Sengoku Komachi Kuroutan: Noukou Giga - Vol. 14 Ch. 67 - Innovation

[Fireboy]

Once Oda conquerors Japan Shizuko should get him to set his sights on the New World. If they're fast enough they should be able to claim or take over the BC/California area and set up a Japanese colony.

 

[1234muse]

Okay, for people who aren't reading it carefully, it wasn't Shizuko who came up with the gun but her "uncle" who actually does have significant understanding of modern military weapons from studying it in the 21st century. Shizuko just runs the factories making the guns. Even the biocoke came from him.

she also has a big book of military tech
this does push my suspesion of disbelief since this manga has been decently "realistic"(ha. as if)
I'm just not sure this is something they should be able to do at this stage

 

[MangaRockRefugee]

she also has a big book of military tech
this does push my suspesion of disbelief since this manga has been decently "realistic"(ha. as if)
I'm just not sure this is something they should be able to do at this stage

Handcrafted example of copycat tech with pretty much all the thinking already done is not that farfetching

 

[sssr]

Once Oda conquerors Japan Shizuko should get him to set his sights on the New World. If they're fast enough they should be able to claim or take over the BC/California area and set up a Japanese colony.

Japan didn't start thinking about colonization until the 1800s, starting with Hokkaido and Okinawa/Ryukyu. The objective of every East Asian major state in the 16th century was to either become independent of or conquer China. Why would anyone want to cross the goddamned Pacific and build up stuff from scratch if there's a gigantic wealthy superstate that HAD been conquered by much smaller nations in the past? Everyone remembered and wanted to become Genghis Khan. Nobody cared about some faraway land across the ocean. For that matter, nobody cared about land that was right next door. Historically both Hideyoshi and Ieyasu could have easily taken over Hokkaido and the Ryukyus in their lifetimes. Neither tried. Even Date Masamune, who actually did have ambitions of colonization thanks to his closeness to the Spanish, only established trading posts in Hokkaido.

Even if Shizuko could convince Oda to try to cross the Pacific, it technically wasn't possible yet at this time for the Japanese. The Manila Galleon, the first regular shipping activity between Asia and the Americas, only started in 1565 and was still at a 20% failure rate by the time of Mikatagahara. Also, it's kinda too late for the same reason. The Manila Galleon passed through both the BC and Cali areas to get to Acapulco. The Spanish Crown already had influence (and would soon start colonization) in Cali by this time. Cabrillo's expedition was already 40 years in the past.

 

[1234muse]

Handcrafted example of copycat tech with pretty much all the thinking already done is not that farfetching

We’ve discussed the difficulties in making rifles especially in the past- rifles are actually quite hard to machine. I’m not sure how difficult cartridges are, but they’re certainly not easy-

 

[Ebbelille]

We’ve discussed the difficulties in making rifles especially in the past- rifles are actually quite hard to machine. I’m not sure how difficult cartridges are, but they’re certainly not easy-

Paper cartridges are quite simple and well within the reach of japanese 1570s tech. However, metal cartridges in copper or brass is pretty difficult. It requires drawing of the metal, which is similar to stamping, and is actually a rather complex procedure that requires ample industrial infrastructure already in place. It's not really something you can hand craft with a dozen expert artisans.
Example:

 

[danceofmany]

"To this day, historians still puzzle over the incredible mystery that is the sudden and rapid advancement of firearms and other technologies in the Sengoku Era."

Seriously, this is absolutely nuts. I wish a little more of the experimentation side was shown to demonstrate that Shizuko is not some Mary Sue super genius, but whatever.

Part of her isekai package besides seeds with modern day plant variants was a set of books that includes know-how on guns. It's not something she memorized in case she got isekai'd.

 

[sssr]

Paper cartridges are quite simple and well within the reach of japanese 1570s tech. However, metal cartridges in copper or brass is pretty difficult. It requires drawing of the metal, which is similar to stamping, and is actually a rather complex procedure that requires ample industrial infrastructure already in place. It's not really something you can hand craft with a dozen expert artisans.
Example:

The gun in this chapter is based on the early pattern Sharps Rifle which used a paper cartridge. Nitrated paper (the "casing" for a Sharps cartridge) was already independently invented in China in the Song Dynasty and was heavily used in the production of ribbon fuses and bamboo rockets in both the Song and the Yuan. It would not be beyond the capability of Sengoku-era Japanese people to make. The bigger issue would be the production of mercury fulminate for the primer cap. Both desulfurization of mercury and ethanol purification would be very difficult to perform with existing tools in the Sengoku era.

 

[artichoke]

 

[Kazuraki]

Wait, didn't Japan already have steel? Im confused af. At this point I think mangaka doesn't bother researching anymore.

 

[sssr]

Wait, didn't Japan already have steel? Im confused af. At this point I think mangaka doesn't bother researching anymore.

Japan did, but not in the conventional sense. Japanese metalworkers could produce steel, but they did this using iron sand and charcoal in a long-burn tub furnace called a tatara. The tatara produces (it's still used today) a giant blob of mixed ferro-carbon compounds at the bottom which contains iron, unburnt carbon, various impurities, and a small amount of steel. The best of that steel is called tamahagane and is used to produce the cutting edge of bladed weapons. This is why katanas have an iron body and just a bit of steel edge. The tatara simply can't make enough steel to allow for fully-steel blades.

Japanese industrial base in the Sengoku era was very badly lacking in its ability to perform high-temperature metallurgy needed to produce large amounts of steel consistently because of several factors. The most important one is that unlike China Japan had no major coal resources (China was and still is one of the world's largest coal producers). The Japanese archipelago simply didn't have the fuel type needed to run large high temperature furnaces. That's why uncle "invented" biocoke. Coke is a form of processed coal (made using anaerobic distillation) that can generate much higher temperatures when burned than coal straight from the ground. Biocoke is imitation coke made from organic matter (biomass). I was kinda amused reading through the comments because everyone was complaining about the Sharps rifle being way too ahead of its time. Biocoke is a TWENTY-FIRST CENTURY INVENTION. Well, okay, it was first synthesized in the 1960s, but the process to make it viable only came around in Japan in 2005.

If you ever have a chance to visit Japan and want to look at a tatara blob in real life, you actually can. The Japanese Sword Museum has one on permanent display right in front of the entrance. It is located at 1-12-9,Yokoami, Sumidaku, Tokyo 130-0015. Very nice place. Highly recommended. I try to go there every time I visit Tokyo.

 

[MinsangEnrique]

Japanese industrial base in the Sengoku era was very badly lacking in its ability to perform high-temperature metallurgy needed to produce large amounts of steel consistently because of several factors. The most important one is that unlike China Japan had no major coal resources (China was and still is one of the world's largest coal producers). The Japanese archipelago simply didn't have the fuel type needed to run large high temperature furnaces. That's why uncle "invented" biocoke. Coke is a form of processed coal (made using anaerobic distillation) that can generate much higher temperatures when burned than coal straight from the ground. Biocoke is imitation coke made from organic matter (biomass). I was kinda amused reading through the comments because everyone was complaining about the Sharps rifle being way too ahead of its time. Biocoke is a TWENTY-FIRST CENTURY INVENTION. Well, okay, it was first synthesized in the 1960s, but the process to make it viable only came around in Japan in 2005.

Perhaps - they pursued a low volume but high-quality approach for the downstream coke and steel-consuming industries exactly due to these reasons, and that likewise extended to their gunnery and their choice of the Sharps rifle over rifled muskets; they can't pull-off mass-produced rifled musketry when the steel needed to do so doesn't exist in the first place.

 

[sssr]

Perhaps - they pursued a low volume but high-quality approach for the downstream coke and steel-consuming industries exactly due to these reasons, and that likewise extended to their gunnery and their choice of the Sharps rifle over rifled muskets; they can't pull-off mass-produced rifled musketry when the steel needed to do so doesn't exist in the first place.

Rifled muskets were made from wrought iron with only the breech end heat-treated into steel. It's the Sharps rifle that needs steel.

 

[yeahhhhhhhhno]

Shizuko, we need to cook. We're gonna be making crystal meth bio-coke.

 

[GenesisGemini]

Shizuko is Doraemon.

 

[Kazuraki]

Japan did, but not in the conventional sense. Japanese metalworkers could produce steel, but they did this using iron sand and charcoal in a long-burn tub furnace called a tatara. The tatara produces (it's still used today) a giant blob of mixed ferro-carbon compounds at the bottom which contains iron, unburnt carbon, various impurities, and a small amount of steel. The best of that steel is called tamahagane and is used to produce the cutting edge of bladed weapons. This is why katanas have an iron body and just a bit of steel edge. The tatara simply can't make enough steel to allow for fully-steel blades.

Japanese industrial base in the Sengoku era was very badly lacking in its ability to perform high-temperature metallurgy needed to produce large amounts of steel consistently because of several factors. The most important one is that unlike China Japan had no major coal resources (China was and still is one of the world's largest coal producers). The Japanese archipelago simply didn't have the fuel type needed to run large high temperature furnaces. That's why uncle "invented" biocoke. Coke is a form of processed coal (made using anaerobic distillation) that can generate much higher temperatures when burned than coal straight from the ground. Biocoke is imitation coke made from organic matter (biomass). I was kinda amused reading through the comments because everyone was complaining about the Sharps rifle being way too ahead of its time. Biocoke is a TWENTY-FIRST CENTURY INVENTION. Well, okay, it was first synthesized in the 1960s, but the process to make it viable only came around in Japan in 2005.

If you ever have a chance to visit Japan and want to look at a tatara blob in real life, you actually can. The Japanese Sword Museum has one on permanent display right in front of the entrance. It is located at 1-12-9,Yokoami, Sumidaku, Tokyo 130-0015. Very nice place. Highly recommended. I try to go there every time I visit Tokyo.

I see, thank you for taking time to explain to me. I understand better now.

 

[Razgrizone]

"This will change the era"
Thats an understatement.

 

[Carn109]

Gun

 

[Tambrone]

SHIZUKO

DID YOU ADVANCE GUNPOWDER ARMS RACE BY FOUR CENTURIES AGAIN, SHIZUKO???

 

[Basic_human]

Now this is ridiculous

With current technology that's gun would need extra work to make and make it ridiculously expensive.