Have a dedicated button to separate the old comment system from the new system

[shinya78]

Since someone might as well make the suggestion...

Ever since the complaints about the button that used to direct the old comments to the forums are now being used by the new system, and that the old chapter discussion comments are now being buried underneath it. I suggest adding a new button, not unlike the old one, that would serve the purpose of separating the new integrated comments from the old forum comments.

The old button could function the same as before, just rebranded to something different, while the new button would serve for the new integrated comments. For example, forum [Discuss]ions vs casual [Comment]s. (Or use the new button for the old system, whichever is easier for the devs.)

This is effectively a suggestion to rebrand the old chapter comments in the forums reader as DISCUSS(ions), as an example, to differentiate it from the new system that is taking over as the new COMMENT(s).

This would allow users to quickly comment using the new system, while keeping the old system just as easily accessible as it used to for forum discussions, ensuring that both systems could co-exist without so much a fuss.

"Can we have two buttons?": No, it's confusing, and that will lead to a further split of platform vs forums.

Confusing? How?
All this does is give easy access to what still exists as the old forum comments. The sub-forum where these old comments are located is already called Chapter Discussions for that specific reason. Rebranding the old system to something else would clearly tell the user what to expect, light comments about the chapter vs deep discussions about the chapter. Sure, anyone could use either system for whatever purpose with varying degrees of success, but having both options being openly available right in front for everyone to use is better than burying the old function underneath the new one. Users will naturally trickle down to whichever system they want for whichever purpose.

If the idea was having both alive as mentioned by @Bartolumiu

the plan is to keep both the new comments and the forums alive at the same time, with each having its own purpose.
Title and chapter comments on the new system, and general chatting and discussion here in the forums (so yeah, lurkers, you can keep lurking as you've been doing up until now).

Then this should be a no-brainer.

edit:

Hi, I received a developer reply regarding this suggestion, I'll be posting it here:

Have two buttons: one for forums and one for on-site comments on the chapter list items

Unlikely. It'll be confusing. Easy example: "Interesting chapter, let's read the comments... wait, there are two kinds of comments?"

Once again, the reason they give is that it'll be confusing. Citing that their example user would be "confused when they see that there are two kinds of comments now."

How is this a valid reason when:

• Implementing the [new comments system] while keeping the [old "comments" system](forum discussions) alive already establish the fact that there are indeed two kinds of comments now.
• They acknowledged that the button shouldn't open the reader if users only want to read the comments. This is the very same function the old button had, but for chapter discussions in the forums instead, the function already existed.

Hi, I'll post here a reply I received from the developers regarding this suggestion:

Do not open the reader if you just want to read the comments

"Valid. We will be exploring ways of doing this."

• They acknowledged that "read # older comments" should be renamed to indicate that these are the comments in the forums, which are separate from the new system. Surely their example users would see this, become confused, and ask "wait, there are two kinds of comments?".

Hi, I'll be posting here a developer reply regarding this suggestion:

Be explicit about the fact that older comments exist in the forums to prevent confusing it as if you're going to be navigated to the next page of comments.

"Valid. We'll be discussing on the wording side of things and see if we can be explicit with the fact that it is indeed the forums."

• Having two buttons would quickly let users choose whether to access and use the new system[Comments], or the old system[Forums] with a single click. Something the current setup allows for the new system, but an extra step is needed to be done for the old system. Was the plan to make the forum discussions more obscure than ever, by making it one click further away?

The only other valid reason left that I could think of that doesn't go into tinfoil hat territory that would legitimize their claim, is if, and this is a big IF:

• They assumed when the users asked for two buttons, it meant they should share the exact same icons.

To which I say, it should've been obvious that the icons should be different, without the need for us users to spell it out for them. Even then, making a new icon if none currently exists, shouldn't be out of the question.

If they still claim the same reason for refusal, or change goalposts, then by that point maybe it's due time to get the tinfoil hats.

 

[Jergens]

I feel out of the loop. Way back in the before times, we used to have forum-style integrated comments. Why can't we just do that? Why is it either forum comments or integrated social-media-styled comments? Am I stupid?

Integrated comments has always been on the list of things since that message stared you in the face everytime you looked at title comments. When people wanted integrated they wanted what we had in v3. The "damned if you do damned if you dont" attitude only makes sense if people give them shit for what was actually asked for. Twatter posts aint it and getting conflicting responses on their intentions isn't helping. Maybe the people calling the shots now are just too new and dont remember how things were.

 

[BobBiscuit]

Classic move of wanting to get rid of am old feature by hamstringing it so much that users use the inferior new option because it becomes too much of a pain to use the old one and then pretend the users like the new feature better. That's the real reason why they won't add a button that directly links to the forums and why the forum link is at the bottom of the new comment section rather than the top. They want to put up hurdles to reduce forum use as much as possible so they can justify deleting it later.
Sure, I get that you can't develop new features easily for this forum software. But so what? It's a forum, do you really need new features?

Just to add to this, forums have been around since the earliest days of the internet. How is it not easier, and more resource-efficient, to just create your own source code for forums? Or to find a decently functional open-source base to build from?

 

[curvedtree]

You could've just fully read the opening post to save you some trouble, or read this if the post is now too dayum lawng.

Honestly, I wasn't going to write that edit, but I felt like after reading so many people voice their opinion I should stand up as well and even if it isn't much, at least I voiced my concerns, sure MangaCorpo doesn't care about the free user, but

 

[grrman]

Better idea: Just get rid of this new dumbass system.
No one fucking likes it and the forum system was and still is awesome and superior in every way.

 

[grrman]

I see the "channel hopping" as part of the compromise, and I already know fully well how it feels like to be involved with forums for the less popular titles. Neither system would do much for those titles regardless, it all depends on us users.

I can't read any further into as to why they want more site engagement without going into tinfoil hat territory, but at least I'm inclined to believe that with the new system, they intend to welcome a new wave of readers that comes from a younger generation than us old guards. This new wave being the same wave that suddenly burst into the scene after "La Rona". Only time will tell if this new wave will actually come, but yeah, this is all starting to feel like SF6's Modern and Classic styles clashing all over again.


Obligatory reminder that CommentsTM is currently pay-to-beta test, and will be available absolutely free for all regular users when the paying chefs are done cooking.

When they are done cooking? What are they cooking? A slop pot full of crap no one likes?

 

[Dverin_Oshiban_Duren]

Who actually asked for this?

Yeah, most users were okay with what we originally had.

In short, XenForo has problems, some wanted change, they added a new system and people don't like it.

The reason they made a new system was because a lot of users had complaints about XenForo and a while ago, a new comment system integrated with the mainsite and the migration of forum posts or at least switching to a better forum was seen as an idea which would be troublesome but worth it in the long run.

But what we got was... you know.

I don't mind the new thing as long the old thing ain't gone but what bothers me and many others is the poor communication, some not-so-good decisions and bugs (which they are trying to fix)