Dex-chan lover
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cannon fodder
Senken no Majutsushi to Yobareta Kenshi - Vol. 2 Ch. 9
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Dex-chan lover
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@Silwith
He wants to live a peaceful life, so he still tries to minimize trouble as much as possible.
I think that if he kills ruthlessly and indiscriminately, he might make himself out to be the enemy of the human race. It wouldn't be enough to move out of the kingdom anymore at that point. He also won't be able to have the twins live a normal life in the future anymore with any amount of effort.
@Lesurous
He wants to live a peaceful life, so he still tries to minimize trouble as much as possible.
I think that if he kills ruthlessly and indiscriminately, he might make himself out to be the enemy of the human race. It wouldn't be enough to move out of the kingdom anymore at that point. He also won't be able to have the twins live a normal life in the future anymore with any amount of effort.
@Lesurous
It's like a character design from a 90's JRPG. That headband of all things.
Fed-Kun's army
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@anakskul
and? you think conflict like this will end if you kill them all? i don't think so, if he kill all of the soldiers in that fort, he'll put himself and the twins in dangerous situation where most likely the nobles will hunt them down, unless you expect the author to change the story where the MC is a killing maniac and then kill all the nobles, the end, maybe that's the kind of "ending" you want
and? you think conflict like this will end if you kill them all? i don't think so, if he kill all of the soldiers in that fort, he'll put himself and the twins in dangerous situation where most likely the nobles will hunt them down, unless you expect the author to change the story where the MC is a killing maniac and then kill all the nobles, the end, maybe that's the kind of "ending" you want
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I'm reading the web novel right now and it seems the plot is different between manga adaptation.
Decken and the guards did some info digging on Nere, found information on the twins relating to MC. The twin never went outside due to the all bad memory they're having on outside world so no kidnapping. After couple of days knowing the reason why they are aimed by the guards there is a night raid. House were surrounded by guards and were asked to give the fugitive "female mercenary". The guards doesn't know her name so they ask for "Female Mercenary with blue long hair". At this point MC were handling the situation buying some time for Nere, Phillia and Rihanna to gather up their stuff to run away. MC lied about there are 3 female mercenary with blue long hair in the house and he doesn't know which one they are aiming for. So he lied and went inside the house to bring all 3 of them to the guards so they know which one is the target. With done buying the time, they escape on the roof by flying into the sky. The guards can't enter inside the house btw due to the barrier magic deployed by MC, he only de-activate it on the last sec before he fly outside. The surrounding guards rush inside the house, and they fly outside leaving the town. There are no sword fight, just talk.
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hm yes, because the kidnapping of the children definitely isn't just an excuse to see conscious-free excessive violence.
not that i'm complaining or anything, trashy fantasy gives me sustenance.
not that i'm complaining or anything, trashy fantasy gives me sustenance.
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@jonsmth Nope, wont let that count, they kidnapped the children already, with a fucking army, made clear they want the woman (and him just with her) dead, there is no way a logically thinking person would think "oh hey, if i am not too hard here than everything will sure work out". At this point it is 100% clear that they have to leave anyway, plus, what ticks me off is that the author trys to let him seem ruthless, without going trough with it, its just half-baked, i could live with it if he would be one of this "oh, i want to make it as peaceful as possible idiots" (even if i call them idiots 
), but they make him seem so angry about it and let him go there and he bangs down the half fort, but no, the commander of the troops is STILL not dead, while he could have easily killed him with the first sword alone...
PS: The
@Araxis Dont see it... its obvious at that point that they want to kill the woman and him, there is logically speaking only one way and that is out of the country, into one without ties to this one, so killing them all fast (which is the best option to save the twins at this point) wouldnt change anything for the future anyway.
), but they make him seem so angry about it and let him go there and he bangs down the half fort, but no, the commander of the troops is STILL not dead, while he could have easily killed him with the first sword alone...PS: The
is bullshit if you ask me, if anything a country that dislikes the country he is right now would want to get him as a force, getting such a strong fighter with a bad relationship with your enemy is a perfect, easy power-up. And outside of maybe friendly kingdoms in the direct vincinity no one in a world with monsters that rip people apart and magic would give a shit about someone killing a few people that tried to kill him, if he is strong enough to protect the own citicens agains that monsters.
@Araxis Dont see it... its obvious at that point that they want to kill the woman and him, there is logically speaking only one way and that is out of the country, into one without ties to this one, so killing them all fast (which is the best option to save the twins at this point) wouldnt change anything for the future anyway.
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@firosahoge So, people should only ever post praise?
And as for this manga, so far it just had buildup, I have no problem with it being a bit on a long side. But if this is an actual climax - then of course I wouldn't read if further. It's only chapter 9 by the way, so "reading every single chapter while not liking it" does not apply correctly.
And as for this manga, so far it just had buildup, I have no problem with it being a bit on a long side. But if this is an actual climax - then of course I wouldn't read if further. It's only chapter 9 by the way, so "reading every single chapter while not liking it" does not apply correctly.
Dex-chan lover
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@kwendy complaints are fine, but you were pretty dismissive of the series in one of its climaxes
Saving his kidnapped little girls, exploding the castle, chopping off heads, etc, is "not that interesting" and the "pinnacle of pointless fights"? That's beyond complaining, that's more like you don't find the series interesting at all and at that point, I would think that you would drop it. But if you keep reading beyond this point, it makes me think that you're complaining with your words but liking it in deed.
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@Silwith
He has no qualms killing any of the soldiers. I would think that the problem lies in what the others - the innocent people - may think of him. Surely, news of an entire army company falling to some adventurers wouldn't go unheard of. Any survivors would tell tales of brutality. Or just the evidence of no survivors would be enough. And well, these soldiers may be fathers and sons. They're not bandits. They have each have a family who cares about them.
Now that I think about it, this was probably the more immediate reason - he wants to get the twins back as quickly and safely as possible.
He has no qualms killing any of the soldiers. I would think that the problem lies in what the others - the innocent people - may think of him. Surely, news of an entire army company falling to some adventurers wouldn't go unheard of. Any survivors would tell tales of brutality. Or just the evidence of no survivors would be enough. And well, these soldiers may be fathers and sons. They're not bandits. They have each have a family who cares about them.
Since he's trying to avoid having to kill everyone, he'd want to keep the soldiers from attacking him out of revenge for killing their commander... and also prevent them from killing the hostages out of revenge. Besides, he still has to find the twins.
Now that I think about it, this was probably the more immediate reason - he wants to get the twins back as quickly and safely as possible.
I don't think he'd want to become a pawn of the military in another country. Remember that he doesn't want to tie himself down with anyone because he's still looking for his former party members? Besides, his notoriety would prevent him from interacting with regular people comfortably. It doesn't help that he has the twins with him. His brutality would just confirm the people's prejudice towards the twins.
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@firosahoge Step by step:
1) Saving kidnapped girls would be fine, but we don't even see direct threat to them - they don't affect the battle in any way. Heck, heroes didn't even bothered to secure twins location before destroying the castle.
2) Property damage - well, they alredy caused destruction in the open field, so it isn't topping anything we saw before nor it stretches the bounds of heroes. We know it's a fort in the middle of nowhere that can be just discarded if things go wrong, so we have no sence of value for the destruction caused. The fort strength also has no point of reference either.
3) Head collecting - it was alredy established that military in this world is super weak from previous fight, we know the best of their fighters can be beaten with a kitchen knife even without magic, so no intrigue regarding power comparison. We alredy have some scale about main characters abilities also, so this does not adds anything new. Nothing we saw before indicated extreme humanism of MC that would've created a dilemma of killing people. There is no emotional impact either, because it's all nameless background characters that don't even register as people from readers point of view and it does not visibly affect protagonist either. No exploitation of moral grey zone as well - soldiers are portrayed as greedy, violent and selfish to prevent any sympathy for those who were actually killed. You may say it's somehow gtaphic scene, but it's not that impactful so that it would save the climax.
So, yea, I stand by my word: this battle is a pinnacle of pointlessness that added literally nothing to narrative or aestetic value of the story.
And also yes, if you are a WN reader and you can confirm this is indeed climax of the arc and it's all downhill from there you'll make me big favor. Otherwise I need to see the end of this arc to confirm I need to drop it.
+
Next is just my thoughts on how this fight could be improved, skip if disinterested:
Showing twins faces once helps keeping reader invested in conflics. If villains also, for example, called priests or other authorities to dispose of twins it would've added extra sense of urgency. Speaking of wich, imposing time limit is a universal tool to create challenge for overpowered entitie, better then hostage situations and easier then properly executed moral choices.
Since moving fight to the town (Man of Steel style) would change the narrative completely, we could indicate the significance of the fort at least. It could be defence against monster or raider incursions, it could be preparing troops for some important task we would care about - at least something we could relate to. Or maybe we could learn the past trial of the fortress, so we could know, for example, that it withstood heavy siege or standed for a long time. We couldv'e even drawn parallels with other threats fortress faced - or even could have faced if used by intended purpose, that would actually be perfect if you don't want to add too much flavour. Imagine if our two-man army would be compared to an actual army or to attacking dragon as a metaphor. That and to know those walls are not just shitty brickwork by stating they are intended to withstand certain things helps too.
Since we established the top bar for soldiers in previous arc, there is little we can do about real challenge, but we can create an illusion of such if we make MC take extra steps. Make him display caution, make him prepare his magic in case of emergencies, make him count the amount of archers on the wall to be aware of. Or at least make him anxious or hasety about hostages a little.
I don't know if it would be in character for the protagonist, but making emotional desisions would increase investment in combat too. Make him create pointlessly big spell to threaten the army and back up his surrender demand. make him look back at his partner to make sure she is dealing fine with her task, make him take a glance at crushed enemies or even make him deal the "mercy blow" to a dying foe.
And speaking of wich, we could easily humanise the enemy forces. We only really see single named foe and collective blob of fighters. Villain could use a leutenant he exchange couple of miscellanous lines with, or even the commanding officer of the fortress. Heck, we can create entire point of view of military commander, from the perspective of wich two vile mercenaries just barged in his fortress and making unreasonable demands. Painting the blob would also make a difference. A bit of paint on the armor here and there, flask on the side, scar on the face. The biggest impact imo would be actually showing fallen enemies on the ground or under the rubble.
And there we have it.
1) Saving kidnapped girls would be fine, but we don't even see direct threat to them - they don't affect the battle in any way. Heck, heroes didn't even bothered to secure twins location before destroying the castle.
2) Property damage - well, they alredy caused destruction in the open field, so it isn't topping anything we saw before nor it stretches the bounds of heroes. We know it's a fort in the middle of nowhere that can be just discarded if things go wrong, so we have no sence of value for the destruction caused. The fort strength also has no point of reference either.
3) Head collecting - it was alredy established that military in this world is super weak from previous fight, we know the best of their fighters can be beaten with a kitchen knife even without magic, so no intrigue regarding power comparison. We alredy have some scale about main characters abilities also, so this does not adds anything new. Nothing we saw before indicated extreme humanism of MC that would've created a dilemma of killing people. There is no emotional impact either, because it's all nameless background characters that don't even register as people from readers point of view and it does not visibly affect protagonist either. No exploitation of moral grey zone as well - soldiers are portrayed as greedy, violent and selfish to prevent any sympathy for those who were actually killed. You may say it's somehow gtaphic scene, but it's not that impactful so that it would save the climax.
So, yea, I stand by my word: this battle is a pinnacle of pointlessness that added literally nothing to narrative or aestetic value of the story.
And also yes, if you are a WN reader and you can confirm this is indeed climax of the arc and it's all downhill from there you'll make me big favor. Otherwise I need to see the end of this arc to confirm I need to drop it.
+
Next is just my thoughts on how this fight could be improved, skip if disinterested:
Showing twins faces once helps keeping reader invested in conflics. If villains also, for example, called priests or other authorities to dispose of twins it would've added extra sense of urgency. Speaking of wich, imposing time limit is a universal tool to create challenge for overpowered entitie, better then hostage situations and easier then properly executed moral choices.
Since moving fight to the town (Man of Steel style) would change the narrative completely, we could indicate the significance of the fort at least. It could be defence against monster or raider incursions, it could be preparing troops for some important task we would care about - at least something we could relate to. Or maybe we could learn the past trial of the fortress, so we could know, for example, that it withstood heavy siege or standed for a long time. We couldv'e even drawn parallels with other threats fortress faced - or even could have faced if used by intended purpose, that would actually be perfect if you don't want to add too much flavour. Imagine if our two-man army would be compared to an actual army or to attacking dragon as a metaphor. That and to know those walls are not just shitty brickwork by stating they are intended to withstand certain things helps too.
Since we established the top bar for soldiers in previous arc, there is little we can do about real challenge, but we can create an illusion of such if we make MC take extra steps. Make him display caution, make him prepare his magic in case of emergencies, make him count the amount of archers on the wall to be aware of. Or at least make him anxious or hasety about hostages a little.
I don't know if it would be in character for the protagonist, but making emotional desisions would increase investment in combat too. Make him create pointlessly big spell to threaten the army and back up his surrender demand. make him look back at his partner to make sure she is dealing fine with her task, make him take a glance at crushed enemies or even make him deal the "mercy blow" to a dying foe.
And speaking of wich, we could easily humanise the enemy forces. We only really see single named foe and collective blob of fighters. Villain could use a leutenant he exchange couple of miscellanous lines with, or even the commanding officer of the fortress. Heck, we can create entire point of view of military commander, from the perspective of wich two vile mercenaries just barged in his fortress and making unreasonable demands. Painting the blob would also make a difference. A bit of paint on the armor here and there, flask on the side, scar on the face. The biggest impact imo would be actually showing fallen enemies on the ground or under the rubble.
And there we have it.
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@kwendy wow, that was a detailed response. I kinda skimmed it but I think I got the gist of it, and I generally agree with all your points. I did read some of the lightnovel and it was written even more poorly than this, so the manga version is actually an upgrade in terms of emotional impact and such. Personally I follow so many manga I'm not invested enough in any particular series to really care about how they could have improved it.
For sure they could have definitely improved this scene, but I also enjoy skipping all the chapters that hype up this moment and just get it over with and let heads roll. My expectations are generally pretty low for most series that I read so I feel like I enjoy them more as a result. I come here because of cute twins, strong mc, cute and strong fmc, so I pretty much enjoy every chapter.
Your critique is great but yeah, I'm guessing you'll be disappointed going forward. Since the little I read of the WN was much worse, maybe that's why my expectations were lower from the start.
For sure they could have definitely improved this scene, but I also enjoy skipping all the chapters that hype up this moment and just get it over with and let heads roll. My expectations are generally pretty low for most series that I read so I feel like I enjoy them more as a result. I come here because of cute twins, strong mc, cute and strong fmc, so I pretty much enjoy every chapter.
Your critique is great but yeah, I'm guessing you'll be disappointed going forward. Since the little I read of the WN was much worse, maybe that's why my expectations were lower from the start.
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@firosahoge Thanks!
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