Clarification on rules and moderation

[Friendly_Ram]

I'd appreciate it if the credit page bullshit would go away, but the discussions/arguements/ other shit in comments is fine as is.

 

[Uberlad654]

I haven't encountered any issues myself. Things have gone rather smoothly for me as a reader. I can't really comment on the feuds that happen, although I do find sniping annoying, since I'll sometimes see a new chapter up only to find out it's just the same chapter I already read. But things have been pretty cool here on MangaDex, so no complaints from me.

 

[Tiorlan]

TL;DR: Because of their fuckin' greed, sniping and attacking other groups/individual over a series thus happen and ignite this recent drama BS. It's as though they OWN the damn series like WTF LMAO. Fuckin' assholes, just die in shitholes man.

I laughed at the donation and patreon BS. Believe it or not, certain groups or solo scanlator are driven by greed that they are trying to profit off author's work and thus do whatever they could to scanlate the 'popular' one, even if it means to start another drama BS among groups/individual. Scanlating a manga is indeed difficult to tackle. However, you can't just shove the 'we are low on funds, please donate' card at reader every damn times and expect to be paid in hefty sum. It's fine in securing the series' raw case, but if said groups or individual are always low on donation despite having already gotten the raw, then something feels off there. And don't forget this: scanlating author's work without their permission is already demotivating enough for them and now you pull the donation BS and shove it at the author's face like you goddamn own their series LMAO. Truly hillarious indeed. Hope Japan takes a drastic measure in nuking these hypocrite aggregator and the so called righteous scanlation groups. Sincerely, from a solo scanlator who has gotten sick with hypocrite groups and entitled leechers.

 

[Shyning]

tl;dr (wait, I'm already contradicting my end sentence...) : I agree with the actual moderation but believe that credits pages are an abused loophole that are not handled the same way every social interaction are (that should be kept civil), and hence should be moderated the same way comments and forums posts are (in regards to being respectful).

I voted "No, I believe that the rules are fine as written and that current moderation efforts are satisfactory. " BUT, there's a BUT.
I agree that you shoudn't allow direct/personal attacks towards groups or otherwise similar offensive behavior in credits pages.
I don't see why this wouldn't be allowed on the forums/comments but allowed in the credits pages really, it has much more of an impact than in comments/forums.
While I don't care that much about sniping etc, which some will consider disrespectful (both sides have respectable arguments, I won't delve into this in this case), directly attacking a group in credits pages is definitely disrespectful and harmful towards a good and healthy relationship in general.

Loopholes should be addressed by moderators according to what is weighted as severe enough to take action. While in almost every case this had been handled very well so far, I do firmly believe that the issue about credits pages has been handled quite poorly (and I'm not talking about only recent events but even some way older, quite offensive and directly attacking a group, credits pages).
Not that the moderation has been lazy about it, just that for some reason, it hasn't been handled the same way everything else has been so far, in my modest opinion.
The insults/disrespect shown in credits pages has been so far, imo, been tolerated a lot more than in comments/forums. I understand you may find credits pages to be a bit different because they're part of the "content" and not of the direct interactions made through MangaDex features such as the comments and forums, but I believe they should be handled the same way.
I don't find this hurting in any way the freedom of speech any group may have, but personal feuds have always been and should always be private. Making them public in a group's own social media (Discord or whatever) is to the group's discretion, but trying to influence everyone that reads the chapter and purposely create drama out of it by using (in this case, MD) features from a support that's made to support them (and not to allow them to wage wars) is, in my opinion, a purposely abused loophole and should be handled as such (not definitely forbidden but definitely considered not civil and punished as such, aka removing the credits page or making sure it's modified to be civil, but nothing more as punishment, except, of course, if the offender keeps offending).

Wall of text, sorry, it's 01:30 AM and I've got a few beers down the throat, definitely not feeling like trying to munch this and make it shorter than it is, bear (beer) with me on this one !

 

[PiakuchuKiller]

Moderation to that extent would open the gate for things like removing a chapter that one group is doing because another group did it. staying the way they are, even if it means getting criticized or bagged on should be acceptable. as long as it's within reason and not like a complete death threat sort of thing.

ps snipe my series so i can retire

 

[maierh]

There will never be a satisfying set of rules for everyone for all cases.
I believe that the mangadex moderation should stay true to their own belief, make it clear what that is from time to time if it seems unclear, and enforce it case to case by their own discretion.
To make that clear: I prefer moderators making their own decision without having to justify themselves in some artificial grand scheme. I think most if not all will do any moderation out of believe that it does good. If there are any outliers among the moderators or feuds between individuals the community will do a better job at pointing those out than any rules will.

As long as we have a strong sense of what we want this site to be with trustworthy individuals sacrificing investing their time, I think everything will be fine. I really appreciate the communication btw of current issues even though I'm mostly out of the loop. It's nice to know what's up.

About staying neutral about relations between anything going on in/between release groups and monetization schemes of groups: I also think being neutral is the way to go.
(Especially since mangadex has established its place as #1 to read releases), it should just give a space for any group to provide their releases under their own conditions. There might be conflicts from time to time ofc, but those will be handled case to case. Mostly it's just a vocal few, that complain way too much.

Anyway, keep up the good work. o/

 

[Thoraxe41]

Well I haven't been banned so I am happy with the status quo so far.

Honestly never had an issue. Any drama is nowhere I visit, so can't say much to that.

 

[Orio]

I ain't complaining as long as we can keep posting lolis.

 

[ninjadork]

I haven't had any major complaints about moderator behavior as it currently stands, which is rather impressive; not sure where you found a group of mods with actual restraint, as that seems to be a rare breed these days. I would prefer that a couple of conduct rules are made more specific in order to prevent the possibility of certain types of abuse-of-vagueness in the future, but the situation as it currently stands doesn't have any flaws I currently feel a need to fight over.

 

[maierh]

@Shyning @Thoraxe41
Well I'm not too sure myself. I experienced some credit drama like with "Skeleton couldn't protect the dungeon " and it was mostly distracting when which release to go for, But in that instance I think that it is the job of the reader to choose and if a group gets to crass raise their voice. (ofc the moderation should make up their own mind since most of the time readers are just going with the flow and are over reacting, but the people will give guidance to the hotspots )

 

[Boxxy]

Things have been great so far, people always bitch and complain, the grass is always greener on the other side.

 

[kurosa]

I like the way mangadex has been doing, a little quarrel should not affect our community. So why don't try to be civil and not overreacting and instead try to reach an agreement or maybe work together in case of series with lots of raws?

P.D. That's why I retired xD

@Orio I second that motion with a vengeance!
@ PiakuchuKiller Damn you're right.
@maierh I like to read both works as sometimes groups working in the same work tend to rush and that affects the quality of translation.
@Thoraxe41 Damn you Kissmanga mods, you banned me for the most idiotic reason!

 

[Guralub]

Don't change anything about the moderation, scanlator's wars or whatever shouldn't be of mangadex's concerns. If people keep the discussion in the right place there should not be any intervention, unless we have intentional trolling and what could be considered as detrimental to the reader's enjoyment.
We have different people reading manga here, with different opinions and morals, it's bound to people clash with one another.
Keep things the way they are right now.

 

[psychoc4t]

haha good one moderators moderate things, I know group that still upload how break rule "Obtrusive watermarks are not allowed." they even for time had in their group page that they upload with "Obnoxiouse watermarks" here but they quicklys remove that from their page but still uploads same watermark covered pages, no matter how many times I reports page nothings is done group still upload pages with watermakr covering making it hard to sees, and I has no way to block them from my follows page so whne theys upload series i read and i sees its them and not other groups that don't do this i gets annoyed

 

[sarusa]

No matter what you do, some people are just drama fountains and will create it out of the nothingness of the void - it's some excitement in their lives. I wouldn't worry too much about it, let them go to Kissmanga if they want.

 

[ptbrown121]

As soon as you figure out how much anyone should moderate the content on a hosting platform I think YouTube, Twitter, and Facebook would like to give you bags of money for your formula.

 

[ElTipejoLoco]

Since the rules still explicitly state that MangaDex will remove chapters upon request from scanlators, it is in it and its user-base's best interests to attempt to keep said groups and individuals happy. If the majority of translators are growing unhappy, it should be the staff's priority to address the cause of that dissatisfaction. Otherwise we'll keep running into situations where content keeps leaving the site and 'new groups' have to slow their progress down when they choose to make the 'compromise' of reworking and reuploading older chapters. Some people will also request their content pulled out of solidarity of their peers, so it's going to spread and affect 'un-sniped' works, and some users won't even notice this if the chapters are either fully pulled or the work had been previously completed.

I don't think there's any option in this poll that will actually address this: It's not an issue with loop holes or a lack of clarity. I also don't think there needs to be new moderation staff, because it's not really an issue of "let's enforce the rules harder" so much as "there's simply no measures in place to deal with people getting dissatisfied in this way or to address harassment of groups and individuals via 'extra pages' or 'extra text in uploaded chapters'," period.

MangaDex is currently deciding that it values it neutrality more-so than its content and content providers, so losing some of the latter two at the expense of the first is simply going to become the natural state of the site.

 

[TMW]

Is there a 2.5 vote option? "Yes, I believe that the current rules should be more clearly defined and fleshed out so that all loopholes are closed. Current moderation efforts are satisfactory."

I think the moderators are doing a good job. I also think that if you know there are loopholes for people to exploit, you should close those loopholes before they become the source of community-wrecking drama. Mangadex is still growing, and as it grows it's going to draw in some people who will push the rules as far as they can. Shut down the potential problems before they become major problems.

 

[DANDAN_THE_DANDAN]

Wait there are loopholes?

 

[Noir]

I personally, haven't had any issue with moderation so far, I'm satisfied with the current administration/moderation of the site and would prefer if you guys keep it the way things are right now.
As for the loopholes, they should be dealt with if the present any potential problem/treat.

I couldn't care less about groups drama/feud, as long as i can read my mango tbh.