Until I Become Me - Ch. 67

[Thrembs]

Akira switches between pronouns herself. And when the bullying was happening she fully considered herself a boy. Even now, she hasn't fully committed to a gender yet. The title is "Until I (ore) Become me (watashi)". That level of aggression from you is completely uncalled for given such a nuanced situation. The person you replied to clearly didn't mean to misgender anyone intentionally as a sign of disrespect or otherwise. What's gross here is your holier than thou act.

Well, here’s another for the “ignore” pile.
”until” means it will happen.
The only time “俺” is used is internally, so that’s what’s going to change.

I know what the title is. That’s why mentioned the title. Because that’s what the title means.

 

[luigui1966]

Omg finally let’s go, thank you for the translation!

 

[TheLostLight]

Well, here’s another for the “ignore” pile.
”until” means it will happen.
The only time “俺” is used is internally, so that’s what’s going to change.

I know what the title is. That’s why mentioned the title. Because that’s what the title means.

Aside from being wrong ("until" doesn't logically imply that something it will happen. It only places a conditional on the antecedent if the precedent were to occur) what's your point? You said it yourself: Akira still uses 俺 internally. In many ways, Akira still considers themselves as a boy. I could just as easily make the argument that you are the one misgendering Akira by denying Akira's preferred pronouns in preference to your anticipated conclusion of the story, but I wouldn't because squabbling about this is pointless. The only reason you brought this up was so that you could feel better about yourself by putting other people down. Please log off and spend some time in the real world.

 

[Lunkli]

"I can think of it as a punishment for the bad things I've done."

Yeah, cause you totally don't love this at all. Totally didn't give you the chance to start over and become a better person or anything. Not at all.

 

[StormSen]

Sittin there with THAT user name, misgendering a character in a manga where the very title is explicitly about changing pronouns.
Gross.

@TheLostLight put it rather strongly, but is correct that the MC still regularly wobbles between male and female pronouns for herself. I regard her as female, but she is clearly unsure, so it doesn't make sense to censure another poster for pronoun usage on this.

I'm semi-frequent in disagreeing with people on various threads here, but I do appreciate hearing from people whom I disagree with (e.g. on "The Guy She Was Interested In.." threads). Something that I disagree with today, might be something that I accept later.

 

[rotationplus]

I guess this is the vibe equivalent of talking to someone who hates the label of being trans and just wants to be seen as "normal" as someone who is happy with the label, it's hard to be happy about yourself when others like you see it as a curse sometimes (in this case it's totally more understable, one being happy now gender wise not being able to talk since the other person is still internally a guy)

Shouji's an AMAB transmasc and Akira's an AMAB cisfem.

Shouji has to fight the world's feminizing pressure for his masculinity and Akira has to fight the masculinizing pressure from her formative childhood for her femininity.

Shouji was cursed and Akira was blessed, but both will always be have to face dysphoric feelings from their gender situations.

So yeah I think your comparison to trans people who wish they were born assigned to their gender and trans people who enjoy being trans is reality's closest thing to this situation. Nice job.

 

[rotationplus]

The author really drags the final steps out. Akira has adapted to being female, chooses to present as female (even resisting attempts by her mother to keep presenting as male). Moreover her personality is female. IMO given her mental state, she would have resolved the male/female question years ago. But the author keeps dragging it out.

VS every other GS story I read, where "I'm a girl!" lasts about two pages, and then it's off to the rest of the isekai, power fantasy, etc. (Yes, I know different story style, but the contrast is striking.) (Okay, not "every other," e.g. GS Gyaru.)

I forget, but Akira is having periods now, right? If so, then she's fully functionally female. Although, there should be a question about chromosomes. But that has not been addressed in this magical "medical" sex change story. But assuming that's (somehow) not an issue, then she's good to go as fully functional female.

Shouji OTOH is in more difficult situation... He hasn't adjusted, and so likely has a long and difficult road ahead.

Periods aren't a sign that she's "functionally female". They are a sign that someone has good reproductive health. both female the sex and female the gender are completely distinct human features from menstrual status.

I assume "good to go" is talking about reproductive capabilities, in which case the question about chromosomes is largely irrelevant.

Genetics are just a blueprint, not the actual thing. Geneticists can't even fully read that blueprint because they don't fully understand. What complicates it even more is that our bodies sometimes don't even follow that blueprint, for example there might be multiple blueprints in the first place and the body just happens to pick one of them (Basic biology is basic and not the standard of care).

Anyway, reproductive health can only be confirmed and understood if you studied all of things reproductive doctors do and know how to use it practically, or if you go to a reproductive health doctor to get check-ups.

Again, all of this is only about reproductive health, and nothing about the status of someone's gender and sex.


PS: it sure is wild that we use the same words for sex, an identifier, and gender, an identity.

PPS: sex identifies the probable contents of a body, which includes all the biological things, like the reproductive things, but also the brain's psychological gender identity. Sex is such a broad thing that it's not useful at all except in a generalized situation.

 

[StormSen]

I assume "good to go" is talking about reproductive capabilities, in which case the question about chromosomes is largely irrelevant.

My point about chromosomes is: female is XX, male is XY. But suppose that Akira is producing eggs, but has her original XY chromosomes, then there would be a 25% chance of a YY offspring, which would likely produce some major genetic problems. (There are XYY babies, but my 10 second search found no mention of YY babies, which isn't surprising.) (That's assuming that an egg with just a Y chromosome would work correctly to function as a viable egg.)

 

[rotationplus]

@TheLostLight put it rather strongly, but is correct that the MC still regularly wobbles between male and female pronouns for herself. I regard her as female, but she is clearly unsure, so it doesn't make sense to censure another poster for pronoun usage on this.

I'm semi-frequent in disagreeing with people on various threads here, but I do appreciate hearing from people whom I disagree with (e.g. on "The Guy She Was Interested In.." threads). Something that I disagree with today, might be something that I accept later.

I don't really think the wobbly Japanese self-pronouns really imply she's wobbly about her gender identity. The wobblies are from her not feeling worthy of being a girl due to her past, and due to the gender environment of the society she lives in.

She clearly wants to be a girl (she has expressed desire for being assigned female in the first place, and she pushes back against her mom and others when they try to help her stay masculine or assume she still is), and that is the definition of being a girl.

I would say to use the pronouns that affirm her gender because that is how the character is written.

---

@Thrembs was a bit rude, but it is quite very irritating if someone is willfully ignorant about an aspect of a story that real people like me identify with; however I think they are quick to assume that @yuriloveisthebestlove was willfully ignorant in the first place. It is understandable to do so, in such a grating situation the world is in regarding the popularity of hateful rhetoric, but it isn't really constructive or, more importantly, healthy to take it out on Internet forums. Whatever chance of persuasion existed, even though it's probably low, is lost when a person doubles down after being antagonized. And even if it isn't the deciding factor, it could contribute to a future where the person does agree. While you still have to be confrontational to a person you try to persuade, you need them to be as rational as possible to reach the goal to have them listen to and understand you.

 

[Edvoidity]

Try "Uesugi-kun wa Onnanoko wo Yametai". It's is peak

Already did, I'm pretty sure I read almost every genderbender from 4 years till now, so the crave is real. Series is peak tho, up there with Onimai.

Just read a series called "Mr Magical Girl" focus isn't genderbender but it's still pretty good

 

[rotationplus]

My point about chromosomes is: female is XX, male is XY. But suppose that Akira is producing eggs, but has her original XY chromosomes, then there would be a 25% chance of a YY offspring, which would likely produce some major genetic problems. (There are XYY babies, but my 10 second search found no mention of YY babies, which isn't surprising.) (That's assuming that an egg with just a Y chromosome would work correctly to function as a viable egg.)

if you're willing to, watch this video where Hank Green explains my own point of chromosomes being not effective to identify sex.
YouTube Video

 

[Kanade0021]

Thanks for the translation!

 

[StormSen]

I don't really think the wobbly Japanese self-pronouns really imply she's wobbly about her gender identity. The wobblies are from her not feeling worthy of being a girl due to her past, and due to the gender environment of the society she lives in.

Discarding the MC's JP pronoun use is absurd. The pronoun switching is repeated and consistent. It's clearly something that she (IMO) is undecided on. It's in the title of the manga. It can't be clearer than that.

if you're willing to, watch this video where Hank Green explains my own point of chromosomes being not effective to identify sex.
YouTube Video

You're so focused on the sex issue here that you missed my point. (Or else you understood the point, but ignored it and focused on the sex issue instead.)

 

[Monstrengo]

Shouji's an AMAB transmasc and Akira's an AMAB cisfem.

I would say that how old they were when they got the disease was an important factor. Akira was in second grade (around 7), Shouji however, was in sixth (I assume then that Shouji was either 11 or 12). One was more mature than the other (their friend groups were also at different levels of emotional and mental development - let's cautiously recall how Akira's friends reacted to her change and compare it to the behavior of Shouji's friends). Akira felt forced to become more like a girl in order to "survive" and then learned to like it, but Shouji has different motivations.

Either way, we get to see another victim of Idiopatic Sex Change Syndrome (wonder if it's called ISCS). I'm left wondering how many others have had the disease (I'm guessing just a few hundred; Shouji is only aware of one other person). I do hope that Akira meets the others without fear of showing her face.

Regarding Nana - I still think that Nana actually regrets not helping Akira out, and when she returns to the story, she will apologize or give Akira a big ol' hug.

I find it curious that Akira's mom is watching a program about a Kuga-San and a tale of recovery. It leads me to suspect that Akira might appear on that show...

I used to think that Akira might end up as a fashion model, but after reading this chapter, she might actually become a therapist. Possibly both. But I've been wrong before.

 

[ErikTheRed]

I would say that how old they were when they got the disease was an important factor. Akira was in second grade (around 7), Shouji however, was in sixth (I assume then that Shouji was either 11 or 12). One was more mature than the other (their friend groups were also at different levels of emotional and mental development - let's cautiously recall how Akira's friends reacted to her change and compare it to the behavior of Shouji's friends). Akira felt forced to become more like a girl in order to "survive" and then learned to like it, but Shouji has different motivations.

In addition to the above, given that large parts of what the public associates with gender and sex are learnt behaviors, Shouji also had more time to self-identify to a male gender and has more behaviors/norms att odds with the new physical reality.

 

[Thrembs]

@TheLostLight put it rather strongly, but is correct that the MC still regularly wobbles between male and female pronouns for herself. I regard her as female, but she is clearly unsure, so it doesn't make sense to censure another poster for pronoun usage on this.

I'm semi-frequent in disagreeing with people on various threads here, but I do appreciate hearing from people whom I disagree with (e.g. on "The Guy She Was Interested In.." threads). Something that I disagree with today, might be something that I accept later.

 

[ArchivistAlex98]

Really with how this story tends to drag developments out it's possible that any confrontation realistically ends up being so much later that she should be the only one still hung up on it.

Also, kind of feel the desire to point out that they genuinely did infinitely worse to her than she did to them. Her whole damn psychology as a character is built around that one moment where they harassed her meanwhile they should have all moved on by now.

Then again this is manga. Where some random thing you did in second grade can follow you nearly into adulthood. So. anything could happen.

 

[romie68]

Sittin there with THAT user name, misgendering a character in a manga where the very title is explicitly about changing pronouns.
Gross.

They’re fictional characters homeboy chill out

 

[Hakurei06]

Wait Shouji only knows of some guy in their twenties? Wasn’t there something about a new school for genderqueer students that Akira turned down? IIRC the teacher or counselor mentioned that there were several students with Akira’s condition who were applying to it.

 

[Alethiolet]

Wow.
This is wild.

A “magical gender“ thing where the character just says “Nuh-uh.” and forces life back into shape.
Akira is like a sidelong almost-trans narrative.
Shouji it like an inverted one. I‘m too tired to make a deep comparison.

Point is that I want more shouji.

If you want more like Shouji, I'd suggest checking out Watashitachi wa Moto Joshi desu. The main character in that is a girl who gets genderswapped who tries her best to transition back.