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Isekai Mahou wa Okureteru! - Vol. 3 Ch. 15 - Demon General Rajas III
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Just re-read it. Wasn't the ENTIRE FUCKING POINT that his magic was superior? What a shitty excuse to create fake tension.
@mahtan If it wasn't the best decision, it was the wrong decision. Authority always has to make the best decision. Sacrificing a kid, the friend of your 'Hero', is nothing but cruel and stupid. Want to distract the enemy? Sent several units in different directions, each with 'knowledge' about the 'Hero' being in a different party. Offering innocent merchants, and an innocent casualty of your 'summoning', can't be justified in any way.
All they gained with the gamble was a little time for the 'Hero'. The risks, besides just failing to bait the enemy, included not just losing their greatest asset but also turning him against them.
All they gained with the gamble was a little time for the 'Hero'. The risks, besides just failing to bait the enemy, included not just losing their greatest asset but also turning him against them.
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@cor3zone
No? Authority doesn't have to make the best decision all the time, sometimes there is no best decision to be made but the lesser of some bad ones, which would be this case from the little exposition we got on the demon army advances that lead to this situation.
That is why the idea of having everyone decide on something is stupid, we don't know everything they did to decide on this plan isntead of something else. You, just like the hero, doesn't know nor has the capapcity to understand what a war is and is putting your subjective moral, that comes from a society that is mostly pacific and has no sense of conflict, and imposing that on others from a completly different society that has been at war for years and doesn't have the option our society would have in their position.
I'm not going to say something stupid like "you have to do something to know about it" but I will say that you can't apply moral standards to a situation that is radically diferent from the one those moral strands were made for.
No? Authority doesn't have to make the best decision all the time, sometimes there is no best decision to be made but the lesser of some bad ones, which would be this case from the little exposition we got on the demon army advances that lead to this situation.
That is why the idea of having everyone decide on something is stupid, we don't know everything they did to decide on this plan isntead of something else. You, just like the hero, doesn't know nor has the capapcity to understand what a war is and is putting your subjective moral, that comes from a society that is mostly pacific and has no sense of conflict, and imposing that on others from a completly different society that has been at war for years and doesn't have the option our society would have in their position.
I'm not going to say something stupid like "you have to do something to know about it" but I will say that you can't apply moral standards to a situation that is radically diferent from the one those moral strands were made for.
@gaigous Saying it's "necessary" and "not wrong" is literally justifying it. Something does not need to be morally 'right' to be justifiable.
@mahtan Yes, authority has to always make the best decisions. If all you have are bad choices there will still be a 'best' among them, i.e. the one with less risk/cost. I'm not "putting [my] subjective moral" on the choice, I'm saying there were objectively better choices they could make. They gained very little, at a huge risk. They are literally gambling royal blood, the princess, on the 'Hero' succeding. He is their desperate last chance. Doing anything that might shake his faith in them, is objectively bad. Besides, the gamble failed anyways. The 'Hero' turned around as soon as he found out, meaning any time gained is now lost.
Do you really believe the 'Hero' would never find out about them sacrificing his friend? What do you suppose he would do if he found out his friend died because of the kingdom after his mission was done? Just go "Oh, well" and let it slip? Even if they knew about MCs magic power, it was a dumb decision. MC still struggled in mortal danger. Those kinds of 'for the greater good' decisions are how villains are made.
@mahtan Yes, authority has to always make the best decisions. If all you have are bad choices there will still be a 'best' among them, i.e. the one with less risk/cost. I'm not "putting [my] subjective moral" on the choice, I'm saying there were objectively better choices they could make. They gained very little, at a huge risk. They are literally gambling royal blood, the princess, on the 'Hero' succeding. He is their desperate last chance. Doing anything that might shake his faith in them, is objectively bad. Besides, the gamble failed anyways. The 'Hero' turned around as soon as he found out, meaning any time gained is now lost.
Do you really believe the 'Hero' would never find out about them sacrificing his friend? What do you suppose he would do if he found out his friend died because of the kingdom after his mission was done? Just go "Oh, well" and let it slip? Even if they knew about MCs magic power, it was a dumb decision. MC still struggled in mortal danger. Those kinds of 'for the greater good' decisions are how villains are made.
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wow 7 months ago. Thanks for the chapter!
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even if the hero didn't knew they sacrificed his friend, there is no way to know how he would react when one of his close friends dies. even more so since he comes from a relatively peaceful world where it's rare for people to die a unnatural dead.
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@cor3zone Who is the arbiter of right and wrong, reasonable and unreasonable? Who must be convinced the action is right or reasonable? What would convincing such a person that their plan of action is right or reasonable accomplish other than making them feel good?
Hiroshima is an example of a horrible situation where objectively better actions could have been taken had the people and circumstances been different, but the reality is cruel, we don't always get the optimal outcome, take the good with the bad, flaws and all.
Either way, I've read the LN and can spoil why such a plan was hatched by the duke if you'd like.
Hiroshima is an example of a horrible situation where objectively better actions could have been taken had the people and circumstances been different, but the reality is cruel, we don't always get the optimal outcome, take the good with the bad, flaws and all.
Either way, I've read the LN and can spoil why such a plan was hatched by the duke if you'd like.
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mangaichi back at it again with the slowest quality scans lol
seriously tho 7 months is a very long time.
seriously tho 7 months is a very long time.
What a disgraceful farce... What did they expect to happen by using the best friend of their supposedly "last hope of humanity" as sacrifice? There are so much things that could go wrong, and MC wasn't even needed there, their trick with false info was enough.
And what they expected from teenager hero at that point? "Ok, i will fight to not waste his sacrifice, i guess", or something like that?
Cmon, it is beyond retarded! There are 100 possibilities like hom breaking down mentally, ignoring them and going for rescue (like he did), or just lose truat in them and refuse to cooperate (they don't have binding after all). And with all those bad outcomes, there is literally zero chance that outcome would be in their favour.
Author even made "evil duke" just because he didn't want king to be evil after establishing him as good. But for some reason retarded duke have full rights granted by the king to murder VIP from another world without even consulting with the king?
Cmon, that's just lazy writing. Not just lazy but awful. It's almost as if author himself think that his readers are stupid enough to just accept this shit. I literally don't even want to read further, it's always small things like this that trigger me the most. Things that don't even affect the plot (just cut out that retarded idea with lure and make demon sense unusual aura or something... And nothing even change), but no... Author need "betrayal" drama!
The thing about betrayal drama, it need good logic behind it and great writing of it. But author fucked it up.
And what they expected from teenager hero at that point? "Ok, i will fight to not waste his sacrifice, i guess", or something like that?
Cmon, it is beyond retarded! There are 100 possibilities like hom breaking down mentally, ignoring them and going for rescue (like he did), or just lose truat in them and refuse to cooperate (they don't have binding after all). And with all those bad outcomes, there is literally zero chance that outcome would be in their favour.
Author even made "evil duke" just because he didn't want king to be evil after establishing him as good. But for some reason retarded duke have full rights granted by the king to murder VIP from another world without even consulting with the king?
Cmon, that's just lazy writing. Not just lazy but awful. It's almost as if author himself think that his readers are stupid enough to just accept this shit. I literally don't even want to read further, it's always small things like this that trigger me the most. Things that don't even affect the plot (just cut out that retarded idea with lure and make demon sense unusual aura or something... And nothing even change), but no... Author need "betrayal" drama!
The thing about betrayal drama, it need good logic behind it and great writing of it. But author fucked it up.
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this is what I don't like... they tell him that the nobles of that country used his friend as bait. (disregarding of how op the real mc is) and he is still thinking of that country as allies.
@gaigous Hiroshima is an example of why authority has to make the best decision. Both sides made horrible decisions, which resulted in the tragedy. The sad part is, knowing whether an action is right is impossible before you know the results of it. In this case we know the results, the 'Hero' had his faith in the kingdom shaken and any time gained was lost when he turned around. Thus, the decision to sacrifice MC was wrong.
I've read the spoilers earlier in this thread,
. I think it's dumb, since that's no guarantee the 'Hero' wouldn't be lost because his friend died. If you can explain further, please do so.
I've read the spoilers earlier in this thread,
about the Duke consulting someone aquainted with MC and his power
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@cor3zone I agree with you, I'm just saying reality will not conform to that expectation, over 7 billion people and every single one of them is an individual, you do the math.
People are often "dumb", the duke had reason to believe that would be the result, you can increase the likelihood of success, but guarantees are a fantasy when it comes to people.
People are often "dumb", the duke had reason to believe that would be the result, you can increase the likelihood of success, but guarantees are a fantasy when it comes to people.
@gaigous Saying "reality will not conform" is basically the same as saying discussing morality and ethics is useless. If shit like that is inevitable, why even bother living at all? Guess that's why nihilism is a thing.
Gambling your last chance of survival on nothing more than "reason to believe" in someone surviving impossible odds is not just "dumb", it's probably the worst thing they could do. They had this complete outsider, a naive kid, with enormous power. Enough to possibly save all of humanity from extinction. The only way they had of controlling him was appealing to his altruism. To save him some trouble, they decided to do something that could possibly turn him into their worst enemy. In other series, this is how Demon Lords are made, damnit. You don't gamble when the prize is 'a little time' and the stake is 'the survival of humanity'.
Gambling your last chance of survival on nothing more than "reason to believe" in someone surviving impossible odds is not just "dumb", it's probably the worst thing they could do. They had this complete outsider, a naive kid, with enormous power. Enough to possibly save all of humanity from extinction. The only way they had of controlling him was appealing to his altruism. To save him some trouble, they decided to do something that could possibly turn him into their worst enemy. In other series, this is how Demon Lords are made, damnit. You don't gamble when the prize is 'a little time' and the stake is 'the survival of humanity'.
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yes its alive... thanks for the update...
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@cor3zone You're jumping to extremes, I'm not a nihilist, I'm a moral relativist, but the distinction is lost or denied by many so I don't blame you there.
Here's a quote: “Sometimes you can do everything right and things will still go wrong.”
The duke is a patriot, his goal is the preservation of the kingdom, not humanity as a whole, and he's learned of powers that can destroy it effortlessly, so his perspective isn't the clearest one.
Here's a quote: “Sometimes you can do everything right and things will still go wrong.”
@gaigous I wasn't implying you were a nihilist. But your point was basically the same as 'nothing we do will change things'. If "reality will not conform" our choices are not choices at all, just reality playing out. I believe we make reality conform, by always striving to be better. Like I said, only history can tell right from wrong. We know Hiroshima wasn't the best choice, so it (hopefully) won't happen again.
I agree with the quote. I don't agree that anything about using MC as bait was 'right'.
If so, he chose to gamble with another power that could do the same for what? If his goal was safety for the kingdom, risking the 'Hero' going ballistic against the kingdom is hardly wise in any capacity. Not to mention if MC survives (like he did) and finds out about the plot. MC has been shown to not be as nice as the 'Hero'.
I agree with the quote. I don't agree that anything about using MC as bait was 'right'.
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@cor3zone authority doesnt have to make the best decisions
can barely remember dick about this since the last update was like half a year ago or so, but judging from the dialogue
This world seems to be a monarchy, so why do you believe authority has to make the best decisions
they are just their to protect assets first and foremost everything else is secondary (though this is true even in societies not rules by kings and queens).
if those in authority choose to take poor decisions, there should be a better plan for covering up the can of worms
plus the hero's a kid playing hero, pretty sure you can concoct some story brewed in a meth lab to throw him off
but this guy... judging from how the chapter started, was just talking about using MC and co. as decoys openly
and when caught had no back up story, immediately started spilling all of the beans... thats incompetence and lack of foresight
@gaigous i do disagree about Hiroshima, talking about the nukes yes?
great ol Murrica just had to test the impact of nukes and used a war they were clearly winning to terrorize innocents, while dehumanizing their "race" as well.
horrible situation, all of which was intended, which just shows ye authority doesn't have to make "good decisions" or the "best" ones for that matter; what matters most is the perception of the decisions
would be much appreciated if you did share spoilers, im kinda curious
can barely remember dick about this since the last update was like half a year ago or so, but judging from the dialogue
This world seems to be a monarchy, so why do you believe authority has to make the best decisions
they are just their to protect assets first and foremost everything else is secondary (though this is true even in societies not rules by kings and queens).
if those in authority choose to take poor decisions, there should be a better plan for covering up the can of worms
plus the hero's a kid playing hero, pretty sure you can concoct some story brewed in a meth lab to throw him off
but this guy... judging from how the chapter started, was just talking about using MC and co. as decoys openly
and when caught had no back up story, immediately started spilling all of the beans... thats incompetence and lack of foresight
@gaigous i do disagree about Hiroshima, talking about the nukes yes?
great ol Murrica just had to test the impact of nukes and used a war they were clearly winning to terrorize innocents, while dehumanizing their "race" as well.
horrible situation, all of which was intended, which just shows ye authority doesn't have to make "good decisions" or the "best" ones for that matter; what matters most is the perception of the decisions
would be much appreciated if you did share spoilers, im kinda curious
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