I Shaved. Then I Brought a High School Girl Home. - Vol. 4 Ch. 21

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@Aifax

Your view about what a rape is supposed to be is just totally wrong.
"Explicit verbal consent" when coerced into it by threat is not real consent. Above all when the girl is a minor, and is an unstable situation (running from home). That's 2 things that put her in a weakened position in such a situation.

It's as if you were threatening a girl with a knife and asking her to let it be. Even if she would say ok, that's totally a rape.

I hope my daughters won't ever approach someone like you, cause you truly have a rapist mentality.
 
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Damn bruh that's rape but I can tell that if they fight, Yoshida's getting rocked and then the girl is gonna come from behind and hit that other guy with something ultimately knocking him out.
 
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Took a quick look at the comments and I'm saddened to see even more advocacy of violence. What's wrong with you people? Anyhow,

@Ultimaniac "It's as if you were threatening a girl with a knife and asking her to let it be. "

No it isn't. Not only is he not wielding a knife, but he is not even violent, at all.

@Vikingix "when the girl is a minor"

She's either of consenting age or not. Not only the assumption is that she is (apparently not in Tokyo specifically, but that's a separate issue) , but she's also consented in the past, with the same guy. She's saying "Yes" as usual (she's far from pure or innocent) here. Yes means yes.

@bruhclone @nerufu

Not an argument. Uncivil.

@Makinya

Interesting regarding Tokyo (had no clue local laws could override the states on that of all things). Still, ignoring the law, I'd argue morally-speaking she can give consent because she's given it to the same guy before, and because the age difference isn't large (I'm assuming he's 2 years older than her, and keeping in mind she's almost an adult (17); she's not, say, 14).

Now, is the guy Sayu's about to screw again the best example of human being? I'd say he's not, but "he's a sociopath" is hardly a consent-invalidator, not any more than "He's a criminal". Even for convicted people, they aren't banned from having sex for life. Thus the coercion arguments are weak. It's not like he's holding a knife to her throat, or even remotely threatening violence. Sayu's offering nil resistance here. He did not have to press much to obtain what constitutes clear verbal consent.
 
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Gosh, you absolutely don't get it, in such a way this is frightening.
I already told you, but let me tell you once again. You definitely have the mentality of a rapist.

You don't have to be violent to threaten someones. Telling her that she has to invite him if she doesn't want him to put her in troubles, as well as the man hosting her, that's a THREAT.
And she definitely gave this consent only because of this threat, cause she doesn't want Yoshida to have troubles.
Everything in her is rejecting him right now, even him realize that !

He's coerciting her into doing it, against her own volition.
And moreover, yes he's ALSO violent. He tried to physically force his way while she was saying no.

If you believe a rape is just someone hitting a girl and taking her merely by strength, you have it wrong.

I can believe there are some times where there is a grey zone concerning what a rape is or not. But here, it's totally clear, everything constituting a rape is present.
 
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The technical term for what is going on here is "sexual coercion."

It's literally forcing someone to do something they would not normally do by making threats towards them, their relatives, property, or anything basically. It does not have to be through violence. It also does not matter whether she consent in the past or not. This is about right now. So he can fuck off for all I care.

If someone comes up to you and said, "let's have sex." You expressed you don't want to. They then drop the line, "Oh, it would be sad if for some reason you you got in trouble...," or "I would feel bad if your guardian ends up at a police station because..." That's coercion, and in particular, sexual coercion in this case because they intended to have sex with you but you refused.

At least in the US, legally, "sexual coercion" falls under the broad "sexual assault," which "rape" also falls under. To sum it all up, this guy can go fuck himself.


@Aifaix
I don't even understand how you could defend this guy. Throughout the chapter, Sayu was clearly uncomfortable and does not want to do it with him. He fucking knows she does not want to and yet is still pushing for it verbally, emotionally, and physically until she's OK with it. And only reason why she's OK with it is due to fear of hurting Yoshida's current life. There is nothing proper in the entire exchange. That's fucking sexual coercion.

And consenting in the past means jack shit. Are you one of those people that would say "rape" is not possible between legal spouses? Rape is rape. Does not matter if the victim is already your spouse.

If you still think it's proper. Put yourself into her shoes. Think about her she feels emotionally and physically at the moment. Do you like those feelings? But you still said yes to this guy in fear that if you say no, that would put Yoshida, someone you care for, in a bad spot. Yes, you were just sexually coerced into having sex with this guy when normally you would say no.
 
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@Aifaix
A threat doesn't have to be violent to be a threat. You're ridiculous. I really hope you're the shut in basement dweller you sound like. If you go out into public with that mindset it's only a matter of time before you commit a crime and don't even realize it.
 
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@Enternal

At no point have I defended this guy. He's obviously a sad excuse for a human being. But what little pushing he's doing is entirely fair game. He does not actually cross any line there. And she is saying yes.

@Ultimaniac

I had to reread the chapter end to end. There's no threat here. He's not saying "let me do you or else". At most, he's a little rough in his approach, but she is saying yes.

At this point, the guy had long given up. She's inviting him in. If that's not consent, then nothing is.

As for your hopes... I've long left the nest. Sorry to crush your dreams.

@nerufu

You're literally sidestepping and avoiding to address the actual issue there. What a wuss. I hope you're not as spineless AFK.
 
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@Aifaix

After she refused to bring him to her home
Ch20 p28 : If you take me to your place, I won't tell Asami-chan and the manager a thing about our past
Ch20 p29 : But if you don't... I wonder what I'll do ? You understand, right ?
Her reaction
Ch20 p30 : It's obious... that he's threatening me
In the same page we see all her fears in his mind, including police involvement forcing her back to her parents home, and troubles for Yoshida

That's how she consented him to come with her. He directly threatened her for that.

Then at home
Ch21 p10 : He strongly takes her arm, to assert his physical dominance
Ch21 p12 : While he asserts himself she's scared, he forcefully try to kiss her, after explaining he clearly intends to have sex with her
The result is her headbutting him to defend herself.
Ch21 p15 : So that's how much you don't want to do it with me ?

At this point, the no is totally obvious, and he totally realizes it as he says it so himself.
Does he back off ?
No, he continues making his move
Ch21 p16 : He once again come to her, and try to assert his physical dominance, again.
Ch21 p17 : It won't hurts at all, so don't worry

We then see how she's in fear from what's happening, trying to fight against it, until she realizes she wanted to prevent troubles to Yoshida (refering to the threat of the previous chapter)
Ch21 p17 : If I reject him like this, he'll get angry and I don't know how things will turn out.

That's where she's about to give up, for the sake of Yoshida.

So we have several lines crossed here :
- First, a verbal threat that troubles will occur to her and people close to her if she doesn't invite him at her home
- Then, once he made his way to her home, he takes this opportunity of her being alone and defenseless to have sex with her
- She clearly refuses it, but he still try to abuse of his physical power to have his way, totally ignoring what she says and wants
She finally consent to it only because of the 1st threat, which is still there

Threat and then violence by using his strength to overcome what she says, you totally have a rape. And he never gave up on her, assaulting her several times by force.
If you call that "fair game" and "little rough approach", this is were I consider you have yourself a rapist mentality. When you have to threaten a girl to corner her alone, when she says no, when you see you are scaring her, when she's struggling against your grip, where's the hint that it's not a problem to continue this way ?
Do you imagine yourself making such a move on a girl ? Have you already done it ?
 
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@Aifaix was never an argument, just me calling you retarded, as she was blackmailed, didn't want it, the guy knew it, and was still forcing it. thats literally fucking rape
 
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@Vikingix

Point per point.

Ch20 p28 : If you take me to your place, I won't tell Asami-chan and the manager a thing about our past --> A perfectly fine offer. Note how it's deliberately worded in a way that is not a threat, but an offer.
Ch20 p29 : But if you don't... I wonder what I'll do ? You understand, right ? --> If there's any threat, It is implicit, not explicit. I hate this guy but I have to commend his finesse.
Ch20 p30 : It's obious... that he's threatening me --> her thoughts remain in her mind thus irrelevant. We only know about them because the story made a point to include them. Only her acts are important regarding the issue at hand. Keep this in mind.

That's how she consented him to come with her. He directly threatened her for that. --> Unfortunately, your premises have been established as flawed (weak threat, only implicit, made into an offer instead) and thus the conclusion does not follow what's remaining.

Ch21 p10 : He strongly takes her arm, to assert his physical dominance --> Totally fine action if the other party accepts that. Many a girl loves this kind of thing, and they're not exactly strangers. To top it of, there's no resistance from her to talk about.

Ch21 p12 : While he asserts himself she's scared, he forcefully try to kiss her, after explaining he clearly intends to have sex with her. The result is her headbutting him to defend herself. Ch21 p15 : So that's how much you don't want to do it with me ? --> Here, she rejects one advance. If it was me, I'd back off; It's not worth it. But he knows her, so he can possibly interpret this that she's playing hard to get. I don't know enough about their past to judge this.

Ch21 p16 : He once again come to her, and try to assert his physical dominance, again. --> He chose not to back of. Physical dominance part, worked earlier so it's still a valid move here.

Ch21 p17 : If I reject him like this, he'll get angry and I don't know how things will turn out. --> that's just her thoughts, which we only know because of our privilege as readers.

That's where she's about to give up, for the sake of Yoshida. --> She actually gives explicit verbal consent, and thus the courting game ends and whatever begins, except yoshida arrives.

So we have several lines crossed here :
- First, a verbal threat that troubles will occur to her and people close to her if she doesn't invite him at her home --> Unfortunately implicit rather than explicit. And yes, she's weak not to reject him at this point, and this guy is fucked up, but ultimately the end result is she invites him into her place.
- Then, once he made his way to her home, he takes this opportunity of her being alone and defenseless to have sex with her --> Lots of subjectivity here. She took this man home. There's some expectations set. But ultimately, she should simply reject him, yet...
- She clearly refuses it, but he still try to abuse of his physical power to have his way --> He does neither threaten nor hurt her. Establishing physical dominance can just be seen as foreplay.
totally ignoring what she says --> "So that's how much you don't want to do it with me?" hardly counts as ignoring.
She finally consent to it only because of the 1st threat, which is still there --> the "threat", which was weak, not explicit and, to top it off, restricted to a specific action (let him visit her home) is hardly a reason to finally consent. It doesn't even follow, because the request had already been met, has not been renewed and no new threat has been made.

So, yeah, this guy is fucked up, but he plays by the rules, knows very well which boundaries not to cross, and gets clear, undeniable, verbal consent. You might hate him (I don't like him either, poor Sayu), but I have to tip my hat at how neatly he toils the line, and wins the game he seems to have been playing.

Do you imagine yourself making such a move on a girl ? Have you already done it ? --> Irrelevant to the discussion but to soothe your worries: No and no.
 
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Ok, time to stop this bullshit discussion, in your every answer, you are just checking every rape culture boxes (it's not really a threat, oh it's just implicit, wow the guy is smart, forcing his way to a girl is a game, some girls like it physical, etc...)

You speak well so you might look as a wise man to some people, but the truth is that your view over men/women relationship is totally messed up.
End of the discussion for me.
 
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I will lock this thread. I'm tired of the reports it's generating. Either you can block each other or you can go argue about this on Facebook or in youtube comments, because that's the level of trash I'm seeing here.
 
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tenor.gif


Do it!
 
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Plot twist: He's a strong martial artist, and beats the crap out of Yoshida.

This is just a joke, as I do believe this is very unlikely to happen (I suspect Yoshida is smarter than violence-advocating commenters).

But a reminder: Using violence, besides generally wrong, means accepting that you'll likely be met with more violence, and possibly overpowered.
 
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Wow that psycho guy needs to die. But FMC isn’t helping her case either, that was a ducking stupid mistake allowing him back to the apartment, so I lost a good bit of sympathy for her there. Hope she gets her situation sorted and fucks off back to Hokkaido so MC can actually have a decent relationship with someone else. It looks like he’s gonna have to go through some major bullshit because of this FMC’s past mistakes.
 

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