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Hatsukoi Zombie
- Thread starter MangaDex
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i can't help but think that when tarou remembered and kissed ibusuki eve was fulfilled and vanished like a normal love zombie would all that's left is her other more greedy? side that wants to stay forever........i hope that plot point of eve going into a object is not forgotten... and something that eve knows that would make tarou hate her..no idea what that is
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so eve ship is sinking , and ebino ship is doomed to sink , so i jump to the coming-back ibusuki ship ... scratch that fake ass name , i jump to ririsu ship officially .
@helpfulcomrade
Not sure what series you've been reading, but the only one super selfish and immature to the point he's completely unbearable here is Tarou
Not sure what series you've been reading, but the only one super selfish and immature to the point he's completely unbearable here is Tarou
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This is getting creepy...
Alexa, play ME! ME! ME!
Alexa, play ME! ME! ME!
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I don't understand why Ibusuki is getting all of the hate in these last two chapters - she was practically made a liar by the fake/evil Eve. Tarou didn't even let her explain and immediately trusted Eve like an idiot. I don't want Ebino to have a failed relationship since she has genuinely tried not to do any harm to others, but seriously Ibusuki has been suffering for over a decade due to Tarou, and then on top of that, seeing him reject her constantly throughout the series even while knowing he is a she and his first love. Honestly, the two worst people are Tarou and Eve if anything.
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I love how the anti-Eve brigade suddenly crawls out of the woodworks, completely ignoring the obvious fact that what we/Tarou is seeing isn't the real Eve.
@Bramia
Explain your thought process on this to me, because I have no idea how you came to that conclusion. Tarou hasn't even had much of a personality or character for the last several chapters - he's been relegated to an object that the female characters in the story (mostly Ibusuki) have been manipulating and trying to win over.
@darknesspker
"I don't understand why Ibusuki is getting all of the hate in these last two chapters - she was practically made a liar by the fake/evil Eve. "
Ibusuki was a liar and a manipulator with or without negaEve, negaEve just took advantage of it by outing her to Tarou so that she could ruin any trust he had in Ibusuki and remove her as a rival in his attention and affection. That doesn't make Ibusuki an innocent victim.
"Tarou didn't even let her explain and immediately trusted Eve like an idiot."
Ibusuki's been acting suspicious in front of Tarou several times throughout the story, particularly recently when she tried to learn about how to get rid of FLZs from Tarou's father. And it was Ibusuki who fled the situation the moment it went south for her, Tarou didn't have a chance to get her to explain.
"Ibusuki has been suffering for over a decade due to Tarou"
Blatantly false
"and then on top of that, seeing him reject her constantly throughout the series even while knowing he is a she and his first love."
And why wouldn't he reject her? Did she ever make amends with Tarou for suddenly leaving without telling him until the last minute when they were kids? Did she ever make her feelings for Tarou known to him? Didn't she lie to Tarou (along with everyone else) by presenting herself as a boy, and only after it was obvious that he had figured out the truth did she deign to confess it, with no apologies? Honestly, it boggles the mind how ANYONE can root for Ibusuki and think she's deserving of having a relationship with the boy she likes, when she's acted this way towards him throughout the story.
"Honestly, the two worst people are Tarou and Eve if anything."
At this point I'm fairly certain I'm starting to lose Sanity points.
@Bramia
Explain your thought process on this to me, because I have no idea how you came to that conclusion. Tarou hasn't even had much of a personality or character for the last several chapters - he's been relegated to an object that the female characters in the story (mostly Ibusuki) have been manipulating and trying to win over.
@darknesspker
"I don't understand why Ibusuki is getting all of the hate in these last two chapters - she was practically made a liar by the fake/evil Eve. "
Ibusuki was a liar and a manipulator with or without negaEve, negaEve just took advantage of it by outing her to Tarou so that she could ruin any trust he had in Ibusuki and remove her as a rival in his attention and affection. That doesn't make Ibusuki an innocent victim.
"Tarou didn't even let her explain and immediately trusted Eve like an idiot."
Ibusuki's been acting suspicious in front of Tarou several times throughout the story, particularly recently when she tried to learn about how to get rid of FLZs from Tarou's father. And it was Ibusuki who fled the situation the moment it went south for her, Tarou didn't have a chance to get her to explain.
"Ibusuki has been suffering for over a decade due to Tarou"
Blatantly false
"and then on top of that, seeing him reject her constantly throughout the series even while knowing he is a she and his first love."
And why wouldn't he reject her? Did she ever make amends with Tarou for suddenly leaving without telling him until the last minute when they were kids? Did she ever make her feelings for Tarou known to him? Didn't she lie to Tarou (along with everyone else) by presenting herself as a boy, and only after it was obvious that he had figured out the truth did she deign to confess it, with no apologies? Honestly, it boggles the mind how ANYONE can root for Ibusuki and think she's deserving of having a relationship with the boy she likes, when she's acted this way towards him throughout the story.
"Honestly, the two worst people are Tarou and Eve if anything."
At this point I'm fairly certain I'm starting to lose Sanity points.
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@helpfulcomrade I suppose it's a difference of opinions. As for how she was suffering for years, it was because of Tarou that she started seeing ghosts, something that she didn't want to see/experience but was forced to. I agree that Ibusuki is not innocent, I never claimed she was, I was only referring to the recent chapters - she has done wrong as well, that much is obvious. It seems obvious that Eve herself won't get a full physical body, thus cannot be with Tarou in a normal relationship ( I think she'll merge with Ibusuki or something along those lines), so Eve should be helping Tarou stay happy and form real relationships with people that are alive, hence the purpose of the swimming pool plan in the first place (fall for Ebino). It's not like Ibusuki did this w/ the purpose of becoming his gf, otherwise why go through Ebino? Anyways, having a difference of opinion is fine.
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@darknesspker
"As for how she was suffering for years, it was because of Tarou that she started seeing ghosts, something that she didn't want to see/experience but was forced to."
It's not like Tarou knew that Ibusuki would gain the ability to see FLZs when he headbutted her, and he only did it in the first place because he was upset that Ibusuki decided to tell him she was leaving only when it was time for her to leave.
"It seems obvious that Eve herself won't get a full physical body, thus cannot be with Tarou in a normal relationship"
This isn't obvious to me at all - in fact it was only just recently that we saw an instance of Eve being able to touch Tarou. The full potential capabilities of Eve are yet unknown, and are usually revealed to us as the story unfolds. I think it's entirely possible in this setting that there could be a way for Eve to get a real body of her own. However, setting the issue of Eve ever being able to touch Tarou or not aside, Tarou seems perfectly content for him and Eve to just be together. If his grandfather could live a nice full life with his FLZ, why can't Tarou?
It's nice to discuss this with someone who's reasonable for once.
"As for how she was suffering for years, it was because of Tarou that she started seeing ghosts, something that she didn't want to see/experience but was forced to."
It's not like Tarou knew that Ibusuki would gain the ability to see FLZs when he headbutted her, and he only did it in the first place because he was upset that Ibusuki decided to tell him she was leaving only when it was time for her to leave.
"It seems obvious that Eve herself won't get a full physical body, thus cannot be with Tarou in a normal relationship"
This isn't obvious to me at all - in fact it was only just recently that we saw an instance of Eve being able to touch Tarou. The full potential capabilities of Eve are yet unknown, and are usually revealed to us as the story unfolds. I think it's entirely possible in this setting that there could be a way for Eve to get a real body of her own. However, setting the issue of Eve ever being able to touch Tarou or not aside, Tarou seems perfectly content for him and Eve to just be together. If his grandfather could live a nice full life with his FLZ, why can't Tarou?
It's nice to discuss this with someone who's reasonable for once.
@helpfulcomrade
Everything Tarou does is done without giving a single thought about anyone else. He doesn't care about anyone else. That's why I say he's selfish and unbearable.
The most "feelings" we've seen him show are because he gets aroused by Ebino's boobs, gets dazzled by Ibusuki's occasional "cute panels with shoujo filters" and is in "love" with a ghost (?) who only whispers sweet things to his ear.
Conclusion? He's a horny kid with delusional thoughts about women who can't or is too afraid to figure out anything that's been going on around him for the whole series
Everything Tarou does is done without giving a single thought about anyone else. He doesn't care about anyone else. That's why I say he's selfish and unbearable.
The most "feelings" we've seen him show are because he gets aroused by Ebino's boobs, gets dazzled by Ibusuki's occasional "cute panels with shoujo filters" and is in "love" with a ghost (?) who only whispers sweet things to his ear.
Conclusion? He's a horny kid with delusional thoughts about women who can't or is too afraid to figure out anything that's been going on around him for the whole series
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@helpfulcomrade - Fair enough, but, his grandfather still got married after that and had kids (obviously), I really don't see Ibusuki/Ebino/whoever male MC ends up w/ being happy if they're treated as second fiddle so to speak, especially Ibusuki since she can see Eve (very real potential for jealousy). It would essentially be cheating imo, as Tarou would spend time w/ Eve and ignore his significant other. This doesn't seem like a happy ending to me at all, hence why I personally think that Eve and Ibusuki will combine into one being, or the usual route where if Ibusuki becomes the first love + primary love interest once again, Eve disappears. I really can't see Tarou being with anyone other than Ibusuki unless Eve gets a physical body (which I personally don't believe she will).
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Considering Eve is just Tarou's own delusion, her getting a body and then them living happily ever after is probably the worst possible scenario in terms of personal growth (Tarou ends up doing absolutely nothing and gets a girl for no effort)
Tarou would never keep Eve around and found a family at the same time, that's totally not in character since it would be akin to cheating and he's the type to stay faithful to Eve (otherwise it would defeat the whole point of wanting to stay with Eve in the first place)
Let's discard poor Ebino who never had a chance to begin with and was there for the harem+boobs
If the author goes for a happy ending, it'd have to be Tarou + Ibusuki, the question is how is he going to solve the Eve issue:
Ibusuki+Eve merge, Eve falls asleep, Tarou has an epiphany and realises there is something wrong with Eve and he somehow deals with it (that'd be nice if he could be less passive toward the end)
Tarou would never keep Eve around and found a family at the same time, that's totally not in character since it would be akin to cheating and he's the type to stay faithful to Eve (otherwise it would defeat the whole point of wanting to stay with Eve in the first place)
Let's discard poor Ebino who never had a chance to begin with and was there for the harem+boobs
If the author goes for a happy ending, it'd have to be Tarou + Ibusuki, the question is how is he going to solve the Eve issue:
Ibusuki+Eve merge, Eve falls asleep, Tarou has an epiphany and realises there is something wrong with Eve and he somehow deals with it (that'd be nice if he could be less passive toward the end)
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@Bramia
"Everything Tarou does is done without giving a single thought about anyone else. He doesn't care about anyone else. That's why I say he's selfish and unbearable. "
Does this statement take into consideration all of the people that Tarou's helped in regards to FLZ and relationship issues?
"The most "feelings" we've seen him show are because he gets aroused by Ebino's boobs, gets dazzled by Ibusuki's occasional "cute panels with shoujo filters" and is in "love" with a ghost (?) who only whispers sweet things to his ear."
That's only because Tarou's been reduced to an object in the series ever since it turned into a shojo drama and switched focus on the female characters. Tarou's feelings are perfectly understandable and relatable, for the most part he just wants to avoid getting his heart broken again like what happened when Ibusuki left the country without telling him until the last minute. Outside of that, he's comfortable with the thought of spending the rest of his life with Eve, with or without a "normal" relationship - while at the same time constantly wrestling with his thoughts and emotions in regards to his relationships and his future with the three heroines, and that's mostly because everyone around him (aside from Eve) keeps trying to meddle with him. If you're going to dislike anything, dislike how the author's been writing this story ever since the initial chapters & premise and what they've done to the series' original, now-supposed main character.
@darknesspker
"I really don't see Ibusuki/Ebino/whoever male MC ends up w/ being happy if they're treated as second fiddle so to speak, especially Ibusuki since she can see Eve (very real potential for jealousy). It would essentially be cheating imo, as Tarou would spend time w/ Eve and ignore his significant other. This doesn't seem like a happy ending to me at all"
I agree, which is why it's not something I advocate. What I advocate is Tarou being allowed to make his own decisions and be with the person who makes him happy, which is quite obviously Eve - and Eve quite obviously feels the same way (though she's been led to believe this isn't a good outcome mostly through a combination of lack of knowledge on what FLZs are capable of, and Ibusuki's manipulation). Ibusuki and Ebino should respect his wishes and his autonomy over his own life, and stop trying to tear him and Eve apart for selfish/misguided reasons.
As for how the series ends, it wouldn't surprise me at all if the author intends to do some sort of asspull like the theories you've brought up, and present it as a happy ending (or even a bittersweet one) - I've come to expect the worst when it comes to storytelling in media nowadays. At least I would've had a fun ride up until then, and I'd always have my headcanon that Tarou and Eve stayed together and lived happily ever after, whether Eve managed to acquire a real body or not.
@Tepelgil
Eve is more than Tarou's delusion at this point, as has been clearly explained and shown several times in the story at this point. Also, Tarou has had plenty of personal growth and put in plenty of effort throughout the story - I'm not sure how you can claim otherwise unless you've been ignoring everything he's done ever since Eve showed up and he progressively abandoned his 'energy-saving man' ways.
Tarou + Ibusuki is the WORST possible ending at this point, considering the entirety of Ibusuki's actions and behavior which sum up her immature selfishness. She does not deserve to get what she wants and be in a relationship with Tarou at all, and should just fuck off with her mother and leave Tarou, Eve, and Ebino alone. She's a lying, selfish, two-faced, manipulative, self-righteous self-martyr who blames everyone else around her (mostly Tarou) for her misfortunes and takes no personal responsibility. She is a cancer.
"Everything Tarou does is done without giving a single thought about anyone else. He doesn't care about anyone else. That's why I say he's selfish and unbearable. "
Does this statement take into consideration all of the people that Tarou's helped in regards to FLZ and relationship issues?
"The most "feelings" we've seen him show are because he gets aroused by Ebino's boobs, gets dazzled by Ibusuki's occasional "cute panels with shoujo filters" and is in "love" with a ghost (?) who only whispers sweet things to his ear."
That's only because Tarou's been reduced to an object in the series ever since it turned into a shojo drama and switched focus on the female characters. Tarou's feelings are perfectly understandable and relatable, for the most part he just wants to avoid getting his heart broken again like what happened when Ibusuki left the country without telling him until the last minute. Outside of that, he's comfortable with the thought of spending the rest of his life with Eve, with or without a "normal" relationship - while at the same time constantly wrestling with his thoughts and emotions in regards to his relationships and his future with the three heroines, and that's mostly because everyone around him (aside from Eve) keeps trying to meddle with him. If you're going to dislike anything, dislike how the author's been writing this story ever since the initial chapters & premise and what they've done to the series' original, now-supposed main character.
@darknesspker
"I really don't see Ibusuki/Ebino/whoever male MC ends up w/ being happy if they're treated as second fiddle so to speak, especially Ibusuki since she can see Eve (very real potential for jealousy). It would essentially be cheating imo, as Tarou would spend time w/ Eve and ignore his significant other. This doesn't seem like a happy ending to me at all"
I agree, which is why it's not something I advocate. What I advocate is Tarou being allowed to make his own decisions and be with the person who makes him happy, which is quite obviously Eve - and Eve quite obviously feels the same way (though she's been led to believe this isn't a good outcome mostly through a combination of lack of knowledge on what FLZs are capable of, and Ibusuki's manipulation). Ibusuki and Ebino should respect his wishes and his autonomy over his own life, and stop trying to tear him and Eve apart for selfish/misguided reasons.
As for how the series ends, it wouldn't surprise me at all if the author intends to do some sort of asspull like the theories you've brought up, and present it as a happy ending (or even a bittersweet one) - I've come to expect the worst when it comes to storytelling in media nowadays. At least I would've had a fun ride up until then, and I'd always have my headcanon that Tarou and Eve stayed together and lived happily ever after, whether Eve managed to acquire a real body or not.
@Tepelgil
Eve is more than Tarou's delusion at this point, as has been clearly explained and shown several times in the story at this point. Also, Tarou has had plenty of personal growth and put in plenty of effort throughout the story - I'm not sure how you can claim otherwise unless you've been ignoring everything he's done ever since Eve showed up and he progressively abandoned his 'energy-saving man' ways.
Tarou + Ibusuki is the WORST possible ending at this point, considering the entirety of Ibusuki's actions and behavior which sum up her immature selfishness. She does not deserve to get what she wants and be in a relationship with Tarou at all, and should just fuck off with her mother and leave Tarou, Eve, and Ebino alone. She's a lying, selfish, two-faced, manipulative, self-righteous self-martyr who blames everyone else around her (mostly Tarou) for her misfortunes and takes no personal responsibility. She is a cancer.
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@helpfulcomrade
Considering WHY Ibusuki does what she does, it is pretty funny hearing you say she's selfish. But you clearly hate her so there's no point discussing it further.
Eve is ultimately just Tarou's delusions (more or less) She's the perfect picture he formed in his mind of what Eve-chan would have looked like and behaved in the present so of course he would fall for her. That's actually the whole point of growing up, getting over your delusions and get real (go for Ibusuki) or move on (go for Ebino or just get rid of Eve and stay single) If you think that "I want to stay with my perfect delusion all my life" is ok then YOU have some growing up to do.
Considering WHY Ibusuki does what she does, it is pretty funny hearing you say she's selfish. But you clearly hate her so there's no point discussing it further.
Eve is ultimately just Tarou's delusions (more or less) She's the perfect picture he formed in his mind of what Eve-chan would have looked like and behaved in the present so of course he would fall for her. That's actually the whole point of growing up, getting over your delusions and get real (go for Ibusuki) or move on (go for Ebino or just get rid of Eve and stay single) If you think that "I want to stay with my perfect delusion all my life" is ok then YOU have some growing up to do.
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@Tepelgil
Since you're still clearly ignoring the fact that Eve isn't just Tarou's delusion, I suppose there really -isn't- any point in discussing it with you further. Also, there's something to be said about your claim that people have to give up their ideals to 'grow up'. If that's what your idea of growing up is, then I'll happily stay a dreamer and a manchild for the rest of my life. You enjoy the title of 'adult', which you apparently traded for something of actual value.
Since you're still clearly ignoring the fact that Eve isn't just Tarou's delusion, I suppose there really -isn't- any point in discussing it with you further. Also, there's something to be said about your claim that people have to give up their ideals to 'grow up'. If that's what your idea of growing up is, then I'll happily stay a dreamer and a manchild for the rest of my life. You enjoy the title of 'adult', which you apparently traded for something of actual value.
