The Politics Megathread

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Instrumentality Instigator
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I have no idea why you people think that pinging me is a good idea.

@Chrona
Block him or move on.

@Halo
I don't know what troll-y shit you pulled this time, but can you not do whatever bullshit you do that doesn't get me pinged? It happens again, I'll either permanently lock the thread, petition @Ixlone to ban all political topics on MD, and then start permabanning anyone who posts about politics that is unrelated to a chapter discussion thread...or I'll just ban the next person that pings me. Whatever ends up being easiest.

In short, piss off, all of you.
 
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2VVfzPQ.png


Now we know how to make a grand exit.
 
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@EOTFOFYL

People always want the President dead. Do you not remember 4 years ago when there was a protest outside of where Trump was being inaugurated and people set fires to limos?
@youdontknowwho

Lincoln's first inaugural address did not have a substantial military presence in comparison to Biden because he was not at war until April 14th, though he did have more guards than normal. (An armed Calvary and infantry division) Even then, he faced multiple imminent assassination attempts, (Baltimore Plot being the most notable) yet he still faced a crowd of 25,000 people, some of which were armed, and still addressed the people regardless.

The 1865 inauguration was obviously more guarded but that's because there were 3 regiments and several battalions in the capital. Even then he did not completely shutdown the capital and he had a crowd size of about 30,000-40,000.

750px-Abraham_Lincoln_second_inaugural_address.jpg


Biden not only has the capital completely shutdown, but has a superfluous amount of National Guard given the FBI has not found any evidence of a planned threat. He is not at war, and the fact the democrats are paranoid that even the guard might be Trump supporters or Republicans and so is trying to screen them for ideological divergence indicates to me that this isn't like Lincoln's inauguration at all, but more like a purge and a show of force.

Make no mistake, Biden is the bourgeois, who cares not for the working class and just wishes to re-establish the supremacy of the elitism within politics

I feel like people are not giving Trump enough credit for what he has done to America. He changed the lives of so many people. 400,000 people in fact, last time I checked.

You can't blame Trump for COVID. It's a force of nature outside of our control, and most of it's victims had preexisting conditions that it overtook. He had no factor or means by which he could prevent them from dying because the president does not have the authority to do so. It's the job of the states according to the 10th amendments to handle their plans for quarantine and handling of diseases, not the executive brnch.
 
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ban all political topics on MD, and then start permabanning anyone who posts about politics that is unrelated to a chapter discussion thread

completely immature and unnecessary. you have officially killed the thread (which was probably your goal anyway) and are going to incense a lot of people who are already fairly well fired up as a result of this discussion. good to know that the rules kinda don't matter if the mods are mod!

(ban me if you wish, i won't be coming back)
 
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Banning all politics is probably a bad idea because there's mangas that are expressly political or discuss political philosophies, as well as the fact that having a containment thread where people can go would men there's a pressure valve or a more healthy outlet rather than to let it keep building it up.

Plus it would just further pre-existing echo chambers and further any polarization that exists in society
 
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@ItsQuote
If I wanted to kill the thread, I wouldn't have unlocked it several months ago. Stop being stupid.

@Tamerlane
You ban enough people, they get the message. No one is interested in polite political discussion on an Asian cave painting website. You're all too busy fellating Trump or talking about lining libs/trumpers up against the wall to consider that perhaps politeness would be nice. Ix has threatened to shut down the thread permanently and ban politics, and I am now inclined to agree. Also, are you unable to read? I said *anything outside of a chapter discussion thread.*
 
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@Tamerlane I think you completely missed my point. I wasn't arguing about whether the heightened security (or "militaristic takeover" as you put it) around BIden's inauguration is necessary or not. Rather, my first reply was about how you used it to suggest that Biden acts that way because doesn't have the consent of the governed, a.k.a he wasn't democratically elected. I've seen this meme before. Why do you need to mobilize troops at all if people voted for you, right? Following that logic, Lincoln must have cheated his way to the presidency, because a bunch of southern states seceded upon his election and he had to spent most of his term fighting a bloody war against them. It was because Lincoln didn't have consent of the governed, and totally not because the slaveholders couldn't bear the thought of a president that actually saw people as people and tried to negate the election outcome that they didn't like.

Everything about this administration so far is looking entirely corporate, artificial
If that how it looks to you then so be it.
and lacking any actual human support
Which is complete untrue. The fact that I support the upcoming admin is enough to show that you were just making it up. (Last time I looked, I was an actual human)
which makes the fact he's supposedly the most candidate in American History into doubt
The logic here (or rather, the lack of it) makes my head hurt. So you're questioning the integrity of the election based on how the Biden admin (which hasn't really started yet) looks to you? Isn't this the classic "feel > real"? Reality can't be real because it doesn't feel like it to me? Next you'll tell me no one could have voted for Biden because his inauguration is empty. I always think of the corrupt orange menace as a complete POS who is entirely devoid of aptitude and character, and almost everything his admin did was incompetent and/or immoral. I wouldn't entrust my piggy bank to someone I regard as a failure of a human being, so there is no way any sane people would even contemplate voting for him, let alone 75 millions. There is just absolutely no ways he could have won an election before and been the candidate with the second highest number of votes in the entire American history. Am I doing this right?

You mixed what is essentially your vague, subjective opinion regarding appearance (I don't like the way he looks) with a made up fact not based on reality (no one supports him) to come to a conclusion not backed up by previous arguments (He couldn't have got that many votes). The end result is a non sequitur that makes no logical senses but dressed up as a logical argument. That's the part I took issue with.

Regarding covid, I don't think Trump is responsible for 400,000 American death. Just a substantial part of that number. He is the head of the government, the chief executive of the land. How does the President of the United States have no responsibilities at all in dealing with the largest domestic crisis in years? Out of his control? So he was elected to take care of problems arising from himself only? Anything that take more than flipping a switch is out of the question? Whatever happens to "The buck stops here"?

States would struggled regardless. People would die no matter what he did. But it didn't have to be that many. He could have done much better. He could have told his people that it's actually patriotic to wear a damn mask. He could have said "hey, this shit is serious" from the start rather than "keep doing what you're doing because it would go away like a miracle." He could have made an example for everyone and stopped holding super-spreader events with little to no social distancing. Heck, he could have just shut up and not encouraged people to drink bleach. Millions voted for him, believed him, trusted him, emulated him. He could have saved lots of people just by behaving responsibly. If only he could prioritize American lives over his own reelection prospect that he probably feared would be hurt because of the economic downturn. It turned out the economy still went to shit even with Americans dying daily around the country (at the rate of one death per 30 seconds).

But don't listen to my rant, because it's just my subjective opinion. The man himself said keeping the death toll to "only" 100,000 would be a huge success for his administration. We will have been approaching the half million mark by the end of February. The number can speak for itself.
 
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I think you completely missed my point. I wasn't arguing about whether the heightened security (or "militaristic takeover" as you put it) around BIden's inauguration is necessary or not. Rather, my first reply was about how you used it to suggest that Biden acts that way because doesn't have the consent of the governed, a.k.a he wasn't democratically elected. I've seen this meme before. Why do you need to mobilize troops at all if people voted for you, right? Following that logic, Lincoln must have cheated his way to the presidency, because a bunch of southern states seceded upon his election and he had to spent most of his term fighting a bloody war against them. It was because Lincoln didn't have consent of the governed, and totally not because the slaveholders couldn't bear the thought of a president that actually saw people as people and tried to negate the election outcome that they didn't like.

And you missed mine. (Excuse my Lincoln Fanboyism, but I’m a yankee at heart and he’s one of the men in our history I’ve always admired ever since I visited his library and memorial.)

Lincoln, even though he was in a precarious situation, presented himself as a man of the people. He did not close off the capital because of the risks presented to his life because he knew he valued the people of the nation more than his own personal safety. Despite the risks it presented, he still spoke before a mob of thousands of people and did not do so from some far back safe position.

The FBI has stated there’s very little possibility of a credible threat, yet the politicians and the elites of society hide behind chained fences and waste taxpayer funds on tens of thousands of National Guard that lay in the streets as they go home to their mansions. For what purpose? A DRPK style military triumph in order to show the people what would happen if they dare oppose their betters?

No, the context of the situations are wildly different. South Carolina had already declared secession before Lincoln had ever entered office and he had already been brought to death’s door many times on his trip to DC, but he was no coward. Biden closes the capital-the land and government that is owned by the people and for the people-because he is not one who cares for the people but those at the top
Which is complete untrue. The fact that I support the upcoming admin is enough to show that you were just making it up. (Last time I looked, I was an actual human)

You’re taking my slightly hyperbolic point and then using anecdotal evidence in order to disprove a general trend.

My point very clearly is that there’s not the grassroots, working class support you see with Trump. (Hell, just look at the people at the Capitol Hill protest and you’re definitely be aware that these people aren’t the upperclass or intelligentsia in any sense of the term.) People aren’t enthusiastic about Biden, and most of his support in the primaries was corporate and from the Establishment.

There’s not only a lack of enthusiasm from everyone but those as covered in the muck or corruption as he is, like the CCP, but a clear astroturfing and pandering that never actually resolves the core problems of the political system. It’s throwing bread and circuses for the plebeians to keep us docile and in check as he slowly makes sure only corporate interests are solved.

The logic here (or rather, the lack of it) makes my head hurt. So you're questioning the integrity of the election based on how the Biden admin (which hasn't really started yet) looks to you? Isn't this the classic "feel > real"? Reality can't be real because it doesn't feel like it to me? Next you'll tell me no one could have voted for Biden because his inauguration is empty. I always think of the corrupt orange menace as a complete POS who is entirely devoid of aptitude and character, and almost everything his admin did was incompetent and/or immoral. I wouldn't entrust my piggy bank to someone I regard as a failure of a human being, so there is no way any sane people would even contemplate voting for him, let alone 75 millions. There is just absolutely no ways he could have won an election before and been the candidate with the second highest number of votes in the entire American history. Am I doing this right?

You mixed what is essentially your vague, subjective opinion regarding appearance (I don't like the way he looks) with a made up fact not based on reality (no one supports him) to come to a conclusion not backed up by previous arguments (He couldn't have got that many votes). The end result is a non sequitur that makes no logical senses but dressed up as a logical argument. That's the part I took issue with.

You probably haven’t come to this thread often because if you have been here even a day or so ago, you would know I have laid out a lot of empirical data and evidence out in the open. The fact you misrepresent my argument in order to make it seem like it’s based on my subjective whims rather than the point that I am making seems to me like you want to discredit the point rather than address the crux of the argument.

When you’re basically calling a lid early every day, can’t draw a fraction of the crowds Obama did or Trump does, barely had any support in the primaries compared to the opposing party, having little to no voter enthusiasm, having decidedly worse sales of merchandise and worse advertising than Trump, (which tends to be accurate predictors of elections with things like Halloween masks, cookies, merchandise, etc all having a near 100% prediction rate of the President), and yet you not only win but are more popular than any candidate in the nation’s history despite performing worse with every demographic but white men and worse in every city but the ones in the swing states?

Yeah, no, not an argument based solely on how I feel.

I’ll address the COVID claims later but keep beating that strawman, because that’ll surely own the libs
 
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Finally, a mod said what I have been thinking for months!
I feel so happy I could cry
IcyPoliteIndianglassfish-size_restricted.gif

Resist urge to PING to show my appreciation
 
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Alright, I found the answer to all of (my) life's problems after a few hours of searching.

@Tamerlane is going to love this.

The US military has been doing undercover urban exercises in south LA due to "hypothetical urgent matters, i.e. LARPers being taken seriously" and it also explains those annoying and illegally unmarked black helicopters that have been everywhere since last February.

It's the most annoying shit on the planet being woken up at 2AM by this stuff. Bell 407s are extremely loud despite being single props and there is always at least three of these things darting around at any given moment early in the morning.

For anyone wondering how the military has been doing this and been semi-getting away with it, California is under a somewhat strict lockdown for the pandemic and it makes the perfect place for close combat urban guerilla warfare simulations with it being a concrete jungle with endless sprawl.
 
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but can you not do whatever bullshit you do that doesn't get me pinged?

So basically... Do whatever it takes to get him pinged. Your move, shitposters.

Ix has threatened to shut down the thread permanently and ban politics

The loli master has the right idea, it seems... Or maybe Chrona is actually an alt.

the politicians and the elites of society hide behind chained fences and waste taxpayer funds on tens of thousands of National Guard that lay in the streets as they go home to their mansions.

What else is new? Same full-of-love politicians who supported the riots and illegal immigration while safely living in their gated neighborhoods and calling for building bridges on social media. "Thou can cause chaos, just not against me" is the message.

Also: Biden wishes to restore relationship with the media. Lmao. The western, or at least, the American media had shown that they are a bunch of dramatic hypocrites, even went so far as to export drama on social media to other countries. Yeah, a puppet master surely love his puppet.
 
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My man was working overtime while you were bullshitting here:

https://www.whitehouse.gov/briefings-statements/statement-press-secretary-regarding-executive-grants-clemency-012021/
https://www.nytimes.com/2021/01/20/us/politics/trump-pardons.html
...
Among others receiving pardons from Mr. Trump were three prominent Republicans who had served in the House before their convictions. They were Rick Renzi, who was sentenced in 2013 to three years in jail in association with a bribery scheme involving an Arizona land swap deal; Robert Hayes of North Carolina, who pleaded guilty in 2019 to lying to the F.B.I.; and Randall “Duke” Cunningham of California, who pleaded guilty in 2005 to taking $2.4 million in bribes from military contractors.

🦀🦀🦀🦀🦀🦀🦀​

Y8OGkhA.jpg

🦀🦀🦀🦀🦀🦀🦀​

 
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@Halo
Even spicier, rumors of him creating his own party is cropping up.
https://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2021/jan/19/donald-trump-wants-create-new-patriot-party-report/
 
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@EOTFOFYL I wish, but rumors are no better than conspiracy theories.

That inauguration was such a meme. "WE HAVE PROTECTED THE DEMOCRACY" - while standing next to the people they were calling out for attacking the democracy.
 
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@eotfofyl
Give it a year or two until Bernie's base throws a temper tantrum over not getting what they thought they were promised when they voted for the Democrat's version of Trump. There will be so much spin protecting/defending it, you could swear you woke up in Steel Ball Run's version of the US.
 
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@wowfucktron

I was in support of Bernie in 2016, and then he basically submitted to Hillary and went off the deep end, ignoring his anti-establishment policies into a more "controlled opposition" stance and got really woke, and started to seem more and more of a hypocrite.

If they rigged it against Trump, they sure as hell rigged it against Bernie, and either bought him off or shut him up if he wanted any future political ambitions.

@youdontknowwho

Response part 2, electric boogaloo

Regarding covid, I don't think Trump is responsible for 400,000 American death. Just a substantial part of that number. He is the head of the government, the chief executive of the land. How does the President of the United States have no responsibilities at all in dealing with the largest domestic crisis in years? Out of his control? So he was elected to take care of problems arising from himself only? Anything that take more than flipping a switch is out of the question? Whatever happens to "The buck stops here"?

There's only so much a person can feasibly do to stop a force of nature. Can you blame the leaders of a country for the deaths caused by a large earthquake that suddenly arises? Or can you blame the people in charge when some unforeseen disaster like a typhoon or a hurricane rampages the coastline? Sure, you can warn the public, tell the to take precautions, but when you deal with such a large scale of people, it ultimately falls into their hands and the hands of fate to determine what happens, as there will always be those that view your Cassandra Truth with dismal and hand-wave it away.

The entire point of Albert Camus's "The Plague" is that all the attempts to counter the plague is ultimately futile because it's humans trying to control nature or project some sense of order upon it that it cannot adhere to. That's the point of a plague, is that it indiscriminately targets people seemingly arbitrary whether they are rich, poor, innocent, guilty, old, young, etc. You can try to curtail it, try to slow the spread, but it ultimately is a Sisyphean task as the adverse effects to human psychology, economic ruin, and general oppression leads to unrest and disdain, as people are unable to cope with their fates.

Note also that total deaths for 2020 is about ~ 3,187,086 as opposed to ~2,852,609 in 2019 and 2,839,205 in 2018. (source secondary) Given this year had the entirety of US society such down from public life in response to the pandemic, an additional 0.1% fatalities is pretty damn good all things considered.

States would struggled regardless. People would die no matter what he did. But it didn't have to be that many. He could have done much better. He could have told his people that it's actually patriotic to wear a damn mask. He could have said "hey, this shit is serious" from the start rather than "keep doing what you're doing because it would go away like a miracle." He could have made an example for everyone and stopped holding super-spreader events with little to no social distancing. Heck, he could have just shut up and not encouraged people to drink bleach. Millions voted for him, believed him, trusted him, emulated him. He could have saved lots of people just by behaving responsibly. If only he could prioritize American lives over his own reelection prospect that he probably feared would be hurt because of the economic downturn. It turned out the economy still went to shit even with Americans dying daily around the country (at the rate of one death per 30 seconds).

The president, aside from the media's slander, did tell people to wear a mask and he did whenever he wasn't speaking publicly, and to socially distance. He was actively still working with health officials, but the World Health Organization is hard to follow given that they change very frequently due to what they can observe, and their observations are always in flux as an ongoing crisis tends to do with scientists.

If you're going to blame anyone, blame Xi Jinping, who neglected his duty and pretended it didn't exist during the first few months of the virus's existence.

The bleach thing was clearly a joke the Media took out of context, he repeatedly told the American people to do certain actions and to socially distance, and did everything he could to remain constitutional. To have the government expand their power and overreach to deal with a temporary crisis that we may never get back not only lacks foresight but lacks knowledge of how overreach occurs and that tyrants always find a way to justify their growing influence to the public, even if it means crushing the inalienable rights of the general population.

If only he could prioritize American lives over his own reelection prospect that he probably feared would be hurt because of the economic downturn. It turned out the economy still went to shit even with Americans dying daily around the country

Again, according to the constitution, it is the job of the states to deal with any matters not explicitly described, not the federal government. You can't have lockdowns, especially in big cities, and yet blame Trump, who before had record-low unemployment and one of the best economies since the recession, for it when the decision was made independently of any action he could have taken. Either you have COVID restrictions, or you don't.

Biden won't fix it, given he wants to extend the lockdowns, which will only make the corporations richer and more powerful, and shrink the middle class, closing small businesses and increasing tensions as people fall into further material decline, all for a virus with an incredibly high survival rate.
 
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