Tensei Kizoku, Kantei Skill de Nariagaru ~Jakushou Ryouchi o Uketsuida node, Yuushuu na Jinzai o Fuyashiteitara, Saikyou Ryouchi ni Natteta~ - Vol. 1…

[Lord-Raine]

For all of her attempts at being morally self-righteous, it seems to be overlooked that Ars is literally a five year old fucking child, and only Ars knows that he's actually significantly older.

I don't care about the slavery cliche, or how he will obviously buy her and she will obviously start to warm up to him because of that. I don't mind cliches, most of them exist because they are good structures to build or progress a story. What I care about is that she gave this absurd and selfish speech about why a five year old trying to help her is actually the scum of the earth, and not only did she get away with her bullshit, but the author used the main character to confirm that she was morally in the right, even though she obviously was not. For someone demanding that he consider other's circumstances, she was remarkably unwilling to consider the circumstances surrounding a five year old rich child who just wants to help in the best way he can.

I've read too many stories, not even manga, but fantasy and science fiction novels, with that kind of bullshit, where the main character is treated like scum by randos and orbital characters and then the author shoves their ass into the picture by given them a soap box and having the MC agree with them. It's also almost always a female character that does it. I wasted a week of my life reading The Belgariad because it came recommended, and I've also read the entire Wheel of Time series, so I have zero patience for that bullshit anymore, I'm sick to death of it. Keep your moralizing bitch female characters who are Always Right to yourself. It's one of the most obnoxious traits of a Mary Sue, and one that they all share, and while you don't have to be a Mary Sue to do it, you do have to be an author's pet character, and it's ALWAYS a red flag.

The worst part of all is that this isn't even how it happened in the LN, apparently. According to other people posting, when Ars met her in the original, she was already captured and up for sale. So that means this entire insulting sub plot of bullying a 5 year old for wanting to help the homeless and forcing us to listen to a two-chapter long self-righteous speech where the author uses her as a mouthpiece for their own opinions was an unnecessary extra addition. This did not have to exist.

 

[Wulfleyn]

Boi, go break some fucking jaws.

 

[NotFunstuff]

boy oh boy I sure do love me some vtubers

 

[Xoldin]

@Elroy79 No shit slavery still exists. Everyone knows that but that's completely irrelevant to what im trying to say. I'm saying why isekai authors are fetishizing it, hence using slave girls as harem targets and having MCs eagerly participate in buying slave girls. Notice that I'm only saying "slave girls" because those are the only slaves that isekai MCs are interested in saving. I don't mind the protrayal of slavery in mideval/fantasy settings, but what bugs me is that the only slaves isekai authors are interested in saving are those that can be banged.

Like I get it, authors need cute girls to sell books. They don't necessarily need to be slaves girls but I'm assuming Japanese Otakus love the idea of owning cute girls. It's still a pretty disgusting fetish nonetheless.

 

[Elroy79]

@Kuraiaku, Every time slavery comes up in these comments, it turns into "Why did author do this because its bad in our world" type conversations with people imposing their view of slavery on an alien world. So, yes, I brought it up in the conversation because it never gets brought up that it still exists while people are standing on their self-righteous pedestal about it. You didn't say it, yet, but I replied to the implication or I should say preemptively got ahead of the impending conversation about how the author is some type of warped person for including it in a story. Again, you didn't say or do this, I realize that. But yes, you're right, in my haste I could've worded it different. It's out their in the interweb ether now, so oh well. Was not my intention to offend you, was just trying to have a conversation.

@Xoldin, slavery is a horrible thing in reality and you're upset authors write about it in a fantasy setting? You don't see the point of me bringing up IRL here? With IRL we get into not only current slavery, but historical slavery which includes slaves joining historical harems. I'm not saying all authors are this deep, don't get me wrong. I'm saying that if you're writing a story and pulling from a historical-like setting then there's a precedent. There's a precedent even in the modern world, that's also my point. Lastly, there are isekai in which the MC saves male slaves and they join the group, maybe not as a love interest, but as a loyal friend and teammate. I can't think of the name right now, and can't recall if it actually falls in isekai or just fantasy, which brings me to another point I'll make in a moment. But in this story the MC saves a girl slave and a wolfman beastkin like slave and they both join the squad. I don't even think he touches the girl because of her age. He just wanted the wolfman because of his strength and the wolfman was like you have to bring the girl along. About fantasy, it's not just isekais that do this, it happens in the general fantasy genre as well when authors are mimicking what they see or read about in ancient cultures like the Middle East, etc. My overall point is that it makes no sense to be upset about it in a fictional context when the horrendous act is still ongoing in reality and was a reality in history. Even if it's a gimmick used to bring a female character into a harem. Case and point, I'm not a fan of grimdark rape, so I don't read grimdark rape stories just to piss myself off. (Not accusing you of anything, just having a conversation, sad I have to qualify any of this)

@twinklecake, ok, if you say so. I must have triggered you somewhere like the other one in the slavery conversation. Tangential truths? Really? So bringing up realities to people complaining about fictional content is half related when those realities relate to the fictional content? Okay, whatever. See above and below. Sorry I'm not the type of person who resorts to 255 characters to make a point or something like that.

@Rayster, first thanks for not getting offended and having a conversation with me. Second, about Ars and adult minds transported to small bodies in worlds controlled by the authors' whims, you have a very good point there. We can't be dogmatic one way or the other. See below, I give my reason thinking it's more likely the author dropped the ball and/or chooses to have Ars act like a child for convenience at certain points.

About Charlotte, I get it, there's a reason for her distrust, but there's also inherent reasons around the entire event that could challenge her distrust like Ritsu, Ars actually offering a better comeback in words and actions, etc. We agree overall here as well. Put it this way, and I'm being vague on purpose, but coming from a, I'll say, particular group of people in the West who see themselves as constant victims of another particular group of people due to something our ancestors went through (slavery and racism) I hear this kind of logic all the time from adults even. The entire argument is wrapped up in their own prejudices and racism although they believe they can't be racist themselves for reasons and then I see the "I don't trust anything because it's controlled by them" mentality constantly keep them down and from achieving anything, essentially it's mental slavery keeping them in poverty. Not only that, the conversation regarding slavery is only narrowed to the Atlantic slave trade, never ventures beyond that making them feel like the only people to ever have it done to them and when you bring up the history and current reality of slavery...well...now I'm ranting. You get my point.(Indirect qualification of myself in regard to the impending continued slavery conversation as well, sorry to put you through this. You had nothing to do with it. So sad that people can't just have conversations these days.)

@ka-ka-kaitouu, Also, thanks for having a conversation and not getting triggered. As far as Charlotte goes, forgive me if this is repetitive, but I only came after the girl's argument because of the way the author presented it. Had he presented as an actual 10-12 year old making the argument, I'd have left it alone, although disagreed with her. Rayster made a good point about the readers having the omnipresent-god-like-perspective versus her perspective and you did as well bringing in an understanding of vassals into the conversation. So I get that she had an experienced reason, just feel like now, the author should've presented it a bit better, but hey, it's a run of the mill isekai and I know how those go so ¯\_(ツ)_/¯.

I can see how Ars' revelation is likely more about his thought process in regard to his goal, but he took action on it so I don't think he was just putting it off as an eternal unreachable goal, so I would question the author making him think like that after the encounter with Charlotte. I do agree that his internal conflict is more about how he didn't realize there were more problems going on than just defending his people, etc.

Good point that the letter rankings aren't really quantified for us so we don't know what they actually correlate to aside from Ars' interpretation of them and he only looks at the high ranks. He briefly compared them to numbers in the first chapter, but it wasn't a one for one trade off. Ars just seems to see B, A, and S as good to great and it correlates to them being good at the thing, like the bow gu. While anything below B-S seems to be not good or average.

@Rayster, @ka-ka-kaitouu, looking back, this page in chapter 1 generally gives me doubt about Ars simply being a toddler and raises my suspcion that the author just forgot, in this particular instance, or from here on when he wants to forget it, that Ars is actually a 35 year old man in a boys body. Not only that, but he would be considered a genius in his world and has learned enough as with his 35 year old man mental capacity to be able to deal with certain things. Don't get me wrong, he wouldn't be able to deal with everything, but a philosophical argument shouldn't trip him up so easily.

@Lord-Raine, I agree with most of what you said. Disagree about the Mary Sue bit, at least for now.

 

[FgoSegul]

NOOOOOOO, DONT TAKE THE VTUBER BAG!!!!! YOU CANT RETURN FROM THAT HELL!

 

[Nora_1_2_3]

okay there's more drama in the comments than i thought there'd be

 

[Kuraiaku]

@Elroy79 no problem, it's fine actually since you've cleared it up nicely. I know it's very easy to get misunderstood with text-only communication without any gestures/tone to differentiate the intention.

 

[Xoldin]

@Elroy79 So I can't criticize isekai slavery because slavery still exists? IRL slavery sucks and I'm not ignoring it but that doesn't mean I can't criticize isekai slavery. And yeah, I was mostly generalizing in my previous response. There's no doubt that there's some isekais that doesn't do the slave girls trope and I respect those stories. Also I don't absolutely despise the trope, more like annoyed. There's still some really good isekai stories that uses the slave girls trope, so i read them. (Shield Hero for example) Others like "I'm a NEET but when I went to Hello Work I got taken to another world" (isekai names sucks lol) I drop almost instantly.

 

[ae0n]

yup, `disappointed ars` is my new spirit animal.

 

[Elroy79]

@Karuaiku, No problem, understood.

@Xoldin, you're free to criticize just like I'm free to criticize your criticism. I understand you being annoyed about it. I just think at this point in the life of the genre it's become a moot argument. Again, for example, I dislike lolis and shotas, so I try my best to refrain from them despite the fact they're a stable part of anime/manga culture and you can go into any story without them and then BAM! they show up out of no where. But, I refrain from going into a story knowing there's one in it or that a story revolves around, say lolis, then going into the comment section and ranting and raving about how I think it can potentially symbolize fetishes people hide in real life when it comes to preadolescent attraction and I think arguments made in defense of lolis and shotas are pretty weak, but at the end of the day lolis and shotas exist in fiction although pedophilia, etc. is a reality. I can make the comparisons, but I'd rather be upset about the reality since it harms actual real children. Still, I can criticize the fiction all day long, sure, but it's fiction and I can't complain when someone criticizes my criticism of said fiction. Can debate them, have a conversation, sure. At some point, it becomes a moot issues. Lolis and shotas have existed in anime/manga culture for a while now and Japanese culture is not Western culture, Japanese ideas are not always congruent with Western ideas. Doesn't necessarily make it all right...I'm ranting...sorry.

 

[Narehate]

@Lord-Raine It's not like she herself isn't a victim of the system and incredibly angry at everything while also being a child herself. And even still, the whole "some day? when is someday?" line is because to her he's a naive 5 year-old saying a bunch of shit that she has no reason to believe he can ever accomplish. Vague promises of this sort from someone like him are just meaningless platitudes. It's narcissistic, self-satisfactory BS meant to satisfy their own ego (from her perspective).

She didn't have to be so harsh, sure, but at best he's just some dumb naive kid who thinks he's going to change shit even if his intentions are in the right place, and even if he does end up changing things, it'll be so far down the line, how worth it would it be anyways? At absolute worst he's one of this rich evil bastards who are just going to sell her off again and it's obvious that she doesn't trust the rich for shit.

I haven't actually read the LN so I don't know how this went there, but I didn't really have any problems with this scene.

 

[Xoldin]

@Elroy79 I'm not really complaining about your criticism on my comment. I welcome respectful discourse and your choice not to rant on stuff you dislike. But you and I are different people. Stating my criticism on public forums is my way to vent my frustrations on the subject. Sure, its not gonna do anything but I still like to have my opinion heard. Plus it's not like I'm aggressively ranting on every isekai comment section, just the occasional small comments that I dislike the trope.

 

[Elroy79]

@Xoldin, fair enough.

 

[Serverclosed]

These chapter are getting dull, and hell I dislike mc.

 

[lazerus56]

In with @xoldin on this one. This white knight savior trope , not exclusive to isekai fantasy but currently highly prevalent, shows a pattern of fetishization . It's also not that a fantasy world can't have slavery the issue is that it's rarely treated in a way that actually humanize's the enslaved individual or empowers them in any way. Just glorify someone for buying someone else.

 

[AngryFerret]

Jesus I went to the comment section and almost lost a faith in humanity. Ok you can disagree with her rant but at least you should acknowledge it validity.

She has radical left viewpoint and she is trying to stay true to it. Basically she sees the MC offer as a way for him to boost his ego or just to brag about it.

But to elaborate about her world view. She sees the nobles as a main reason why the poor has this horrible life conditions*cough* Walmart or Amazon work conditions*cough*. So working for them would mean betraying her cause. Additional even if some nobles engage in charity it doesn't matter for her as she views it as just their passing hobby that doesn't change anything in a grand scheme.

About the comment that she want change now. Well the same argument used members of civil right movement. They saw atrocities and they want solution immediately as people are literally dying or are mistreated at this moment. They don't want to wait to unforseen future.

So just imagine being a life hardened beggar and some weird, entitled, rich kid just approach you and demand to that you swore a fealty to him. Bulshit you that you have amazing skills, not knowing anything about you. First I would think that the he thinks about you as a prostitute, he want to use you in other way or it was just a swing of his fancy. In her place I would just punch him straight into a face.

 

[Marmot]

So in the WN (or whatever's translated as a web novel), MC does this cliche thing where he goes to a slave market and finds her there. This story is much richer.

Even if it has triggered a flame war

 

[mahtan]

That girl is really stupid...
Even if she hate the nobles or whatever she is clearly in no situation to say no to a job, especially is said job will allow her to take care of the children easier than having to steal while running away from what amount to (unofficial) guards.

@AngryFerret
Yeah... no there is no validity to her rant.
Starting with that the "left" ideology is terrible wrong and mismatch with reality, which means that everything she is doing believing in that is wrong and will not get her anything other than suffering.
Another thing is that "I want change now and not in the future" mentality that I can't even explain how retarded it is. To even believe that it has some worth as a wish shows the person has zero understanding of how the world works and why it works that way and, as consequence, make that person unable to do anything at all about the situation and ultimately end up depending on other people that actually knows what they are doing to accomplish that "ideal". News flash it gets done but not immediately and the "efforts" of the people that "want it now" do more harm than help with it.

People glamorizing that kind of behavior is what lead to what we see nowadays where most of the young population are idiots that chant idealist ideals without realizing that they have already been reached and end up making everything worse for everybody.

 

[abconline]

Man I kind of want him to be like, yo I'm done playing nice, there's a war coming, you either work for me or you and your friends die.