Very far away
Rebuild World - Vol. 10 Ch. 46
- Thread starter MangaDex
- Start date
The eastern district is such a small place where akira currently lives, but if he tries and goes to the frontline (a much massive place where the corporate government resides) he'd be dead real quick for how dangerous that place is.
Probably, since in order to initiate "rebuild world" the current civilization must be destroyed or make it collapse.
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Viola is one of the best manipulators in the series and her cunningness was introduced during the thief arc
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Quite literally says she's going to change his personality.
Number 498 made it all the way to the objective, are you just not bothering to read? Akira hasn't even gotten into the first level of the Kuzusuhara ruins, he hasn't even started going to the objective.
And given there's been 498 previous subjects, I'd say she has a good chance of getting another Akira, ESPECIALLY since Katsuya is right there and being "guided" too.
You're just splitting hairs. All of Alpha's actions, from Chapter 18 onward, are for the sake of manipulating Akira. That's the whole point of that part of the chapter. He took an illogical action which contrasts her analysis of him having distrust of humans. So everything she does and questions him about, is going to be for the sake of manipulating, influencing and altering his behaviour to her end alone.
She doesn't have limited interference, she has "broad range interference with free will". That same contract where she went through Cognition Process Rules and bypassed the rule and was able to take his silence as agreement. Whatever limitations the contract has Alpha has shown that she can and has used loopholes. Now as far as I can tell there's something lost in Mini-Alpha's dialogue, cause it cuts too abruptly.
And that acting is in fact manipulative behaviour. We get to see Alpha's true face in both the white void and her internal monologue. That's the point of us readers being able to see it. Her clingy jealous act is an act to get Akira emotionally attached to her, which is by definition manipulative.
And again, every single time we see Alpha's internal thoughts, she's utterly void of emotional attachment to Akira beyond him being a pawn to her goal. The lack of friendship and emotion is exactly the point, it means everything. It's faked to gain his trust.
Seriously, re-read the manga, look at the sections when he's not looking or she's not directly speaking to him.
Your memory explains how you thought Akira got the furthest when he literally hasn't even started.
She's been tricking him since chapter one. Manipulation is to change or control by skilled, insidious or unfair methods to for an advantage or to serve a purpose. Insidious meaning subtly or gradually. Alpha's act in front of Akira is itself a trick, you admitted to this in a previous paragraph.
Going further, her costume/outfit changes. Teasing Akira with sexual innuendo. Putting down every female he shows any hint of emotional attachment to. Acting "clingy and jealous" when he's shy around other women paying attention to him.
Because this is how she really acts and thinks:
Chapter 1, Akira refuses the contract
Chapter 4, right after he agrees to her contract.
Chapter 7, Alpha analyzes Akira's reasoning to save Elena and Sara.
That's the point of those panels, the point of every time the author gives us Alpha's internal monologue, versus how she interacts with him.
Yeah, you've shown me with your arguements that "she's not manipulating him"
Except it hasn't with regards to Elena, Sara, Sheryl and Shizuka. Akira has acted out of character as far as Alpha has known regarding them, that Alpha makes note of it and deliberates what she should do.
That's the weirdest, most contrived definition of manipulation I've ever heard, to where I'm sure you made that up just to have this arguement.
And even then, by your own definition Alpha is still manipulating Akira. Her very persona is "inaccurate information". Her personality is "fake", an "act". And Akira's been convinced to place his trust in her, and only be in charge of "willpower" and "resolve".
If you're still convinced you're right, well I can't help someone who's going to ignore common definitions to suit their own purposes.
Edit: You bring up Sheryl and how she's manipulating Akira but fail to recognize how Alpha's doing the exact same thing?
Wait the other dude said that was the WN not the LN result.
but does having an AI help them do it better?
Yes, they can tune it
First off, that says RECCOMENDATION not "action taken" Show me the actual manipulation, just because that's the system recommendation does not mean that this Alpha is doing it.
Quite literally says she's going to change his personality.
Number 498 made it all the way to the objective, are you just not bothering to read? Akira hasn't even gotten into the first level of the Kuzusuhara ruins, he hasn't even started going to the objective.
And given there's been 498 previous subjects, I'd say she has a good chance of getting another Akira, ESPECIALLY since Katsuya is right there and being "guided" too.
You're just splitting hairs. All of Alpha's actions, from Chapter 18 onward, are for the sake of manipulating Akira. That's the whole point of that part of the chapter. He took an illogical action which contrasts her analysis of him having distrust of humans. So everything she does and questions him about, is going to be for the sake of manipulating, influencing and altering his behaviour to her end alone.
She doesn't have limited interference, she has "broad range interference with free will". That same contract where she went through Cognition Process Rules and bypassed the rule and was able to take his silence as agreement. Whatever limitations the contract has Alpha has shown that she can and has used loopholes. Now as far as I can tell there's something lost in Mini-Alpha's dialogue, cause it cuts too abruptly.
And that acting is in fact manipulative behaviour. We get to see Alpha's true face in both the white void and her internal monologue. That's the point of us readers being able to see it. Her clingy jealous act is an act to get Akira emotionally attached to her, which is by definition manipulative.
And again, every single time we see Alpha's internal thoughts, she's utterly void of emotional attachment to Akira beyond him being a pawn to her goal. The lack of friendship and emotion is exactly the point, it means everything. It's faked to gain his trust.
Seriously, re-read the manga, look at the sections when he's not looking or she's not directly speaking to him.
Your memory explains how you thought Akira got the furthest when he literally hasn't even started.
She's been tricking him since chapter one. Manipulation is to change or control by skilled, insidious or unfair methods to for an advantage or to serve a purpose. Insidious meaning subtly or gradually. Alpha's act in front of Akira is itself a trick, you admitted to this in a previous paragraph.
Going further, her costume/outfit changes. Teasing Akira with sexual innuendo. Putting down every female he shows any hint of emotional attachment to. Acting "clingy and jealous" when he's shy around other women paying attention to him.
Because this is how she really acts and thinks:
Chapter 1, Akira refuses the contract
Chapter 4, right after he agrees to her contract.
Chapter 7, Alpha analyzes Akira's reasoning to save Elena and Sara.
That's the point of those panels, the point of every time the author gives us Alpha's internal monologue, versus how she interacts with him.
Yeah, you've shown me with your arguements that "she's not manipulating him"
Except it hasn't with regards to Elena, Sara, Sheryl and Shizuka. Akira has acted out of character as far as Alpha has known regarding them, that Alpha makes note of it and deliberates what she should do.
That's the weirdest, most contrived definition of manipulation I've ever heard, to where I'm sure you made that up just to have this arguement.
And even then, by your own definition Alpha is still manipulating Akira. Her very persona is "inaccurate information". Her personality is "fake", an "act". And Akira's been convinced to place his trust in her, and only be in charge of "willpower" and "resolve".
If you're still convinced you're right, well I can't help someone who's going to ignore common definitions to suit their own purposes.
Edit: You bring up Sheryl and how she's manipulating Akira but fail to recognize how Alpha's doing the exact same thing?
Where does it say anywhere the 498 "made it to the objective"? Because chapter 37 page 16 does not say that. In fact this page specifically says that the system doesn't want him to act like the previous subjects. So obviously they didn't do good.
Katsuya is a failure, or did you literally miss the part where the fork said that Katsuya has limited ability to perceive them?
As for broad-range interference you are now contradicting yourself. You have taken Alpha's words as actions in every one of your post. If she said it she did it. But literally I showed you something where she straight up says "I have limited interference" and you're like "Well she said it before" If you're going to take her word at face value her most recent words are right not the ones from before. So are you assuming what she says all the time is 100% what she's doing or not?
No 'acting' is not manipulation. Especially when Alpha has given Akira control over her behavior and he literally picks how she acts and can tell her to stop acting one way. Alpha 'has no personality' originally, that's uncomfortable to deal with, emulating a personality to make conversation easier is not automatically manipulation.
As for rereading the manga, you probably should. Alpha has multiple text bubble types, even when talking to herself. Nothing has been verified but there is the possibility that Alpha's 'ego' and the over all system that controls the AIs are two separate things, and a lot of what you keep quoting, is actually the system talking and not Alpha. It's not an impossible situation.
There is just so much wrong your analysis of Alpha's personality. First off all those pictures you showed eyes like that in most other manga are representative of 'possession' or a second personality or the like. They generally are not used for characters who have been faking a personality coming out of the act. They are sometimes, but the other is much more common.
I told you that I don't see manipulation, and you're so bent on it's happening, but the best you can come up with for an example is "Alpha's faking her behavior" but you can't actually prove that. You're assuming Alpha has no personality, however why do the 2 different forks have different appearances? And you can't say "It's to fit the desires of the person they're with" because Katsuya can't see her and she knows it. And our Alpha doesn't seem to be 100% aware of Akira's taste. So evidence suggest their appearance is chosen by something, likely themselves since they have control over it. That suggest differences between them in how they think.
As for the 498, 'making it to the ruins' I'm not even 100% sure that's their goal. But even making it there doesn't make them 'further than Akira' if they had no hope of surviving when they got there. But look at chapter 42 and reread the conversation between the AIs. The AI's both interpreted the second encounter differently, our Alpha also specifically says "his target" when referring to Katsuya, suggesting there might be different targets. But also in this conversation we get the information that the AI's are not all running the same test, as noted by the fork at the end. But also (and this is depending on how accurate the word choice the translators used) it looks like the forks can choose to change the focus of their experiment when they change subjects.
As for Sherly, the big difference between Sherly and Alpha is Alpha makes her personality changes obvious and lets Akira tell her to stop. If she was trying to manipulate him, generally it'd be subtle so he doesn't notice. It could be manipulation, but it could also be her idea of a joke. Also she should be able to read enough of his thoughts to know that he actually doesn't like any of the girls like that, 'cept potentially the store clerk, at least where we are he is physically attracted to them but that's it. I'm pretty sure Alpha has also said some of it is to get him used to women so that he can't be manipulated by them.
The short of it is this, you posted a definition for manipulation as well. And though you tried to make fun of my definition yours is mostly the same. The key in it though is manipulation is 'insidious' behavior but not only 'insidious' behavior, but to control, gain and advantage, or for a purpose. You even defined 'insidious' as subtle or gradual. So if you're saying she's manipulating him, show me this. Show me something that in the book is clearly an 'insidious' action taken to gain an advantage, control, or for a purpose. Not one that you assume is doing that but one the book shows is that clearly.
Because all you've shown is that Alpha is capable and willing to manipulate him. But guess what, that can be said about literally everyone, even the shop keeper. Everyone has motive to manipulate Akira, something they can gain. Everyone puts on at least some level of an act. All store clerks have the 'business smile' the two hunter girls are careful around Akira too, the reseller guy is as well. Just about everyone is because Akira is very volatile and you need to be to work with him. The only one who doesn't have some measure of behavior shift is Katsuya.
Edit: In fact, if Alpha has no personality, why would she pretend to have one? To make Akira work for her? Yeah that's normal, 'cept Akira has mad trust issues, and she'd have been aware of that when she did that massive function activation. I mean even when he first met her and she showed she was giving him good directions, the moment he relaxed he stopped following her directions. So Akira would've actually probably responded better to her acting like a machine that only tells the truth, then it wouldn't even come to mind that she's trying to trick him. Why take the difficult route of trying to get him to trust a 'human'?
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It was speculated that the 498th subject of Alpha 1 is Yanigasawa (just an Alias).Also in the wn, the corporate government created "The Anti-Rebuild-World Personnel" to stop the initiation of "Rebuild World" since in order for it to happen, the current civilization/society must collapse or be destroyed. Alphas true objective might be to initiate "Rebuild World" that's why he backed out after knowing everything at the near end of his journey with Alpha 1.
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Yeah sorry dude but i am afraid alpha is straight up manipulating akira because he's a sociopath with super human potential that she can use to accomplish her goal. 498 almost did it but then stopped and betrayed her due to morality. hence why she now looks for people with more flexible morals such as akira. She is trying to seperate him from the two hunter chicks that he defies mission parameters to help, because she views them as dangerous to her mission cause they have good morals.
Also (And i hope i set up this spoiler correctly)
We have met 498 in a previous chapter, and when he betrayed alpha she straight up fucked up his brain so he couldn't connect to the old world network any more as punishment.
Also also (not sure if this is a spoiler or not but ill put it in there to be safe)
Every time akira uses that compressed time perception shes teaching him it actually causes brain damage. She helps mitigate it, and his expensive medical treatments reverse it, but she never informs him of the consequences of using it. Without her using it is dangerous and could lead to him having major brain damage which is a manipulative act
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What chapters are those in cause now we're finally getting some stuff concrete?
You're about 900 times better then SunSun because you actually know how to get straight to the proof instead of your feelings.
For 498, as I said before, I do not think Alpha is incapable of manipualting people, nor of being outright evil, I just said I don't think she is currently manipulating Akira. With regards to the hunters I do not think that is 'manipulation' it is very obvious that Alpha doesn't like them, and she prefers Akira doesn't deal with them. He still chooses to. Again, attempts at persuasion isn't manipulation.
For the first thing about 498 can you point me back to the chapter so I can reread it.
Now as for the time compression thing. If that is true still in the manga, that it is doing brain damage to him, then I would say that yes, that is manipulation. Barely (cause pretty sure he'd still do it cause he'd die without it.) but still on the manipulation side of the fence. However that hasn't been verified yet in the manga so there's still chance that it ends up not being manipulation in this.
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Sure give me a second while i figure out how to post an image inside a spoiler...
While i was looking that up i thought up another spoilery thing that is technically manipulation so one second:
So all those nanomachine medicines that akira uses that alpha has told him to keep rather than sell? The reason she wants him to use them, and use them alot and often, is so she can trigger a mutation in his body that will grant him super strength on par with a high level augmented suit (the kind that can destroy a tank with a single punch) Now sure this could be seen as a cool thing but she hasn't explained to akira the consequences or side effects of the medicine because she is trying to intentionally trigger the mutation. I do think that classifies as manipulation as well
I am not sure how much of the novel stuff i can go into without it being actual spoilers but yeah she outright hides stuff from him to trick him into doing things that are harmful in the long term but beneficial in the short term. Plus her overall goal, the thing she needs akira to achieve, is down right apocalyptic in scale hence why test 498 refused to help her when he got to the goal and saw and understood what she intended to do. It's why she keeps so many secrets from akira, cause despite his sociopathic nature (pick literally any chapter for proof of it in the manga, he is so fucked up mentally) he still goes out of his way to help people that he deems as allies, and alpha can not afford another morality case like 498.
Edit: SORRY TYPO I MEANT CHAPTER 37
Seriously why can't more people be like you and just actually back their stuff up with facts.Sure give me a second while i figure out how to post an image inside a spoiler...
The dude from that page is 498, alpha's former partner who betrayed her as mentioned in one of the weird dream sequences where alpha was calculating her plan while unknowingly being watched by akira. For betraying her due to his morality she basically crippled his ability to use old world network. Chapter 37 is where its from.
While i was looking that up i thought up another spoilery thing that is technically manipulation so one second:
So all those nanomachine medicines that akira uses that alpha has told him to keep rather than sell? The reason she wants him to use them, and use them alot and often, is so she can trigger a mutation in his body that will grant him super strength on par with a high level augmented suit (the kind that can destroy a tank with a single punch) Now sure this could be seen as a cool thing but she hasn't explained to akira the consequences or side effects of the medicine because she is trying to intentionally trigger the mutation. I do think that classifies as manipulation as well
I am not sure how much of the novel stuff i can go into without it being actual spoilers but yeah she outright hides stuff from him to trick him into doing things that are harmful in the long term but beneficial in the short term. Plus her overall goal, the thing she needs akira to achieve, is down right apocalyptic in scale hence why test 498 refused to help her when he got to the goal and saw and understood what she intended to do. It's why she keeps so many secrets from akira, cause despite his sociopathic nature (pick literally any chapter for proof of it in the manga, he is so fucked up mentally) he still goes out of his way to help people that he deems as allies, and alpha can not afford another morality case like 498.
Edit: SORRY TYPO I MEANT CHAPTER 37
Man it was updating so slow around then I didn't even realize those two people were the same guy. So he probably isn't as 'evil' as he was portrayed to be in his appearance huh?
While I totally agree that would be manipulation for sure. I find that a weird choice by her, cause doesn't she need the augment suit to fully control his actions? So like if he gets strong enough to not need it wont she be unable to move his body?
Pretty much it looks like all the stuff related to the actual cases of manipulation haven't happened yet in the manga. Like her actual goal hasn't been reviled and all the other stuff hasn't. Though it doesn't look like her goal will change, between the manga and the novel.
Like i said she was aiming for the like 10% mutation chance cause there will be times when she is unable to provide full support like the gray mist grenades that inhibit electronics or when he's deep underground (if i remember correctly her goal is deep underground hence why she needs a person with a physical body to get there physically) so him having a super human body that can operate without her is an important step to her plan.
and while this hasnt happened in the manga yet
Her goal is in direct conflict with the world governments goal in that if she gets her goal fulfilled bad shit happens in terms of humanity surviving so akira following her plans ends up with a huge ass government bounty on his head. It's implied she knew that would always happen but didn't tell akira until it already did, and by then he was so reliant on her skills that abandoning her after the betrayal would mean his death so he was forced to continue helping her if he wanted to live.
I suppose that's true, just figure it's a pretty big risk.
Yeah it looks like for sure that this will stay, especially considering the name. So it's like a "Old humans want to get rid of new humans and start over" kinda thing?
Kind of? So i havent read all of it yet but its kind of a reset protocol for the world thats already been used several times. The new world is trying to prevent it from being used again, and 498 realized that activating it when he got to it would destroy the world and make the world worse than it already is, so he betrayed alpha for which she punished him by fucking up his brain and cutting him off from the old world connection. I am still not 100% clear on alpha's origins other than she is a super powerful AI with higher access protocols than the one following katsuya around. Like even when akira finds himself in ruins run by more powerful AI than alpha, she still has limited access to their systems until they kick her out.
Any way all that ive posted has been to say that her actions now are preparations for manipulations in the future, which is still manipulation in the long run so back to my original point. Alpha is manipulating akira.
Well like I said if the nanomachines or the big plot thing stay the same in the manga, then yeah that will end up being manipulation.
I have no problem with the idea of manipulation being something Alpha does. it's just that people were saying it as fact for it is happening. But literally we have zero confirmation of that in the manga now, and none of them were going "No it's revealed later and this is what happens." Instead they just posted a bunch of BS about nonconfirmed stuff. It was like trying to prove an accusation with "Well the neighbor said he was a murderer too."
Fair but i mean even without my future knowledge her actions and the way she talks vs the way she thinks are clear signs that she is manipulating akira. What makes this funny is that even later on when akira learns she's manipulating him, he still stays with her partially because shes too useful to part ways with (she made herself an existence he cant survive without) but mainly because he always keeps his word and he gave his word he would help her. He would rather die than break his word which is funny to me cause Alpha didn't need to manipulate him the moment she got his word that he would help. But she never considered that because 498 tests all resulted in failure due to them being normal, morally upright, non sociopaths.
