Risou no Himo Seikatsu - Vol. 19 Ch. 78 - Their own work

[NotSomeone]

Unless there is outside influence, at most they should only have relitively crude weapons like the bowl style morters/cannons and blunderbuss. Musket style rifles should be rather advanced and a precursor to more modern firearms.

Then we must be reading different manga. Because the central focus of the Twin Kingdoms has always been about the creations of magical tools and weapons. As for magical manufacturing, the current prince is working on that right now in the story. He is even in the Capua palace, researching on how to produce a magical tool that acts like a copy machine. I believe the example given was a device that could endlessly produced fireball wands.

Now iirc, the inspiration for this magical device was another that was able to produce non-magical items by supplying it the raw materials. So I really see no issue in acquiring a couple of magical replicators that would be capable of printing the parts for a few dozen bolt/lever actions rifles.

And as I mentioned in my previous post, the barrels and other parts wouldn't even need to be metal. As long as they could withstand the pressures involved, it would be just as easy to make them from durable wood or bone.

O . o
Because before the MC arrived glass was almost completely unknown to this world? They had yet to reach the level of technology to produce anything more then low quality foggy lumps of glass and sand.

As for why it took so long to reverse engineer, they only had a vod of a glass making competition to work from. Aura was evem pissed because of the ridiculous temperatures needed to properly melt the silica sand. So yeah it's another case of needing to build the tools to build the build the advanced tools to make the things they want.

But lo and behold, once they could produce sufficiently clear glass, they were able to make prefect spheres with few flaws.

Wow... you really didn't bother to read my comment before trying to shit all over it did ya...

I said "At no time was I interested in the why or how they created gunpowder and firearms" and rather then an overview your post came off as a poor attempt to explain your assumptions. Most of which came accrossed as incoherent or just flat wrong.

The prince is trying to create a magic tool that can create magic tools at will. That's different from using magic to turn raw materials into complex objects.
Like I said, if there was such magic that could turn raw material into complex objects, they would just have used that to create glass balls instead of wasting years of research.
It's not about having invented glass. If now they know it exists and that it's made out of silica, why wouldn't they feed silica into the magical "turn this into that" machine? Because it doesn't exist.

And I did bother reading your comment.
I ended my comment giving my overview on the gunpowder situation:

Gunpowder probably wasn't created in the South because people down there can blow each other up with magic if they wanted.
The North is said to be technologically advanced, while the South relies on Magic for most stuff.
Gunpowder could be a recent discovery in the Northern continent, the fact that the Princess's ship doesn't have cannons is indicative. My guess is that the Church in the North is working on things like gunpowder precisely to invade the South without getting ratio'd by magic.

And I used your comment:

Gun powder is dead simple to make from relitively common ingredients.

And it's not like the reaction can't be mimicked in half a dozen ways with magic. So it's something that only becomes relevant if the transmigrator lacks magical ability and needs to fight or if the natives have cooked up gunpowder of their own.

Now that MC has become aware of the issue, he can work to mitigate the excesses of firearms and artillery.

As a base for which to build upon my argument: "Yeah gunpowder is simple to make, it just wasn't made in the South yet because they rely on magic. It could also be that the North just recently discovered it because the Princess' ship has no guns."
That's my previous quote (Gunpowder probably wasn't created...) reduced and digested.
You responded to that saying you had no interest on it, but I didn't make that argument at the behest of your interest, I just added to the conversation because I wanted to.
Now from my understanding, It seems like we're both not native english speakers, so it seems like there's some sort of language barrier thing going on here, because I didn't mean to shit on your comment as much as it seemed to me like you was shitting over mine with the whole "I am not interested" thing.

 

[NotSomeone]

No, he's not a warmonger, and I never said that about him. But you don't need to be a warmonger to take into consideration how your newly adopted homeland is going to protect itself. Also, keep in mind the preceding events that caused that Aura became their Queen in the first place. It was the aftermath of their bloodiest war in history, and Aura was the absolute last of her line from all the others getting unalived in that war.

That said?

In this chapter, we've come across a mercenary on different continent who has the odor of gunpowder lingering around him. This means they have muskets at the very least already. And if they have muskets in the hands of mercenaries, then that means they are not shy about using them!

That, right there all on its own, creates a moral imperative: that no matter how you might feel about warfare, the much greater wrong would be to withhold the knowledge that would give your people an edge. Because for however many lives of soldiers may perish? You can easily multiply that by 10-fold for the number of commoners lives lost should they be conquered.

And that's to say nothing about people taken as slaves.


Yeah, Miserys_End got me there with that one with regards to production and technology. You honestly don't need much. If you already have steel, then you already have sufficient technology to get started.

And yes, rifling is kinda late to the party. But it is the easiest and most simple to implement upgrade to muskets. During the American Civil War they began to implement rifling in muskets, and things went from there.

And I'm not envisioning numbers in the thousands. Hell, if you can make lever-action rifles (even if they're only the single shot breach loaders), then that provides such an edge that a couple of platoons will be all you need. Because in terms of combat? Reloading a musket takes forever.

So that would mean Capua shouldn't need a whole lot. Just a couple of hundred. And that can be easily accomplished in a matter of months with a single workshop of about ten or twenty craftsmen and metal smiths.

I didn't argue you said Zen was a warmonger. What I meant by that is: If you are not war-minded, creating a weapon of mass destruction could bring a heavy toll into your mental health. Gunpowder is the genesis of modern warfare, some authors like John Milton and Cormac McCarthy attribute it's creation (literaly and figuratively) to the Devil.

And having "steel" is one thing, people had steel thousands of years before gunpowder. Having high quality steel is something else interely. Yeah you could use some sort of super fantasy material instead, but wouldn't that be rare? At that point, it's just easier to do what Gribeauval did and streamline the production of casted cannons parts so that you can have mobile interchangable artillery. That and making simple matchlocks would already put you way ahead of anyone in this setting.

And even that's all assuming a mediocre burnout Japanese salaryman would know anything about those kinds of things.

 

[Miserys_End]

The prince is trying to create a magic tool that can create magic tools at will. That's different from using magic to turn raw materials into complex objects.

But most single shot rifles are dead simple to make, with very few moving parts. We are not talking about turret mounted autocannons and ballistic anti-missile systems here. Just a simple breach loaded firearm with a few moving parts and prepackaged ammunition would ruin any military that just developed black powder weaponry.

Like I said, if there was such magic that could turn raw material into complex objects, they would just have used that to create glass balls instead of wasting years of research.
It's not about having invented glass. If now they know it exists and that it's made out of silica, why wouldn't they feed silica into the magical "turn this into that" machine? Because it doesn't exist.

It's rather simple, because they didn't know it was possible? Or to put another way, and to keep the explanation as simple as possible for you, if a person had no idea that an egg was edible, why would you expect them to produce omelets?

The same applies here. The Twin Kingdom has no clue how to create clear glass and has to rely on difficult to obtain crystals and gems. It's too the point they were surprised by the diamonds on Aura's wedding ring. Which to me means they lack a method to filter out the impurities from the materials they have available. Some of Jirou's glass marbles OTOH are just pure clear glass with few if any inclusions.

And I did bother reading your comment.
I ended my comment giving my overview on the gunpowder situation:

And I used your comment:

As a base for which to build upon my argument: "Yeah gunpowder is simple to make, it just wasn't made in the South yet because they rely on magic. It could also be that the North just recently discovered it because the Princess' ship has no guns."
That's my previous quote (Gunpowder probably wasn't created...) reduced and digested.
You responded to that saying you had no interest on it, but I didn't make that argument at the behest of your interest, I just added to the conversation because I wanted to.

O . o; yeah... like i said it was a poor attempt based on faulty assumptions.

There is no relation between the Princess's ship carrying blackpowder cannons and the other nations of the northern continent developing it. It simply means her nation doesnt have access to it. As pointed out above, if a random merc has access to firearms, they should have been developed long before she sailed south. So if Freya failed to convey this information to Jirou or Aura, she either thought they already knew, or the author just failed to think it she should know. Or the merc isn't as simple as he was implied to be.

Now from my understanding, It seems like we're both not native english speakers, so it seems like there's some sort of language barrier thing going on here, because I didn't mean to shit on your comment as much as it seemed to me like you was shitting over mine with the whole "I am not interested" thing.

LMAO! Nah. Despite growing up in an english speaking nation, my mother tongue is and will always be Typo.