Merge "Shoujo Ai" tag with "Yuri" :planned:
- Thread starter GoggledAnon
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So it's planned to be merged? I guess that if it does happen then one would have to click on the MU link or look at different sites if there is no link to see what sort of content it really is and if it's semi-explicit or not (since the smut tag isn't a very good indicator of how explicit post-merging, considering the amount of censoring there is in these kind of things).
Edit: Also, MangaDex hosts many types of comics, not just Japanese manga. There's manhwa, manhua (we also have Wuxia genre tag), and various comics from different countries (including Western comics). Changing the tags to be more like the native Japanese system seems to be kinda weird, considering MangaDex's diversity and how some sites that MangaDex includes in the Information section of the comic page (specifically MangaUpdates and MyAnimeList) separates Shoujo Ai and Yuri and Shounen Ai and Yaoi rather than merging them.
Edit: Also, MangaDex hosts many types of comics, not just Japanese manga. There's manhwa, manhua (we also have Wuxia genre tag), and various comics from different countries (including Western comics). Changing the tags to be more like the native Japanese system seems to be kinda weird, considering MangaDex's diversity and how some sites that MangaDex includes in the Information section of the comic page (specifically MangaUpdates and MyAnimeList) separates Shoujo Ai and Yuri and Shounen Ai and Yaoi rather than merging them.
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GL with those confusing time.
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@KatoShuu Ecchi won't exist afterwards so... not sure what the 2nd argument is about. I mentioned it in my post that we were getting rid of it.
Safe -> Suggestive (Ecchi western definition falls here, no longer in use) -> Erotica (Smut falls here, no longer in use) -> Pornographic (Hentai western definition falls here, no longer in use)
Isekai was used and abused by Japanese people
Safe -> Suggestive (Ecchi western definition falls here, no longer in use) -> Erotica (Smut falls here, no longer in use) -> Pornographic (Hentai western definition falls here, no longer in use)
Isekai was used and abused by Japanese people
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I thought shoujo ai is more like s class, so yuri is different in that aspect. Point in case is Euphonium, it's not yuri but it's shoujo ai (or s class) since both main girls have their own (het) love interests (well, this take will make yurifags get angry but you get the point).
Maybe, mangadex should create wiki for the definitions instead?
Maybe, mangadex should create wiki for the definitions instead?
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Been over a year and still not merged, despite being planned. What's the deal? 😐
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@thesupremextream Likely the change will come with the new version of the whole website. So keep waiting
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I will be kicking dead horse, but I randomly came across this here and skimmed through...
I have no problems merging the tags if that's how you want to play this, but in my opinion these two mean different things.
Shoujo Ai was originally about little girls at the age where they are not really emotionally developed to process romance and their friendship outgrowing the limits of "friend" and them trying to face the new emotions so from the old stuff I recall reading, it was generally about late elementary school or middle school aged girls usually in girls schools.
And as people repeated multiple times - yuri is an umbrella term for any girl/girl romance.
In other words just like Isekai is generally subgenre of fantasy, shoujo-ai is under yuri.
Also have no idea whether it worked similar with shounen-ai and yaoi. The only shounen-ai I read was probably this.
To be absolutely honest, I personally would prefer adding tags, not removing.
-Like some that would convey basic tone of the titles would be nice. I mean just looking at isekai, you have wide swings between something like this and this
-One could also make an argument for adding tags for character traits of main cast...
-Tags describing how fast pacing is could also be useful.
Some might think that it might spoil the story, but syosetu, a novel website, has all of these covered and it is super useful.
Quite frankly overwhelming majority of my searches here were just a waste of time. It is better to first find a title on site like mangaupdates and then look for it here.
I have no problems merging the tags if that's how you want to play this, but in my opinion these two mean different things.
Shoujo Ai was originally about little girls at the age where they are not really emotionally developed to process romance and their friendship outgrowing the limits of "friend" and them trying to face the new emotions so from the old stuff I recall reading, it was generally about late elementary school or middle school aged girls usually in girls schools.
And as people repeated multiple times - yuri is an umbrella term for any girl/girl romance.
In other words just like Isekai is generally subgenre of fantasy, shoujo-ai is under yuri.
Also have no idea whether it worked similar with shounen-ai and yaoi. The only shounen-ai I read was probably this.
To be absolutely honest, I personally would prefer adding tags, not removing.
-Like some that would convey basic tone of the titles would be nice. I mean just looking at isekai, you have wide swings between something like this and this
-One could also make an argument for adding tags for character traits of main cast...
-Tags describing how fast pacing is could also be useful.
Some might think that it might spoil the story, but syosetu, a novel website, has all of these covered and it is super useful.
Quite frankly overwhelming majority of my searches here were just a waste of time. It is better to first find a title on site like mangaupdates and then look for it here.
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Just gon' leave this here, might clear some misunderstanding ... or not.
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@thesupremextream:
It should be said (whilst I would know nothing of anything going on behind the scenes, if that were to happen) that the official story is (and has been for over a year) that this change will come alongside/after a future technical update to the site.
Said update has not arrived, so the tag change not being here is... at the very least, fully consistent with previous statements. I don't know what the official stance is (Soon™ ?), but it would seem it is de facto not a high priority (which seems plausible, given the spates of growing-pain issues the site has had during the pandemic. I'm not really following those developments, honestly, beyond reading the announcements. I disproportionately care about the state of tags compared to other stuff, compared to the average person XD).
It should be said (whilst I would know nothing of anything going on behind the scenes, if that were to happen) that the official story is (and has been for over a year) that this change will come alongside/after a future technical update to the site.
Said update has not arrived, so the tag change not being here is... at the very least, fully consistent with previous statements. I don't know what the official stance is (Soon™ ?), but it would seem it is de facto not a high priority (which seems plausible, given the spates of growing-pain issues the site has had during the pandemic. I'm not really following those developments, honestly, beyond reading the announcements. I disproportionately care about the state of tags compared to other stuff, compared to the average person XD).
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Shoujo Ai is generally younger girls being involved/purer relationships, entirely convivial romance, and maxes out at 1st base
Yuri is generally mixed age groups or older/"less pure" relationships, mostly standard romance, and maxes out at 2nd or 3rd base, depending on the age group/rating
Best way to explain is Kobayashi
Kobayashi and Kanna is Shojou Ai
Kobayashi and Tooru is Yuri
Yuri is generally mixed age groups or older/"less pure" relationships, mostly standard romance, and maxes out at 2nd or 3rd base, depending on the age group/rating
Best way to explain is Kobayashi
Kobayashi and Kanna is Shojou Ai
Kobayashi and Tooru is Yuri
"Shoujo ai" is a stupid nonsense term, you should not use it. It's just shameful misuse of Japanese words.
Looks especially dumb where characters are adult girls (shoujos? really? facepalm.)
Would be better to merge it into Yuri i.e. "Lily" which is used in Japan for even slight romance or strong platonic feelings (they also have "Rezu" for hardcore lesbianity). I wonder why we Japanese manga fans can't do the same?
Looks especially dumb where characters are adult girls (shoujos? really? facepalm.)
Would be better to merge it into Yuri i.e. "Lily" which is used in Japan for even slight romance or strong platonic feelings (they also have "Rezu" for hardcore lesbianity). I wonder why we Japanese manga fans can't do the same?
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(not trying to argue or anything)
The line "I wonder why we Japanese manga fans can't do the same?" , I don't think that really can be applied here since not all the things on here are manga. We have Chinese, Korean, Japanese, English, etc of things to read. And we can't satisfy all the languages for the tags. So the shounen/shoujo should stay because even if people don't know everything about the terminology, they can at least know that yaoi and yuri stories have more of those scenes, while shounen/shoujo ai don't.
And I completely agree that because these phrases are a bit ambiguous and don't carry across all languages, sometimes stories are mislabled, or instead of romantic relationships are about friendships, or something else.
Just my bit on why it's better to keep those tags separate ^^
(Also let it be know that I have not read all the comments on this forum due to time constraints, so please do not think I wrote this despite reading everything)
The line "I wonder why we Japanese manga fans can't do the same?" , I don't think that really can be applied here since not all the things on here are manga. We have Chinese, Korean, Japanese, English, etc of things to read. And we can't satisfy all the languages for the tags. So the shounen/shoujo should stay because even if people don't know everything about the terminology, they can at least know that yaoi and yuri stories have more of those scenes, while shounen/shoujo ai don't.
And I completely agree that because these phrases are a bit ambiguous and don't carry across all languages, sometimes stories are mislabled, or instead of romantic relationships are about friendships, or something else.
Just my bit on why it's better to keep those tags separate ^^
(Also let it be know that I have not read all the comments on this forum due to time constraints, so please do not think I wrote this despite reading everything)
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