"Hitokiri" Shoujo Koushaku Reijou no Goei ni Naru - Vol. 1 Ch. 3

[namingwrongs]

Do you know what the different between a sword used to kill people and a sword used to kill monsters is? Nothing. It's the same fucking thing. Only, logically, swords and swordmanship/treatises (or kata in Japanese or whatever it's called, I don't know, I haven't touched Japanese martial arts) is based on what? Killing people. That's what they were developed for. When you see the master katana swordsman do all those cool poses and stances and shit, that was developed as part of sword training to do what? To kill people. Swords aren't that good of a weapon for against wildlife, either. Polearms, spears, javelins and bows especially were primarily used on hunts. Why? Because reach. You don't want to be in reach of the bear or whatever creature that's multiple times heavier and stronger than you. (And before I hear the tired old arguments that make me want to stab my eyes out with a pencil like "but this is a manga, so it could be different in their world" - she's using a fucking katana from our world. A katana that was developed and shaped that design to do what? To kill people. Things are going to have shared consistency.) So in either this world OR OURS a sword is exponentially more likely to be used in combat against people than monsters/animals. So, again, why is he making and repairing swords if that's his problem? That's the issue.

So, yes, he has cognitive dissonance. And there are people in the real world that have such contradictory nonsensical takes like this (although mostly regarding firearms).

You're ignoring the fact that fictional works with monsters in them have people using swords, knives, or even their bare hands to fight monsters all the time. They use weapons from our world not because of convergent design, but because those are what the author is familiar with/wants to write about. The entire premise of your argument is false.

 

[7goat]

Blacksmiths make more than just swords, you know. Every hammer, knife, nail, and horseshoe in the village was probably made by him.

I immediately got the vibe that the blacksmith used to make weapons but he had a Tony Stark moment and swore it off entirely as a form of radical pacifism, moving to such a remote village to escape.

I'd read a Tony Stark isekai. Sounds fun.

 

[definitionofinsanity]

They use weapons from our world not because of convergent design, but because those are what the author is familiar with/wants to write about. The entire premise of your argument is false.

Tell me how a katana somehow "works different" because it exists in a fantasy world rather than our own. You can't. It has the same properties, the same design. That being used for human combat against other humans.

So, no, this does not make my argument false in any way shape or form.

Actually, the very fact that you're admitting that the author/mangaka is drawing from our own history torpedoes your argument. But instead of taking a sword design that would possibly be made in their universe to somehow solely fight monsters, they're using weapons we developed for war against what? Humans. Proving my point.

And if you don't believe me, I ask you: what is she fucking doing with her katana in this not-Earth place? Oh, right, fucking killing people with it like what it was designed for here on Earth. I rest my case.

 

[ndcuongvn]

Do you know what the different between a sword used to kill people and a sword used to kill monsters is? Nothing. It's the same fucking thing. Only, logically, swords and swordmanship/treatises (or kata in Japanese or whatever it's called, I don't know, I haven't touched Japanese martial arts) is based on what? Killing people. That's what they were developed for. When you see the master katana swordsman do all those cool poses and stances and shit, that was developed as part of sword training to do what? To kill people. Swords aren't that good of a weapon for against wildlife, either. Polearms, spears, javelins and bows especially were primarily used on hunts. Why? Because reach. You don't want to be in reach of the bear or whatever creature that's multiple times heavier and stronger than you. (And before I hear the tired old arguments that make me want to stab my eyes out with a pencil like "but this is a manga, so it could be different in their world" - she's using a fucking katana from our world. A katana that was developed and shaped that design to do what? To kill people. Things are going to have shared consistency.) So in either this world OR OURS a sword is exponentially more likely to be used in combat against people than monsters/animals. So, again, why is he making and repairing swords if that's his problem? That's the issue.

So, yes, he has cognitive dissonance. And there are people in the real world that have such contradictory nonsensical takes like this (although mostly regarding firearms).

Monster =/= wildlife. There isn't any depiction of what kind of monster there are yet, but if there're goblin, orc or kobold then it make sense that people would fight them with swords. Not to mention, there's magic in the setting of this manga.

"Do you know what the different between a sword used to kill people and a sword used to kill monsters is? Nothing" The same could be said about polearms, spears, javelins and bows. Monsters exist in the setting. so as a blacksmith you have to make weapon, even if you absolutely hate killing human. Because otherwise, your village might be wipe out by monsters. At least, that's what i think happening here.

Again, this is a fictional story, not real life. In real world, there're cognitive dissonance people that you can just randomly encounter out of nowhere. But in fictional stories, authors usually wouldn't add a cognitive dissonance character (or any character with complicated personality) if it doesn't serve any purpose in the story.

 

[k_reads]

"And not just the men, but the women, and the children, too." - Works like a charm on noble women )

No anything but the women

 

[namingwrongs]

Tell me how a katana somehow "works different" because it exists in a fantasy world rather than our own. You can't. It has the same properties, the same design. That being used for human combat against other humans.

So, no, this does not make my argument false in any way shape or form.

Actually, the very fact that you're admitting that the author/mangaka is drawing from our own history torpedoes your argument. But instead of taking a sword design that would possibly be made in their universe to somehow solely fight monsters, they're using weapons we developed for war against what? Humans. Proving my point.

And if you don't believe me, I ask you: what is she fucking doing with her katana in this not-Earth place? Oh, right, fucking killing people with it like what it was designed for here on Earth. I rest my case.

It doesn't need to work differently. It's a very simple device. It has hard core and a sharp edge, and you use it to cut through whatever you want to cut. The thing that makes your argument false is that it was not created or developed in universe for a purpose similar to ours. It was imported whole cloth by a force that probably doesn't care a whit how the design came about. You are assuming the same process went into the weapon existing in their world when it might as well have been that the god of katanas sent a psychic message to some blacksmiths telling them to forge katanas with this design. What it was used for in our world doesn't matter and proves nothing. What matters is not the actual facts of the katana, but the author's image of them.

Furthermore, what one specific person is using a tool for also proves nothing about the intention of its design. People use tools in unconventional manners all the time. Even if you were right about them being designed in universe to fight people, it wouldn't stop people who were already using them to fight from fighting monsters monsters with them successfully. It's not an inherent contradiction for the blacksmith to only want to make weapons for fighting monsters, no matter what form those weapons might take. It's fairly silly for you to insist that any weapon designed for fighting monsters must have some completely unfamiliar and original form when that is almost never seen in fiction - even in stories where people only fight monsters and not each other. That is a waste of the author's time and brain power if they have an actual story they want to tell. All that's necessary is to have something that they and the readers can recognize as a weapon, and the most iconic melee weapons are swords of various stripes.

 

[definitionofinsanity]

Monster =/= wildlife.

Yes, it does. That's an asinine argument. In their world, it is the wildlife.

Again, this is a fictional story, not real life. In real world, there're cognitive dissonance people that you can just randomly encounter out of nowhere. But in fictional stories, authors usually wouldn't add a cognitive dissonance character (or any character with complicated personality) if it doesn't serve any purpose in the story.

...You don't think authors have characters with character flaws that exist in real life in their stories? What... even... How can you even think this?

You realize idiots exist in real life and in fiction, right? Hypocrites exist in real life and in fiction. And there's plenty of shit in stories that does not serve a purpose to the plot or story but are included. This... is not even an argument. And it's not factual.

 

[definitionofinsanity]

It doesn't need to work differently. It's a very simple device. It has hard core and a sharp edge, and you use it to cut through whatever you want to cut. The thing that makes your argument false is that it was not created or developed in universe for a purpose similar to ours.

This is bordering on a circular argument, and it's still baseless. What makes a sickle useful for agriculture is its design. THAT DOES NOT CHANGE if you go to a different world. For instance, are you aware how many cultures independently invented the bow? So, what, do you think some used it differently because it was made on its own and not in the same environment? Like, according to your logic, the difference in a javelin being a javelin is where it's invented. Like a javelin stops being a javelin because it's another world... and we can just willfully fucking ignore that it's the SAME design being used for the SAME purpose but dispute it being related.

...Come on.

She's not using a fucking slab of steel with an edge on it, she's using a katana. It's not -esque. It's not "reminiscent." It's a katana. One that was developed and designed that way for a purpose: fighting humans. That does not change because we moved the fucking venue. A sickle with a curved blade that excels in cutting wheat does not stop being good at that mechanical because we're not on Earth.

Furthermore, what one specific person is using a tool for also proves nothing about the intention of its design. People use tools in unconventional manners all the time.

Then by your logic if it's not Earth, a sickle is a perfect surgeon's tool for operating and doing open heart surgery. Because it could, IN THEORY, be used by a person or culture that just decided that.

Even if you were right about them being designed in universe to fight people, it wouldn't stop people who were already using them to fight from fighting monsters monsters with them successfully.

It would help with natural selection with people that decide to get even more up-close-and-personal with beasts and monsters much larger and stronger than they are.

There's people that have tried hunting grizzly bears with knives in reality - in our own world. The stupidity of it "didn't stop people" from using them that way. The bears did almost exclusively, however.

Somehow, one way or another, the "Hunting Bears With Knives" community got the memo that it's not a good idea and almost no one does it. Strange how that worked itself out. We have thousands of years of using melee weapons against VERY dangerous creatures to humans. Why is it that we very, VERY rarely ever see swords being used despite swords being so ubiquitous to human culture/society/warfare/use for millennia? It's... almost like there's a reason... Much like how the "Hunting Bears With Knives Society" has practically zero members.

It's not an inherent contradiction for the blacksmith to only want to make weapons for fighting monsters, no matter what form those weapons might take.

YES. IT IS. Because he has NO CONTROL over that once it leaves his hands! It's like a gun store having a rack of rifles and shotguns and saying, "How many animals have you killed? Just so you know, I'm against hunting! I won't sell or repair a firearm that is used for it! You can only shoot paper targets with it! Promise!" EVEN THE FUCKING MANGA HIGHLIGHTS THIS STUPIDITY:

This is the person in question playing dumb and inventing reasons not to object or convince themselves.

 

[namingwrongs]

YES. IT IS. Because he has NO CONTROL over that once it leaves his hands! It's like a gun store having a rack of rifles and shotguns and saying, "How many animals have you killed? Just so you know, I'm against hunting! I won't sell or repair a firearm that is used for it! You can only shoot paper targets with it! Promise!"

He's not running a gun store or a weapon store. If he was and he had racks of swords, she could have just bought one and been done with it. She was very explicit about being able to work with any sword. They're trying to special order something that he doesn't usually deal in. If he has anything lying around, it's household tools like the one he lent her.

There's people that have tried hunting grizzly bears with knives in reality - in our own world. The stupidity of it "didn't stop people" from using them that way. The bears did almost exclusively, however.

Somehow, one way or another, the "Hunting Bears With Knives" community got the memo that it's not a good idea and almost no one does it. Strange how that worked itself out. We have thousands of years of using melee weapons against VERY dangerous creatures to humans. Why is it that we very, VERY rarely ever see swords being used despite swords being so ubiquitous to human culture/society/warfare/use for millennia? It's... almost like there's a reason... Much like how the "Hunting Bears With Knives Society" has practically zero members.

I know, right? It's almost like we live in a world governed by the laws of physics where humans have no magical powers and something won't be useful for some specific purpose just because some random person thinks it should be. You know, the kind of world that doesn't serve as a meaningful comparison to theirs.

Then by your logic if it's not Earth, a sickle is a perfect surgeon's tool for operating and doing open heart surgery. Because it could, IN THEORY, be used by a person or culture that just decided that.

Yes. That's what it means when someone writes a fictional story that's not set in our world. They import whatever they want to use from their own knowledge in the ways that they want to use it and it works the way they want it to even if it wouldn't work in our world.

 

[Kagimizu]

I'm going to posit that the reason he doesn't want to repair the sword for her isn't because he's against killing: notice that he asked not "have you killed with this weapon?" but "how many people have you killed with this weapon?". And what was her response?

As everyone has pointed out and happily praised, it was cold-blooded ambivalence.

While it's being interpreted as him not wanting to repair a weapon for killing, I think the more accurate motivation is that he doesn't want to repair a weapon used by someone with no regard for human life. After all, he doesn't know her or her story: sure she might be a bodyguard for a noble, but that doesn't automatically make her a good person. It just makes her someone in a prestigious position. If she spares no thought or consideration for the lives she takes, I can see why he wouldn't want to be responsible for putting a deadly weapon in her hands.

It's like how in most countries, if someone is applying to be a police officer or emergency personnel they (ideally) screen out the ones who have no regard for human life or think nothing of using lethal force at the earliest justification. You want to put those tools in the hands of someone who really understands the weight of what's at stake and how to use it responsibly. Not someone who treats killing people with all the reverence of remembering what they had for lunch a few days ago.

 

[Ritsuaka]

Looks fun so far

 

[TakeiDaloui]

I think part of the blacksmith's argument lies in her response.
A sword can kill. And he can make swords. But what likely bothers him the most is the lack of care she has for those she has killed. That she has killed so many that she doesn't care to count nor even consider the number of lives important. There's no guilt or uncomfortable feelings of taking lives even if necessary, it's just a cold response that indicates the act of killing is so mundane that it is engrained in her very self. So if he made a sword for her, it's purpose would undoubtedly be to kill, not to serve any other purpose such as defending someone via killing, and to do so without any consideration of what it means to take a life.

 

[Siddasloth]

hhhhhnnnnngggggggg
though to be real only an insane person counts their kill imo

Yeah why would you count your kills lmao. Its like a baker keeping count of how much bread they've baked. Real psycho shit would be that.

 

[Siddasloth]

Lol the author is trying so hard hahahaha. Well I guess that's a type of writing on its own. Giving your character weird eyes every now and then while they say benign shit isn't how you make someone look insane hahahaha its laughable. But hey the action is great and the art is fine so I guess I'll stick around for the ride.

 

[ansonh92]

Yes, yes, we know you have plot armor, so hurry up and fight that guy.
God, we are killing so many minor characters in under 5 chapters.

 

[weleasewodger]

Do we dare powerscale the maid and bodyguard?
I think Shurine clears but idk how difficult it would be

Dunno but maid-sans tits are over 9000

 

[weleasewodger]

We see by the dialogue he himself gives, the fact that one of the girls talks to him and she talks to him multiple times about it. I'm sure the maid or whoever talked to him probably brought up the fact that it was needed because she was a bodyguard. Again, the guy doesn't care. If what you're saying is true, throughout the multiple discussions and knowing she was a bodyguard, the guy would have repaired her sword. The fact is he doesn't care because he doesn't want any weapons in the hands of anyone that might kill. Which is silly.

His actions are, indeed, contradictory and he's exhibiting cognitive dissonance.

Your opinion is Blacksmith is silly. He doesn't make weapons for people he considers psychopaths .Bodyguard as she is written is not a psycho path but from their quick interaction he thinks she is.
That's his prerogative. Once he told the bodyguard that, she should have buggered off and gone to find some else to fix her sword.

 

[definitionofinsanity]

Your opinion is Blacksmith is silly. He doesn't make weapons for people he considers psychopaths .Bodyguard as she is written is not a psycho path but from their quick interaction he thinks she is.
That's his prerogative. Once he told the bodyguard that, she should have buggered off and gone to find some else to fix her sword.

It's his prerogative to have cognitive dissonance and to be contradictory, but that doesn't make his stance any less nonsensical. Also your insinuation that he "doesn't make weapons for psychopaths" is baseless because he stated that he does not want to make any weapons that might be used to kill people... despite making and repairing weapons that are designed to do just that. He literally doesn't want to make any weapon for anyone (psychopath or not) that would be used to kill people for ANY reason. He was quite clear on that. So you saying he only doesn't want to do it for psychopaths is baseless and unfounded.
Also, your suggestion that they "just find someone else to do it" is ridiculous because the manga itself pointed out he is literally the only one in the village capable of doing it. Did you not read it?

 

[Ninoren]

Really hope its not gonna devolve into a story where others talk mc out of killing 🤨

That kinda render the main plot point deadge

 

[TheMagnificentSteinerr]

theres good stuff going on here, but something about it feels wrong... like it doesn't really fit together.