Saihate ni Madou - Vol. 1 Ch. 5

[Absolutel]

Read chapter 5 with Moonlight on the river by Mac DeMarco playing its so sad but good.

 

[gundulgondrong]

i have this feeling that he's gonna fuck his mom,

 

[Yokubou]

It's already chapter 5 and you're still commenting something like this...? It's like we've been reading two different manga, or that you should have posted this, perhaps in the first chapter's discussion.

First up: Having death sentences does not mean being harsh on ALL crimes, and in this case, SA against minors. Westerners are NOT more tolerant of pedophiles. Case and point: The case of Gary Plauche, who fatally shot a pedophile INSIDE a court room. His sentence was 7 years of prison, which he did not have to serve. He instead only served 5 years of probation with some community service.
This shows that killings against pedophiles are treated more generously than killings against other people in the west.

On to your main point:
So what you're saying is that no one should discuss crime and punishment differences between cultures after chapter 1, even though it was only in chapter 5 that was revealed that the rapist's crimes were known where it was only previously hinted at?

Is it also every reader's duty to comb through threads of every chapter before posting? Is it beneficial for you to shut down conversations that you've had before but other people didn't?

If you feel you have reached your own conclusion on the matter, you can just let other people discuss it and just ignore the posts.

Why do you feel the need to tell people they should not talk about it anymore? Is there a reason to gatekeep when people should talk about something?

 

[Mr_Detective]

First up: Having death sentences does not mean being harsh on ALL crimes, and in this case, SA against minors. Westerners are NOT more tolerant of pedophiles.

Well, your churches seem to be full of them.

Case and point: The case of Gary Plauche, who fatally shot a pedophile INSIDE a court room. His sentence was 7 years of prison, which he did not have to serve. He instead only served 5 years of probation with some community service.
This shows that killings against pedophiles are treated more generously than killings against other people in the west.

So, a yankee, I assume? So? Still doesn't contradict what I said. It's a civilian who killed him, just like the MC, not the death penalty.

On to your main point:
So what you're saying is that no one should discuss crime and punishment differences between cultures after chapter 1, even though it was only in chapter 5 that was revealed that the rapist's crimes were known where it was only previously hinted at?

You had 4 chapters to do this. We have done this. Chapter 5's focus was the little girl and her current life.

Do Japanese people prefer that a pedo NOT be killed? As much as some people in the west wouldn't want a civilian to carry out execution on their own. I'm still facepalming at how you even asked this...
If he went to jail in the west, he'd be a hero instead. No. He'd still be a murderer and still have to struggle mentally with his action.

You jumped in with a comment that had nothing to do with anything, just to wank your western ego. What do you want people to tell you? "Yeah, them japs are pedos and don't want pedos killed, unlike us westerners who kill them to become hero." Are you satisfied now?

Is it also every reader's duty to comb through threads of every chapter before posting? Is it beneficial for you to shut down conversations that you've had before but other people didn't?

Yeah, you should read the discussion of the previous chapters before posting someone thing that has been discussed intensively before. Especially when your post was nearly pointless and utterly irrelevant. It's as if your skipped the last 2-3 chapters and came into the newest comment section to post something so low-effort.
I didn't shut down conversations. I participated in them. I shut down your attempt to wank your western ego.

If you feel you have reached your own conclusion on the matter, you can just let other people discuss it and just ignore the posts.

Your post was so dumb that I felt irritated leaving you to wank yourself. Dealing with you isn't pleasant, either.

Why do you feel the need to tell people they should not talk about it anymore?

I did no such thing.

Is there a reason to gatekeep when people should talk about something?

See above.

Both of your posts reeks of western supremacy, arrogance, and ignorance all mixed in. Look, you're not the first one of your kind I encounter, and I don't have a lot of patience for people like you. You think murdering someone makes you a hero? Do a little more growing up. "But I have-" No, son. You still have a long way to go.

Remember, you're reading a fictional story. If everybody approves the MC's action and he's totally okay with what he did, there'd be no drama, and therefore no story.

Another waste of time of a conversation.

 

[Yokubou]

Well, your churches seem to be full of them.

Please define "Your churches" if you are referring to Catholism, do you think 100% of Westerners are Catholic?

So, a yankee, I assume? So? Still doesn't contradict what I said. It's a civilian who killed him, just like the MC, not the death penalty.

I know you do a lot of assuming, but I am neither a Westerner nor an American. But you do a very good job of glossing over the case and point by equating a prison sentence for the MC and someone who gets to walk free immediately after killing someone else.

You had 4 chapters to do this. We have done this. Chapter 5's focus was the little girl and her current life.

So you are in charge for setting a time limit for a conversation? Like I said, chapter 5 revealed a clue in the news article. You wanting to move away from the topic doesn't mean that others have to.

You jumped in with a comment that had nothing to do with anything, just to wank your western ego. What do you want people to tell you? "Yeah, them japs are pedos and don't want pedos killed, unlike us westerners who kill them to become hero." Are you satisfied now?

How do I wank my Western ego if I'm not Western? I ASKED if Japan doesn't want their pedos killed, as a culture. If you want to give a facetious answer you are entirely welcome to, but it only reflects upon yourself when you project your own thoughts onto other people. Like how you get defensive immediately.

Yeah, you should read the discussion of the previous chapters before posting someone thing that has been discussed intensively before. Especially when your post was nearly pointless and utterly irrelevant. It's as if your skipped the last 2-3 chapters and came into the newest comment section to post something so low-effort.
I didn't shut down conversations. I participated in them. I shut down your attempt to wank your western ego.

I've yet to see you discuss anything in good faith when your replies are stated as definitive facts when they are merely opinions. So am I not allow to have a discussion with people who didn't actively post in the last 4 chapters?

Your post was so dumb that I felt irritated leaving you to wank yourself. Dealing with you isn't pleasant, either.

And yet you are here, assuming I am wanking my ego when I have been bashing my own culture the entire time. Just because I am born in a region does not automatically force me to fall in love with my own culture and think there is no room for improvement.

I did no such thing.


See above.

Telling people that they should've just gone back to read all the discussion in the threads of the last 4 chapters instead posting anything at all doesn't count as shutting down a conversation, okay.

Both of your posts reeks of western supremacy, arrogance, and ignorance all mixed in. Look, you're not the first one of your kind I encounter, and I don't have a lot of patience for people like you. You think murdering someone makes you a hero? Do a little more growing up. "But I have-" No, son. You still have a long way to go.

Remember, you're reading a fictional story. If everybody approves the MC's action and he's totally okay with what he did, there'd be no drama, and therefore no story.

Another waste of time of a conversation.

I never said murdering a pedo makes you a hero, I said they would treat you as a hero in prison. Outside of prison, they would not treat you as a hero, nor would they ostracize you for it.

Exactly, this is a fictional story set in the real world. The characters are fictional but it does not mean it is completely devoid of social commentary, that is precisely why understanding the culture is required to comprehend the reason for MC's actions and thoughts.
But when I asked a genuine question wondering if Japan's culture of ostracizing a murder just because he killed a pedophile, I immediately get labeled as a "western supremacist".
It makes me wonder who should be the one growing up when they talk down to others in order to win their argument.

By all means if you think replying to me is a waste of time, then spare yourself the effort. I'm just trying to figure out why a random guy on the internet is lashing out at me, so I myself don't think it's a waste of time.

 

[Mr_Detective]

How do I wank my Western ego if I'm not Western? I ASKED if Japan doesn't want their pedos killed, as a culture. If you want to give a facetious answer you are entirely welcome to, but it only reflects upon yourself when you project your own thoughts onto other people. Like how you get defensive immediately.

I've yet to see you discuss anything in good faith when your replies are stated as definitive facts when they are merely opinions. So am I not allow to have a discussion with people who didn't actively post in the last 4 chapters?

But when I asked a genuine question wondering if Japan's culture of ostracizing a murder just because he killed a pedophile, I immediately get labeled as a "western supremacist".
It makes me wonder who should be the one growing up when they talk down to others in order to win their argument.

I'm not gonna bother with the rest of your whining.

OK. I'll give you some answers: some people want the rapists killed. Some don't. Some don't want a random citizen to take matters into his own hands because society will be drowned in chaos very quick if everyone does that and ignore the justice system. Some might see him as a hero. Some might approve what he did. Some might stay away from him. Sounds just like, oh, I don't know, any western country, no? Right. It's not wanking your western ego. It's hugging westerners' nuts and putting them on a pedestal. Not much of a difference. The western equivalent of what a Japanophile is.

Of course you wouldn't see me discussing anything at all if you just read the first 2 chapters then jump straight into this comment section to sing your praise for the west, which you seem to be viewing with rose-tinted glasses. Again, people have been discussing the MC's actions, how the court actually went easy on him, how people actually sided with him, and how he has to live with the consequences and trauma of his actions. You could have read that to understand the story further. But no, reading is hard. It's easier to just say "how come these damn japs not want their pedos killed, he'd be a hero in the glorious western lands". That's ignoring all sort of logic, consequences, and problems that actions like his can cause in society, all of which had been discussed. It's like someone asking how the Vietnam War started while everyone is looking at the aftermath.

Suddenly the idea that manga isn't real goes out the window when it comes to story like this. The one who can't bother to read is the one that needs to grow up more. Like I said, you're not the first of your type I come across. We all know what the point of that post was. I have little to no tolerance for people like this. Of course, I detest wasting my free time. But I at least felt compelled to let people know how dumb they are when they try hard to sound "smart". And now, I'm done. Welcome to the list.

 

[Yokubou]

I'm not gonna bother with the rest of your whining.

For a entire post about claiming that I do not read, you certainly made it clear that you won't read at the start of it.

OK. I'll give you some answers: some people want the rapists killed. Some don't. Some don't want a random citizen to take matters into his own hands because society will be drowned in chaos very quick if everyone does that and ignore the justice system. Some might see him as a hero. Some might approve what he did. Some might stay away from him. Sounds just like, oh, I don't know, any western country, no? Right. It's not wanking your western ego. It's hugging westerners' nuts and putting them on a pedestal. Not much of a difference. The western equivalent of what a Japanophile is.

If I believe that offending pedophiles should be removed from society permanently in one way or another, and the western law provides leniency to killings of pedophiles, does that make me a Westernphile? Do you not know how to differentiate that agreeing with one policy doesn't make one agree with ALL policies? The west still upheld the law by punishing the murderer, but extenuating circumstances are provided. Do I HATE Japan just because I question why the MC is feeling anxiety that he's being judge by his community and whether it's a socio-normative phenomena for him to conform to the guilt rather than to be defiant and stand by his own choices?

Of course you wouldn't see me discussing anything at all if you just read the first 2 chapters then jump straight into this comment section to sing your praise for the west, which you seem to be viewing with rose-tinted glasses. Again, people have been discussing the MC's actions, how the court actually went easy on him, how people actually sided with him, and how he has to live with the consequences and trauma of his actions. You could have read that to understand the story further. But no, reading is hard. It's easier to just say "how come these damn japs not want their pedos killed, he'd be a hero in the glorious western lands". That's ignoring all sort of logic, consequences, and problems that actions like his can cause in society, all of which had been discussed. It's like someone asking how the Vietnam War started while everyone is looking at the aftermath.

Yes, exactly. People join and leave conversations at different timeframe. I am seeking a conversation at chapter 5 with other people who might be in a similar situation as myself. Someone who simply read the manga without diving in the threads at every single chapter. And yet you are here, saying that it is inappropriate to do so because yourself and other people have already discussed it, effectively in another room by yourselves and therefore all new entrants must go to read the logs in that room instead.
I do find myself pointing to the same part of your argument of "you like the west and therefore your point is invalid", while both the premise and conclusion seems quite flawed. I do agree with the west on this point, and I believe that the violent parts of society that are in prison would be welcoming of a pedophile killer. That's why I wonder why the MC would come out of prison feeling remorse for the murder when he would've had positive reinforcement within prison.
On your example, why would it not be allowed for people to look into why the Vietnam started after the war is over? Historians are still debating over the causes of many wars long after they were over.

Suddenly the idea that manga isn't real goes out the window when it comes to story like this. The one who can't bother to read is the one that needs to grow up more. Like I said, you're not the first of your type I come across. We all know what the point of that post was. I have little to no tolerance for people like this. Of course, I detest wasting my free time. But I at least felt compelled to let people know how dumb they are when they try hard to sound "smart". And now, I'm done. Welcome to the list.

Let me repeat myself in case you didn't read before replying. The manga isn't real, the commentary is real.
If you really want to stereotype me, what type am I?
What was the point of my post? By "we", who are you representing?

Let's say I am as dumb as you claimed, so you are helping the community by bashing the dumb? Could you elaborate on how that would help the community?

 

[Akikako]

Mike Tyson move.

 

[MEBWizz]

Translator here.

Even as I am typing this message, I'm not 100% confident in my translation of the title (「最果てに惑う」as "Lost at the Farthest Ends"). I'd prefer to translate the title when the manga ends so that I have as many clues as possible, but I suppose it is unreasonable that way. There's another translation in my mind ("Tempted at the Farthest Ends"), but everything so far in volume 1 doesn't really support this one. Then again, things might develop in favor of this interpretation later on... We'll see where it goes in that case.

Thank you all for reading, and please please please consider buying the manga (various platforms to choose from in the main page of this manga) to support the author! Financial success means the manga is less likely to be axed; it also incentivizes official translation!

P/S: I have noticed that some groups have based their translation on ours, so feel free to contact me on mangadex to get access to our psd files. (Please credit "puppy" as the redrawer in that case.)

I would appreciate it if you would continue to translate this manga as I currently, can only read English, German, and/or Spanish. I have access to someone who can translate French for me into one of the three mentioned languages but I don't know anyone who can translate Japanese unless I look on Mangadex and I try to contact one of them. I have been searching the internet to see if a translation of this manga existed in one of the languages that I could read but unfortunately, I have not been able to find one.

 

[MEBWizz]

For a entire post about claiming that I do not read, you certainly made it clear that you won't read at the start of it.

If I believe that offending pedophiles should be removed from society permanently in one way or another, and the western law provides leniency to killings of pedophiles, does that make me a Westernphile? Do you not know how to differentiate that agreeing with one policy doesn't make one agree with ALL policies? The west still upheld the law by punishing the murderer, but extenuating circumstances are provided. Do I HATE Japan just because I question why the MC is feeling anxiety that he's being judge by his community and whether it's a socio-normative phenomena for him to conform to the guilt rather than to be defiant and stand by his own choices?

Yes, exactly. People join and leave conversations at different timeframe. I am seeking a conversation at chapter 5 with other people who might be in a similar situation as myself. Someone who simply read the manga without diving in the threads at every single chapter. And yet you are here, saying that it is inappropriate to do so because yourself and other people have already discussed it, effectively in another room by yourselves and therefore all new entrants must go to read the logs in that room instead.
I do find myself pointing to the same part of your argument of "you like the west and therefore your point is invalid", while both the premise and conclusion seems quite flawed. I do agree with the west on this point, and I believe that the violent parts of society that are in prison would be welcoming of a pedophile killer. That's why I wonder why the MC would come out of prison feeling remorse for the murder when he would've had positive reinforcement within prison.

Suddenly the idea that manga isn't real goes out the window when it comes to story like this. The one who can't bother to read is the one that needs to grow up more. Like I said, you're not the first of your type I come across. We all know what the point of that post was. I have little to no tolerance for people like this. Of course, I detest wasting my free time. But I at least felt compelled to let people know how dumb they are when they try hard to sound "smart". And now, I'm done. Welcome to the list.

If you two know anything about how criminals are truly treated in the real world then some of these statements should never have been made. I personally think that the author is doing a tremendous job of addressing how criminals are treated even if their intentions are for a good reason.

Some of the drama in this manga is spot on such as: how killing a pedophile is still murder and in the West, the only way a killer would get away with killing a pedophile would be if the pedophile were to be caught red-handed (in the act). How a criminal who has served their time whether you are Japanese or a Westerner if you have committed a crime equivalent to a felony in the West then society will treat you the same.

 

[curvedtree]

I mean... if we are taking matters ipsis litteris, Waku was arrested in September 12th for precisely 7 years, how come Christmas is around the corner?

Hold up... what if this other girl, Sumire, is in the whole plot? Or even she is the original daughter or even Shiika's sister?

 

[KuhaKenuvo]

I kind of need the main character to stop being so pathetic. Like a lot.

 

[sagittarjus]

Brat deserved it for what happened earlier. Although wouldn't be too surprised if she was a victim of Shiika's dad.

Thanks for the TL

That happened at least 7 years ago tho, so unless the dad assaulted a 5-y-o, I'm pretty sure its not her, she could be related to one of the SA victims tho, just like our MC

 

[Kuromachin]

:3