Usotsuki Satsuki wa Shi ga Mieru - Vol. 8 Ch. 75 - Adoration

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Also, on the note of the police: they better be there next chapter. Even if they've already called the police at that point (and someone better have), chances are they'd still be en route so I can give a slight pass for them not being there just yet. I can see the VP not mentioning the murder or Seo in her dismissal speech so that the students wouldn't panic, which would be a dead giveaway to Seo and spur her to act. If Satsuki is at the center of a big scene in the gym it's fair to assume she's seeing premonitory corpses there, so top priority is to foil the plan.

They have multiple witnesses to Seo stabbing the president though, namely Satsuki and the VP. And she dropped the crafting knife (which she held without gloves, so fingerprints are on it) by the body, so there's physical evidence alongside witness testimony. Stabbing the president was a spur-of-the-moment thing, but the rest of the mass murders are just kinda weird to me.
 
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Reading the comments here is kinda frustrating. I don't think the manga was ever portraying Kai as an outright villain OR trying to "vindicate" him in death and portray him as "right." I don't think it's trying to portray either of them as specifically "right," though I do agree his approach is a bit more "wrong" than Satsuki's.

His main role was showing the multiple perspectives to the ability to see premonitory corpses. Satsuki has a pathological need to save people thanks to the trauma with her mother, so she focuses mostly on the "situation": how they die, and how to prevent the death. The corpses only show up 24 hours in advance at most though, so she's basically living in the moment and acting with a constant sense of urgency.

Kai however didn't have that need, and thus was able to analyze the situation and the overall ability from a less emotional standpoint. Compared to Satsuki, he DID focus more on helping the living, because he looked at how to improve the situation overall to try to prevent those corpses from appearing altogether. Don't agree with him murdering people to do it, but that particular method also came from trauma: he saw Saijou (vice pres) being bullied by their teacher, and with that power balance, he couldn't think of any way to save her than to remove the teacher from the picture. Given the fact that first murder saved her, Saijou naturally saw it as "right" and fed into that view as they got older.

One other key aspect of his viewpoint though: he thought messing with "fate" can have consequences. He outright told Satsuki that he'd seen a lot more premonitory corpses since she enrolled and that he thought "fate is looking for another death" to replace the lives she'd saved. And honestly? I think his theory might be right. His approach of killing off an "evil" person to keep it balanced is still pretty wrong, but... It IS weird how many deaths Satsuki has seen in the span of this manga. It's not just a case of a story being more eventful than reality: Satsuki saw her first premonitory corpse in third grade, and then five years later saw her mother's. So she'd had the ability for at LEAST five years without seeing a premonitory corpse, while in the span of this manga she's seen dozens.

Basically, the situation is more nuanced than one person being totally right or wrong. They're both right and wrong, just in different areas. While he and the vice president are wrong for justifying murdering people, they're right to focus on preventing the corpses from appearing in the first place by improving the overall environment. We automatically think of Satsuki as "right" because saving people is generally morally upright, but she's reactionary and only acts once she sees corpses. She doesn't really think to look at the larger picture unless she sees that person die again, which can have nasty long-term consequences if it's not a one-off incident, and struggles at how to help people outside of literally saving their lives.

One more thing: all the characters are right when they say that Satsuki is saving people so she won't feel guilty. She doesn't realize it because saving people IS inherently good, so it's hard to call it "selfish," but her motive does ultimately stem from her guilt more than altruism. And we've seen how that can make her tear herself apart even more when she fails, girl's living on the edge of a breakdown at all times.
Thank you. I swear it feels like the people here just have a hate boner for the president and see him as the bad guy because he killed people, completely ignoring why, and how he went about it. Not to mention if he was right about stopping premonitory corpses from happening, leading to worse outcomes in the end, then what Satsuki is doing, is actively harmful.

They talk about the emo girl who died due to the presidents plan, but they ignore the fact that if his theory is right, then that was lead up to by Satsuki's actions. Dying by lightning strike is such a rare and unlikely thing to happen, but it was made possible because of all the other deaths that were prevented before.

It genuinely just feels like people are mad that their cute GL story with some stakes was interrupted by the Prez pointing out the issues with Satsuki's way of thinking and her self-destructive behaviour, combined with him killing the emo girl, and his smug behaviour, and they all together culminated in people just shitting on him relentlessly.
 
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So, I couldn't even take this chapter seriously because it's more evident they just left his body in the dang classroom and like not even the vice president told a teacher that he's dead. No one would be going to the gym if they knew a student just died because of a stabbing
 
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If Satsuki is at the center of a big scene in the gym it's fair to assume she's seeing premonitory corpses there, so top priority is to foil the plan.
Ah, good point! That's a possibility.

Stabbing the president was a spur-of-the-moment thing, but the rest of the mass murders are just kinda weird to me.
This has been eluding me, too. Yeah, she's planned mass murder in at least two locations and had Komachi's help. But why? Wouldn't one explosion be enough? Page 20 doesn't seem convincing on its own. There's a wide gap which should've been filled before this arc, to actually give all of this some purpose, so that reading through these chapters every 2 weeks wouldn't be so frustrating.
 
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Why tf is the police not there yet? What about an ambulance. Why is Seo still running around?
A student was stabbed in the school, other students saw it happen, and the bitch is still walking around? That makes no sense to me.
 
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“Kai never made the ‘right thing’ into the excuse” yeah cuz he killed for pleasure dude is a literal psychopath. He was like “doesn’t matter why I kill em”.

Also, how out of touch do you have to be to think someone (Satsuki) trying to save someone else is performative. You’re allowed to care about other people besides yourself and the guy you like (and by like, I mean idolize and have a very abnormal attachment to).

Also, “Kai isn’t here anymore”. Like yeah babe, thats how death works. That thing you’re feeling? That’s what Satsuki has been trying to prevent.

Anyways, all in all, there is no right answer to the trolley problem, but there is a wrong answer. The wrong answer is thinking your answer is right and believing that you have the moral high ground. Telling Satsuki off bc she wants to try to save all the lives when you’d rather trade one life for several is the wrong answer. The whole issue with the trolley problem and similar situations is that you have to choose to dies. Satsuki is trying to derail the trolley and jump off just in time so that no one dies. There’s no issue in terms of the morals there. (When consequences of her actions come into play, that’s different…)

Lastly, please, for the love of god, see a therapist or something!! Christ girl, a guy killed for you and now you’re assisting him in murders. Where are your critical thinking skills? No, fuck it. Where are your basic thinking skills? They died with that teacher of yours, huh? Damn shawty your trauma is more complex than [something really complex maybe math idk]. Killing is bad girl. (There are exceptions, but we don’t talk about exceptions till you understand the basics). Just because murder was right one time doesn’t mean it’s okay. Just bc Kai says killing is fine doesn’t mean it’s fine. If Kai jumps off a bridge would you- ok thats a pointless question, of course you would. You’re a fucking piece of work babe. I need this girl in therapy asap.
 
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Anyways, all in all, there is no right answer to the trolley problem, but there is a wrong answer. The wrong answer is thinking your answer is right and believing that you have the moral high ground. Telling Satsuki off bc she wants to try to save all the lives when you’d rather trade one life for several is the wrong answer. The whole issue with the trolley problem and similar situations is that you have to choose to dies. Satsuki is trying to derail the trolley and jump off just in time so that no one dies. There’s no issue in terms of the morals there. (When consequences of her actions come into play, that’s different…)
It's not that simple. First, the consequences of her trying to derail the trolley cannot be set aside as "different" so as to purge any moral issue. Imagine picking either fork and dismissing any death just the same: to me, it should feel just as wrong. And that's because, secondly, derailing it wouldn't be an issue if there were no passengers in it, or anybody else in the vicinity, and here's the problem: by derailing the trolley to avoid what is fate-bound, she's endangering the passengers (all those people she's saved and joined her) and some more (Prez, potentially VP, all the random casualties in classroom and gym). Like someone here pointed out, what Prez said about Death demanding payback for saving that many people might be true, or perhaps it's mere cause and effect branching off beyond our understanding; anyhow, she fucked up. There is no right answer to the trolley problem because it's a rigged game: whatever you choose, you are wrong. The key takeaway is understanding the folly that you've committed, instead of hiding behind false morals, and whether you can live with it. If anything, Satsuki as a narrator regrets saving Komachi at the end of Chapter 1, so her future self may have absorbed this much.
 
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It's not that simple. First, the consequences of her trying to derail the trolley cannot be set aside as "different" so as to purge any moral issue. Imagine picking either fork and dismissing any death just the same: to me, it should feel just as wrong. And that's because, secondly, derailing it wouldn't be an issue if there were no passengers in it, or anybody else in the vicinity, and here's the problem: by derailing the trolley to avoid what is fate-bound, she's endangering the passengers (all those people she's saved and joined her) and some more (Prez, potentially VP, all the random casualties in classroom and gym). Like someone here pointed out, what Prez said about Death demanding payback for saving that many people might be true, or perhaps it's mere cause and effect branching off beyond our understanding; anyhow, she fucked up. There is no right answer to the trolley problem because it's a rigged game: whatever you choose, you are wrong. The key takeaway is understanding the folly that you've committed, instead of hiding behind false morals, and whether you can live with it. If anything, Satsuki as a narrator regrets saving Komachi at the end of Chapter 1, so her future self may have absorbed this much.
That’s a very good point actually. I didn’t think of it that way. I was gonna point out that there could be others on the trolley or people standing by but I felt like that would add a lot and I didn’t wanna blab on and on.
 
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I'm still stuck on Komachi. She really is just like a lifeless doll for anyone to control. Satsuki, Seo, even Prez at one point. Despite all that I feel there's something darker lurking underneath, like she's the real antagonist of this series
 
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Didn't Kai get stabbed, like THIRTY MINUTES AGO AT THIS POINT? ISN'T HE STILL BLEEDING OUT IN THAT CLASSROOM? Why is no one doing anything, why isn't the whole school dismissed because there was a murder??? WHAT DO YOU MEAN HE'S NOT ANYWHERE. BRO HE GOT STABBED WITH A BOX CUTTER THROUGH A UNIFORM, IF HE GETS HELP HE'LL BE FINE.
 
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i feel like if kai went after shitty adults like the first one, he wouldn't be perceived so badly, but he's going after teenagers. also its kinda crazy how the manga hasn't really bought up that everyone is a fuckin teenager barring the science teacher. can't imagine the stress some kid would be going through if they constantly saw dead bodies every day. or even being friends with a kid who can
 

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