Maou no Ore ga Dorei Elf wo Yome ni Shitanda ga, Dou Medereba ii? - Vol. 1 Ch. 4 - First Love with a Communication Disorder is like Mouldy Bread 3
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Yeppers, evil church dude just has to be involved up to his neck in the evils, and wants to use the holy knight who looks like she might actually be a Holy Knight to target Zagan since Zagan isn't part of his network; whatever the result, he expects it to work out in his favor, since her ending up teaming up with Zagan is... inconceivable!
Is la sigh. *sigh*
Agree that it's an overused trope.
There is, however, the very real problem that any hierarchical system, regardless of whether it is secular or religious, is prone to being targeted by those who seek power over others; if you don't at some level desire authority over other people, you'll never seek a supervisory position, after all. It becomes a problem when those seeking power in such a hierarchy cease to care about people as individuals, and it's all over when they start to feel that their position in the upper levels of the hierarchy indicates that they are better than others.
If it's a hierarchical religion that embraces an interventionist deity, it's open to abuse by whoever is in the position to be the official interpreter of any messages from that deity. "God wills it" is a pretty heavy trump card, after all, when no one is in a position to dispute your claims as to what God desires. This has been a major problem within Judaism, Christianity and Islam over the centuries. Others as well, but these are the major players that everyone is currently aware of in the 3D world.
Bleh.
Now, if you actually do have an interventionist deity, there's the potential for divine retribution against someone claiming something is the deity's will when it isn't. Of course, there's also the potential that the deity is actually issuing the instructions that the priest claims he's issuing; just because he's God, or a god, doesn't mean he's a good guy.
Is la sigh. *sigh*
Agree that it's an overused trope.
There is, however, the very real problem that any hierarchical system, regardless of whether it is secular or religious, is prone to being targeted by those who seek power over others; if you don't at some level desire authority over other people, you'll never seek a supervisory position, after all. It becomes a problem when those seeking power in such a hierarchy cease to care about people as individuals, and it's all over when they start to feel that their position in the upper levels of the hierarchy indicates that they are better than others.
If it's a hierarchical religion that embraces an interventionist deity, it's open to abuse by whoever is in the position to be the official interpreter of any messages from that deity. "God wills it" is a pretty heavy trump card, after all, when no one is in a position to dispute your claims as to what God desires. This has been a major problem within Judaism, Christianity and Islam over the centuries. Others as well, but these are the major players that everyone is currently aware of in the 3D world.
Bleh.
Now, if you actually do have an interventionist deity, there's the potential for divine retribution against someone claiming something is the deity's will when it isn't. Of course, there's also the potential that the deity is actually issuing the instructions that the priest claims he's issuing; just because he's God, or a god, doesn't mean he's a good guy.
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D'aww. What a cute scene. Equipping a cute girl reduced his charisma penalty and the attunement (Affection) is only growing.
You know, are there any stories where the churches and/or their patron gods aren't evil? I guess there are also neutral ones, so rather, are there any that are genuinely benevolent and uncorrupt (maybe excusing a few lower-ranked scumbags), led by benevolent gods?
You know, are there any stories where the churches and/or their patron gods aren't evil? I guess there are also neutral ones, so rather, are there any that are genuinely benevolent and uncorrupt (maybe excusing a few lower-ranked scumbags), led by benevolent gods?
@Weasalopes
Sorry but i'm a bit trigerred by your statement..
Hierarchial system? What? Sorry but in my religion, we know what each meaning in each text in holy book, and we read it at daily basis.
Sorry but please do not use Fiction Religion as basis to interpret and judge Real Life Religions, it's different
And what you say? Just because he is a god, doesnt mean he's a good guy..
Pfft
Wrong, try to use your logic here
The meaning of god(for me) he know all and he create all, and only one
If he who create all(including Good and evil) and he's a bad guy..
I doubting his divinty? Or whatever is that(i dont know the word in english)
Can he still call himself a god?
And can we still believe he is a god?
Ok,excluding my statement up there, this is my first time reading this manga, and i'm already hooked up
Sorry but i'm a bit trigerred by your statement..
Hierarchial system? What? Sorry but in my religion, we know what each meaning in each text in holy book, and we read it at daily basis.
Sorry but please do not use Fiction Religion as basis to interpret and judge Real Life Religions, it's different
And what you say? Just because he is a god, doesnt mean he's a good guy..
Pfft
Wrong, try to use your logic here
The meaning of god(for me) he know all and he create all, and only one
If he who create all(including Good and evil) and he's a bad guy..
I doubting his divinty? Or whatever is that(i dont know the word in english)
Can he still call himself a god?
And can we still believe he is a god?
Ok,excluding my statement up there, this is my first time reading this manga, and i'm already hooked up
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@strvlan Real world religious texts are just as ficticious as fictional religions. Religion itself is not evil, even in fictional settings; Evil lies in those who manipulate the faith and belief of others for their own ends, as this priest clearly does.
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@Stralvan
Segments of Christianity have taken the position that the official interpretation of doctrine comes from within the ordained clergy; that Catholicism had taken it to the point to forbid translations of the scriptures into the common tongues to insure that interpretation only came from the hierarchy of the church was part of what led to the Reformation.
Various segments of Judaism have also taken this stance at various times. As has Islam.
Other religious traditions have also had it that the interpretation of signs, portents, and messages from the relevant deity were the purview of the priesthood within that faith.
It does happen in this world. It is not only something that happens in works of fiction.
Look at the history of Europe; the stance of the established faith influenced a great many things, and at times the church hierarchy was filled with very unscrupulous individuals who used their position for the aggrandizement of their secular relatives, or their home nation, etc.
It has the potential to become a problem anytime secular policy is required to be in line with religious doctrine, as when this occurs those in the position of interpreting for the deity suddenly gain great temporal power, and, inevitably, some prove unworthy of this responsibility.
Even those worthy of the responsibility, in that they don't abuse it deliberately for the benefit of those they care about, still have the potential to be in error in their interpretations.
One sees it with Islam, in those countries where the religious leadership gains temporal power.
It's happened with Christianity since the early years.
Judaism has had problems with this.
And it doesn't take all that much research to determine that it's been a problem with a great many faiths which developed outside the Middle East.
Any faith which has established doctrine, someone was involved in determining what that doctrine is.
Someone, at a minimum, said, "These writings constitute the Holy Works; all others are in error at some level."
What they selected as being the Holy Writings were those which fell in line with their personal interpretation of the will of their deity.
So long as there is free will, there's the potential for misinterpreting, knowingly or unknowingly, any messages from the deity.
None of this gets into the question of whether the deity has your best interest at heart.
Any deity that actually interacts with their creation has an agenda.
The very act of creation says that there is an agenda, something that made expounding the effort of worth to the deity.
I will admit, I'm most familiar with what has occured within Christianity in Europe and North America. Both from looking at it from the outside, when studying European and New World history, and from within, in that at various times I was an evangelical charismatic, a member of several semi-mainstream Protestant denominations, and LDS. In addition, for a period I was Bahai, and my upbringing was as a Unitarian Universalist.
I've been very fortunate, in that all the religious leadership I had direct contact were good people, sincere in their faith and very well intentioned. However, none of them had temporal authority derived from their religious status.
I keep waffling back and forth in my reaction to how often a corrupt clergy or evil god appears in Isekai; it depends upon how cynical I'm feeling at the time.
All that aside, I too think this manga is worth continuing to read.
Segments of Christianity have taken the position that the official interpretation of doctrine comes from within the ordained clergy; that Catholicism had taken it to the point to forbid translations of the scriptures into the common tongues to insure that interpretation only came from the hierarchy of the church was part of what led to the Reformation.
Various segments of Judaism have also taken this stance at various times. As has Islam.
Other religious traditions have also had it that the interpretation of signs, portents, and messages from the relevant deity were the purview of the priesthood within that faith.
It does happen in this world. It is not only something that happens in works of fiction.
Look at the history of Europe; the stance of the established faith influenced a great many things, and at times the church hierarchy was filled with very unscrupulous individuals who used their position for the aggrandizement of their secular relatives, or their home nation, etc.
It has the potential to become a problem anytime secular policy is required to be in line with religious doctrine, as when this occurs those in the position of interpreting for the deity suddenly gain great temporal power, and, inevitably, some prove unworthy of this responsibility.
Even those worthy of the responsibility, in that they don't abuse it deliberately for the benefit of those they care about, still have the potential to be in error in their interpretations.
One sees it with Islam, in those countries where the religious leadership gains temporal power.
It's happened with Christianity since the early years.
Judaism has had problems with this.
And it doesn't take all that much research to determine that it's been a problem with a great many faiths which developed outside the Middle East.
Any faith which has established doctrine, someone was involved in determining what that doctrine is.
Someone, at a minimum, said, "These writings constitute the Holy Works; all others are in error at some level."
What they selected as being the Holy Writings were those which fell in line with their personal interpretation of the will of their deity.
So long as there is free will, there's the potential for misinterpreting, knowingly or unknowingly, any messages from the deity.
None of this gets into the question of whether the deity has your best interest at heart.
Any deity that actually interacts with their creation has an agenda.
The very act of creation says that there is an agenda, something that made expounding the effort of worth to the deity.
I will admit, I'm most familiar with what has occured within Christianity in Europe and North America. Both from looking at it from the outside, when studying European and New World history, and from within, in that at various times I was an evangelical charismatic, a member of several semi-mainstream Protestant denominations, and LDS. In addition, for a period I was Bahai, and my upbringing was as a Unitarian Universalist.
I've been very fortunate, in that all the religious leadership I had direct contact were good people, sincere in their faith and very well intentioned. However, none of them had temporal authority derived from their religious status.
I keep waffling back and forth in my reaction to how often a corrupt clergy or evil god appears in Isekai; it depends upon how cynical I'm feeling at the time.
All that aside, I too think this manga is worth continuing to read.
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The elf is more than enough.²
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this is so adorable i almost got diabetes. Help me...~ ?
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That was fucking adorable!
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i really like the part where shopkeeper say his gratitude after a year
its refreshing.
its refreshing.
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That’s extremely cute lol
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Why is it always the church, I know they're pedos irl but damn
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corrupted church
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order me one of that "how to talk to whaman" grimoire
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