Ueno-kun wa Kaihatsuzumi - Ch. 79 - Now and Forever

[BegoneThoth]

But his relationship won't be sexless or unhappy, as pointed out already, you misread this chapter.



It COULD be a open door, as long as we keep getting new chapters it could always happen but the way things have gone lately makes me believe this is pretty final as far as Ueno and Chisaki's relationship.



Man I feel for Tsubomi fans but sadly we really are past that station at this point.

I don't think it's necessarily a misreading: "Even if...eventually manage to..." We haven't really been shown any great romance between those two.

---

I think it says something that Tsubomi has fans, and that the author made them have so much more chemistry than either of the two love interests. Seemingly accidently if this Moka-End is really the finale at that. Even Chisaki has some fans, partially due to her portrayal as the "main girl". But can you really say that your a fan of this Moka-End? That the readers really feel it? 🥳

Their relationship is shown to be inherently incompatible, and only appealing because they see the other as a way out of what they are. An example, from the chapter titled "Arousal and Compatibility": "I just can't look at you in that way." That's in reference to the yuri girl being so arousing that kissing was enough for him. He can't look at Moka like that because that goes against what his image of her is, fundamentally. 😇
"How do you face the parts of yourself that you hate?" is a central theme of the story. That question reverberates throughout the characters, not just Ueno. But with this Moka-End Ueno's (supposed) answer is "I want to change, together with Manaka-san". But that's a rather immature answer. Or shall we say an undeveloped one. Think about it. There were some comments posted in previous chapters about how Ueno, and Moka, are masochists. So how are they going to "develop"? What's the plan? One of them takes one for the team and becomes a sadist? They alternate? Ueno's extreme masochism is overridden by love of vanilla? There's a reason why so many comments have fretted over possible ntr. 🤗

The fact of the matter is Ueno doesn't need to go on a forlorn quest for happiness. He already found it in Tsubomi. 🥰

 

[MrPP118]

I don't think it's necessarily a misreading: "Even if...eventually manage to..." We haven't really been shown any great romance between those two.

---

I think it says something that Tsubomi has fans, and that the author made them have so much more chemistry than either of the two love interests. Seemingly accidently if this Moka-End is really the finale at that. Even Chisaki has some fans, partially due to her portrayal as the "main girl". But can you really say that your a fan of this Moka-End? That the readers really feel it? 🥳

Their relationship is shown to be inherently incompatible, and only appealing because they see the other as a way out of what they are. An example, from the chapter titled "Arousal and Compatibility": "I just can't look at you in that way." That's in reference to the yuri girl being so arousing that kissing was enough for him. He can't look at Moka like that because that goes against what his image of her is, fundamentally. 😇
"How do you face the parts of yourself that you hate?" is a central theme of the story. That question reverberates throughout the characters, not just Ueno. But with this Moka-End Ueno's (supposed) answer is "I want to change, together with Manaka-san". But that's a rather immature answer. Or shall we say an undeveloped one. Think about it. There were some comments posted in previous chapters about how Ueno, and Moka, are masochists. So how are they going to "develop"? What's the plan? One of them takes one for the team and becomes a sadist? They alternate? Ueno's extreme masochism is overridden by love of vanilla? There's a reason why so many comments have fretted over possible ntr. 🤗

The fact of the matter is Ueno doesn't need to go on a forlorn quest for happiness. He already found it in Tsubomi. 🥰

You make a lot of good points, I just don't think a Tsubomi ending is on the cards at this point.

 

[TroubleFait]

Just dont offscreen Tsubomi losing her virginity, author.

I believe in the threesome!

Ueno and Moka need to accept Tsubomi in their life!

Just take that scene when she walked in on Chisaki and Kanako trying it in bed, replace this with Ueno and Moka. But instead of pushing her out, they invite her in. Happiness needs to be shared!

 

[Late_Komei]

I believe in the threesome!

Ueno and Moka need to accept Tsubomi in their life!

Just take that scene when she walked in on Chisaki and Kanako trying it in bed, replace this with Ueno and Moka. But instead of pushing her out, they invite her in. Happiness needs to be shared!

Well I certainly won't complain if that scene actually happens, lol.

 

[lionemperor90]

Wow, that is it. Chisaki-Ueno master-slave relationship is officially over. With all three bullies leaving him alone, Ueno is finally free....?

Ueno admitting that he probably won't ever lose his desire to bullied by Chisaki is something I always have in mind with the resolution of Ueno's character. Break his programming but embrace his masochism. But in this case, it seems like Ueno might never break his programming, but he's optimistic in finding a way to circumvent it for Moka. If that's so, then I wonder what methods will Ueno do to have sex with Moka properly because it would be a sad ending if Ueno can only have sex with Moka while thinking about his time getting bullied like the time he lost his virginity. Ueno mentioned trying to develop Moka to finding a kink that only he knows about it. Does he expect the same with Moka finding something new for Ueno? If Moka isn't becoming a dom, then maybe Ueno will find arousal of Moka wearing gym clothes...I don't know lol. Hopefully, Ueno and Moka will continue to work hard to find a solution to make the relationship work out.

For Chisaki...I know someone mentioned in an earlier chapter decision wondering why Chisaki never tried bullying someone else before. Now that she broke up with Ueno, she will actively try to find an even better 'Ueno' to bully until the day that they die. No redemption...and she's definitely not apologetic for what she did to Ueno. It's hard to say what changed in Chisaki's character throughout the story unlike Tsubomi for example. She found out what she wants, I guess (make her friends happy). On the 'bright' side, her femdom ways will continue on her new victim or participant if Chisaki didn't have to spend time programming the next (un)forunate dude.

I think Chisaki's friendship with Tsubomi & Kanako will absolutely continue and maybe Moka as well. I like to imagine Chisaki flaunting her new boy toy in the future in front of Ueno to taunt him, lol. We'll see next chapter...

character progression would be accepting that shes basically a dominatrix

 

[chiga-kun]

chapter 80 is

Spoiler

a twisted flashback i didn't get it very well maybe after the traslation it will be easier to understannd

 

[Late_Komei]

chapter 80 is

Spoiler

a twisted flashback i didn't get it very well maybe after the traslation it will be easier to understannd

That scene is an alternate scenario if Ueno didn't stop Chisaki from taking his virginity.

 

[yinkyo]

Welp...I guess I can't haz Ueno having a 4 Dom mommy type of harem, huh.....

 

[Esgar]

I think the end is near and I loved it, Yeah you two very flawed people go be happy. But yeah I love that Ueno understand the power Chisaki has over him but is not letting it control his life anymore and Chisaki finally letting him go so they can both move on and be truly happy.

"Flawed people" is a really interesting way of putting "rapist and her victim" lmao.

 

[Esgar]

You know it's fiction when they are screaming in the middle of the street in an urban area, but there's is nobody around

I mean, it's also a rape victim appealing to his rapist who somehow acts like she is the victim and vows to "be happy" and find another rape victim (who hopefully consents, but seems optional). I would say that it's unrealistic, but considering that she is a woman, I guess it's not too crazy that she gets away with it without any consequences and without ever even apologizing for raping him. This manga and the discussions here have been wild if you really step back and think about it xD

 

[Esgar]

Wow, that is it. Chisaki-Ueno master-slave relationship is officially over. With all three bullies leaving him alone, Ueno is finally free....?

Ueno admitting that he probably won't ever lose his desire to bullied by Chisaki is something I always have in mind with the resolution of Ueno's character. Break his programming but embrace his masochism. But in this case, it seems like Ueno might never break his programming, but he's optimistic in finding a way to circumvent it for Moka. If that's so, then I wonder what methods will Ueno do to have sex with Moka properly because it would be a sad ending if Ueno can only have sex with Moka while thinking about his time getting bullied like the time he lost his virginity. Ueno mentioned trying to develop Moka to finding a kink that only he knows about it. Does he expect the same with Moka finding something new for Ueno? If Moka isn't becoming a dom, then maybe Ueno will find arousal of Moka wearing gym clothes...I don't know lol. Hopefully, Ueno and Moka will continue to work hard to find a solution to make the relationship work out.

For Chisaki...I know someone mentioned in an earlier chapter decision wondering why Chisaki never tried bullying someone else before. Now that she broke up with Ueno, she will actively try to find an even better 'Ueno' to bully until the day that they die. No redemption...and she's definitely not apologetic for what she did to Ueno. It's hard to say what changed in Chisaki's character throughout the story unlike Tsubomi for example. She found out what she wants, I guess (make her friends happy). On the 'bright' side, her femdom ways will continue on her new victim or participant if Chisaki didn't have to spend time programming the next (un)forunate dude.

I think Chisaki's friendship with Tsubomi & Kanako will absolutely continue and maybe Moka as well. I like to imagine Chisaki flaunting her new boy toy in the future in front of Ueno to taunt him, lol. We'll see next chapter...

I really struggle with how the manga tries to portray it as a "relationship". Like, reverse the genders and I think most people wouldnt see it that way at all. It really was just one-sided sexual abuse that made him develop stockholm syndrome, and even now she never apologized, receives no consequences and goes on happily living her life looking for her next victim. It's just... idk.

 

[Esgar]

Preface disclaimer: My reactive humanist defiance towards operant conditioning makes my most-desired isekai goddess power "necromancy" so I can summon the spirit of B.F. Skinner and punch him to death again because of how behaviorism has both obviated the need for any kind of romantic free will and also made American special education's most valiant efforts still racist as fuck
For once I appreciate Ueno's recognition of a behavioral conditioning model of kink acquisition because his assertion to Chisaki is basically "Yup, you did your damage, and I've been 'developed' or 'programmed.' But guess what, bitch? Call me EEPROM 'cause my ass is reprogrammable. I'm gonna be a masochist on my own terms with a girl of my choosing, and you can go kick rocks with those mysteriously-steaming and un-licked feet of yours."

I think we're owed at least one more Chisaki chapter where she reconciles her feelings and actions, because basic reading comprehension and common sense tell us (and the MC) that the lady doth protest too much, methinks, when she asserts that she has no feelings for a fungibly-submissive Ueno, because...

I think one of this series' most yikes-ass takes is going to be a moral equivalence between Ueno and Chisaki on the basis that they're equally "perverse" and that if we're going to be accepting of Ueno's kink, we must therefore accept Chisaki's ドS-ass abuse of him because consent doesn't really factor into traditional understandings of BDSM and their relationship was cool because it was balanced and transactional; if he had himself an orgasm it wasn't rape. Thus, she needs no redemption and any apology would undermine a JP kink-positive reading. I'm dying to see how it ultimately resolves this.

I agree that it's hard to concretely point to any way in which she's grown as a character, because she keeps doing the same shit but with a potentially different understanding of herself and her circumstances that remains unconfirmed, and that's like, nothing.
Why does the triple IPA I'm pounding only come in tallboys? It's like a crime against responsible drinking.

Yeah, it's wild that even in this chapter it appears as if she has some moral high ground "I will show him!" when she is literally his rapist. It's treated as if they are both "responsible" for it and that it was a "relationship" when it was absolutely no such thing. Zero remorse from her, zero consequences, only a "happy ending" where she looks for her next victim, who she will force to be even MORE abused than Ueno. Of course, this time she will try to find someone more willing, but seems optional lmao.

It makes me think back to the douchebag guys who forcefully kissed a girl and how they were portrayed as very serious rapists and were ultimately beat up (by the 100x worse rapist Chisaki). It's just so wild to look at that and then compare it to how Chisaki is treated as some forlorn heroine here, an equal in a partnership. Imagine them being treated the same, with the manga portraying a hope for them to be happy and find other girls to assault? It's just unthinkable.

This isnt SM. SM involves real relationships, consent and communication. This was abuse and only abuse. Any kinks that developed were response to abusive conditioning and not borne from free exploration.

I guess it's just the identity crisis that every femdom manga has. It has to be both fetish fuel and half serious romance which ultimately leads to rapist women being treated like damsels in love entanglements. It just doesnt work imo. But an interesting read nonetheless, even if it is frustrating.

 

[TroubleFait]

It makes me think back to the douchebag guys who forcefully kissed a girl and how they were portrayed as very serious rapists and were ultimately beat up (by the 100x worse rapist Chisaki). It's just so wild to look at that and then compare it to how Chisaki is treated as some forlorn heroine here, an equal in a partnership. Imagine them being treated the same, with the manga portraying a hope for them to be happy and find other girls to assault? It's just unthinkable.

I believe the author is very deliberate in showing the double-standards. Those are twisted people (either twisted by themselves in the case of the trio of bullies, or twisted by them in the case of Ueno), and they have an altered perception of reality.

 

[BegoneThoth]

I believe the author is very deliberate in showing the double-standards. Those are twisted people (either twisted by themselves in the case of the trio of bullies, or twisted by them in the case of Ueno), and they have an altered perception of reality.

Ueno himself states that she was doing the same thing. Her reaction suggests that she at least on some level recognizes it's validity. During their final interaction. 🤓

 

[Esgar]

I believe the author is very deliberate in showing the double-standards. Those are twisted people (either twisted by themselves in the case of the trio of bullies, or twisted by them in the case of Ueno), and they have an altered perception of reality.

I think the author made a good effort when he made that parallel between Chisaki and the douchebag guy, but he dropped the ball with this ending. Chisaki never faces the consequences that that guy did. She is not "beat up" like he was, not even figuratively speaking via the narrative. In fact, she is the one that gets to play the hero and beat those guys up, for doing 0.0001% of what she did.

She is not even made to find remorse or apologize to Ueno. She is framed by the story as some kind of "equal" love rival, when she was nothing but an abuser through and through. She is given a happy ending with the MC basically groveling before her in this chapter as she calls him her slave and claims that she will look for more victims. It leaves a bad taste because the story here does not tackle the double standard; it frames itself in it, as if it's no big deal.

She is framed like a heroine. That's my issue with this. If she was just a twisted rapist who never showed any remorse and was shown as such, I would be fine with the depiction. Instead, she is treated like a damsel in a love entanglement who was "rejected" and is now vowing to rape some other dude. It's off-putting. Contrast that with how the douchebag guy was framed in the story.

 

[TroubleFait]

She is framed like a heroine. That's my issue with this. If she was just a twisted rapist who never showed any remorse and was shown as such, I would be fine with the depiction. Instead, she is treated like a damsel in a love entanglement who was "rejected" and is now vowing to rape some other dude. It's off-putting. Contrast that with how the douchebag guy was framed in the story.

I was disagreeing with you until this point, but now I can't say that you're wrong.

I think the author shines a light one that double standard. When she beats the douchebag up, she feels good about it but we the readers know that she's just as shitty as him.

And a story does not need a totally happy ending. It doesn't need to pu ish her, or to have her reflect, or even for Ueno to realise that he owes her no respect. I'm perfectly happy with him not yet being at a point where can surmount that. It will take time. Heck, he even tells that to her, how he can't erase what she did to him. I think that makes for a great story.

But there's no one to see her for what she is (except maybe Tsubomi?) Moka is a damaged person too, she's not well enough to see this clearly and take her to account. Maybe it would be otherwise if her big sister were to learn about this.

---

Also:

and is now vowing to rape some other dude.

I think she had at least enough character development to avoid doing to someone else what she did to Ueno. She's not completely stupid, she knows that however he "likes" what she's doing to him, he will never stay with her because of what she did to him.

There are people who actually are into that shit, who would happily devote their life to someone who treats them like that. My bet is she'll look for someone like that.

 

[Esgar]

I think she had at least enough character development to avoid doing to someone else what she did to Ueno. She's not completely stupid, she knows that however he "likes" what she's doing to him, he will never stay with her because of what she did to him.

There are people who actually are into that shit, who would happily devote their life to someone who treats them like that. My bet is she'll look for someone like that.

The way she has been depicted in this story makes me believe that she will just go on to abuse another guy. She is showing no remorse at all and she now has a chip on her shoulder to "show him" aka Ueno how much better her life is going to be without him, how she will find a slave to replace him.

Is that the mentality of someone who has seen the error of her ways? She wants to find someone who will be even more of a slave to her. Rather than building a relationship with a guy, built on communication and consent, she is going to focus on finding whoever will be the better slave, discarding (or worse) anyone else. What will happen if the guy she is assaulting next finds something uncomfortable? Will she threaten to abandon him? Will she force herself on him? I think there is a high chance that she will do these things because she wants the perfect slave to flex on Ueno.

And even if she finds that super masochist who will do anything she wants, that will be tragedy in itself. She is not going to be a proper domme, who cares about his comfort and boundaries and about keeping things sane and safe. She will take advantage of that guy and abuse him no matter how dangerous or detrimental it is to his life, focusing only on what she can extract from him. Just like she did with Ueno. Again, she believes that "they're both at fault" and that it was some kind of "relationship."

Remember, she has been shown to be an abuser. Not someone who knows about SM, consent or sane, safe and consensual play. She has shown no desire to change on this front beyond a half-hearted "I will find someone willing." That's not enough for it to not be abuse. Just like Ueno getting an erection was not an invitation to rape. There are plenty of broken men out there who get taken advantage of. For example, men who let themselves be ruined from findom. They get exploited. Just like girls who have been raped and form a complex that predatory men prey on.

So ultimately, she is a "flawed character" (read: rapist) who is shown as being worthy of a happy ending without ever changing anything about herself. Without ever having to face any consequences. That's how she is framed - as if she is mostly fine as she is, equally as flawed as her victim and is deserving of being on equal footing as the other characters. And I find it hard to see how the story makes any effort to point out this double standard in the ending. If anything, it really makes a show of saying "they're both responsible." It's laid on thick in every dialogue leading up to the ending. It was incredibly frustrating to read them saying this and for both the story and people in the comments treating it as "maturity."

If the story wanted to take the serious route properly, it should have kept framing her as just as bad as the douchebag guy (actually much worse). It shouldnt have tried to make a point of "they're both at fault" and it shouldnt have given her this "ride into the sunset" as the MC grovels before her. How she is portrayed to the reader is just as important as how the narrative or the other characters treat her imo. It's the message that the readers receive: she is the same as the douchebag guy but she is exempt from the same scrutiny.

It just comes down the the identity crisis of the story, as I've mentioned elsewhere ¯\(ツ)/¯

 

[Mikael.L]

I thought of a way for the story to continue, though I'll admit to not being too familiar with the full details of everything so it might be impossible: 😶‍🌫️

Ueno is moving out of his apartment that has Chisaki's on it's right. But his new apartment hasn't been detailed. So, in a repeat of the gag from the first chapters, he runs into the trio entering the apartment on his apartment's left: Tsubomi's.
The next story arc would be Ueno & Moka's attempts at a relationship. Yet, as comments have been pointing out, that's quite boring and uninteresting. This would be the theme in-universe. At the same time Tsubomi, who is Ueno's neighbor and rather proactive with hanging out (as seen in the previous chapter with Moka), is consistently interacting with Ueno.
This culminates in the question Ueno poses to himself: "What is this feeling when hanging out with Tsubomi that he doesn't feel when hanging out with Moka?" It's an archetypal realization that everyone probably has seen done in other stories.

Spoiler: Kumanishi Bijutsubu Rafusuke-senpai

This is a point that comes up regarding being drawn.

There's the next story arc. And it's open-ended enough that the author could continue from there. Most importantly, the best girl is now main girl. 😊

Something I forgot about until I saw a comment mention: Tsubomi is a virgin. Ueno is too, if I'm not mistaken. It seems odd that that would be introduced but not used at all outside of some superficial gags. 🧐

Spoiler: RAW spoiler

In the next chapter at the RAW link, Chisaki even asks a "What if?" vis a vis her and Ueno sleeping together during that toilet scene

Or perhaps I'm giving the author too much credit, but they have so far been earning a good amount. Seriously did anyone think when reading the first chapters talking about the stinky feet of the characters that we would get this journey? 🤠



tldr: This resolution is way too boring both meta-wise and in-universe. Tsubomi is best girl. Copium is getting expensive.
🤸‍♀️

Tsubomi for the win but not on this timeline twin 🤞🙏.
She is def no good, i believe she is the most inmature, considering she is conscious of what she's done and not why she did it.

Im pretty sure Tsubomi, who is now trying to get closer to Ueno, feels the same way she did when bullying Ueno... "If i do this then we'll be friends right?"
Its something i've thought for a while now, but in terms of self-grow, she is the one staying behind...

 

[Mikael.L]

I don't think it's necessarily a misreading: "Even if...eventually manage to..." We haven't really been shown any great romance between those two.

---

I think it says something that Tsubomi has fans, and that the author made them have so much more chemistry than either of the two love interests. Seemingly accidently if this Moka-End is really the finale at that. Even Chisaki has some fans, partially due to her portrayal as the "main girl". But can you really say that your a fan of this Moka-End? That the readers really feel it? 🥳

Their relationship is shown to be inherently incompatible, and only appealing because they see the other as a way out of what they are. An example, from the chapter titled "Arousal and Compatibility": "I just can't look at you in that way." That's in reference to the yuri girl being so arousing that kissing was enough for him. He can't look at Moka like that because that goes against what his image of her is, fundamentally. 😇
"How do you face the parts of yourself that you hate?" is a central theme of the story. That question reverberates throughout the characters, not just Ueno. But with this Moka-End Ueno's (supposed) answer is "I want to change, together with Manaka-san". But that's a rather immature answer. Or shall we say an undeveloped one. Think about it. There were some comments posted in previous chapters about how Ueno, and Moka, are masochists. So how are they going to "develop"? What's the plan? One of them takes one for the team and becomes a sadist? They alternate? Ueno's extreme masochism is overridden by love of vanilla? There's a reason why so many comments have fretted over possible ntr. 🤗

The fact of the matter is Ueno doesn't need to go on a forlorn quest for happiness. He already found it in Tsubomi. 🥰

Their way to change its truly an undeveloped one but thats because its their first experience not even a common a relationship and they are conscious of it, even if the answer is far from being clear it was the right phrase "We'll discover pleasures that pierces through our regretful past" (Not said in that manner, i just like that take).

Asides from that i also consider Tsubomi as a potential girl but nothing more, if its about growing then she is at the start line..
I think it may sound exaggerated but, she is full of regrets and thats good, being conscious and apologizing is the correct way.
However, she left aside the reason why she've done that and just that little fragment among the lines is still on its mind inconsciously, that its the origin of those feelings of attraction she has upon Ueno.

Basically she is superficial, she as a person has yet to realize what its beyond obvious, what lies beyond of her good and bad deeds.

 

[BadHaremSchollar]

I kinda expected both to lash put a bit more. But Chisaki lost because she never accepted her own desire for him.