5Toubun no Hanayome - Vol. 11 Ch. 93 - Tsun-dere-tsun
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@dube my problem is more that people still are doing it with Ichika even though that already passed and she regret it, but they forgave Nino which made something worse. Both did it, but only one continues to get those comments.
And it's not like I dislike Nino. She's my favorite along Ichika. It's just that it's like what I said before.
And it's not like I dislike Nino. She's my favorite along Ichika. It's just that it's like what I said before.
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@miyako19 is right about how it should be " Good couple complement each other." not "they are alike" as the latter doesn't guarantee anything but the reader being right if two people are "alike."
And I'm with @Kent12121 about how people treat different heroines differently. Some people forgiving one over the other. It bothers me, and I'd assume should bother others, either way. To me, the antics of this episode with Nino represents the issue I've had in many romcoms with tsundere characters, where their hostility, act or not, isn't taken seriously. Yes, some people are hostile, but the ones in a good number of series shouldn't be laughed off with a "I didn't do or say anything harsh." Looking at you, shahzehan, who dared call Yotsuba a coward, when you can also call Nino an aggressivebitch tsundere. Also, Itsuki has been better treated in that... maybe she doesn't have feelings. If she did, author chose for her not to be invasive as Ichika or Nino have been. Nino hasn't learnt a shred of anything from her aggressive attitude, and some people may like that, but I find that immaturity to not be worth Fuutaro's time. Let me add that the two are not alike, since switching their places wouldn't lead to a similar scenario happening.
I am certainly glad to see Nino getting a chapter, even if she is my second least favourite heroine.
And I'm with @Kent12121 about how people treat different heroines differently. Some people forgiving one over the other. It bothers me, and I'd assume should bother others, either way. To me, the antics of this episode with Nino represents the issue I've had in many romcoms with tsundere characters, where their hostility, act or not, isn't taken seriously. Yes, some people are hostile, but the ones in a good number of series shouldn't be laughed off with a "I didn't do or say anything harsh." Looking at you, shahzehan, who dared call Yotsuba a coward, when you can also call Nino an aggressive
I am certainly glad to see Nino getting a chapter, even if she is my second least favourite heroine.
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@McLXIX Coincidence or not, the father has entered the scene for other twins too. As a result, as much it may be some sign, it's a weak sign imo.
As for the signs of attraction, Fuutaro has been more romantic sensitive because of Nino, yes. But I take it it's less Nino-only but more that he notices at least two of the Quints is in love with him (the other being Miku). As someone who has claimed times before of his lack of understanding girls and romance, he's taking the best approach he knows of: from the book. But even he realizes he needs to stop that. Hence point 1 is null.
Point 2, he is under the assumption that Nino is in love with him; as mentioned above, he's trying to get the grasp of romantic notions. Of course he is going to be bothered by the change in tone, as if someone had told him a lie. He's using the "lessons" as a guideline because he's still learning the ropes, so him using them is like using formulas from a textbook when doing some problem solving. Point 3 hence does not hold ground.
We are much aware that Fuutaro is taking notice of the Quints beyond being just girls, especially for those he has become aware because of confessions. Wouldn't you feel taken aback when a beautiful/handsome model gives you the "don't touch me" response?
Point 5 is you taking a coincidence for a fact. He thought of the Quints, and thought about giving flowers. However, as he says in the chapter, he doesn't want to be present. Therefore, he gives it to whoever he meets next, which happens to be Nino. It's a nice notion that he at least sees Nino approachable enough, but I don't think it was in his mind to appeal to her "you liked your mother" side.
Fuutaro may be blunt, and he's trying to learn romantic "language," but he is still clueless about a lot of things. If anything in honesty, I don't find his question of "Didn't you actually come to hate me" to be anything more than an honest question he never had the chance to ask. He's seeing Nino's love for him out of analysis, nothing personal yet, which is why he asks about her when she "come to hate him again" because of his past trauma of being hated by her. It bites her in the ass that she disregards how harsh she had been. I also wish to add that seeing his response in a black-white way (reject = hate, all other = love) is terrible, since you can consider that any person would not like to be hated, especially with Fuutaro who wants to get along with all the Quints, knowing in most cases they want to operate together.
Undeniably his small blush may be a hint that he seeks more than "be friendly," but as we may know, if he aint used to the affection, he's going to blush. It makes him out to being a bit green, but he is. He hasn't experienced romance as much. But to treat it in absolutes, once again, just causes exaggerations.
Placed this ins a separate response for the good sake of length.
As for the signs of attraction, Fuutaro has been more romantic sensitive because of Nino, yes. But I take it it's less Nino-only but more that he notices at least two of the Quints is in love with him (the other being Miku). As someone who has claimed times before of his lack of understanding girls and romance, he's taking the best approach he knows of: from the book. But even he realizes he needs to stop that. Hence point 1 is null.
Point 2, he is under the assumption that Nino is in love with him; as mentioned above, he's trying to get the grasp of romantic notions. Of course he is going to be bothered by the change in tone, as if someone had told him a lie. He's using the "lessons" as a guideline because he's still learning the ropes, so him using them is like using formulas from a textbook when doing some problem solving. Point 3 hence does not hold ground.
We are much aware that Fuutaro is taking notice of the Quints beyond being just girls, especially for those he has become aware because of confessions. Wouldn't you feel taken aback when a beautiful/handsome model gives you the "don't touch me" response?
Point 5 is you taking a coincidence for a fact. He thought of the Quints, and thought about giving flowers. However, as he says in the chapter, he doesn't want to be present. Therefore, he gives it to whoever he meets next, which happens to be Nino. It's a nice notion that he at least sees Nino approachable enough, but I don't think it was in his mind to appeal to her "you liked your mother" side.
Fuutaro may be blunt, and he's trying to learn romantic "language," but he is still clueless about a lot of things. If anything in honesty, I don't find his question of "Didn't you actually come to hate me" to be anything more than an honest question he never had the chance to ask. He's seeing Nino's love for him out of analysis, nothing personal yet, which is why he asks about her when she "come to hate him again" because of his past trauma of being hated by her. It bites her in the ass that she disregards how harsh she had been. I also wish to add that seeing his response in a black-white way (reject = hate, all other = love) is terrible, since you can consider that any person would not like to be hated, especially with Fuutaro who wants to get along with all the Quints, knowing in most cases they want to operate together.
Undeniably his small blush may be a hint that he seeks more than "be friendly," but as we may know, if he aint used to the affection, he's going to blush. It makes him out to being a bit green, but he is. He hasn't experienced romance as much. But to treat it in absolutes, once again, just causes exaggerations.
Placed this ins a separate response for the good sake of length.
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@GreenMoriyama
Excellent points.
@Kent12121
I wouldn't sweat it. What happened with Ichika is rather recent and since then she's been quiet so people are left with feelings and opinion of last deed done by her. People's views will change as her story continues. I mean... in case people forgot, Nino drugged Fuu... twice!!... and I forgot if I read the comments after the first or second drugging... people were wanting her to die. TO.... DIE!! 😲Now she's best girl lol.
Did Ichika sabotage all of Mikus baked goods or poison them?? Did she tie Miku up? Trip her to break her leg to keep from going on the trip??
No... She disguised herself as Miku a couple of times and told a lie. She used something that they are so use to doing usually to help each other and she used it to try and get an edge over Miku and the others. Was she in the wrong? Sure. And she apologized to all her sisters and especially, tearfully, to Miku and Miku forgave her with an understanding comment of "Love hurts. doesn't it?" Nino even said, after herself lunging at Fuu at the end of the arc unable to watch him and Miku together, if circumstances were different they may be in switched positions.
From Chapter 1, it was Itchika that first noticed Miku's interest in Fuu... and it was Itchika that would try to get Miku to act or do what she could to encourage them and at the same time try to get out of her way and try not to feel anything even though Fuu and Ichika kept having their moments... The Festival/Fireworks from first arc, the test of courage and realizing that Fuu was the boy she said she fell in love with in Kyoto 5 years ago, being stuck in the storage building and the bonfire dance, the chapter where Ichika is doing scenes at the bakery and ends with Fuu praising Ichika while she slept on his shoulder... oh my gosh they had so many moments together. From the very beginning it was her intention of supporting Miku and not get in the way fighting impulses and feelings through many of those moments... but she's a young girl in love... in love with the boy she fell in love with that evening in Kyoto 6 years ago... so she went runaway train with no brakes for a bit. No reason to hate her for it.
But going forward, there will be Ichika quitting school and moving out, determined to put distance from Fuu... out of sight, out of mind, out of heart... we'll see how that goes. And then we'll find out eventually what happened that evening Fuu and Ichika spent in Kyoto 6 years ago and we'll find out how Fuu learns of it... and feels about it when he finally knows. There still a bit of development for Ichikas story before the end and I'm sure people will have calmed down with the comments... a little less vitrol lol.
That said, I do like Nino's aggressive attitude and it's cute. She's the first person to ever confess to Fuu and along with knowing Miku's feelings he's taking their feelings for him sincerely and wanting to respond to them in kind. But Fuu's first confession ending up his bride?? I'm not so sure. It's nice to see Miku be a little more aggressive too so we should see more of that back and forth between the two.
Ichika and Yotsuba... they are the ones I am watching... both girls have currently steeled themselves.
Itchika is determined to take herself out of the game. She didn't quit earlier because she wanted to stick around with Fuu and her sisters. But she's decided to quit and concentrate on her acting. The question is... is the main reason to quit school is because she really wants to pursue her acting career? Or is the main reason she's quitting school is to put distance and put her feelings for Fuu behind her and forget them by concentrating on her career. Is that really going to work?
Yotsuba... completely unreadable since her last arc. At the end of the trip she told Itsuki things are fine as they are when Itsuki wanted her to tell Fuu she was the girl in Kyoto. Is that how she really feels?? How will Fuu feel when besides finding out Ichika was the girl he spent the evening with, how will Fuu feel when he finds out Yotsuba was the girl he spent the day with.
And Itsuki... no clue. She has a good relationship with Fuu... as seen in the last chapter. Fuu can open up to her at times... talk about his girl troubles with Itsuki since he did confide in her about Miku and Nino in previous chapter as well as interactions in the beginning when she took a drugged Fuu home and when she stayed at his place. So I dunno. She seems uninterested and more concerned with keeping her family together. But she could be the one who kissed Fuu at the bell.
I like all the sisters really. Couldn't bet for sure who the bride is. I'm looking forward to the story gaining some speed in next chapters hopefully.
Excellent points.
@Kent12121
I wouldn't sweat it. What happened with Ichika is rather recent and since then she's been quiet so people are left with feelings and opinion of last deed done by her. People's views will change as her story continues. I mean... in case people forgot, Nino drugged Fuu... twice!!... and I forgot if I read the comments after the first or second drugging... people were wanting her to die. TO.... DIE!! 😲Now she's best girl lol.
Did Ichika sabotage all of Mikus baked goods or poison them?? Did she tie Miku up? Trip her to break her leg to keep from going on the trip??
No... She disguised herself as Miku a couple of times and told a lie. She used something that they are so use to doing usually to help each other and she used it to try and get an edge over Miku and the others. Was she in the wrong? Sure. And she apologized to all her sisters and especially, tearfully, to Miku and Miku forgave her with an understanding comment of "Love hurts. doesn't it?" Nino even said, after herself lunging at Fuu at the end of the arc unable to watch him and Miku together, if circumstances were different they may be in switched positions.
From Chapter 1, it was Itchika that first noticed Miku's interest in Fuu... and it was Itchika that would try to get Miku to act or do what she could to encourage them and at the same time try to get out of her way and try not to feel anything even though Fuu and Ichika kept having their moments... The Festival/Fireworks from first arc, the test of courage and realizing that Fuu was the boy she said she fell in love with in Kyoto 5 years ago, being stuck in the storage building and the bonfire dance, the chapter where Ichika is doing scenes at the bakery and ends with Fuu praising Ichika while she slept on his shoulder... oh my gosh they had so many moments together. From the very beginning it was her intention of supporting Miku and not get in the way fighting impulses and feelings through many of those moments... but she's a young girl in love... in love with the boy she fell in love with that evening in Kyoto 6 years ago... so she went runaway train with no brakes for a bit. No reason to hate her for it.
But going forward, there will be Ichika quitting school and moving out, determined to put distance from Fuu... out of sight, out of mind, out of heart... we'll see how that goes. And then we'll find out eventually what happened that evening Fuu and Ichika spent in Kyoto 6 years ago and we'll find out how Fuu learns of it... and feels about it when he finally knows. There still a bit of development for Ichikas story before the end and I'm sure people will have calmed down with the comments... a little less vitrol lol.
That said, I do like Nino's aggressive attitude and it's cute. She's the first person to ever confess to Fuu and along with knowing Miku's feelings he's taking their feelings for him sincerely and wanting to respond to them in kind. But Fuu's first confession ending up his bride?? I'm not so sure. It's nice to see Miku be a little more aggressive too so we should see more of that back and forth between the two.
Ichika and Yotsuba... they are the ones I am watching... both girls have currently steeled themselves.
Itchika is determined to take herself out of the game. She didn't quit earlier because she wanted to stick around with Fuu and her sisters. But she's decided to quit and concentrate on her acting. The question is... is the main reason to quit school is because she really wants to pursue her acting career? Or is the main reason she's quitting school is to put distance and put her feelings for Fuu behind her and forget them by concentrating on her career. Is that really going to work?
Yotsuba... completely unreadable since her last arc. At the end of the trip she told Itsuki things are fine as they are when Itsuki wanted her to tell Fuu she was the girl in Kyoto. Is that how she really feels?? How will Fuu feel when besides finding out Ichika was the girl he spent the evening with, how will Fuu feel when he finds out Yotsuba was the girl he spent the day with.
And Itsuki... no clue. She has a good relationship with Fuu... as seen in the last chapter. Fuu can open up to her at times... talk about his girl troubles with Itsuki since he did confide in her about Miku and Nino in previous chapter as well as interactions in the beginning when she took a drugged Fuu home and when she stayed at his place. So I dunno. She seems uninterested and more concerned with keeping her family together. But she could be the one who kissed Fuu at the bell.
I like all the sisters really. Couldn't bet for sure who the bride is. I'm looking forward to the story gaining some speed in next chapters hopefully.
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Couldn't wait. Nino was beeeeiiiiinnnng sooooo cuuuuute~~~
I thought it was Ichika again, I'm sorry Ichika.
I'm glad we got some Futaro POV. Missed them.
I hope Ichika stays at the house OAO. If she quits school, it's kind of inevitable, but Futaro will probably don't want that.
I think maybe it's her redemption arc, I would love to see that because I always liked her story and was my girl. Looking forward to whatever enfolds.
I thought it was Ichika again, I'm sorry Ichika.
I'm glad we got some Futaro POV. Missed them.
I hope Ichika stays at the house OAO. If she quits school, it's kind of inevitable, but Futaro will probably don't want that.
I think maybe it's her redemption arc, I would love to see that because I always liked her story and was my girl. Looking forward to whatever enfolds.
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@GreenMoriyama
I stand by my claims.
After all this is what the author drew and wrote and I am simply stating what is shown. I did say SIGNS of Fuutarou is attracted to Nino.
Signs meaning it’s open for interpretation by any reader. By that alone, the 6 signs I mention cannot simply be discarded unless the author himself makes the narrative clearer that these signs holds no value. Negi drew and made his narrative in a certain way to make his readers think a certain way.
The claims I made about the signs is by no means a guarantee that Fuutarou is love with Nino since I think you reacted to my comment as if I make such claims. I did say, “Whether that means he is romantically interested to her I am not sure-Negi keeps it vague.”
Now, I will respond to your counter arguments that really stand out.
I quoted and italicized your counter arguments,
[ul]and my responses to it are indented[/ul]
“But I take it it's less Nino-only but more that he notices at least two of the Quints is in love with him (the other being Miku).”
[ul]False, Fuutarou knows Ichika is also in love with him.[/ul]
“he's taking the best approach he knows of: from the book. But even he realizes he needs to stop that. Hence point 1 is null.”
[ul]False, fact is Fuutarou is reading the guide just before meeting Nino. Behaviour has more impact over words and as you can see, he still ends up using the guide towards her interactions with Nino in the chapter.[/ul]
“He's using the "lessons" as a guideline because he's still learning the ropes, so him using them is like using formulas from a textbook when doing some problem solving.”
[ul]This is based solely from you own interpretation and is it not shown in the manga that Fuutarou is using the guide book like “formulas from a textbook”. Recall from the previous chapter that he says “I want to read some more on [the romance guide book] to find out my own feelings.” This is the reason why he has the guidebook.[/ul]
“Wouldn't you feel taken aback when a beautiful/handsome model gives you the "don't touch me" response?”
[ul]You can’t simply assume that everyone will react a certain way. The way you or I would react holds no value compared to how the character in the receiving end of the that dialogue would respond. That is up to the author. [/ul]
“he gives it to whoever he meets next, which happens to be Nino. It's a nice notion that he at least sees Nino approachable enough, but I don't think it was in his mind to appeal to her "you liked your mother" side.”
[ul]Once again, this is just an assumption and holds no value since it is not shown in manga(dialogue or drawing). You can’t assume that the way you will react to an event in a work fiction will be how a character in the work of fiction will respond. “It's a nice notion that he at least sees Nino approachable enough”, where did it show in the chapter that Fuutarou “sees Nino approachable enough” as if she’s a last resort?[/ul]
“I don't find his question of "Didn't you actually come to hate me" to be anything more than an honest question he never had the chance to ask. He's seeing Nino's love for him out of analysis, nothing personal yet, which is why he asks about her when she "come to hate him again" because of his past trauma of being hated by her.”
[ul]Another assumption here. Your claim that, “he's seeing Nino's love for him out of analysis, nothing personal yet” got any evidence of it? And an evidence is not an interpretation or assumtion, it is a dialogue or drawing. When did Negi show in the manga that Fuutarou is "traumatized" by Nino's past actions.[/ul]
“I also wish to add that seeing his response in a black-white way (reject = hate, all other = love) is terrible, since you can consider that any person would not like to be hated, especially with Fuutaro who wants to get along with all the Quints, knowing in most cases they want to operate together.”
[ul]I don’t why you come to the conclusion that I have a binary mindset when I’m commenting about signs-which by the way is the complete opposite of binary since signs are clues and can be interpreted in a number different ways.[/ul]
“Undeniably his small blush may be a hint that he seeks more than "be friendly," but as we may know, if he aint used to the affection, he's going to blush. It makes him out to being a bit green, but he is.”
[ul]False, Fuutarou has been receiving affection from the Quints for a very long time since the very early chapters and plenty of it. Remember Miku affectionately saying that Fuutarou “needs to take responsibility” from chapter 3? and then cooking for him the next chapter? It should be harder for him to blush since he’s been receiving all kinds of affection from the Quints. The fact that he blushes is a big deal.[/ul]
I am sorry to say that most, if not all your counter arguments are either false or based solely from your own interpretation/assumption of the chapter and is not supported by evidence in the manga either by drawing or dialogue.
I stand by my claims.
After all this is what the author drew and wrote and I am simply stating what is shown. I did say SIGNS of Fuutarou is attracted to Nino.
Signs meaning it’s open for interpretation by any reader. By that alone, the 6 signs I mention cannot simply be discarded unless the author himself makes the narrative clearer that these signs holds no value. Negi drew and made his narrative in a certain way to make his readers think a certain way.
The claims I made about the signs is by no means a guarantee that Fuutarou is love with Nino since I think you reacted to my comment as if I make such claims. I did say, “Whether that means he is romantically interested to her I am not sure-Negi keeps it vague.”
Now, I will respond to your counter arguments that really stand out.
I quoted and italicized your counter arguments,
[ul]and my responses to it are indented[/ul]
“But I take it it's less Nino-only but more that he notices at least two of the Quints is in love with him (the other being Miku).”
[ul]False, Fuutarou knows Ichika is also in love with him.[/ul]
“he's taking the best approach he knows of: from the book. But even he realizes he needs to stop that. Hence point 1 is null.”
[ul]False, fact is Fuutarou is reading the guide just before meeting Nino. Behaviour has more impact over words and as you can see, he still ends up using the guide towards her interactions with Nino in the chapter.[/ul]
“He's using the "lessons" as a guideline because he's still learning the ropes, so him using them is like using formulas from a textbook when doing some problem solving.”
[ul]This is based solely from you own interpretation and is it not shown in the manga that Fuutarou is using the guide book like “formulas from a textbook”. Recall from the previous chapter that he says “I want to read some more on [the romance guide book] to find out my own feelings.” This is the reason why he has the guidebook.[/ul]
“Wouldn't you feel taken aback when a beautiful/handsome model gives you the "don't touch me" response?”
[ul]You can’t simply assume that everyone will react a certain way. The way you or I would react holds no value compared to how the character in the receiving end of the that dialogue would respond. That is up to the author. [/ul]
“he gives it to whoever he meets next, which happens to be Nino. It's a nice notion that he at least sees Nino approachable enough, but I don't think it was in his mind to appeal to her "you liked your mother" side.”
[ul]Once again, this is just an assumption and holds no value since it is not shown in manga(dialogue or drawing). You can’t assume that the way you will react to an event in a work fiction will be how a character in the work of fiction will respond. “It's a nice notion that he at least sees Nino approachable enough”, where did it show in the chapter that Fuutarou “sees Nino approachable enough” as if she’s a last resort?[/ul]
“I don't find his question of "Didn't you actually come to hate me" to be anything more than an honest question he never had the chance to ask. He's seeing Nino's love for him out of analysis, nothing personal yet, which is why he asks about her when she "come to hate him again" because of his past trauma of being hated by her.”
[ul]Another assumption here. Your claim that, “he's seeing Nino's love for him out of analysis, nothing personal yet” got any evidence of it? And an evidence is not an interpretation or assumtion, it is a dialogue or drawing. When did Negi show in the manga that Fuutarou is "traumatized" by Nino's past actions.[/ul]
“I also wish to add that seeing his response in a black-white way (reject = hate, all other = love) is terrible, since you can consider that any person would not like to be hated, especially with Fuutaro who wants to get along with all the Quints, knowing in most cases they want to operate together.”
[ul]I don’t why you come to the conclusion that I have a binary mindset when I’m commenting about signs-which by the way is the complete opposite of binary since signs are clues and can be interpreted in a number different ways.[/ul]
“Undeniably his small blush may be a hint that he seeks more than "be friendly," but as we may know, if he aint used to the affection, he's going to blush. It makes him out to being a bit green, but he is.”
[ul]False, Fuutarou has been receiving affection from the Quints for a very long time since the very early chapters and plenty of it. Remember Miku affectionately saying that Fuutarou “needs to take responsibility” from chapter 3? and then cooking for him the next chapter? It should be harder for him to blush since he’s been receiving all kinds of affection from the Quints. The fact that he blushes is a big deal.[/ul]
I am sorry to say that most, if not all your counter arguments are either false or based solely from your own interpretation/assumption of the chapter and is not supported by evidence in the manga either by drawing or dialogue.
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@kent12121
Mostly, Nino did it before she come to like Fuutarou. She just try to protect her family and the victim is only Fuutarou. Ichika did it even though she know the victim is her own family. So, well I think it's clearly different.
Mostly, Nino did it before she come to like Fuutarou. She just try to protect her family and the victim is only Fuutarou. Ichika did it even though she know the victim is her own family. So, well I think it's clearly different.
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