Risou no Himo Seikatsu - Vol. 17 Ch. 70 - Voyage into the Unknown

[sat129]

Even the manga points it out that MC can't insta cast it

They say that but in all the other scenes he teleports in like under 10 seconds.

 

[DLRevan]

Actually, it's not a very good explanation. I mean, I expected that she didn't consider him a threat to her throne, but definetly not for the reason she stated. Because it's not a valid reason - Puyol must have bloodline magic, he was the second in line to marry her if the MC hapened to refuse and it was already stated that having this ability is an absolute requirement, since the goal is to produce heirs who possess said magic. His might not be as powerful as Aura's or even Zenjiro's, but if he managed to overthrow the current royal family, this point would be moot, since he'd be the the strongest bearer remaining and thus have no trouble being recognized as king.

I don't see your point. Why would being a candidate for king consort make him a potential candidate to be king regnant? It is not like Zenjiro is eligible to be the actual ruling king either, even with bloodline magic. And he's a candidate because he's male and part of a distant royal line, making him the best choice to likely produce a heir with the bloodline magic. That was when there was absolutely zero male bloodline magic holders who could marry Aura. Even if that did happen, it would be based on a hope that such a heir could be produced, not a certainty. And he would still not actually rule, no more than Zenjiro does now.

Her explanation is a truncated version of an explanation I gave in the comments previous chapter which focuses solely on the bloodline magic factor. The longer answer is that Aura has the support of various institutions and conventions, partially due to her family connections, political capital and yes, her bloodline magic giving her legitimacy.

She is implying all of that in her explanation, it is not just about bloodline magic. Puyol cannot overthrow the royal family because he has absolutely no legitimacy in the eyes of the above-mentioned. That is why I described it as an advanced monarchy, akin to something like the Byzantine Empire. In such a country, legitimacy of the reigning monarch is enshrined under multiple layers institutional support. You can't become the monarch just by leading a snap revolution or being 'popular'.

What it is susceptible to, just like in the real world, is transitioning to a constitutional monarchy or republic. That happens when those institutional systems collectively do away with the position of the monarch so that power is shared among more individuals. That happens when the monarch is no longer able to remain an equal or greater partner among those sub-leaders, in which case power transfers one step down and is re-distributed. That won't happen in this kingdom, because conveniently, bloodline magic is useful and unique, and cannot be replicated by the current level of technology. In the real world, its usually because the monarch is filthy rich and controls the national treasury and/or has religious legitimacy which is a special factor in itself.

They also won't elevate one of their own, like Puyol, as a new singular leader (at least deliberately) because it changes nothing about the status quo except to benefit a rival and to lose all the benefits of political connection from the previous monarchy. They'd never do it.

And that links all the way back to her choosing Zenjiro. He actually has weaker actual blood ties to the royal family than other candidates. Now you might think, doesn't that put her in an unstable situation? Are there threats from people like Puyol who could at least reason out some legitimate claim if he tried to execute a coup d'état? No, you would be looking at it the wrong way in that case. Actually, the fact that she could push through her agenda to become the reigning Queen, as well as choose her husband of choice, demonstrates the stability of her claim to the throne among all those supporting factors.

So Aura's throne is stable. In fact it couldn't be more stable under such a system. Her issues lie in the smooth running of her country, not in keeping her throne. That ship has long since sailed, the moment she chose a husband who was not within the current aristocracy and cemented the precedent of being a female reigning monarch. That is why she basically laughs off the notion when Zenjiro brings it up.

 

[finalm]

I don't see your point. Why would being a candidate for king consort make him a potential candidate to be king regnant? It is not like Zenjiro is eligible to be the actual ruling king either, even with bloodline magic. And he's a candidate because he's male and part of a distant royal line, making him the best choice to likely produce a heir with the bloodline magic. That was when there was absolutely zero male bloodline magic holders who could marry Aura. Even if that did happen, it would be based on a hope that such a heir could be produced, not a certainty. And he would still not actually rule, no more than Zenjiro does now.

Her explanation is a truncated version of an explanation I gave in the comments previous chapter which focuses solely on the bloodline magic factor. The longer answer is that Aura has the support of various institutions and conventions, partially due to her family connections, political capital and yes, her bloodline magic giving her legitimacy.

She is implying all of that in her explanation, it is not just about bloodline magic. Puyol cannot overthrow the royal family because he has absolutely no legitimacy in the eyes of the above-mentioned. That is why I described it as an advanced monarchy, akin to something like the Byzantine Empire. In such a country, legitimacy of the reigning monarch is enshrined under multiple layers institutional support. You can't become the monarch just by leading a snap revolution or being 'popular'.

What it is susceptible to, just like in the real world, is transitioning to a constitutional monarchy or republic. That happens when those institutional systems collectively do away with the position of the monarch so that power is shared among more individuals. That happens when the monarch is no longer able to remain an equal or greater partner among those sub-leaders, in which case power transfers one step down and is re-distributed. That won't happen in this kingdom, because conveniently, bloodline magic is useful and unique, and cannot be replicated by the current level of technology. In the real world, its usually because the monarch is filthy rich and controls the national treasury and/or has religious legitimacy which is a special factor in itself.

They also won't elevate one of their own, like Puyol, as a new singular leader (at least deliberately) because it changes nothing about the status quo except to benefit a rival and to lose all the benefits of political connection from the previous monarchy. They'd never do it.

And that links all the way back to her choosing Zenjiro. He actually has weaker actual blood ties to the royal family than other candidates. Now you might think, doesn't that put her in an unstable situation? Are there threats from people like Puyol who could at least reason out some legitimate claim if he tried to execute a coup d'état? No, you would be looking at it the wrong way in that case. Actually, the fact that she could push through her agenda to become the reigning Queen, as well as choose her husband of choice, demonstrates the stability of her claim to the throne among all those supporting factors.

So Aura's throne is stable. In fact it couldn't be more stable under such a system. Her issues lie in the smooth running of her country, not in keeping her throne. That ship has long since sailed, the moment she chose a husband who was not within the current aristocracy and cemented the precedent of being a female reigning monarch. That is why she basically laughs off the notion when Zenjiro brings it up.

I'm only referencing what she said in this particular chapter. Of course a ruler keeps his/her crown because of key supporters and other factors, but that's not the issue here and it's not what she said at all. The conversation went like this: Aura mentioned that Puyol's plan to raise the influence of the military (which he commands) is troublesome and Zenjiro immediately wondered whether he plans to use said military in staging a (obviously through violence) coup. Aura didn't actually anwser this question and just dissmised it by saying "In order to be king here you need bloodline magic, so he could never get recognized". That's all she said in response, the rest is your own justification as to why she doesn't consider him a threat. While I agree with most of it (I've argued pretty much the same in a different thread), it's still not on topic. The topic being - Aura is implying that Puyol has no bloodline magic, which doesn't make much sense.

He never was a "candidate" for the position of reigning king, no one was. It's not something that comes up while the current monarch is alive and well, after all. However, since as Aura claims, it's impossible to rule without bloodline magic, then being a candidate for king consort automatically means that you should have a shot at the throne IF you can get rid of the current regining royals and subjugate the rest of the state - this is the scenario Zenjiro is thinking of. Unless you claim that out of all the candidates, only Zenjiro actually had the magic and the rest were just picked due to their standing? I find that hard to believe, since even Puyol's sister, with a distant relation to royalty (presumably the same as his own) is said to have it and she's not in any position of significance.

 

[RonBWL]

I'm only referencing what she said in this particular chapter. Of course a ruler keeps his/her crown because of key supporters and other factors, but that's not the issue here and it's not what she said at all. The conversation went like this: Aura mentioned that Puyol's plan to raise the influence of the military (which he commands) is troublesome and Zenjiro immediately wondered whether he plans to use said military in staging a (obviously through violence) coup. Aura didn't actually anwser this question and just dissmised it by saying "In order to be king here you need bloodline magic, so he could never get recognized". That's all she said in response, the rest is your own justification as to why she doesn't consider him a threat. While I agree with most of it (I've argued pretty much the same in a different thread), it's still not on topic. The topic being - Aura is implying that Puyol has no bloodline magic, which doesn't make much sense.

He never was a "candidate" for the position of reigning king, no one was. It's not something that comes up while the current monarch is alive and well, after all. However, since as Aura claims, it's impossible to rule without bloodline magic, then being a candidate for king consort automatically means that you should have a shot at the throne IF you can get rid of the current regining royals and subjugate the rest of the state - this is the scenario Zenjiro is thinking of. Unless you claim that out of all the candidates, only Zenjiro actually had the magic and the rest were just picked due to their standing? I find that hard to believe, since even Puyol's sister, with a distant relation to royalty (presumably the same as his own) is said to have it and she's not in any position of significance.

The scenario Zenjirou is thinking of is simply impossible to pull off, is what Aura meant. Look at the Twin Kingdoms, they literally migrated from the North and established themselves as royalty despite the fact that the country was already ruled by the 4 native tribes there. Bloodline magic simply triumphs everything in this world, so even if Puyol gets rid of the entire Royal family, their neighbor kingdoms will simply invade and take over the throne.

 

[finalm]

The scenario Zenjirou is thinking of is simply impossible to pull off, is what Aura meant. Look at the Twin Kingdoms, they literally migrated from the North and established themselves as royalty despite the fact that the country was already ruled by the 4 native tribes there. Bloodline magic simply triumphs everything in this world, so even if Puyol gets rid of the entire Royal family, their neighbor kingdoms will simply invade and take over the throne.

She seems sure that is the case, but not for the reasons you stated. The only reason she gave is that for the people of the southern continent to accept someone as a ruler, that someone needs to have bloodline magic.

As for neighbours invading - this is a world of feudal kingdoms, the only thing stopping them from doing so is the country's ability to defend itself (and the possibility of other countries attacking them, when they are busy with their conquest, I guess). Bloodline magic's role in this haighly depends on what it can do, but I don't think it can actually match the importance of a strong military, much less trump it. Take a look a Aura's: sure the ability to teleport and create temporary barriers is neat, but given their limits, pretty much insignificant in war. I suppose there are the rumors that she can raise the dead, but no monarch would take this seriously without any confirmation.

Now, the bestowal magic of the Twin Kingdoms is impressively useful, since they can create powerful weapons, still it's outright said that without creating loads of magic tools that can make other magic tools (a proposition the current king finds unacceptable) it would be impossible to provide a meaningful amount to gain proper advantage. As such bloodline magic is more of a cultural thing - it's like our world's "divine right to rule" that members of royal families had, or at least convinced the masses that they did. It's possible to regin without it, since the north has not been overrun by anyone from the south. It's just a matter of how a ruler is seen by his people.

 

[DLRevan]

I'm only referencing what she said in this particular chapter. Of course a ruler keeps his/her crown because of key supporters and other factors, but that's not the issue here and it's not what she said at all. The conversation went like this: Aura mentioned that Puyol's plan to raise the influence of the military (which he commands) is troublesome and Zenjiro immediately wondered whether he plans to use said military in staging a (obviously through violence) coup. Aura didn't actually anwser this question and just dissmised it by saying "In order to be king here you need bloodline magic, so he could never get recognized". That's all she said in response, the rest is your own justification as to why she doesn't consider him a threat. While I agree with most of it (I've argued pretty much the same in a different thread), it's still not on topic. The topic being - Aura is implying that Puyol has no bloodline magic, which doesn't make much sense.

He never was a "candidate" for the position of reigning king, no one was. It's not something that comes up while the current monarch is alive and well, after all. However, since as Aura claims, it's impossible to rule without bloodline magic, then being a candidate for king consort automatically means that you should have a shot at the throne IF you can get rid of the current regining royals and subjugate the rest of the state - this is the scenario Zenjiro is thinking of. Unless you claim that out of all the candidates, only Zenjiro actually had the magic and the rest were just picked due to their standing? I find that hard to believe, since even Puyol's sister, with a distant relation to royalty (presumably the same as his own) is said to have it and she's not in any position of significance.

So we both agree her legitimacy to the throne extends beyond the fact that Aura has bloodline magic.

Just because there are other factors doesn't mean that the bloodline magic isn't the most important factor. As I did say in my previous post, the bloodline magic is still the anchor of her legitimate claim to the throne, she has the magic and due to her lineage, has the highest chance of carrying on that bloodline magic to heirs.

The rest of my answer, is that Aura also brings up recognition with an implication that other nobles and officials are the ones to do so. This is where the plethora of other factors come in, but bloodline magic remains the first factor he has to pass to gain recognition.

This is where the threat from Puyol, at least as a candidate for the reigning king, ends. He doesn't have bloodline magic, full stop. Even if his sister has it, he does not. I think you have also confused your own answer....

However, since as Aura claims, it's impossible to rule without bloodline magic, then being a candidate for king consort automatically means that you should have a shot at the throne IF you can get rid of the current regining royals and subjugate the rest of the state - this is the scenario Zenjiro is thinking of.

Are you talking about what Aura is saying or what Zenjiro was thinking then, you kind of changed tack halfway through your own sentence.

I'm going to make an assumption here that you're homing in on the fact that Zenjiro, being able to actually demonstrate the bloodline magic, was chosen as consort for that reason. That is incorrect. Zenjiro was chosen not because of bloodline magic, but because he (ostensibly) had stronger blood ties to the main family. As Aura said at the beginning of the whole story, the fact that Zenjiro was actually able to use the magic despite being a distant descendant was a fortuitous coincidence as it helped to shore up her plan. The consort doesn't actually need to be able to use bloodline magic, and that makes sense as many descendants of branch families and other distantly related royals would have had theirs diluted out. Yes, the rest of the candidates were just picked due to their standing. Zenjiro was technically picked due to his background of being a more direct descendant, even though it wasn't actually true. The reason such a descendant is valued is there's a higher chance of passing on the bloodline magic...since he can actually use it, there is no doubt he is actually the strongest candidate for that purpose regardless of the minutiae of his actual lineage.

So Puyol does not have bloodline magic. He was a consort candidate due to his standing and due to being descended from a distantly related line. He can never be a candidate for the reigning monarch instead of consort. The whole initial problem of succession in this story exists in the first place is because there are NO male holders of the bloodline magic, either in the main or branch families, which is why Aura is the first queen regnant.

 

[DLRevan]

That is an interesting concept, and one that’s sadly outside the scope of this story: how will civilization develop in a world where the divine right of kings is not only real, but trivially provable?

If such a thing really existed, then it's a question that answers itself. Materially, you would bow to divine right because its....more right. Civilization with a true leader of divine providence could only prosper divinely...right? Otherwise there wouldn't be a point to it.

 

[finalm]

So we both agree her legitimacy to the throne extends beyond the fact that Aura has bloodline magic.

Just because there are other factors doesn't mean that the bloodline magic isn't the most important factor. As I did say in my previous post, the bloodline magic is still the anchor of her legitimate claim to the throne, she has the magic and due to her lineage, has the highest chance of carrying on that bloodline magic to heirs.

The rest of my answer, is that Aura also brings up recognition with an implication that other nobles and officials are the ones to do so. This is where the plethora of other factors come in, but bloodline magic remains the first factor he has to pass to gain recognition.

This is where the threat from Puyol, at least as a candidate for the reigning king, ends. He doesn't have bloodline magic, full stop. Even if his sister has it, he does not. I think you have also confused your own answer....

Are you talking about what Aura is saying or what Zenjiro was thinking then, you kind of changed tack halfway through your own sentence.

I'm going to make an assumption here that you're homing in on the fact that Zenjiro, being able to actually demonstrate the bloodline magic, was chosen as consort for that reason. That is incorrect. Zenjiro was chosen not because of bloodline magic, but because he (ostensibly) had stronger blood ties to the main family. As Aura said at the beginning of the whole story, the fact that Zenjiro was actually able to use the magic despite being a distant descendant was a fortuitous coincidence as it helped to shore up her plan. The consort doesn't actually need to be able to use bloodline magic, and that makes sense as many descendants of branch families and other distantly related royals would have had theirs diluted out. Yes, the rest of the candidates were just picked due to their standing. Zenjiro was technically picked due to his background of being a more direct descendant, even though it wasn't actually true. The reason such a descendant is valued is there's a higher chance of passing on the bloodline magic...since he can actually use it, there is no doubt he is actually the strongest candidate for that purpose regardless of the minutiae of his actual lineage.

So Puyol does not have bloodline magic. He was a consort candidate due to his standing and due to being descended from a distantly related line. He can never be a candidate for the reigning monarch instead of consort. The whole initial problem of succession in this story exists in the first place is because there are NO male holders of the bloodline magic, either in the main or branch families, which is why Aura is the first queen regnant.

My comment about Zenjiro's thoughts only pertained what he thought Puyol might do with his newfound influence, I'm basing my argument on what Aura said in this particular chapter, because it seems like blunder by the author. This is because Puyol not having the magic does not make sense from many angles.

Sorry, but you seem to be going back and forth with your argument. On one hand you recognize that a consort that posseses the ability gives the best chance of passing it on to the heirs, on the other you're comfortable with assuming that this would not result in bloodline magic being the most important factor for becoming a candidate for this role. Even though Aura specifically said that the main purpose and duty of a consort is to help produce children, especially now, when the royal family was cut down to a signgle member. Don't you think everyone would be desperate not only to have the royal family be large, but also for it to consist of as many bloodline magic users as possible? After all, a royal without the ability is only one in name - he can't succeed the throne no matter what, so he's not really an heir.

We don't really know what it means exactly to have the ability. It might be that the royal couple's "strength" is simply due to the fact that the they are the only ones to possess the knowledge of how to utilize the gift. Aura did after all teach Zenjiro how to teleport (with a lot of difficulty), this might be all it takes for someone like Puyol's sister to become just as capable of using it. It's in fact, pretty likely - recall how that world's magic is based on exact wordings, mana costs, mental images and intentions. It's like a complex safe combination, so as long as it stays within the royal family, no one else can use a single spell.

It was said that there were no male royals left, that is all. No one ever claimed that there are no male holders of bloodline magic, at least I found no such statement. Cite me the chapter and page number if you have.

I also want you to think about how not possesing the ability would impact a high noble like Puyol, especially since his relative has it and it doesn't really afford her any special treatment, implying that it's not a very rare thing among the nobility. He'd be seen as inferior stock, likely a shame to the family. I can't imagine he'd be allowed to get as far in life as he has. If he still did despite that... well, I can only say that would be a frightening level of competence and/or cunning - Aura would be a fool not to consider him capable of anything, including a successful coup and establishing a new regime, after all, he'd basically specialize in doing the impossible.

 

[RonBWL]

My comment about Zenjiro's thoughts only pertained what he thought Puyol might do with his newfound influence, I'm basing my argument on what Aura said in this particular chapter, because it seems like blunder by the author. This is because Puyol not having the magic does not make sense from many angles.

Sorry, but you seem to be going back and forth with your argument. On one hand you recognize that a consort that posseses the ability gives the best chance of passing it on to the heirs, on the other you're comfortable with assuming that this would not result in bloodline magic being the most important factor for becoming a candidate for this role. Even though Aura specifically said that the main purpose and duty of a consort is to help produce children, especially now, when the royal family was cut down to a signgle member. Don't you think everyone would be desperate not only to have the royal family be large, but also for it to consist of as many bloodline magic users as possible? After all, a royal without the ability is only one in name - he can't succeed the throne no matter what, so he's not really an heir.

We don't really know what it means exactly to have the ability. It might be that the royal couple's "strength" is simply due to the fact that the they are the only ones to possess the knowledge of how to utilize the gift. Aura did after all teach Zenjiro how to teleport (with a lot of difficulty), this might be all it takes for someone like Puyol's sister to become just as capable of using it. It's in fact, pretty likely - recall how that world's magic is based on exact wordings, mana costs, mental images and intentions. It's like a complex safe combination, so as long as it stays within the royal family, no one else can use a single spell.

It was said that there were no male royals left, that is all. No one ever claimed that there are no male holders of bloodline magic, at least I found no such statement. Cite me the chapter and page number if you have.

I also want you to think about how not possessing the ability would impact a high noble like Puyol, especially since his relative has it and it doesn't really afford her any special treatment, implying that it's not a very rare thing among the nobility. He'd be seen as inferior stock, likely a shame to the family. I can't imagine he'd be allowed to get as far in life as he has. If he still did despite that... well, I can only say that would be a frightening level of competence and/or cunning - Aura would be a fool not to consider him capable of anything, including a successful coup and establishing a new regime, after all, he'd basically specialize in doing the impossible.

One thing many readers may get confused is the term "bloodline magic". In this world, magic exists, and most people posses ability to perform basic magic (earth-water-fire-wind), BUT the Bloodline Magic, like Space-Time, Bestowal, Recovery, etc... are royalty exclusive. That's why Puyol doesn't actually have a shot at the throne because he simply doesn't possess this requirement.

At the start of the story, Aura was the only surviving Royal Member, with bloodline magic that carries Space-Time. This bloodline could be passed down to another generation either by impregnating a female noble with high magic capacity (male) OR give birth to a boy with help of another male noble with magic capacity (female) - Aura being the latter case, and the first one to have to carry out this practice.

As I said earlier, he could get rid of Aura, Zenjirou and even Prince Carlos for that matter. But Capuan people, and to an extend, all of their neighbor countries, will not recognize him as a king, and Capua could very well be invaded by another royal family next door.

 

[DLRevan]

My comment about Zenjiro's thoughts only pertained what he thought Puyol might do with his newfound influence, I'm basing my argument on what Aura said in this particular chapter, because it seems like blunder by the author. This is because Puyol not having the magic does not make sense from many angles.

Sorry, but you seem to be going back and forth with your argument. On one hand you recognize that a consort that posseses the ability gives the best chance of passing it on to the heirs, on the other you're comfortable with assuming that this would not result in bloodline magic being the most important factor for becoming a candidate for this role. Even though Aura specifically said that the main purpose and duty of a consort is to help produce children, especially now, when the royal family was cut down to a signgle member. Don't you think everyone would be desperate not only to have the royal family be large, but also for it to consist of as many bloodline magic users as possible? After all, a royal without the ability is only one in name - he can't succeed the throne no matter what, so he's not really an heir.

We don't really know what it means exactly to have the ability. It might be that the royal couple's "strength" is simply due to the fact that the they are the only ones to possess the knowledge of how to utilize the gift. Aura did after all teach Zenjiro how to teleport (with a lot of difficulty), this might be all it takes for someone like Puyol's sister to become just as capable of using it. It's in fact, pretty likely - recall how that world's magic is based on exact wordings, mana costs, mental images and intentions. It's like a complex safe combination, so as long as it stays within the royal family, no one else can use a single spell.

It was said that there were no male royals left, that is all. No one ever claimed that there are no male holders of bloodline magic, at least I found no such statement. Cite me the chapter and page number if you have.

I also want you to think about how not possesing the ability would impact a high noble like Puyol, especially since his relative has it and it doesn't really afford her any special treatment, implying that it's not a very rare thing among the nobility. He'd be seen as inferior stock, likely a shame to the family. I can't imagine he'd be allowed to get as far in life as he has. If he still did despite that... well, I can only say that would be a frightening level of competence and/or cunning - Aura would be a fool not to consider him capable of anything, including a successful coup and establishing a new regime, after all, he'd basically specialize in doing the impossible.

I think you're the one being confused...and also making a lot of assumptions that imply you either haven't read the manga or forgotten most of its contents. It's quite strange to ask for a chapter to quote when literally every conversation they have about succession and magic bloodlines talk about this issue. We know all the things you say we don't know. Like bloodline magic is important, but that the government is also otherwise meritocratic for example.

I literally said having bloodline magic was the most important factor, "Just because there are other factors doesn't mean that the bloodline magic isn't the most important factor", but you say I said the opposite? Do you have reading comprehension issues? Is that why you find it so hard to grasp not just me, but others telling you that magic, bloodline magic and being of royal blood aren't all the same thing?

You're also seemingly conflating him ascending to the throne and becoming a consort. You're confusing even yourself. You know what either mean, yet sometimes you're also stating them to be the same, since this chapter's issue is about him possibly threatening Aura's position as the ruling monarch. You also argue that Aura's stated main role is to produce a heir who can use the bloodline magic, but you've in that same moment forgot she is the ruling monarch and so her actually using the magic is important too.

It's very damn simple. Puyol and his sister are distantly descended from royalty. So is Zenjiro. Pairings between those of royal descent are intended to increase chances of producing a heir who can use the magic. He has a leg up on everyone else because he can actually use the magic too, which implies an child between him and Aura will almost certainly have it. Puyol does not. He could have been consort at least, but he didn't get that chance either. He does not have any chance whatsoever to become the actual monarch, through politics, rebellion or otherwise. The author is right.

That's all I'm going to say. It is pointless going any further when you contradict yourself, misquote others, refuse to acknowledge facts being presented to you, and ignore the setting as literally stated in the text of the manga in favor of your own interpretation, on the excuse that it hasn't been explained.

 

[finalm]

I think you're the one being confused...and also making a lot of assumptions that imply you either haven't read the manga or forgotten most of its contents. It's quite strange to ask for a chapter to quote when literally every conversation they have about succession and magic bloodlines talk about this issue. We know all the things you say we don't know. Like bloodline magic is important, but that the government is also otherwise meritocratic for example.

I literally said having bloodline magic was the most important factor, "Just because there are other factors doesn't mean that the bloodline magic isn't the most important factor", but you say I said the opposite? Do you have reading comprehension issues? Is that why you find it so hard to grasp not just me, but others telling you that magic, bloodline magic and being of royal blood aren't all the same thing?

You're also seemingly conflating him ascending to the throne and becoming a consort. You're confusing even yourself. You know what either mean, yet sometimes you're also stating them to be the same, since this chapter's issue is about him possibly threatening Aura's position as the ruling monarch. You also argue that Aura's stated main role is to produce a heir who can use the bloodline magic, but you've in that same moment forgot she is the ruling monarch and so her actually using the magic is important too.

It's very damn simple. Puyol and his sister are distantly descended from royalty. So is Zenjiro. Pairings between those of royal descent are intended to increase chances of producing a heir who can use the magic. He has a leg up on everyone else because he can actually use the magic too, which implies an child between him and Aura will almost certainly have it. Puyol does not. He could have been consort at least, but he didn't get that chance either. He does not have any chance whatsoever to become the actual monarch, through politics, rebellion or otherwise. The author is right.

That's all I'm going to say. It is pointless going any further when you contradict yourself, misquote others, refuse to acknowledge facts being presented to you, and ignore the setting as literally stated in the text of the manga in favor of your own interpretation, on the excuse that it hasn't been explained.

Now you're just being obtuse. If it's "in every conversation" then find one and cite it instead of grandstanding. I'll wait.

All this "you are confusing yourself!" is really getting annoying when every post I have to correct you on what was actually said, either by me or the characters... you know what? Let's see your reading comprehension is doing: please point out the sentences where I apparently conflate the positions of king consort and reigning king. That'll be a barrel of laughs...

Oh yeah, "facts" because you say so. The reality is that we are both working with conjecture here, since it hasn't even been directly said whether Pujol has the ability or not, much less if there are any male holders and a number of other things you just assume. I've been recognising this fact from the start, that's why I start my conjectures with things like "I don't think that..."
and the like. You on the other hand seem to have it all figured out...

I've been doing my best to argue in good faith, but all you do is repeat yourself and accuse me of misquoting (again, where?), contradicting myself (where?) etc, not to mention the ad-personams. This is a politician's way of arguing and just like a politician, you turn tail and run when backed into a corner... That's pathetic, man and everyone can see it plain as day.

 

[finalm]

One thing many readers may get confused is the term "bloodline magic". In this world, magic exists, and most people posses ability to perform basic magic (earth-water-fire-wind), BUT the Bloodline Magic, like Space-Time, Bestowal, Recovery, etc... are royalty exclusive. That's why Puyol doesn't actually have a shot at the throne because he simply doesn't possess this requirement.

At the start of the story, Aura was the only surviving Royal Member, with bloodline magic that carries Space-Time. This bloodline could be passed down to another generation either by impregnating a female noble with high magic capacity (male) OR give birth to a boy with help of another male noble with magic capacity (female) - Aura being the latter case, and the first one to have to carry out this practice.

As I said earlier, he could get rid of Aura, Zenjirou and even Prince Carlos for that matter. But Capuan people, and to an extend, all of their neighbor countries, will not recognize him as a king, and Capua could very well be invaded by another royal family next door.

You're wrong about it being royal exclusive - it is directly said in chapter 4 that the general's sister, distantly related to royalty (as many nobles doubtlessly are) has it.

Yeah, it makes sense that the magic can be passed down from a union of holder and non-holder. Otherwise it should only be limited to direct royal descendants and as I've pointed out - it isn't. What exactly are you arguing against in this paragraph?

Assuming he doesn't have it, yeah probably. Though an invasion would only be likely if there was another devestating civil war that severly weakend the country's military, bloodline magic, useful as it is, is too limited to have a significant effect on armed conflicts between nations.

 

[RonBWL]

You're wrong about it being royal exclusive - it is directly said in chapter 4 that the general's sister, distantly related to royalty (as many nobles doubtlessly are) has it.

Yeah, it makes sense that the magic can be passed down from a union of holder and non-holder. Otherwise it should only be limited to direct royal descendants and as I've pointed out - it isn't. What exactly are you arguing against in this paragraph?

Assuming he doesn't have it, yeah probably. Though an invasion would only be likely if there was another devestating civil war that severly weakend the country's military, bloodline magic, useful as it is, is too limited to have a significant effect on armed conflicts between nations.

I'm pretty sure royal blood isn't equal to "bloodline magic". This is the case with Freya, even though she is royal and carry royal blood in her vein, her magic capacity is so low that she isn't able to prove her royalty with bloodline magic (Because the Northern countries rely on technology for so long their bloodline magic started to dwindle).

Now, Puyol and his sister is explicitly stated to have (shallow) Royal Blood, which might have been achieved through some mixed marriage in the past generations. They do not actually have bloodline magic, even though they could, in theory, help birthing a legitimate heir to Capua Kingdom. So, it's not possible for them to actually take the throne because they aren't recognized as royal by everyone.

 

[finalm]

I'm pretty sure royal blood isn't equal to "bloodline magic". This is the case with Freya, even though she is royal and carry royal blood in her vein, her magic capacity is so low that she isn't able to prove her royalty with bloodline magic (Because the Northern countries rely on technology for so long their bloodline magic started to dwindle).

Now, Puyol and his sister is explicitly stated to have (shallow) Royal Blood, which might have been achieved through some mixed marriage in the past generations. They do not actually have bloodline magic, even though they could, in theory, help birthing a legitimate heir to Capua Kingdom. So, it's not possible for them to actually take the throne because they aren't recognized as royal by everyone.

No, that was never claimed. It's probably possible for a southern royal to be born without the ability (though this wasn't really established, so I'm just making a conjecture based on how genetics work). The North in particular is said to be ruled by monarchs without any bloodline abilities, so that is kind of a special case.

Ah, I see where you're going with this now. I've looked at the chapter again and to my surprise it says "royal blood and high magic power". I was convinced that it specifically said "royal magic". In that case I was wrong, there seems to be no mention of anyone else outside of the royal couple having the ability, so it might very well be limited to the royal family from the very beggining.

It is however, incredibly strange, since a lot of nobility are bound to be cloer or further relatives of the past royals, that's just how the upper class functioned. For there to be absolutely no one but the reigning family points to either it being impossible to pass on if both parties don't hold it (making the whole concubine business utterly pointless), or some shenanigans like "becoming a royal grants it"...

 

[DLRevan]

Now you're just being obtuse. If it's "in every conversation" then find one and cite it instead of grandstanding. I'll wait.

People explain the difference between having magic, having bloodline magic and having royal blood to you...multiple times.

I can even quote to you, word for word (and have done so), what I have said versus what you think I am saying, and you still claim that was not true. The words I typed word for word, in quotation marks, against your remarks, and you still claim I have not pointed it out? What is this, manzai? Or are you genuinely stupid?

That is not even the sum list of problems with your supposed "good faith" engagement.

Ah, I see where you're going with this now. I've looked at the chapter again and to my surprise it says "royal blood and high magic power". I was convinced that it specifically said "royal magic". In that case I was wrong, there seems to be no mention of anyone else outside of the royal couple having the ability, so it might very well be limited to the royal family from the very beggining.

And you claim you dont have a reading comprehension problem. It's stated there in fucking black and white, in the clipped style of manga writing so people like you can't get confused. And here you are claiming you understand the past content of the series so well when you have ignored multiple posts of people nicely and not so nicely telling you you can't read a simple bloody line of English.

I am not going to bother quoting anything or arguing anything further. What would be the point? If you want to call me a politician, that's wrong. You know why? Politicians are savvy enough to not bother engaging people who have lazy and moronic thinking. This is not even about knowledge. You can bring a flat earther into space and they'll still say the earth is flat. I've already failed on that count trying to talk to you in the first place, including this ver post.

You can go on and live content that I "ran" from your superior understanding and logic. I don't even know why I'm explaining this, it's a waste of time.

 

[finalm]

People explain the difference between having magic, having bloodline magic and having royal blood to you...multiple times.

I can even quote to you, word for word (and have done so), what I have said versus what you think I am saying, and you still claim that was not true. The words I typed word for word, in quotation marks, against your remarks, and you still claim I have not pointed it out? What is this, manzai? Or are you genuinely stupid?

That is not even the sum list of problems with your supposed "good faith" engagement.



And you claim you dont have a reading comprehension problem. It's stated there in fucking black and white, in the clipped style of manga writing so people like you can't get confused. And here you are claiming you understand the past content of the series so well when you have ignored multiple posts of people nicely and not so nicely telling you you can't read a simple bloody line of English.

I am not going to bother quoting anything or arguing anything further. What would be the point? If you want to call me a politician, that's wrong. You know why? Politicians are savvy enough to not bother engaging people who have lazy and moronic thinking. This is not even about knowledge. You can bring a flat earther into space and they'll still say the earth is flat. I've already failed on that count trying to talk to you in the first place, including this ver post.

You can go on and live content that I "ran" from your superior understanding and logic. I don't even know why I'm explaining this, it's a waste of time.

I'm seriously in awe what a sleaze you are. NOW you claim to have been saying the same thing as the other guy? Even though you AGREED with my (incorrect) statement about the sister and tried to wriggle your way out of it with ad-personams? You didn't even bother to check, did you? Well, no wonder you won't cite anything - can't handle the possibility of being flat out wrong, better to drown the opposition in word salads. You're worse than a politician (though it's clear you admire that kind of mindset), you're a petulant child that always needs to have the last word and will lie through his teeth, no matter how small the issue at hand is. Take your fragile ego and gtfo. If I ever see you again I will point people to this ltttle exchange, they deserve to know what kind of "discussion" they are getting themselves into.

 

[LeonsamaX]

I get his fear 100% If I was asked to go back in time and go on a voyage from Morroco to Finland except sea monster ARE ACTUALLY REAL AND HUGE I wouldn't sign up 😂
You can also tell Aura's still dealing with the trauma of losing her entire family. The duty to rule and prosper her nation vs wanting to keep her only family safe and alive

 

[DLRevan]

I'm seriously in awe what a sleaze you are. NOW you claim to have been saying the same thing as the other guy? Even though you AGREED with my (incorrect) statement about the sister and tried to wriggle your way out of it with ad-personams? You didn't even bother to check, did you? Well, no wonder you won't cite anything - can't handle the possibility of being flat out wrong, better to drown the opposition in word salads. You're worse than a politician (though it's clear you admire that kind of mindset), you're a petulant child that always needs to have the last word and will lie through his teeth, no matter how small the issue at hand is. Take your fragile ego and gtfo. If I ever see you again I will point people to this ltttle exchange, they deserve to know what kind of "discussion" they are getting themselves into.

Go ahead and point. I don't know if you're the liar you claim I am, or if you are just stupid, because so much of your conversation is 1 + 1 = 3, and somehow I'm the one lying. Like this deal about her sister...where did I agree she had it? I said it doesn't matter if she has it or not, Puyol doesn't. You should be the one to go check, I have never, ever said she had bloodline magic.

Reams and reams of examples of you misunderstanding, misquoting, reinterpreting, conflating, and now, a petty vendetta.

If you're so confident...sure, go ahead. Quote and link this all over. I welcome others to review what we've said. You talk to me about politicians and ego, in the comment section of a manga that is about politics, and with an ego that makes you feel like you have to have a vendetta against a 'petulant child'. I'll walk away shaking my head knowing a loon like you exists, you'll walk away with a foolish threat based on a house of cards. Surely not an empty one right? You're not the egotistical liar here with unsound arguments here, after all.

I'll give you one thing. At least I'll admit I'm a fool too, for continuing this conversation even when I said I wouldn't. But by god, if you aren't one of the strangest characters I've ever met here. BUT, at least I can walk away without having made a stupid promise.

 

[finalm]

Go ahead and point. I don't know if you're the liar you claim I am, or if you are just stupid, because so much of your conversation is 1 + 1 = 3, and somehow I'm the one lying. Like this deal about her sister...where did I agree she had it? I said it doesn't matter if she has it or not, Puyol doesn't. You should be the one to go check, I have never, ever said she had bloodline magic.

Reams and reams of examples of you misunderstanding, misquoting, reinterpreting, conflating, and now, a petty vendetta.

If you're so confident...sure, go ahead. Quote and link this all over. I welcome others to review what we've said. You talk to me about politicians and ego, in the comment section of a manga that is about politics, and with an ego that makes you feel like you have to have a vendetta against a 'petulant child'. I'll walk away shaking my head knowing a loon like you exists, you'll walk away with a foolish threat based on a house of cards. Surely not an empty one right? You're not the egotistical liar here with unsound arguments here, after all.

I'll give you one thing. At least I'll admit I'm a fool too, for continuing this conversation even when I said I wouldn't. But by god, if you aren't one of the strangest characters I've ever met here. BUT, at least I can walk away without having made a stupid promise.

Oh, now I'm the oppressor with a vandetta and you're my victim, eh? Truly, you're quite the specimen. I was thinking you're just an attention starved child, but this kind of gaslighting points at deeper psychological issues. Indeed, I will warn people any chance I get, since talking to you is like being in a highly abusive relationship and no one deserves to feel like that. This might sound unkind, but I get the feeling I'm not the first person you made to think that, the way you just come down on people without any provocation feels like well practised behaviour. Thankfully, I don't have to live with you, but I pity anyone that does. Now then, any more ravings you'd like to share? Remember, this will now be your very own peagant for people all over to admire, so no need to be shy.

 

[DLRevan]

Oh, now I'm the oppressor with a vandetta and you're my victim, eh? Truly, you're quite the specimen. I was thinking you're just an attention starved child, but this kind of gaslighting points at deeper psychological issues. Indeed, I will warn people any chance I get, since talking to you is like being in a highly abusive relationship and no one deserves to feel like that. This might sound unkind, but I get the feeling I'm not the first person you made to think that, the way you just come down on people without any provocation feels like well practised behaviour. Thankfully, I don't have to live with you, but I pity anyone that does. Now then, any more ravings you'd like to share? Remember, this will now be your very own peagant for people all over to admire, so no need to be shy.

Only that I find the use of the term 'ravings' in your own post to be immensely ironic, as is the six or seven way psychoanalysis.

Actually, everything in this discussion can be summed up as highly ironic, so I got nothing else to add. Fire away with the pageant, good luck with that.