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I was watching Nyanko Days and wondered if having catgirls as pets was slavery in a way, since there are other series with catgirls that are treated as equals to regular humans. Just a dumb thought I had.
Is having catgirl pets okay?
- Thread starter Ysoseerius
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there is no know law preventing it so... why not?
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The main current IRL ethical issue would be that in order to get something 99% human/1% cute cat parts, you'd pretty much have to start with a human and then splice in the nyanko-y traits. Genetic engineering for anything less-noble than curing congenital diseases is currently bad juju among the popular opinion of normies.
As for fictional takes on the topic, I'd recommend two visual novels: Nekopara (on Steam), and Wanko to Kurasou.
Nekopara has explicitly genetically-engineered-from-cats catgirls that are considered pets, but can earn a license that lets them to do things like run errands/sightsee unattended, hold jobs, etc. Their overall legal status isn't explored in too great a detail, but it is clear in the game that catgirls have the same mental acuity as normal humans of similar apparent age.
Wanko is more nuanced and much more detailed: (spoilered for wall of text)
Wanko's pets vary in intelligence: there's a catgirl that reads at the college level (it'salso mentioned that this is very unusual) and on the flipside, there's a doggirl that's a show breed--purposely inbred for looks like IRL purebreed pets--who probably won't ever get beyond the mental age of a human elementary schooler.
As for fictional takes on the topic, I'd recommend two visual novels: Nekopara (on Steam), and Wanko to Kurasou.
Nekopara has explicitly genetically-engineered-from-cats catgirls that are considered pets, but can earn a license that lets them to do things like run errands/sightsee unattended, hold jobs, etc. Their overall legal status isn't explored in too great a detail, but it is clear in the game that catgirls have the same mental acuity as normal humans of similar apparent age.
Wanko is more nuanced and much more detailed: (spoilered for wall of text)
The game actually gives the prices for reputably-attained kemonomimi (catgirls and doggirls both) pets: 60-80k yen for cheap/low-demand puppers, and up to 4 million+ yen for fancy/pedigree/exotic breeds. And pet stores don't really carry them because of government minimum housing standards on humanoid pets (i.e. something resembling a bed, under a roof, indoors; no cages). Plus there are licenses/qualifications for humanoid pets that allow them to go about unattended, that require the floof to have basic literacy and understanding of human society (e.g. obeying traffic lights, etc.) which kind of upgrades their legal standing from "pet" to "unattended minor". It also mentions that despite all that, parental abandonment to a human gets one tossed in jail as felony; intentionally abandoning a potentially-just-as-intelligent humanoid pet gets you a fine and a slap on the wrist.
Also, the big difference in humanoid pets' intelligence and human intelligence in this game is that pets have trouble with lateral thinking; they're good at following rules, but solving big open-ended problems just kinda overwhelms them. Thus they might have personal dreams/aspirations, but no clue how to navigate in human society from point A to point G.
Another mental difference between humanoid pets and humans is in written language acquisition. Most kemonomimi can read alphabets/syllabaries (such as katakana) with practice, but only the smarter floofs can really internalize the symbols, and thus a lot of them memorize the shapes by rote and have to translate each character rather than processing entire words/syllables/mora without thinking about it.
Similarly, most humanoid pets have trouble writing, not so much the physical act, but more the "translate spoken word to hand"/expressing-oneself parts. Mikan the puppy-girl who is the main kemonomimi character in the game, is likely the second-smartest humanoid pet in the game, but her writing still comes across as stilted when she scribbles notes for the family refrigerator.
Also, the big difference in humanoid pets' intelligence and human intelligence in this game is that pets have trouble with lateral thinking; they're good at following rules, but solving big open-ended problems just kinda overwhelms them. Thus they might have personal dreams/aspirations, but no clue how to navigate in human society from point A to point G.
Another mental difference between humanoid pets and humans is in written language acquisition. Most kemonomimi can read alphabets/syllabaries (such as katakana) with practice, but only the smarter floofs can really internalize the symbols, and thus a lot of them memorize the shapes by rote and have to translate each character rather than processing entire words/syllables/mora without thinking about it.
Similarly, most humanoid pets have trouble writing, not so much the physical act, but more the "translate spoken word to hand"/expressing-oneself parts. Mikan the puppy-girl who is the main kemonomimi character in the game, is likely the second-smartest humanoid pet in the game, but her writing still comes across as stilted when she scribbles notes for the family refrigerator.
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The first question should be, why do we like cat girls? Because they are cats that can act like human, or because they are human with some human attractiveness to them?
As far as it goes for me, physically, it is just about cuteness. Cute animal traits in human girls. Grr.
But psychologically... it sounds more about power over an inferior creature. Rationally, would you want cats that can compete with you on intelligence and analysis, like long life partners? Or would you prefer to feed them, to cure them, to pat them given they would welcome it all (even if they didn't, it would be more like a game)?
If the answer is 2, then we are on the same page and cat girls should not be allowed. I demand an explication from those who chose the first option.
PD: Not even that, we must start by the principle that we would be *buying* those cat girls. That's actually slavery right there.
As far as it goes for me, physically, it is just about cuteness. Cute animal traits in human girls. Grr.
But psychologically... it sounds more about power over an inferior creature. Rationally, would you want cats that can compete with you on intelligence and analysis, like long life partners? Or would you prefer to feed them, to cure them, to pat them given they would welcome it all (even if they didn't, it would be more like a game)?
If the answer is 2, then we are on the same page and cat girls should not be allowed. I demand an explication from those who chose the first option.
PD: Not even that, we must start by the principle that we would be *buying* those cat girls. That's actually slavery right there.
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you could say that the legality of an humanoid pet may be legal or not, since they are not exactly human but a pet (you could've others legal issues with a law because of this) but also it depends on the intelligence of the "humanoid", because if you see other fantasy manga where cat-human like, beast-kin or even non humanoids types with human like intellect, they are considered as an equal existence, not as a pet. if so, then is slaverism, at least in this world. So in regards at nyanko days, they has an intelligence as an elementary kid with personality traits of a cat, but with not so low knowledge of the human world, thus making it more of a slave instead of a pet, but still it will be in a gray legal area in which it could be pass as a legal thing.
On the other hand... why to have one when you can have 2+
On the other hand... why to have one when you can have 2+
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Pets are family so no problems over here.
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It's fine as long as you take proper care of them...
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Forced ownership of a sapient being should be considered slavery by default. Then you simply apply human laws.
[ul]Willing guardianship is not illegal.
Puppy mills of sapient beings is illegal.
Assigned custodianship is not illegal.
Guardian abuse is illegal.
[/ul]
Etc.
[ul]Willing guardianship is not illegal.
Puppy mills of sapient beings is illegal.
Assigned custodianship is not illegal.
Guardian abuse is illegal.
[/ul]
Etc.
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Imma shift this atmosphere into a more believable tone here. Imagine the future where everyone have androids Detroit: Become Human style but instead of demanding for independence, they have prosthetic cat ears and tails and want to be your pet.
If we go by the intelligence argument, it's not unlikely for us to see robot/catgirls rights similar to human rights. It's hard to imagine a modern world without these rights to govern countries.
If we go by the sapience argument, a grey area is probably more likely. I mean, if society looks at robot catgirls as body pillows with an endoskeleton and an AI, is it any different from a Roomba?
Let's go to the middle route: the Turing test. Are they really sentient or are they just a machine imitating sentience? Is there any difference between one and the other? If sentience can be encoded with 1s and 0s, how come we can't understand the sentience in our heads? Okay I'm going on a tangent but you get the idea - should they only receive rights if they pass the Turing test?
There's my 2¢.
If we go by the intelligence argument, it's not unlikely for us to see robot/catgirls rights similar to human rights. It's hard to imagine a modern world without these rights to govern countries.
If we go by the sapience argument, a grey area is probably more likely. I mean, if society looks at robot catgirls as body pillows with an endoskeleton and an AI, is it any different from a Roomba?
Let's go to the middle route: the Turing test. Are they really sentient or are they just a machine imitating sentience? Is there any difference between one and the other? If sentience can be encoded with 1s and 0s, how come we can't understand the sentience in our heads? Okay I'm going on a tangent but you get the idea - should they only receive rights if they pass the Turing test?
There's my 2¢.
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Considering that my interpretation of a cat girl (or any other kind of “girl” for that matter) is a biological human equivalent, except the only physiological difference is the traits that identify what animal they are partially related to. This means that they are no different from humans in the context of ownership, though wether or not that is taboo depends on your native culture. (Looking at you, old traditions of old religions)
Intelligence is going to determine if they have rights. If they have mostly animalistic minds, I would imagine accusations of crimes against humanity being possible since people into bestiality is already a problematic minority, and would get worse if we go and “humanize” them like that. If we go reverse, and have humans with animalistic appearances (in a non “furry” way) it will be the biological equivalent of “cyberpunk” aesthetics, though it would raise eyebrows among the common populace. Make genetic engineering common place however, just like our tech and food, people won’t care as much about how much we take it for granted. It is a good question why we would want to create a cat girl of our own...
Make me wonder if it’s ok to clone yourself as a substitute child if you don’t have a spouse...
But back on topic.
Since philosophically, they are more animal than man than a man itself, it would be a worse problem if their instincts still kick in. Would you really want to take care of a human who cannot control themselves? We already have problems with violence (and warfare for that matter) among men, and wild animals are no different; it would be even worse to think about animal girls going into heat. Think of the children who were minding there own business until they walk along and see that by mistake. Stray cat girls (and boys, since every yin needs a yang) fucking in the streets would be traumatic.
Now, caring for a person is acceptable, so long as they are willing, so we have that down. As some people say, if they are treated as family, then it’s ok, but think about the animals who get abused and abandoned. Since humans can still be abusive towards each other, I think that this would intensify previous societal problems like racism since people default to calling animal people as another race, just like elves and dwarves, rather than a separate species entirely (so no interracial here).
Purchasing them is right out, because buying a life for personal gain, no matter how much you may compensate for it, should be considered wrong. Would you like it if you were sold by your parents under the promise that your new home will take care of you?
For the most part, I think it is wrong to have catgirl pets. I can see it being a possible gene mod trend if people can mod themselves quick and develop the appearance fast enough, though it will have a rough start.
A good question based off of all of this, is do you think the extremists of the Furries will co-opt this technology to make their wet dreams a reality, ushering in a new age of darkness and yiffing? I could see this apocalypse happening if cloning on a mass scale is possible...
Intelligence is going to determine if they have rights. If they have mostly animalistic minds, I would imagine accusations of crimes against humanity being possible since people into bestiality is already a problematic minority, and would get worse if we go and “humanize” them like that. If we go reverse, and have humans with animalistic appearances (in a non “furry” way) it will be the biological equivalent of “cyberpunk” aesthetics, though it would raise eyebrows among the common populace. Make genetic engineering common place however, just like our tech and food, people won’t care as much about how much we take it for granted. It is a good question why we would want to create a cat girl of our own...
Make me wonder if it’s ok to clone yourself as a substitute child if you don’t have a spouse...
But back on topic.
Since philosophically, they are more animal than man than a man itself, it would be a worse problem if their instincts still kick in. Would you really want to take care of a human who cannot control themselves? We already have problems with violence (and warfare for that matter) among men, and wild animals are no different; it would be even worse to think about animal girls going into heat. Think of the children who were minding there own business until they walk along and see that by mistake. Stray cat girls (and boys, since every yin needs a yang) fucking in the streets would be traumatic.
Now, caring for a person is acceptable, so long as they are willing, so we have that down. As some people say, if they are treated as family, then it’s ok, but think about the animals who get abused and abandoned. Since humans can still be abusive towards each other, I think that this would intensify previous societal problems like racism since people default to calling animal people as another race, just like elves and dwarves, rather than a separate species entirely (so no interracial here).
Purchasing them is right out, because buying a life for personal gain, no matter how much you may compensate for it, should be considered wrong. Would you like it if you were sold by your parents under the promise that your new home will take care of you?
For the most part, I think it is wrong to have catgirl pets. I can see it being a possible gene mod trend if people can mod themselves quick and develop the appearance fast enough, though it will have a rough start.
A good question based off of all of this, is do you think the extremists of the Furries will co-opt this technology to make their wet dreams a reality, ushering in a new age of darkness and yiffing? I could see this apocalypse happening if cloning on a mass scale is possible...
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