We Shall Now Begin Ethics - Vol. 1 Ch. 3 - The Ideal Teacher

[criver]

@Ikkakun

you were likely a bully like any other

You don't get to decide that for people you do not know.

I'm just saying, you can't say that you're one of the normal ones that don't bully

I can. I don't go out of my way to intentionally try and harm others. On the other hand you can't make assertions about me, since you do not know me.

when in fact the vast majority of normal people have been unknowingly bullies in one way or another.

You can't be bullying "unknowingly", since the definition of bullying requires intentional actions. Also the "vast majority" of "normal" people are not bullies. See the recent academic publications on the subject, the % is way below 50.

Group of kids messing around with you, so you single one out and then fight them to make them stop.

Depends on what "messing around" includes. Also you do not single out one person, you deal with all of them, even if separately one at a time. And that doesn't apply only when you are the victim. If you are a bystander you should also remind them that this is unacceptable behaviour. The best deterrent to bullying is the bully understanding that this is not acceptable behaviour, and that there are repercussions for it.

Who's to say that from another perspective, you don't just look like some kid who overreacted and resorted to violence over a harmless joke?

I never implied that you should beat up people over jokes. You're simply taking the worst interpretation of what I wrote.

And even if they are beating down on you to begin with, is there literally no other way to handle it? Violence begets more violence.

If the authority figures that are supposed to deal with this do not do their job, then no, there's no better alternative. Ignoring bullying doesn't make it better. Violence doesn't always beget more violence either - revenge does. You need to make sure that the person being punished understands why he's being punished. This will serve as a deterrent the next time he thinks of engaging into anti-social behaviour.

Who's to say they won't just gang up on you later and beat the shit out of you as a group and even worse the next time?

It's possible, but unlikely, especially if you punished them enough the first time, and especially if they are in a group usually.

 

[Ikkakun]

@criver So the kids getting bullied are supposed to systematically single out their bullies and beat them up, and do so not out of revenge, but for the sake of disciplining these bullies on the repercussions of their actions. Like Batman. Because self-righteous bullied kids are gonna be emotionally sound enough that when they do take violence into their own hands, they won't go too far, I'm sure.

Maybe I don't know you but I know people enough to know that even without intentionally trying to harm people, you can still be complicit in bullying. If you've ever badmouthed someone with a small group of others, you think that just stays in your little bubble? That stuff goes around and eventually makes its way back to its target, even if indirectly. Pretty much no one's hands are clean in this, and if you think it's fine because people don't go out of their way to harm others, I think that's just plain naive. That's all I'll say on that.

 

[criver]

@Ikkakun

So the kids getting bullied are supposed to systematically single out their bullies and beat them up,

I am just going to quote myself:

If the authority figures that are supposed to deal with this do not do their job, then no, there's no better alternative.

Unless you want to argue that the better alternative is to ignore the bullying and let it get out of hand. It's detrimental for both parties, so the sooner the ones bullying learn that it is not acceptable and does not go without repercussions the better.

And I would also emphasize that you don't have to be the victim to actually take measures against it:

If you are a bystander you should also remind them that this is unacceptable behaviour.

If the majority stood up against bullies you'd have no bullying occurring, this includes bystanders.

Because self-righteous bullied kids are gonna be emotionally sound enough that when they do take violence into their own hands, they won't go too far, I'm sure.

The longer they wait to put up any resistance, the worse for both parties. Learned helplessness is a thing. Most bullying cases can be resolved just by putting a minimal amount of resistance and not being a craven. That includes the bystanders mind you - it's as much cowardly telling yourself that it is not your problem.

even without intentionally trying to harm people, you can still be complicit in bullying.

Once again - you cannot be unintentionally bullying someone. You can unintentionally hurt someone, but that doesn't fall under the definition of bullying.

if you think it's fine because people don't go out of their way to harm others, I think that's just plain naive.

If you're talking shit about somebody behind their back, then you are going out of your way to try and harm them, even though indirectly. It's pretty clear this is intentional. Though I wouldn't consider this bullying if you're just discussing what anti social behaviours somebody exhibits (and this is indeed the case), I would on the other hand consider it bullying if people are spreading false rumours, or making fun of the disability of others.

 

[laiseran]

Everyone in the comments chapter 1: looks like it'sｂｉｇｂｒａｉｎｔｉｍｅ

Everyone now: lemme tell you about MY opinion on this ethical issue this is literally the worst thing you are actually totally wrong here ...
...so technically speaking it *is* that way and thus I am totally right.

Also man this teacher is such a pseudo-intellectual who doesn't know anything about *real* ethics, I sure am glad I'm nothing like him.

 

[Ekfreet]

@tigerstar186 see? Schools are scummy places with shitty people.

 

[pinkeree]

what is this teacher even teaching? see everyone as good? i’m fine with that every human is innately good the ambiguity between good and bad, however there are some things that are just straight up in the wrong such as bullying. despite the circumstances that forces bullies to bully, unless their life was at gunpoint, I dont understand how u can see someone who terrorizes another’s life for their own emotional stability as good, the victims aren’t even treated as equal in this case, if all humans are inherently good, then why does this inequality from bullying exist? if we were to take this a step even further, how about those rapists in this chapter? How can the teacher just preach to look at everyone good when he just witnessed rape a few days back. Rape definitely cannot be an act committed by a good person. this teacher is nuts

 

[hensin3]

the setting is literally GTO or ass classroom copy pasta, but with more edgy theme.

 

[flaine]

Lmao at this manga.
The Teacher is just aggressively centrist.
The unintentional comedy of this manga's writing due to the author's own narrow portrayal of complex issues is the kind of irony only God can set up.

 

[DustyOldQrow]

look, I'm not gonna say that this manga is one of the best portrayals of ethical quandaries, but some of ya'll need to understand that much of ethics is essentially asking impossible questions just to get people thinking. One of the most famous philosophical and ethical questions ever, Plato's question of "Is something pious because the gods love it or do the gods love it because it is pious?" is simply not meant to have a concrete answer.

 

[maozli]

oh so he did report! that makes me feel... somewhat better i guess...
i'm still worried about the other girl though

 

[sakuchu]

@pinkeree
I think he's trying to say that everyone's the victim and perpetrator of one thing or another. A bully may be the "bad" guy for bullying, but who knows what he may be the victim of outside of school? Abusive parents/family? Severe debt? Neglect? Starvation? Ect. Alternatively, the victim of bullying may become so vindictive of bullies that he'll target his revenge and punishments on them exclusively without regard of what might be the reason for their bullying or the circumstances they may have in their lives, thus he becomes the bully of the bullies, and the cycle loops.
Of course this doesn't excuse their actions or crimes. But ethics allows us to consider both sides of the coin.

What Sensei is saying is that people aren't inherently bad. Everyone has some good in them, it's just a question of are they acting on this virtuous side of themselves.

 

[Doomroar]

A reported school rape!? in a manga!?

Revolutionary, actually never seen before. It is refreshing to see it go this way for once, instead of the typical nothing.

 

[Not-Ak-not]

@Doomroar Now they just need to report it to the police, almost there..

 

[Deathhappens]

I really like how the author frames every new character around the Takayanagi's first speech and how they each perceived it.

 

[Monky]

There is substance in this manga
I like it

 

[Rohan_sensei]

Bro I vibe with this teacher.

 

[akiarag]

wank bank

 

[meyounmycat]

Every chapter is getting better n better !

 

[starch12313]

Fuck im liking this

 

[Arlindo000]

dude... this is gold