Shikkaku Mon no Saikyou Kenja - Sekai Saikyou no Kenja ga Sara ni Tsuyoku naru Tame ni Tensei Shimashita - Vol. 11 Ch. 34 - The Strongest Sage, Fight…
- Thread starter MangaDex
- Start date
@Kisato
Ah yes... Cute... Figures...
I understand now why someone like Iris is loved for being "carefree", and Jar Jar isn't...
And not knowing how humans works, (in other words being ignorant) is one thing.
I have never expected someone to know it all and not have 'flaws' as a being.
But with that said, I do believe some flaws are more serious than others, and need to be adressed properly.
Once again, sorry. I just don't find her constantly ruining for her companions and still clearly don't bother to evolve as a person as "cute"...
Ah yes... Cute... Figures...
I understand now why someone like Iris is loved for being "carefree", and Jar Jar isn't...
And not knowing how humans works, (in other words being ignorant) is one thing.
I have never expected someone to know it all and not have 'flaws' as a being.
But with that said, I do believe some flaws are more serious than others, and need to be adressed properly.
Once again, sorry. I just don't find her constantly ruining for her companions and still clearly don't bother to evolve as a person as "cute"...
Dex-chan lover
- Joined
- Mar 6, 2018
- Messages
- 1,655
I wanna see more of the S rank guy
- Joined
- May 27, 2018
- Messages
- 22
@Southpaw Iris is not dumb. She just doesn't care. And the reason for that is, that she's been the apex predator for a few hundred years now.
She doesn't have to care. Even in her human form she can just stand there and take any attack like superman takes trains.
That and the fact that she doesn't care are used for comic relief. I wouldn't say it makes her cute. But it makes her lovable.
(Her banged up dragon self was pretty cute though)
She doesn't have to care. Even in her human form she can just stand there and take any attack like superman takes trains.
That and the fact that she doesn't care are used for comic relief. I wouldn't say it makes her cute. But it makes her lovable.
(Her banged up dragon self was pretty cute though)
@DrNagnorjum
Those traits are not mutually exclusive... One can be dumb and be uncaring...
Which I stated previously. I don't expect everyone to be perfect, but there comes a point in were I believe that issues needs to be adressed.
Her being an Apex predetor is only an excuse for her.
She has companions now... If you reread what I actually wrote, do you honeslty thought I would bother asking people why they loved her, if her "carefree" attitude only affected her?
Ever heard of the word "selfish"?
And I am fine with characters being carefree. However, I do think there comes a point when one can be a little bit too "carefree". So sorry, I don't find people that has clear flawns that affect others, and don't bother to improve on them, to be "lovable"...
Those traits are not mutually exclusive... One can be dumb and be uncaring...
Which I stated previously. I don't expect everyone to be perfect, but there comes a point in were I believe that issues needs to be adressed.
Her being an Apex predetor is only an excuse for her.
She has companions now... If you reread what I actually wrote, do you honeslty thought I would bother asking people why they loved her, if her "carefree" attitude only affected her?
Ever heard of the word "selfish"?
And I am fine with characters being carefree. However, I do think there comes a point when one can be a little bit too "carefree". So sorry, I don't find people that has clear flawns that affect others, and don't bother to improve on them, to be "lovable"...
Fed-Kun's army
- Joined
- Feb 5, 2018
- Messages
- 892
@Southpaw, I understand your point but it simply doesn't apply to Iris. For this one specific reason, she is a dragon.
You may think that this doesn't explain anything but being a dragon excuses a lot of her behaviors. She doesn't usually pay attention to plans because she doesn't need to. Planning and sneaky actions are things humans do because humanity is weak.
Dragons come equipped with all sorts of sensors, their feet and belly can sense the slightest of tremors, they have excellent cat-like hearing, dog-like sense of smell, and can instinctively detect magic.
It's almost impossible to sneak up on a dragon, so why care about subterfuge or meticulous planning?
Iris seems carefree but while she was preocupied with following after the buterfly, she was properly paying attention, which is easily shown in the next page when the topic changes and she immediately starts participating in the conversation.
Borrowing your example from Jar Jar Binks, the reason why Jar Jar Binks is hated and not treated as cute and funny is becuse he is pretty much useless for the most part, also his carelessness did bring them real problems at times. Jar Jar cannot blame anything but himself for his misses, as he is in his natural state, and his problems comes from faults he can easily fix. Lastly Jar Jar Binks is a humanoid, his race ahs the same kinds of problems and strenghts other humanoid races have, including humans. Dragons are completely alien compared to humans, tehy have their own concerns that doesn't correspont to anything a humanoid has.
Iris has her moments but she does her job properly, most of her misses comes from the fact that she is not used to being at human size, she cannot calculate her strenght properly in that body, and her sense of proprtion is drastically affected for looking at things from an angle she is still getting used to.
Not a single one of Iris carefree actions has ever brought any problems to the team. You can use the example of her not noticing her own aura making enemies run from them or more aggressive towards them, but this is not a matter of being carefree as much a she can never notice this kind of thing while staying alone for so long. It's not a matter of picking up on a problem and fixing right away because she's not doing anything wrong.
And while it is true that she is a team now, you have to remember the reason why she had to take human form, it was not for mere convenience or to become a part of the team. If not for the fact that her body is injured in ways she cannot immendiately heal, she would have joined the team on her dragon form, and then no one could criticize her for how she'd behave.
You may think that this doesn't explain anything but being a dragon excuses a lot of her behaviors. She doesn't usually pay attention to plans because she doesn't need to. Planning and sneaky actions are things humans do because humanity is weak.
Dragons come equipped with all sorts of sensors, their feet and belly can sense the slightest of tremors, they have excellent cat-like hearing, dog-like sense of smell, and can instinctively detect magic.
It's almost impossible to sneak up on a dragon, so why care about subterfuge or meticulous planning?
Iris seems carefree but while she was preocupied with following after the buterfly, she was properly paying attention, which is easily shown in the next page when the topic changes and she immediately starts participating in the conversation.
Borrowing your example from Jar Jar Binks, the reason why Jar Jar Binks is hated and not treated as cute and funny is becuse he is pretty much useless for the most part, also his carelessness did bring them real problems at times. Jar Jar cannot blame anything but himself for his misses, as he is in his natural state, and his problems comes from faults he can easily fix. Lastly Jar Jar Binks is a humanoid, his race ahs the same kinds of problems and strenghts other humanoid races have, including humans. Dragons are completely alien compared to humans, tehy have their own concerns that doesn't correspont to anything a humanoid has.
Iris has her moments but she does her job properly, most of her misses comes from the fact that she is not used to being at human size, she cannot calculate her strenght properly in that body, and her sense of proprtion is drastically affected for looking at things from an angle she is still getting used to.
Not a single one of Iris carefree actions has ever brought any problems to the team. You can use the example of her not noticing her own aura making enemies run from them or more aggressive towards them, but this is not a matter of being carefree as much a she can never notice this kind of thing while staying alone for so long. It's not a matter of picking up on a problem and fixing right away because she's not doing anything wrong.
And while it is true that she is a team now, you have to remember the reason why she had to take human form, it was not for mere convenience or to become a part of the team. If not for the fact that her body is injured in ways she cannot immendiately heal, she would have joined the team on her dragon form, and then no one could criticize her for how she'd behave.
One of those guys is going to get their pointy sombrero stuck in a wall.
So what, if you need to take a leak between checkpoints you just have to stand in the path or what? Having a rule like that just screams 'we're trying to hide a big evil mcguffin in these woods!'
So what, if you need to take a leak between checkpoints you just have to stand in the path or what? Having a rule like that just screams 'we're trying to hide a big evil mcguffin in these woods!'
@BloodySorcerer
.. Okey, just for the sake of it.
I completely agree with you on this.
And?
Look, honestly, I do to a major degree, agree with your points.
But once again... Non of it actually address my main issue.
I can't believe I need to repeat this once again, (is it my English that is totally broken or what is going on?!)
I don't mind characters has flaws! I don't mind if they are 'somewhat' carefree!
But like most things in life, there are LIMITS. Keyword here: "Somewhat".
There comes a point were one can be 'too' carefree, and it just comes across as 'gross negligence'. Especially when one does the same mistakes, without bothering to improve.
So let me be absolutly clear right now: I am bothered on the fact that she is "too carefree" (imo).
And yet every respond so far has been about defending her "flaws".....
.. Okey, just for the sake of it.
I completely agree with you on this.
And?
Look, honestly, I do to a major degree, agree with your points.
But once again... Non of it actually address my main issue.
I can't believe I need to repeat this once again, (is it my English that is totally broken or what is going on?!)
I don't mind characters has flaws! I don't mind if they are 'somewhat' carefree!
But like most things in life, there are LIMITS. Keyword here: "Somewhat".
There comes a point were one can be 'too' carefree, and it just comes across as 'gross negligence'. Especially when one does the same mistakes, without bothering to improve.
So let me be absolutly clear right now: I am bothered on the fact that she is "too carefree" (imo).
And yet every respond so far has been about defending her "flaws".....
Ah, whatever. I don't really care about this anymore.
She isn't the worst, I never hated her personally, altough I do find her borderline annoying with how carefree she can be sometimes.
All I wanted to hear was WHY so many people LIKED her specifically. And instead it become about defending her 'honour'... But I guess that one was on me..
Every chapter, the comments are filled with "Iris".. Why?
Well, I guess I will like always, retort to making up hypothesis.
I have some right now at the moment. But if I am correct, I guess I will never know..
She isn't the worst, I never hated her personally, altough I do find her borderline annoying with how carefree she can be sometimes.
All I wanted to hear was WHY so many people LIKED her specifically. And instead it become about defending her 'honour'... But I guess that one was on me..
Every chapter, the comments are filled with "Iris".. Why?
Well, I guess I will like always, retort to making up hypothesis.
I have some right now at the moment. But if I am correct, I guess I will never know..
Active member
- Joined
- Feb 13, 2018
- Messages
- 303
@Southpaw I like Iris because I think she's a pretty good depiction of how a dragon in human form would probably behave. Dragons are extremely arrogant in a passive kind of way. They know they're strong and they know they can just fight their way out of a problem that comes up, so why would they share the same kind of concerns that people do? They consider most of the world not worthy of their interest. I think Iris is a pretty good reflection of that. She's not too dumb to live so much as she's a gremlin because she has no reason not to be. She can do whatever she feels like, and she does. Who is going to stop her? Iris could probably kill every single character, be they demon, monster, or human, we've seen up until this point, with relative ease. The only thing we've seen so far that's actually out of her league is Matthias.
I like her because I feel like she's a pretty good reflection of how a young (for dragons), bored dragon would actually behave.
I like her because I feel like she's a pretty good reflection of how a young (for dragons), bored dragon would actually behave.
Fed-Kun's army
- Joined
- Feb 5, 2018
- Messages
- 892
@Southpaw
" I am bothered on the fact that she is "too carefree" (imo)."
Here's your answer:
"Iris seems carefree but while she was preocupied with following after the buterfly, she was properly paying attention, which is easily shown in the next page, when the topic changes and she immediately starts participating in the conversation."
She is not being too carefree to the point of negligence, she is just choosing to not engage in topics she doesn't care about.
" I am bothered on the fact that she is "too carefree" (imo)."
Here's your answer:
"Iris seems carefree but while she was preocupied with following after the buterfly, she was properly paying attention, which is easily shown in the next page, when the topic changes and she immediately starts participating in the conversation."
She is not being too carefree to the point of negligence, she is just choosing to not engage in topics she doesn't care about.
@Lord-Raine
Thank you for your point of view.
Do I agree with everything you said? Not really.
Am I willing to argue about it? Nah.
But I can agree with a lot of it.
However, even if I for the sake of it, would agree with everything you just wrote. I still find it to be lacking as an explanation.
But thank you non the less.
Thank you for your point of view.
Do I agree with everything you said? Not really.
Am I willing to argue about it? Nah.
But I can agree with a lot of it.
However, even if I for the sake of it, would agree with everything you just wrote. I still find it to be lacking as an explanation.
But thank you non the less.
@BloodySorcerer
That is not really what happened.. The scene was cut, and a new one began where they arrived at the new checkpoint..
There wasn't a "new conversation" in which she participating in...
You copy and pasting your own comment doesn't make it more so.....
But sure, once again.. Just for the simpicity.. Lets say that your version did happen.
And!?
Do you not understand the concept of "too"?
I don't even think you understand the concept of 'gross negligence'...
Must I perhaps explain to you how your point of view is way to simplistic?
That is not really what happened.. The scene was cut, and a new one began where they arrived at the new checkpoint..
There wasn't a "new conversation" in which she participating in...
You copy and pasting your own comment doesn't make it more so.....
But sure, once again.. Just for the simpicity.. Lets say that your version did happen.
And!?
Do you not understand the concept of "too"?
I don't even think you understand the concept of 'gross negligence'...
Must I perhaps explain to you how your point of view is way to simplistic?
Fed-Kun's army
- Joined
- Feb 5, 2018
- Messages
- 892
@Southpaw "But sure, once again.. Just for the simpicity.. Lets say that your version did happen. "
It's literally what happened, the scene wasn't really cut as much as they were talking as they moved about. It's easy to see from the whole scene(including the pages before) that Iris was indeed paying attention up until the other girls asked about an explanation on what Mathias was saying about the pass. It was then that Iris left. Easy to see that she was bored with a conversation she didn't enjoy, and was instead interested in the buterfly. Why is this behavior acceptable? THe reasoning lies below. In my next answer.
"I don't even think you understand the concept of 'gross negligence'..."
No, I don't think that YOU do.
Gross Negligence can only happen when someone doesn't fulfill their responsibilities with due commitment, which may result in problems.
Which is not the case, was never the case with Iris. It's not her responsibility to formulate plans, or be involved in more complex actions. She is the powerhouse of the group, her only responsibility lies in destroying whatever it is that Mathias tells her to and fight enemies head on, and not once did she fail to do exactly that.
To put things in perspective let us convert the scene to D&D. IN place of Iris we'll have a FIghter, in Place of Mathias we'll have a Mystic Theurge(a Prestige class between mage and cleric), and instead of Ruri and Alma, we'll have a Rogue and a Ranger both trying to Multiclass with Wizard. The Mystic, Fighter, Rogue and Ranger go through the checkpoint, the Mystic starts talking about the pass they received at checkpoint, the Rogue and Ranger, who are learning magic from the Mystic ask more details to the Mystic.
Do you really think the Warrior, the only one on the team who doesn't care about the minute details on magic, would remain in the conversation?
He knows the pass is enchanted and my cause problems, he heard about the spell, and thats ok for him, why should he be there to listen how the spell is formed if he'll never be able to use it and no one expects him to?
Also Mathias doesn't have to explain anything to her because she has centuries of experiences of her own, fighting demons, humans or whatever threat to her territory.
Which is why she has more freedom to do what she wants. Unlike the other two who are essentially Mathias apprentices.
The reason why she is likeable is the contrast between her actions and her actual performance, she acts curious and childish because everything she is currently experiencing is new to her, but she is extremely dependable when need be. She's earned her carefree atitude.
It's literally what happened, the scene wasn't really cut as much as they were talking as they moved about. It's easy to see from the whole scene(including the pages before) that Iris was indeed paying attention up until the other girls asked about an explanation on what Mathias was saying about the pass. It was then that Iris left. Easy to see that she was bored with a conversation she didn't enjoy, and was instead interested in the buterfly. Why is this behavior acceptable? THe reasoning lies below. In my next answer.
"I don't even think you understand the concept of 'gross negligence'..."
No, I don't think that YOU do.
Gross Negligence can only happen when someone doesn't fulfill their responsibilities with due commitment, which may result in problems.
Which is not the case, was never the case with Iris. It's not her responsibility to formulate plans, or be involved in more complex actions. She is the powerhouse of the group, her only responsibility lies in destroying whatever it is that Mathias tells her to and fight enemies head on, and not once did she fail to do exactly that.
To put things in perspective let us convert the scene to D&D. IN place of Iris we'll have a FIghter, in Place of Mathias we'll have a Mystic Theurge(a Prestige class between mage and cleric), and instead of Ruri and Alma, we'll have a Rogue and a Ranger both trying to Multiclass with Wizard. The Mystic, Fighter, Rogue and Ranger go through the checkpoint, the Mystic starts talking about the pass they received at checkpoint, the Rogue and Ranger, who are learning magic from the Mystic ask more details to the Mystic.
Do you really think the Warrior, the only one on the team who doesn't care about the minute details on magic, would remain in the conversation?
He knows the pass is enchanted and my cause problems, he heard about the spell, and thats ok for him, why should he be there to listen how the spell is formed if he'll never be able to use it and no one expects him to?
Also Mathias doesn't have to explain anything to her because she has centuries of experiences of her own, fighting demons, humans or whatever threat to her territory.
Which is why she has more freedom to do what she wants. Unlike the other two who are essentially Mathias apprentices.
The reason why she is likeable is the contrast between her actions and her actual performance, she acts curious and childish because everything she is currently experiencing is new to her, but she is extremely dependable when need be. She's earned her carefree atitude.
@BloodySorcerer
.... Dude, are you for real?
Page 51 ends with (I assume Mathias because it fades out) tells them "Alright! Let's head to the second checkpoint".
And the next page has literal title card stating that they arrived at the next checkpoint...
That is by all means is a change of scene....
This is one of the most 'dead on the nose' the changing of a scene.......
And taken from Sawayalaw:
Chapter 26.2, 'Held Hostage Part 2':
Mathias: "Go easy on them"
Iris: "Okey".
Meanwhile let me REV up that arm and charge towards them with a 'DEADPAN' look....
Mathias: "Iris......"
Sure, they were thugs. But this still by all means falls under the term of 'gross negligence'.
And it is things like these that make me say that she is acting "too carefree". Because this is how she is actually depicted.... In which therefore ""pointing out a scenario where she was paying attention"" doesn't change the overrall depection of her.
Oh, and also.
.... Dude, are you for real?
Page 51 ends with (I assume Mathias because it fades out) tells them "Alright! Let's head to the second checkpoint".
And the next page has literal title card stating that they arrived at the next checkpoint...
That is by all means is a change of scene....
This is one of the most 'dead on the nose' the changing of a scene.......
And taken from Sawayalaw:
"Extreme indifference" or "reckless disregard for the safty of others"..
Chapter 26.2, 'Held Hostage Part 2':
Mathias: "Go easy on them"
Iris: "Okey".
Meanwhile let me REV up that arm and charge towards them with a 'DEADPAN' look....
Mathias: "Iris......"
Sure, they were thugs. But this still by all means falls under the term of 'gross negligence'.
And it is things like these that make me say that she is acting "too carefree". Because this is how she is actually depicted.... In which therefore ""pointing out a scenario where she was paying attention"" doesn't change the overrall depection of her.
Oh, and also.
Yes, because I am sure the century old dragon has never seen butterflies before. But have been sure to have had a lot of conversations....
Similar threads
