate demon lords call yourself anything else and make a strong distinction between what he is and what a true demon lord is
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One does not simply touch magic!
What's with the asterisk in "commander*"?
What's with the asterisk in "commander*"?
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It's so convenient to have an S rank adventurer under your command.
No, she's not. Even today, a rumor about the president being injured has an effect on the stock market, since people panic and try to gather their money. In this case, people would see the Emperor killed, and assume that there's nowhere left safe in the empire, and flee. The country would be devastated
