Moto Ansatsusha, Tensei Shite Kizoku no Reijou ni Narimashita - Vol. 2 Ch. 11.2

[anzuda]

And heck, even if Serena doesn't know how to love someone even in familial way, i'm pretty sure that's the mother job to teach their son or daughter to do so

I feel that she might learn what love is from the prince instead of mom as he keep showering her with love and concern

 

[Abricomas]

Aaaw

In my opinion though, if that shit didn't came and make your mother fear what she couldn't understand, you would probably slowly learning what is love since she will definitely shower you with it instead of that shit. You learn by repetition afterall. by seeing and feeling what love from her, you would know come to know what it is.

What are you talking about? Serena was showered with love for years but she rejected it as unnecessary. Did you forget that Serena was mentally aware since she was born and experienced all of the love that her mother gave her, but didn’t return any of it?

 

[Penthero]

I still consider mother to be bad, mostly because we’ve seen how she acts with Rosemary, she’s more of a pet whose purpose is to be cute and mother haven’t shown any care at making sure Rosemary actually can live a proper life as a noble. Stupidity isn’t and excuse for the mother.

 

[anzuda]

Waste of time. Tigur also had no authority.

I think they meant it as a wake up call instead of as an advice. To force the mother who are scared of her own child to face the reality, that she IS her child, not some monster.

 

[Abricomas]

I think they meant it as a wake up call instead of as an advice. To force the mother who are scared of her own child to face the reality, that she IS her child, not some monster.

What, to face the reality that the child considers love to be an unnecessary and frivolous burden, has felt that way since birth, and she is a killer who kills entire families without hesitation? Sure she’s doing it now as a sanctioned assassin of the nation, but she’d do it for cash just as easily.

 

[anzuda]

What are you talking about? Serena was showered with love for years but she rejected it as unnecessary. Did you forget that Serena was mentally aware since she was born and experienced all of the love that her mother gave her, but didn’t return any of it?

Even a rock could be pierce through by a droplet of water if it come constantly. Sure she might reject it from the start because she felt it was unnecessary, but remember at chapter one she was slowly opening up to it. If not, she won't even consider the thought about being protected by someone else (relating her mom's comment with the knight from previous life) and just defaulting to "Let's pretend to be a normal girl" like after that shit came.

Sure, i don't believe she would understand love the same way her normal mom does since her personality already been molded from her past life, but it definitely not "I do this because i have obligation to the family and if reason were to appear, i would have no connection to them after that"

 

[Abricomas]

Even a rock could be pierce through by a droplet of water if it come constantly. Sure she might reject it from the start because she felt it was unnecessary, but remember at chapter one she was slowly opening up to it. If not, she won't even consider the thought about being protected by someone else (relating her mom's comment with the knight from previous life) and just defaulting to "Let's pretend to be a normal girl" like after that shit came.

Sure, i don't believe she would understand love the same way her normal mom does since her personality already been molded from her past life, but it definitely not "I do this because i have obligation to the family and if reason were to appear, i would have no connection to them after that"

I went back to chapter 1, and it was mostly Serena, after being loved for 6 years, just going “how much more of this do I have to endure? Just have to act like a normal child. Dammit, the dog survived; I was trying to kill it. I have to avoid my parents if I want to get stronger in peace.”
So she wasn’t slowly opening up to loved she spent 6 years enduring it like it was a job she had to do, and another 6 years actively avoiding it when she could in order to do what she actually wanted.

 

[YamiRi]

This is why I said that her mom deserved her own salvation. Simply because it is almost impossible for Serena and her mother to connect. Both need some character development arc to be able to understand each other. Her mother is naive while Serena is more like her dad.

 

[equationx]

How can she teach a daughter that already knows about love and considers it frivolous? Serena knows love, has been shown love for years, and still considers it to be an immaterial and unnecessary thing.

Just because someone knows about love, doesn't mean they understand it, it's exactly why she thinks the way she is, because she can't comprehend what it means to love someone which in line with what i said, she knows love, but she doesn't know how to love, it's a different thing

And the mother doesn't actually taught her, she just shows her, expect her to understand despite knowing what kind of daughter she have, she basically doesn't even try to understand what the daughter is thinking about, it's another reason why Rosemary is the way she is, a bitch

 

[anzuda]

What, to face the reality that the child considers love to be an unnecessary and frivolous burden, has felt that way since birth, and she is a killer who kills entire families without hesitation? Sure she’s doing it now as a sanctioned assassin of the nation, but she’d do it for cash just as easily.

No, to make her face the fact that no matter how scared she is or how she couldn't understand her own child, in the end she is still her child. Her own blood and someone that she should have been beside of instead of an outsider she pick up randomly.

Whether she took the mantle of a mother for her again or deciding that Serena is too much for her is another story entirely, but at least that would and should give both of them a closure, not this half-baked relationship where she still want to be her mother but couldn't make herself actually do it.

I went back to chapter 1, and it was mostly Serena, after being loved for 6 years, just going “how much more of this do I have to endure? Just have to act like a normal child. Dammit, the dog survived; I was trying to kill it. I have to avoid my parents if I want to get stronger in peace.”
So she wasn’t slowly opening up to loved she spent 6 years enduring it like it was a job she had to do, and another 6 years actively avoiding it when she could in order to do what she actually wanted.

... What hurt you so badly that you see the world like this...
I genuinely curious how did you ends up reading (or maybe not) the body language like that. Well, if that is how you see it i can't exactly say you are wrong since we don't have any narrative like in the novel to know for sure (manga tend to deviate a little from the novel afterall)

I was talking about page 14-15 specifically, the scene where after she tries to comfort her mom to not be seen suspicious, she was shocked and seems to feel awkward when her mother hugged her. She could have been depicted being awkward all the time she was hugged or give up and just wait until the hug is finish, but page 15 shows she relaxed a little with her eyes not as big as the previous page and while her expression didn't change much from page 14, to me it does looks more neutral than the awkward look, showing that she relaxed a little but not so much that she looks like she gave up like on page 16.

To me, it's the look of acceptance, where she still have reservation to it as if worrying at the possible danger existing in the background but accept that there is nothing she could do there. She accept not a hopeless situation where she literally couldn't do anything to fight it, but the little protection she could have by being hugged. She even stop thinking about the dog and the attacker for a moment to even start questioning if her mom would still act like she that if she was the one in danger, would she still think about mercy and kindess if she were the one that is going to be hurt.

She was starting to question about her idea of violence for the sake of survival, whether it was something she absolutely need or just something to be used when it truly necessary. That fact alone shows that she was starting to move from her pastlife. IF she were to keep being showered with kindess like that, while she won't be those perfect innocent heroine, she would definitely won't be like her current self. Someone who made herself as the outsider in the house while the actual outsider is acting like the real daughter. She cares only about her own survial and her obligation as the daughter of the house. She doesn't even care about any shit Rosemary is doing that would and could destroy the house like she had no close ties with it.



P.S.
This is also what many mother in our world had to face. A child could be born with neurological disorder that made them doesn't feel fear, so they couldn't learn moral like normal children. They would take risk and can't associate negative stimuli like being stabbed, getting hit, or sudden loud noise with fear that usually stop someone from actually do something, like our MC even if hers is a learned trait and not a born one. Yet they could still be taught about the good and kindness of the world. If they can, why can't Serena also learn love? if 6 years aren't enough, why not 12, 15, 18, or 20 years.

 

[nomadicengi]

This is why I said that her mom deserved her own salvation. Simply because it is almost impossible for Serena and her mother to connect. Both need some character development arc to be able to understand each other. Her mother is naive while Serena is more like her dad.

I agree with this one. They both don't have common ground to go with and both are not actively trying to find it. Only way for something to start is a dark event to occur where it puts her mother at risk and Serena is forced to act. Will both reconcile afterwards? Hard to tell but at least it will give both of them to start somewhere I guess.

 

[anzuda]

And the mother doesn't actually taught her, she just shows her, expect her to understand despite knowing what kind of daughter she have, she basically doesn't even try to understand what the daughter is thinking about, it's another reason why Rosemary is the way she is, a bitch

I feel like i need to straighten this a little. Children learn primarily by imitation the adult (or creature with the closest interaction to them). They then learn by associating the action they learn to a more abstract concept or idea to create a framework of what that is.

It's normal for a mother to just show abstract concept of thinks like love, mercy, and kindness since kids usually won't understand it even if you explain it. Kids will ask why themself when they are ready for a more complex and abstract thought about the concept they just accept all this time. The only problem i see here is that Serena never actually ask her.
But mind you, I'm saying this not to say that the mom is not wrong. Knowing her daughter is different she ran away and tries to channel her motherly instinct on Rosemary instead of her real daughter

 

[hsun]

Tigur in last page:
"6/10".

What if she just fake her death?

 

[Abricomas]

No, to make her face the fact that no matter how scared she is or how she couldn't understand her own child, in the end she is still her child. Her own blood and someone that she should have been beside of instead of an outsider she pick up randomly.

Whether she took the mantle of a mother for her again or deciding that Serena is too much for her is another story entirely, but at least that would and should give both of them a closure, not this half-baked relationship where she still want to be her mother but couldn't make herself actually do it.



... What hurt you so badly that you see the world like this...
I genuinely curious how did you ends up reading (or maybe not) the body language like that. Well, if that is how you see it i can't exactly say you are wrong since we don't have any narrative like in the novel to know for sure (manga tend to deviate a little from the novel afterall)

I was talking about page 14-15 specifically, the scene where after she tries to comfort her mom to not be seen suspicious, she was shocked and seems to feel awkward when her mother hugged her. She could have been depicted being awkward all the time she was hugged or give up and just wait until the hug is finish, but page 15 shows she relaxed a little with her eyes not as big as the previous page and while her expression didn't change much from page 14, to me it does looks more neutral than the awkward look, showing that she relaxed a little but not so much that she looks like she gave up like on page 16.

To me, it's the look of acceptance, where she still have reservation to it as if worrying at the possible danger existing in the background but accept that there is nothing she could do there. She accept not a hopeless situation where she literally couldn't do anything to fight it, but the little protection she could have by being hugged. She even stop thinking about the dog and the attacker for a moment to even start questioning if her mom would still act like she that if she was the one in danger, would she still think about mercy and kindess if she were the one that is going to be hurt.

She was starting to question about her idea of violence for the sake of survival, whether it was something she absolutely need or just something to be used when it truly necessary. That fact alone shows that she was starting to move from her pastlife. IF she were to keep being showered with kindess like that, while she won't be those perfect innocent heroine, she would definitely won't be like her current self. Someone who made herself as the outsider in the house while the actual outsider is acting like the real daughter. She cares only about her own survial and her obligation as the daughter of the house. She doesn't even care about any shit Rosemary is doing that would and could destroy the house like she had no close ties with it.



P.S.
This is also what many mother in our world had to face. A child could be born with neurological disorder that made them doesn't feel fear, so they couldn't learn moral like normal children. They would take risk and can't associate negative stimuli like being stabbed, getting hit, or sudden loud noise with fear that usually stop someone from actually do something, like our MC even if hers is a learned trait and not a born one. Yet they could still be taught about the good and kindness of the world. If they can, why can't Serena also learn love? if 6 years aren't enough, why not 12, 15, 18, or 20 years.

Page 15 doesn’t look like acceptance of protection, but acceptance of a hug she isn’t getting out of and contemplating if her mother is the same type of person as the knight, who would die for the sake of another. Serena was considering what that is like, and that she can’t understand it.
Then in the following pages Serena reiterates that she wants to be able to defend herself, and she needs to develop her body to kill as she wants.

Why force Serena to do something she doesn’t want to, just because you think she should? Isn’t she entitled to live her life as she wants to, now that she’s an adult?

 

[jenev]

The MC being a reincarnation is still no excuse for her mother being too stupid for her position lmao

 

[Abricomas]

Just because someone knows about love, doesn't mean they understand it, it's exactly why she thinks the way she is, because she can't comprehend what it means to love someone which in line with what i said, she knows love, but she doesn't know how to love, it's a different thing

And the mother doesn't actually taught her, she just shows her, expect her to understand despite knowing what kind of daughter she have, she basically doesn't even try to understand what the daughter is thinking about, it's another reason why Rosemary is the way she is, a bitch

How do you teach love, if not by showing?
And knowing what kind of daughter? She knew that Serena avoided her, didn’t reciprocate expressions of love, acted cold and distant, and instead of playing would instead go and do things where she couldn’t be seen.
What’s she going to do, give a lecture on interpersonal relationships?
Like, can you give an example of teaching love that the mother hasn’t done, with someone who has an adult intellect and actively tries to deceive you?

 

[Abricomas]

The MC being a reincarnation is still no excuse for her mother being too stupid for her position lmao

You have a point there, and it’s the duke who should have fixed that problem.
It feels like it must be endemic to the household for the staff to also be like the duchess.
Maybe the duke did too good of a job keeping his wife and household safe from the machinations of other nobles.

 

[Antinomy]

The conversation in this comment section reminded me of a villainess isekai. Specifically, in that series, the mom had a vision of all the evil her daughter would do in the future. So, instead of trying to raise her correctly, she immediately cut ties with her and decided to raise the 2nd daughter personally. Now, it's heavily implied that this is actually what would have led to the original mc becoming evil.
Which makes me question the mom here, if she didn't give up on Serena, while we know she wouldn't have probably changed much. Would the mother of had any slight impact on her personality?

---

Thanks for the TL btw

 

[DaDingo]

Serena actively rejected her mother’s love, because she didn’t need or want it. How can her mother have done any better when her daughter came out as a full-grown adult that doesn’t care to experience love because she knows it as a burden?

Teach her daughter how to love? Her daughter knows love, has experienced it from her parents, and decided that she doesn’t want to reciprocate.

The thing is Serena’s mother did try BUT she tried way to little.

As we’ve seen time and time again Serena will humor almost anyone given they put effort to be with her but the mother thought that was to much of a headache and then literally replaced her OWN F**king daughter with a stranger, then the replacement was literally spoiled beyond belief kinda showing that she wasn’t really a good parent in the first place.

A real noble parent would shut that “you hate me because I’m a commoner” down SO FAST, as to a noble family their status as nobility is very important and the girl isn’t a commoner anymore she IS a noble.

 

[DaDingo]

You have a point there, and it’s the duke who should have fixed that problem.
It feels like it must be endemic to the household for the staff to also be like the duchess.
Maybe the duke did too good of a job keeping his wife and household safe from the machinations of other nobles.

Victim of his own success huh?

It all fine and dandy that he is so good at his job but with the event with the prince’s he should know what the problem is in his family AND still he does nothing…